Artorius Horus T
sincerety
51 goals and 51 assists last year and 31 goals and 31 assists so far this year
Pretty mint i'd say...
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LW Arthur Kaliyev (2019, 33rd, LAK)
- Thread starter Canadian Game
- Start date
- Status
Pretty mint i'd say...
Steve Zissou
I'll order you a red cap and a Speedo.
With a post like this it's apparent that all you know is the McDavid's of the world... and that's a shame.
Jagr
Zetterberg
Jason Allison
Pavelski
Backstrom
Getlaf
Perry
Bergeron
Tavares
James Neal
Robitaille
Thornton
Spezza
Toffoli
Mark Stone
Even Laine looks like he has lead feet sometimes... but that shot! Oops, kind of like Kaliyev.
AveryStar4Eva
Registered User
Agreed with the poster above if a player has the smarts they can still make it even if they are slower. I’d rather have a snail that can pot 30 and do damage on the powerplay than a speedster with no brain.
Smart Alek
Registered User
The only player there who skated as badly as Kaliyev was Allison and I really don't know what to make of that comparison since they were such different players and the game was much slower. But to a man all of those guys hustled, Kaliyev does not. Most even backchecked. Laine does have some similarities, but again, he hustles to make up for his deficiencies.
I want to think it's just a lack of effort, and that's why I'm really looking forward to seeing him at the WJCs. Maybe he'll raise his game against better competition... I hope so. But have you actually watched him play and thought the game he's currently playing could translate into today's NHL? And did you ever watch Brendl play in junior? He had a rocket too... they really could have been clones. Thankfully, Kaliyev's book isn't written yet.
Mats26
Vet Movement - What's the Maatta?
NHL size, shot and now he’s playing the PK and doing it incredibly well. So much for poor work ethic. Worried about skating, it's the easiest of all the skills to fix. I am sure the Kings' development team with hire someone like Barry Karn to help his skating. Reminds me of Alex Killhorn and the strides he made after Tampa hired Karn.
AveryStar4Eva
Registered User
Scoring at this pace and the Kings having some contracts fall off this offseason you gotta wonder if he’s going to get a nine game look next season? Kings are rebuilding so it wouldn’t really hurt to keep him around for awhile. Maybe do something like the Islanders have done with Dobson. Keep him around a couple months to build up his strength and get him in a couple games + practices.
Frolov 6'3
Unregistered User
Skating and speed are different things. Skating is bad, speed is above average.
“Maybe he will raise his game against better competition” sounds very odd if you talk about a player who is scoring a goal per game.
The WJC wont be a speed contest either. What are you expecting there from him, a new track record ?
Smart Alek
Registered User
I'm expecting him to hustle to get loose pucks, hustle to forecheck, hustle to backcheck, and win some puck battles. He doesn't need to be successful at those things yet, but he needs to try.
I'm not questioning his ability to dominate at the OHL level, but whether he can translate that to the NHL game. Some of you guys sound like I hate the guy, but the opposite is true... I'd really like to see him succeed. I just have the same reservations about him that dozens of NHL teams had when they chose to use their first round picks on players with less talent than Kaliyev.
I suppose I should take into account that I'm mostly speaking to people here who are Kings fans... I imagine if others were visiting this thread more, my views would be fit squarely within the mainstream. That, or people are just stat watching and not seeing him play.
MBH
Players Play
King'sPawn
Enjoy the chaos
As of right now, Kaliyev is at the top in primary points/game, according to pick224.com
Which spans over all junior leagues, NCAA, and some European leagues.
Which spans over all junior leagues, NCAA, and some European leagues.
WADEugottaBELAKthat
Nikishin turning heads.
I tend to agree that Kaliyev certainly needs to work on some things. He is clearly so offensively ahead of the pack in the OHL that it appears he is developing some defensive habits that won’t help him thrive in the NHL. His lack of defensive stick work and hustle is glaring. He seems content prioritizing goals and points. This is common for junior players though, and plenty of players have adjusted. So there is hope. Big time. I think of Anthony Mantha when trying to foresee what type of development trend we could potentially see optimistically.
Pessimistically I believe Pavel Brendl is a perfect comparable. But frankly I don’t think Kaliyev’s skating mechanics are as bad. Certainly not Jason Allison-bad. If he can pick up his defensive puck hunger I think it can really help mask his skating inefficiencies.
Perhaps the question becomes about development. If he’s lucky he will get a coach that will give him a long time to figure things out. If not, he might get stigmatized early and find the NHL door closed abruptly.
I am cheering for the guy. For if he maxes out his potential and gets some traction in his development, he still has that potential to become a bonafide star.
Frolov 6'3
Unregistered User
Yes good points but Allison was much slower. He is faster, he wins puck battles and he does back check. That makes me wonder why you say people might just watch his stats. Jason was an insane player, a different one, we can only hope Kaliyev will become as good.
If he hustles too much, he is not on the right position to score and i dont doubt he is kinda lazy too. Lets not overrate the hustling part if you have a shot like that though.
This has nothing to do with me or others saying that you hate the guy. Did we really sound this harsh? I dont think so....me personally just doesnt (completely) agree.
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I was super happy when he fell to the 2nd round, so Ottawa could nab him. They passed, and I think it'll be a pick they regret.
Raccoon Jesus
We were right there
I don't think any of the above criticisms are off-base, but they feel a little outdated--they're at least works-in-progress after this year's development camp and abstracts like "compete" and "two-way game" are showing up in his leadership and PKing. These are some quotes from Kings scouting heads after the WJSS right before the year:
Kings encouraged by Kaliyev at WJSS; how the Hlinka restarts the scouting season - LA Kings Insider
"But I also wanted to learn more about the Kings prospects at last week’s WJSS, the stats and details of which are below. Kaliyev led all Kings at the tournament with five points, showing that his game was at a good place one month after development camp.
“I think that’s people saw there or what you see with him in the OHL is what he is and he’s a goal scorer. The puck finds him around the net. He’s in the right spot on rebounds. He’s got a good stick. He’s got a good shot,” Emerson said. “One of the exciting things for us, and we had a number of our scouts there and we’re all watching him, is the pace of skating was fine. He was keeping up with the high pace. That was another exciting factor and fundamental that we were really happy with.”"
"With Artie (Arthur Kaliyev), what you’re looking for is, number one, we drafted him because he can score. Is he going to be able to do that? Is he going to get opportunities, and obviously what we saw, he had some great success at this event, so yeah, he checked that box. But a couple of the other boxes — we know he’s got a lot of work ahead of him in the next few years with the compete and skating and work ethic and playing a faster-paced-type of hockey that we see in the NHL. And we saw actually a good indication that that’s going to happen. So, you’ve got a lot of work to do in the coming years. You’ve got to get stronger, you’ve got to get the leg strength, you’ve got to grow. Jeez, he’s so young. But if he matures, and it looks like he will, we’re pretty excited about what we’ve got there. "
And more recently, evaluation leading up to current USA camp:
Lizotte holding up well; Toffoli's "had a rough stretch"; Turcotte, Kaliyev on preliminary USA roster - LA Kings Insider
"Arthur Kaliyev and Alex Turcotte, both 18-year-old underagers, were named to the United States’ preliminary World Juniors roster earlier today. More on that to come, but the early sense I have is that Turcotte is close to a virtual lock for the tournament while Kaliyev is more of a bubble-type player. For Kaliyev, it’s important that he shows USA Hockey that he’s made responsible strides away from the puck. (He has, and he showed that at the World Juniors Summer Showcase.) "
So no one is ignoring these concerns--we all know these affected his draft position--but to pretend they're not being work-in-progressed is an outdated take.
Kings encouraged by Kaliyev at WJSS; how the Hlinka restarts the scouting season - LA Kings Insider
"But I also wanted to learn more about the Kings prospects at last week’s WJSS, the stats and details of which are below. Kaliyev led all Kings at the tournament with five points, showing that his game was at a good place one month after development camp.
“I think that’s people saw there or what you see with him in the OHL is what he is and he’s a goal scorer. The puck finds him around the net. He’s in the right spot on rebounds. He’s got a good stick. He’s got a good shot,” Emerson said. “One of the exciting things for us, and we had a number of our scouts there and we’re all watching him, is the pace of skating was fine. He was keeping up with the high pace. That was another exciting factor and fundamental that we were really happy with.”"
"With Artie (Arthur Kaliyev), what you’re looking for is, number one, we drafted him because he can score. Is he going to be able to do that? Is he going to get opportunities, and obviously what we saw, he had some great success at this event, so yeah, he checked that box. But a couple of the other boxes — we know he’s got a lot of work ahead of him in the next few years with the compete and skating and work ethic and playing a faster-paced-type of hockey that we see in the NHL. And we saw actually a good indication that that’s going to happen. So, you’ve got a lot of work to do in the coming years. You’ve got to get stronger, you’ve got to get the leg strength, you’ve got to grow. Jeez, he’s so young. But if he matures, and it looks like he will, we’re pretty excited about what we’ve got there. "
And more recently, evaluation leading up to current USA camp:
Lizotte holding up well; Toffoli's "had a rough stretch"; Turcotte, Kaliyev on preliminary USA roster - LA Kings Insider
"Arthur Kaliyev and Alex Turcotte, both 18-year-old underagers, were named to the United States’ preliminary World Juniors roster earlier today. More on that to come, but the early sense I have is that Turcotte is close to a virtual lock for the tournament while Kaliyev is more of a bubble-type player. For Kaliyev, it’s important that he shows USA Hockey that he’s made responsible strides away from the puck. (He has, and he showed that at the World Juniors Summer Showcase.) "
So no one is ignoring these concerns--we all know these affected his draft position--but to pretend they're not being work-in-progressed is an outdated take.
newfy
Registered User
Kaliyev is going to be an extremely interesting prospect to watch going forward. I was kind of thinking Mantha as a comparable because he was criticised for a lack of hustle in junior and he went a goal a game in his draft +1. But Manthas skating really set him apart from Kaliyev in my opinion. Mantha though was never knocked for his skating, he was always seen as a really solid skater and great for his size. And thats really the major knock on Kaliyev even moreso than compete level I think. Every scout knew he could score but he still ended up in the second round, on the other hand most guys who tear up junior like he has post draft end up being at least decent NHLers.
Hes going to be a really interesting one to watch. I havent seen him this year so the WJC will be good to watch and see how he looks. I could see him absolutely lighting it up with Caufield and Turcotte and people in here spouting off about how great hes going to be but playing with those guys doesnt mean much to me. I want to see his compete level and where his skating is at now
AveryStar4Eva
Registered User
I don’t know how he keeps finding these dangerous areas to just clap them home. I have a feeling he’s going to pot a lot of goals for the kings they have some very good playmakers to feed him the puck. Vilardi to Kailyev while Turcotte takes on the toughest match ups seems like a dream scenario if they pan out.
Pavel Buchnevich
"Pavel Buchnevich The Fake"
You have to put those kids with someone who can skate, and has a good energy level. Someone like Akil Thomas wouldn't be a bad option.
Kupari-Turcotte-Grundstrom
Thomas-Vilardi-Kaliyev
Mats26
Vet Movement - What's the Maatta?
I am surprised you are that high on Kupari and Thomas. I personally don't see Kupari on our first line and see Thomas as an energy 2 way player on the 3rd line but can fill in on top lines as necessary. Don't forget about Fagemo. He is slowly moving up my Kings prospect chart.
I will hope to see our 2020 1st rd pick as the 1 LW:
(Lappy\Raymond\Perfetti\Rossi )Vilardi Kaliyev
Kupari Turcotte Fagemo
I guess if you want to send him down the freeway to be reunited with Zegras you can.... im not going to stop you.
Pavel Buchnevich
"Pavel Buchnevich The Fake"
I thought I was lower on Kupari than most, but I could definitely see him as a top 6 winger. I don't think he's a center. Thomas might be more of a third line player, but maybe he also is a 5th or 6th forward. I wouldn't rule that out. I don't think teams need their three best on one line, and their next three best on the next line. If the Kings top 6 works in a way where Turcotte and Vilardi are co-1C's, and Kaliyev is the next best forward because he's a big scorer, you can afford to mix and match the rest of the top 6. I think Fagemo is probably more of a third liner, but there's probably not that much of a difference between him and Thomas.
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