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LW Anthony Mantha (2013, 20th, DET) II

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Claypool said:
I don't think he's playing any better or worse than any of the other 2nd and 3rd line players on the team. His play is underwhelming relative to your expectations I guess.

Outside of Pulkkinen, Miele, and Callahan (before his injury) everyone else struggled offensively this season, and I don't think that's a coincidence. If Mantha got to play with Pulkkinen and Miele all season on the top line and on the power play he'd have plenty of points, so I'm not too concerned with his offensive play. Yeah, his backchecking kinda sucks and he doesn't seem to hustle every shift. He also can't dominate people using his size so he'll need to get stronger in that area.
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Bolded for emphasis. I want to make sure people understand this: Mantha barely had any PP time all season, and of that small amount of minutes, very few of them were on the top unit. Despite that, he scored 6 power play goals. He had a small handful of assists, although I can't track that. But 6 PPG is third on the team, with the other two being... Pulkkinen (10) and Miele (8), who are the guys carrying the top unit. What this should tell you is that Mantha could have produced a LOT more with power play time.

This should change the perception a little. .5 PPG with almost no power play time is not a bad rookie season. Yeah, Mantha still has problems to iron out, but his offensive production is probably not on that list.
 
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The way I see it I that we can make all the excuses we want about the guy. Broken leg, never got into the groove, his linemates, lack of PP, etc, etc,.....

but obviously management and coaches would see that and not call him out like this if its true. They are obviously upset about his season and let the world know. And it's not like it is the first that Mantha heard about it. Coaches and management at every level have 1 on 1 meetings with their players multiple times a year. You can count on the fact that his play came up many times throughout the year at their meetings with Mantha. Maybe going to the press is the last resort for them to get through to him
 
Skinnyjimmy08 said:
The way I see it I that we can make all the excuses we want about the guy. Broken leg, never got into the groove, his linemates, lack of PP, etc, etc,.....

but obviously management and coaches would see that and not call him out like this if its true. They are obviously upset about his season and let the world know. And it's not like it is the first that Mantha heard about it. Coaches and management at every level have 1 on 1 meetings with their players multiple times a year. You can count on the fact that his play came up many times throughout the year at their meetings with Mantha. Maybe going to the press is the last resort for them to get through to him
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Yeah, an organization known for taking it's time with prospects is down to their last resorts with a 20 year old. Especially after Babs and Kenny said the same thing just not nearly as harsh.
 
The Nose said:
Guys don't just put up 57 goals in 57 games at the Junior level. There's a reason why he was rated so highly, and I won't be surprised if he proves it next year. That being said there is a lot he needs to work on for it to happen.
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Do you mean there's a reason he was rated so low? In his draft year, he outscored everyone in the first round, and was one of the biggest guys in the first round, yet fell to 20th. There was a reason and everyone knew what it was, and he still has the same problems.

He was a high risk, high ceiling/low floor prospect and still is. He could end up being better than Bo Horvat, who scored less than him and was way smaller in his draft year, but it's not very likely.
 
Not going to throw him under the bus because I actually like him but I really hope this helps people realize how idiotic it is to judge a player by points in the CHL.

Development is far more than that.
 
Mantha just doesn't have the aggression and energy required for the pros. He is a floater... Always has been, probably always will be. Sorry but I think the odds are pretty good that Mantha will be either an extremely late nhl bloomer or an outright bust.

Bennett and his aggression/compete levels are a perfect example of what Mantha is entirely devoid of.
 
rickyr said:
mantha just doesn't have the aggression and energy required for the pros. He is a floater... Always has been, probably always will be. Sorry but i think the odds are pretty good that mantha will be either an extremely late nhl bloomer or an outright bust.

bennett and his aggression/compete levels are a perfect example of what mantha is entirely devoid of.
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bingo!!!!
 
ZeroPT said:
Not going to throw him under the bus because I actually like him but I really hope this helps people realize how idiotic it is to judge a player by points in the CHL.

Development is far more than that.
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Given he is in the Detroit development system, I think they will get him on the right path :) Might take a few years though.
 
Didn't know there was so much Mantha hate on these boards. Definitely gonna be bringing up some of these quotes when he lights up the AHL next year.
 
This is a PERFECT example of how inflated the QMJHL numbers are.

Stan Bowman, and Bob Murray have stated that you have to take QMJHL numbers with a grain of salt as the league is Pure Offense.

Mantha's season wasn't bad it was actually on par with a first year, but people expecting those gaudy QMJHL numbers are clueless.

Same thing happened this year with Nicolaj Ehlers, with people saying he should of gone in the top 5 because of his output

These QMJHL massive point getters wouldn't even be able to put up 85 points if they were playing in the WHL.
 
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Breakers said:
This is a PERFECT example of how inflated the QMJHL numbers are.

Stan Bowman, and Bob Murray have stated that you have to take QMJHL numbers with a grain of salt as the league is Pure Offense.

Martha's season wasn't bad it was actually on par with a first year, but people expecting those gaudy QMJHL numbers are clueless.

Same thing happened this year with Nicolaj Ehlers, with people saying he should of gone in the top 5 because of his output

These QMJHL massive point getters wouldn't even be able to put up 85 points if they were playing in the WHL.
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I don't think the problem is with inflated numbers. Players coming from all CHL often struggle when they first play in the AHL. Heck, players coming from the NCAA even struggle as well.

However, the QMJHL is an easy league in the sense that the tempo is relatively slow and passing lanes are wide open. At the same time, the physical play is a bit lacking compared to the other leagues. This means a floater can more easily succeed in the QMJHL than in the OHL or WHL.

I don't think Detroit is disappointed with Mantha's offensive output. I think they are disappointed that he is happy just racking up points with a lack of personal involvement. Size doesn't mean anything if you don't use it.

As to the Q, they can produce good players but imo they have too many teams which makes it easy for better players to succeed and doesn't prepare them well for the next level.
 
Breakers said:
This is a PERFECT example of how inflated the QMJHL numbers are.

Stan Bowman, and Bob Murray have stated that you have to take QMJHL numbers with a grain of salt as the league is Pure Offense.

Mantha's season wasn't bad it was actually on par with a first year, but people expecting those gaudy QMJHL numbers are clueless.

Same thing happened this year with Nicolaj Ehlers, with people saying he should of gone in the top 5 because of his output

These QMJHL massive point getters wouldn't even be able to put up 85 points if they were playing in the WHL.
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The goals for per game in the Q, O, and W are all about the same, so I'm not sure what you're on about. It's funny to see how many dismiss his 81 goals as if it was easy, but why don't more do it?
 
SimplySolace said:
The goals for per game in the Q, O, and W are all about the same, so I'm not sure what you're on about. It's funny to see how many dismiss his 81 goals as if it was easy, but why don't more do it?
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When did I say he was a bad player????

Everyone knows QMJHL is pure offense. Even GM's say so, so I'll trust their judgement.


Yawn...... :help::help:
 
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Breakers said:
When did I say he was a bad player????

Everyone knows QMJHL is pure offense. Even GM's say so, so I'll trust their judgement.


Yawn...... :help::help:
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ya I agree it has always been true that the Q has always had real high offensive numbers... its funny though cause even though the league has always had insanely high scoring, a high amount of top notch goalies in the NHL over the years have come out of the Q.. bizzare!!
 
Breakers said:
When did I say he was a bad player????

Everyone knows QMJHL is pure offense. Even GM's say so, so I'll trust their judgement.


Yawn...... :help::help:
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SimplySolace said:
The goals for per game in the Q, O, and W are all about the same
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I'm from Nova Scotia. I watch the Q more than I even watch the NHL. There, for one thing, is more defense than you people seem to think. Junior leagues in general are 'all offense' and the WHL is the only one of the three that really puts an emphasis on defense.

Second, having watched the guy play, he can be very dominant. His problem isn't really effort level IMO, it's consistency. He also has some trouble dedicating to defense, although at teams you will see a commitment. He has work to do but I don't doubt that he will become at least a good goal scoring winger in the NHL. Maybe not a first liner, though it's very possible, but I see him being a strong offensive second liner right now. His developement is hard to see because he has a lot of potential, but consistency and defense need to be worked oon (as I'm sure they will be/have been in Grand Rapids).
 
Breakers said:
This is a PERFECT example of how inflated the QMJHL numbers are.

Stan Bowman, and Bob Murray have stated that you have to take QMJHL numbers with a grain of salt as the league is Pure Offense.

Mantha's season wasn't bad it was actually on par with a first year, but people expecting those gaudy QMJHL numbers are clueless.

Same thing happened this year with Nicolaj Ehlers, with people saying he should of gone in the top 5 because of his output

These QMJHL massive point getters wouldn't even be able to put up 85 points if they were playing in the WHL.
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Yeah sure, it's not like Charles Hudon was as good a rookie as anyone in the AHL this year (including many former WHLers like Shinkaruk).
 
TimeZone said:
Not miles better but he did lead AHL rookies in scoring. So I'd say he was better, yes.
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Anyways, that's not really the point. People will always jump on the obvious example to say it proves their point that such league is terrible and what have you and pass on counter examples. You can find as many scorers from the WHL who didn't translate to the next level. Not saying Shinkaruk is a bust or that Mantha is btw.
 
RickyR said:
Mantha just doesn't have the aggression and energy required for the pros. He is a floater... Always has been, probably always will be. Sorry but I think the odds are pretty good that Mantha will be either an extremely late nhl bloomer or an outright bust.

Bennett and his aggression/compete levels are a perfect example of what Mantha is entirely devoid of.
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So long as he's smart and develops that scoring touch, floater or not he'll have an NHL future. There was a 700+ goal scorer who floated his entire career, I'll let you figure out who on your own.
 
Nyquist said:
Didn't know there was so much Mantha hate on these boards. Definitely gonna be bringing up some of these quotes when he lights up the AHL next year.
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It seems Jim Devellano has an issue with Anthany Mantha as well.


Sportsnet:

Jim Devellano - “Very, very, very disappointing,” said Devellano regarding Mantha’s play. “And I say that with a lot of sadness. Coming out of junior, we had such high hopes for him.”


http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/red-wings-executive-critical-of-anthony-mantha/
 
Countryjunkie said:
Jim Devellano - “Very, very, very disappointing,†said Devellano regarding Mantha’s play. “And I say that with a lot of sadness. Coming out of junior, we had such high hopes for him.â€
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Ouch. If I were Mantha I'd ask for a trade. This is stupid.
 
Read on twitter that he was 2 days away from being a 2012 draft class underager.
 
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