GDT: Los Angeles Kings @ Columbus Blue Jackets 12/20/16 4:00PST

[Raccoon Jesus]

Shouldn't he be though? Shouldn't he be? How much does Quick even have to do with it? OR is it his brand new 10.5 million dollar contract which is drawing the added criticism?

Hey, Kopi SHOULD be critiqued, that's fine. But do so with an acknowledgement of context.

Quick has plenty to do with it given he's given us, other than the lockouts season, at least above average goaltending all season, while minus the last three games, we've gotten league-2nd-worst goaltending while most other metrics remain consistent.

From Rosen, re Kopitar:

"That's probably worth 0.5% of it. The eye test says he's the same player he ever was. This is clearly related to his hand/wrist/arm, the team's lack of top-unit power play success, the fact that he's playing with less productive linemates, and that he's hit 8 posts this season. The metrics say that his performance is completely in line with his other seasons, and that his defense and checking has remained at an elite level. It's low-hanging fruit to look at his contract and complain. There's no lack of fire or desire or any of that nonsense."

 

[BigKing]

I can't remember watching them play a better game this season, at least not on the road against a good team.

Dowd line was fantastic. Setoguchi looked like an entirely different player.

Might as well of tacked an extra month on to the Gaborik injury time frame since he is definitely not in game shape.

 

[Pandaman11]

- A backup goalie playing the game of his life.
- A shootout loss.

Well, where have seen that before, right?

 

[yankeeking]

They've won 10 straight and we dominated that game.

I don't disagree with you but big picture here, the last two PGTs were woe-is-us the-sky-is-falling type stuff when we played like crap and won vs. the Pens. Now we play an awesome game start to finish and lose a coin flip. **** it.

Strangis is a natural, loved him there. We are spoiled this year, I thought this setup with multiple pxp guys would be nutty but it's been fun

at times in 2010/2011 and again in 2011/2012 we had games like these where we dominated for long periods but coundnt get a goal to save our lives so personally I think we are gping to be just fine come the playoffs as long as we get there , gravel, forbort and dowd were all over the ice yesterday and that bodes well for sustaining pressure and moving the puck well. once kopi and gabby get going we should do well in the second half IMHO

 

[Legionnaire]

Hey, Kopi SHOULD be critiqued, that's fine. But do so with an acknowledgement of context.

Quick has plenty to do with it given he's given us, other than the lockouts season, at least above average goaltending all season, while minus the last three games, we've gotten league-2nd-worst goaltending while most other metrics remain consistent.

From Rosen, re Kopitar:

"That's probably worth 0.5% of it. The eye test says he's the same player he ever was. This is clearly related to his hand/wrist/arm, the team's lack of top-unit power play success, the fact that he's playing with less productive linemates, and that he's hit 8 posts this season. The metrics say that his performance is completely in line with his other seasons, and that his defense and checking has remained at an elite level. It's low-hanging fruit to look at his contract and complain. There's no lack of fire or desire or any of that nonsense."

You sure about that John? I'm not pointing to just this season. Kopitar is so much better than his numbers reflect. Yes, I understand his defensive game. Yes, I understand shot selection has a lot to do with puck possession. But it is not that. Go back to the 14'-15' season. How many shots did he take? How many goals did he score? What happened to the Kings that year? Kopitar lacks killer instinct on the offensive side of the puck. He should be driving hard to the net, but he's not. He should be taking those shots instead of going behind the net ala Frolov, and creating nothing. He should be taking those shots instead of passing to guys who can't score. Is it lack of fire? Desire? No. It is lack of confidence and that is probably even worse.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

You sure about that John? I'm not pointing to just this season. Kopitar is so much better than his numbers reflect. Yes, I understand his defensive game. Yes, I understand shot selection has a lot to do with puck possession. But it is not that. Go back to the 14'-15' season. How many shots did he take? How many goals did he score? What happened to the Kings that year? Kopitar lacks killer instinct on the offensive side of the puck. He should be driving hard to the net, but he's not. He should be taking those shots instead of going behind the net ala Frolov, and creating nothing. He should be taking those shots instead of passing to guys who can't score. Is it lack of fire? Desire? No. It is lack of confidence and that is probably even worse.

...and last year?

 

[Legionnaire]

...and last year?

Last year he shot 14.1% and still had under two hundred shots. We lost the division by one point. ONE POINT. Surely, a goal or two extra from Kopitar would have seen us in. Those goals are only going to happen if he shoots the puck. When he's playing with confidence, he shoots the puck.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Last year he shot 14.1% and still had under two hundred shots. We lost the division by one point. ONE POINT. Surely, a goal or two extra from Kopitar would have seen us in. Those goals are only going to happen if he shoots the puck. When he's playing with confidence, he shoots the puck.

He had 25 goals and 74 points. On top of winning the Selke.

He's probably not going to be the 34 goal guy again, but I don't understand the fascination with his raw goal scoring if he's still putting up those sorts of numbers. That means he's driving offense and helping people around him score, which makes the end result the same. Again, I'll ask--what if Kopitar were a 0 goal, 90 point player? The stupidly extreme example, I know, but it's like people want to ignore how Kopitar drives offense and focus on the raw goal scoring side of it. He's got a great shot, I'd like him to be more selfish just like you do, but I wish someone would help me understand how one can lay last season's issues on Anze Kopitar's 'lack of killer instinct' on offense.

 

[123slam]

He had 25 goals and 74 points. On top of winning the Selke.

And he won't get close this year. He isn't making those around him better.

 

[WHOneedsSOX]

He had 25 goals and 74 points. On top of winning the Selke.

He's probably not going to be the 34 goal guy again, but I don't understand the fascination with his raw goal scoring if he's still putting up those sorts of numbers. That means he's driving offense and helping people around him score, which makes the end result the same. Again, I'll ask--what if Kopitar were a 0 goal, 90 point player? The stupidly extreme example, I know, but it's like people want to ignore how Kopitar drives offense and focus on the raw goal scoring side of it. He's got a great shot, I'd like him to be more selfish just like you do, but I wish someone would help me understand how one can lay last season's issues on Anze Kopitar's 'lack of killer instinct' on offense.

Thornton hasn't scored 20 goals since 2011 but he's always near point per game player. Of course we all want Kopitar to score 30 goals but I agree with you, 75 points is the same thing.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

And he won't get close this year. He isn't making those around him better.

Go back and trace the conversation, it wasn't much about what his grand total will be this year; it was about the idea that he has hurt the team in the past by not scoring goals. Hell, he could still pull a 2015 on us and go over PPG (near 2 PPG!) through the end of the year to still end up with 64 points and some folks would probably ignore that and go "but he was terrible in December."

As far as not making those around him better...lol. Show me some proof of that and I'll show you 10 times the proof to refute it.

Hell just look at some simple with-or-without-you stats, it'll show you some funny things about this team, like Drew Doughty is actually a monster this year and Kopitar is carrying possession for just about anyone he plays with while blackholing the opposition, just need his production to turn around.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

We'll be lucky if Kopitar reaches 60 points this season.

He's turning into this player before our very eyes.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

We'll be lucky if Kopitar reaches 60 points this season.

He's turning into this player before our very eyes.

This makes me want to go back and create a list of posters who were lamenting Kopitar's death in 2014-2015 only to watch him come back and put up 74 points and a +34 on his way to the Selke...oh, but he only put up 25 goals, so maybe you're right.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

We'd be fortunate if he hits 20 goals. He's not shooting much nor is he creating much at even strength. He's being praised for his checking game. I guess when the team is starving for goals, you have to find some positive from the overpaid guys who aren't contributing on the scoresheet.

I get that he's not playing with much talent right now, but he's also not doing much on his own to create opportunities.

 

[King'sPawn]

This is the first time since his rookie year he hasn't led the team in scoring, and he has missed games due to injury. While also being among the top defensive forwards on the team.

I think he's done enough to earn the benefit of the doubt.

 

[Omni Owl]

Kopitar is not making 14 million this year to be a defensive checking forward. He needs to be at an elite level to justify that salary. I don't see him turning it around any time soon.

 

[theMajor]

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Kopitar is not making 14 million this year to be a defensive checking forward. He needs to be at an elite level to justify that salary. I don't see him turning it around any time soon.

I can agree with that. However, I can't get on board with "Anze Kopitar is literally Michael Handzus" or "We lost games last year because Anze Kopitar's 25 goals weren't enough" even though he got 70+ points and a +34/Selke.

As to him not turning it around soon, well, I'm hoping some people will be humble enough to eat crow soon. I don't see any way he doesn't, unless his injury lingers like Carter's clearly did last year. Then again, I guess I'm one of the few that's okay with him "merely" putting up 70+ points a year even if they aren't goals directly.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

In the five games Kopitar has been held shotless, the Kings are 1-3-1, and that's happened thrice in December.

 

[Little Psycho]

Kopi looked great before he got hurt and now his playing is disappointing but I'm no way in hell ready to call him Handzus 2.0. We have seen his ups and downs. He's gonna come back up, he might not hit his numbers from last year but he will fine.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

In the five games Kopitar has been held shotless, the Kings are 1-3-1, and that's happened thrice in December.

So thrice since he came back from injury? Because to me that just lends credence to the theory that he's not fading out/burning out as a player, he's just actually hurt and not 100%.

In general, I'm willing to bet that Kopitar being held shotless in a game is a symptom of a bad game all around rather than "just Kopitar sucked." Not that that makes it better, but Kopitar getting a shot on goal wasn't the delta for victory in that game.

Will someone please just tell me directly what we're trying to peddle here? Because I don't think anyone--myself included--does not want more production from Anze. But all these obscure stats and comparisons that are supposed to be shots at him are doing...what exactly?

 

[Trolfoli]

Kopitar is not making 14 million this year to be a defensive checking forward. He needs to be at an elite level to justify that salary. I don't see him turning it around any time soon.

And yet that's exactly what Sutter is using him as because the other two options are Carter and Dowd. Dowd is still young (NHL years that is) and isn't going to be shutting down other teams top lines.

You want more from Kopitar give him linemates that can control the puck in the offensive zone. The system isn't set up to get the centers breakaways, so unless he's generating chances against teams with 2-3 defenders back, the chances have to come from the cycle. Lewis destroys the cycle, and you're left with the current situation.

Edit: Or maybe it's hard to sake with all that coin in his pockets?

 

[Trolfoli]

So thrice since he came back from injury? Because to me that just lends credence to the theory that he's not fading out/burning out as a player, he's just actually hurt and not 100%.

In general, I'm willing to bet that Kopitar being held shotless in a game is a symptom of a bad game all around rather than "just Kopitar sucked." Not that that makes it better, but Kopitar getting a shot on goal wasn't the delta for victory in that game.

Will someone please just tell me directly what we're trying to peddle here? Because I don't think anyone--myself included--does not want more production from Anze. But all these obscure stats and comparisons that are supposed to be shots at him are doing...what exactly?

His contract is worse then Brown's and we should have traded him for Johansen.

 

[Steve Zissou]

Both Toews and Kopitar are not one with the force this year.

 

[PJ Kings Hockey]

Both Toews and Kopitar are not one with the force this year.

Bwah ha ha.

So, are we thinking of having a GDT for the game starting within the hour?