Speculation: Lias Andersson asks for a trade - Part II

[FIRE DRURY]

Anyway,... has anyone thought that maybe there is something wrong with Hartford's management or coaches? Ok,.. the team has been doing well with their complete overhaul in staff down there,... but,... this is the second high prospect along with Kravstov that has been disgruntled with their situation there. Just a thought....

I don’t think so.

Kravstov had issues in Hartford. Lias has issues with Quinn.

 

[nyr2k2]

It wasn't long ago, I was getting severe pushback in saying Howden was better than Lias. And that it would be iffy Lias even makes the team. Well he did make the team out of camp, but not at the expense of Howden.

Anyway,... has anyone thought that maybe there is something wrong with Hartford's management or coaches? Ok,.. the team has been doing well with their complete overhaul in staff down there,... but,... this is the second high prospect along with Kravstov that has been disgruntled with their situation there. Just a thought....

Neither Kravtsov not Andersson thought they belonged in Hartford. Andersson thought he was better than some players on the NHL roster and deserved better from Quinn, and basically quit in Hartford. Kravtsov, sounds like he went down there unprepared to do what was needed to develop into an NHL player and took his sticks and ran home. Can't really fault anyone in Hartford, particularly for Andersson.

Chytil thrived down there, as did Lindgren (through two coaching staffs). Shesterkin has been fantastic and Huska has been good, too, until the past couple starts. Rykov has played well considering he's coming back from what was apparently a pretty legitimate ankle injury. Keane I still maintain isn't as good as his numbers, but he's still having a tremendous rookie year. The team as a whole are playing pretty well. I like what I see from the staff down there. LA and VK, that's all on them.

 

[ohbaby]

Neither Kravtsov not Andersson thought they belonged in Hartford. Andersson thought he was better than some players on the NHL roster and deserved better from Quinn, and basically quit in Hartford. Kravtsov, sounds like he went down there unprepared to do what was needed to develop into an NHL player and took his sticks and ran home. Can't really fault anyone in Hartford, particularly for Andersson.

Chytil thrived down there, as did Lindgren (through two coaching staffs). Shesterkin has been fantastic and Huska has been good, too, until the past couple starts. Rykov has played well considering he's coming back from what was apparently a pretty legitimate ankle injury. Keane I still maintain isn't as good as his numbers, but he's still having a tremendous rookie year. The team as a whole are playing pretty well. I like what I see from the staff down there. LA and VK, that's all on them.

Sure it's possible they're both prima donnas, but these events definitely signals some warning flags.

 

[nyr2k2]

Sure it's possible they're both prima donnas, but these events definitely signals some warning flags.

Yeah probably in scouting or in how we communicate expectations to players before each season. I don't think any of it has to do with Hartford, the coaches, or the structure down there.

 

[haohmaru]

Sure it's possible they're both prima donnas, but these events definitely signals some warning flags.

For the Rangers... and every other team in the NHL. Really dumb move on Lias’ part.

 

[ohbaby]

For the Rangers... and every other team in the NHL. Really dumb move on Lias’ part.

These kids don't strike me as being really stupid. Yes both of them VK and LA made stupid moves, no doubt. VK must have known he wouldn't get any support back in Russia being strictly a loaner who can get recalled at anytime. And LA must have known he has no leverage whatsoever in forcing a trade. So why did these young men make these seemingly desperate decisions? What forced them to come to these unfortunate moves? They had to have thought these things through. My only guess is that,... what they were going through was unbearable and was willing to suffer the consequences.

 

[Deleted member 23124]

These kids don't strike me as being really stupid. Yes both of them VK and LA made stupid moves, no doubt. VK must have known he wouldn't get any support back in Russia being strictly a loaner who can get recalled at anytime. And LA must have known he has no leverage whatsoever in forcing a trade. So why did these young men make these seemingly desperate decisions? What forced them to come to these unfortunate moves? They had to have thought these things through. My only guess is that,... what they were going through was unbearable and was willing to suffer the consequences.

My guess is that they were misled by their advisors. I don't think they made these decisions on their own.

 

[Leetch3]

https://podcasts.google.com/?feed=a...VkKHdJhBTkQieUEegQIAxAE&ep=6&at=1577555866591

Brian Burke discusses Andersson requesting a trade on the Sportsnet hockey central podcast. It starts around the 3:00 minute mark. Burke says if he were the GM he'd just tell Lias to shut up and play. Burke thinks they'll probably get a bag of pucks for Andersson. No reason for a GM to approach the Rangers with anything of value.

I wish I could like burke's comments more than once

 

[nyr2k2]

These kids don't strike me as being really stupid. Yes both of them VK and LA made stupid moves, no doubt. VK must have known he wouldn't get any support back in Russia being strictly a loaner who can get recalled at anytime. And LA must have known he has no leverage whatsoever in forcing a trade. So why did these young men make these seemingly desperate decisions? What forced them to come to these unfortunate moves? They had to have thought these things through. My only guess is that,... what they were going through was unbearable and was willing to suffer the consequences.

All the reports from Hartford have been how great the environment is this year. Lots of negative things about McCambridge and his staff, positive things about the new guys. You can tell in watching them that the level of instruction is like night and day from last year to this year.

Again, Andersson's reasons have been well-documented. He thought he was better than Howden and others and was pissed at how Quinn used him. He didn't think he belonged in the AHL. Kravtsov expected to make the Rangers--he said it since the end of his KHL season--and being sent to Hartford was probably a gut punch. That he was benched for sub-par play and not conforming to the system was the nail in the coffin for a kid who sounds pretty immature. I mean, he left after five games.

Not sure how you'd pin this on anything in Hartford, when everyone else--North American, Russian, European--seems to be doing just fine. Unless you count Gropp, LOL.

 

[ohbaby]

My guess is that they were misled by their advisors. I don't think they made these decisions on their own.

I'm sure they both talked this over with others. These are their futures they are mulling over, so you know there was lots of discussions. They must have been backed against the wall, to even consider the options they eventually put themselves in. Fortunately, VK had the option he chose in his contract. LA's choice was much worse off.

 

[ohbaby]

All the reports from Hartford have been how great the environment is this year. Lots of negative things about McCambridge and his staff, positive things about the new guys. You can tell in watching them that the level of instruction is like night and day from last year to this year.

Again, Andersson's reasons have been well-documented. He thought he was better than Howden and others and was pissed at how Quinn used him. He didn't think he belonged in the AHL. Kravtsov expected to make the Rangers--he said it since the end of his KHL season--and being sent to Hartford was probably a gut punch. That he was benched for sub-par play and not conforming to the system was the nail in the coffin for a kid who sounds pretty immature. I mean, he left after five games.

Not sure how you'd pin this on anything in Hartford, when everyone else--North American, Russian, European--seems to be doing just fine. Unless you count Gropp, LOL.

Well, like I originally said, this is the second time since the shake up in Hartford that this happened. And it might not be the last. I just think it might be a warning flag that something might not be right. Just something to keep an eye on.

Why would LA take such drastic measures? Doesn't make sense. He is obviously revolting against management. Much like VK did.

 

[nyr2k2]

Well, like I originally said, this is the second time since the shake up in Hartford that this happened. And it might not be the last. I just think it might be a warning flag that something might not be right. Just something to keep an eye on.

Why would LA take such drastic measures? Doesn't make sense. He is obviously revolting against management. Much like VK did.

Yes he's revolting against Rangers management. Not Hartford. That's my point. This is a Rangers issue, not a Hartford-specific issue. But you can believe what you want.

 

[BBKers]

Boy oh Boy...

 

[Deleted member 23124]

Yes he's revolting against Rangers management. Not Hartford. That's my point. This is a Rangers issue, not a Hartford-specific issue. But you can believe what you want.

I suspect both either assumed or were misled that they automatically had a spot on the big club.

 

[ohbaby]

Yes he's revolting against Rangers management. Not Hartford. That's my point. This is a Rangers issue, not a Hartford-specific issue. But you can believe what you want.

Six of one, half a dozen of the other. It's all the same. The shake up in Hartford was due to Rangers brass reorganizing.

All I'm saying it's something to keep an eye on. These kids are making moves that don't seem logical unless provoked.

 

[dshea19]

You can see how VK didn't get what was going on because he was confused about why Smith was playing on the 4th line and he was sent down. He didn't get that Smith has nothing to do with him since the Rangers view him as being better than a 4th liner. They sent him down to get major minutes in all important situations for his benefit. He just saw that an unimportant grinder was playing and he wasn't. Hopefully he understands that now. I am sure he was told that, but if your expectations are crushed, then you look for reasons beyond yourself. It was a failure to see the big picture. If he had gone back to the KHL and tore it up, it would have been great and he probably would have come back much more prepared for the NHL. Just a maturity/personal growth issue. He will be fine.

 

[nyr2k2]

Six of one, half a dozen of the other. It's all the same. The shake up in Hartford was due to Rangers brass reorganizing.

All I'm saying it's something to keep an eye on. These kids are making moves that don't seem logical unless provoked.

It's not six of one. You specifically said in your first post you thought something may be wrong with Hartford's management or coaches. I think the problem clearly rests a level above that, with the Rangers coaches and management. Neither player was willing to play in Hartford and it seems pretty apparent that was due to both viewing themselves as NHL players--and not some problem endemic to Hartford.

But again. You can frame it how you want. I think the team needs to do a better job communicating with young prospects, particularly those from outside North America, about expectations. But beyond that, if guys are immature like Kravtsov or have bad attitudes like Andersson (there were signs I didn't really want to acknowledge), there's only so much you can do. Scout better, I guess.

 

[Baby Duck Homme]

It's not six of one. You specifically said in your first post you thought something may be wrong with Hartford's management or coaches. I think the problem clearly rests a level above that, with the Rangers coaches and management. Neither player was willing to play in Hartford and it seems pretty apparent that was due to both viewing themselves as NHL players--and not some problem endemic to Hartford.

But again. You can frame it how you want. I think the team needs to do a better job communicating with young prospects, particularly those from outside North America, about expectations. But beyond that, if guys are immature like Kravtsov or have bad attitudes like Andersson (there were signs I didn't really want to acknowledge), there's only so much you can do. Scout better, I guess.

I read a JD interview where he specifically discussed the need for the Rangers to develop a better support system for young international prospects. He identified that as an area for improvement and there has been some odd behavior from a few of them this year. I agree that the kids need to take accountability but there is blame to share. JD knew that young foreign players who are instrumental to the rebuild need better support and that has definitely become a topic this year.

Edit: here is the link from the interview in June: https://www.google.com/amp/s/nypost...irst-rangers-priority-is-an-ahl-overhaul/amp/

it does make you wonder if he had any inkling of some coming discontent from VK and LA.

 

[ohbaby]

It's not six of one. You specifically said in your first post you thought something may be wrong with Hartford's management or coaches. I think the problem clearly rests a level above that, with the Rangers coaches and management. Neither player was willing to play in Hartford and it seems pretty apparent that was due to both viewing themselves as NHL players--and not some problem endemic to Hartford.
I think the team needs to do a better job communicating with young prospects,...

Hartford's management is just an extension of the Rangers organization. You are talking semantics. And it was what happened in Hartford specifically that soured VK into going back to Russia. So whether it has to do with the Rangers or Hartford, it's all the same. The Rangers are responsible for what happens on the farm. And it was most likely that problem of communicating with the young prospects that lead to this. But I don't rule out they were both spoiled being top prospects expecting more. Just something to keep an eye on.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

Boy oh Boy...

To what are you referring...?

 

[nyr2k2]

Hartford's management is just an extension of the Rangers organization. You are talking semantics. And it was what happened in Hartford specifically that soured VK into going back to Russia. So whether it has to do with the Rangers or Hartford, it's all the same. The Rangers are responsible for what happens on the farm. And it was most likely that problem of communicating with the young prospects that lead to this. But I don't rule out they were both spoiled being top prospects expecting more. Just something to keep an eye on.

It's not semantics. Maybe I'm doing a poor job of stating my views on this so I'll try one final time.

People are now expressing concern with sending guys to Hartford because of what has happened with Kravtsov and Andersson. "The situation" in Hartford is concerning, as I've seen. This is not true.

The situation in Hartford is good, a positive environment where guys are developing. The issue is not with what Hartford IS--the issue for our two problem children is what Hartford IS NOT. And what it is not, is the NHL. You had two kids, Andersson who thinks he's better than Howden and doesn't want to play with Smith, he doesn't think he belongs in the AHL in general. Not that he doesn't belong in Hartford specifically. Same for Kravtsov, who apparently assumed he'd be on the NHL team. He doesn't want to be in the AHL, and then he's benched, and he leaves after five games. Would he have wanted to leave after five NHL games if he was benched? Really, really doubtful. Not a problem with Hartford, but a problem with an AHL assignment and not understanding what he needs to do to get to the NHL.

The Rangers need to do a better job providing support for these players, as JD acknowledged, and communicate better with them about expectations, including expectations when/if they're sent down. I agree this bears watching and needs to improve. But again, it's not a problem with the Hartford coaching staff or in the locker room or anything. You can say it's a Drury issue, but he's a Rangers employee who oversees Hartford. It's a Rangers problem. Knoblauch couldn't have done anything differently, he's doing great down there building a real culture and system. JD and Drury and whoever else need to do better.

But even then, Andersson seems to be a malcontent. Kravtsov had his EAC which was negotiated, and while it was stupid to use it, that was his right. Andersson chose to quit both on-ice and off-ice. That's on him. Again, improve the communications, improve the support. But by all means, send anyone and everyone to Hartford, because from all reports it's a great environment and the kids are developing well--those that are committed, anyway. That's all I've got.

 

[offdacrossbar]

with these two specific players its nothing more than maturity and entitlement.

with Kravtsov, he believed he was better than he really was. kid was not nearly ready to play top NHL minutes. his play away from the puck was awful. he's a top 6 offensive type player or nothing at this point. even Kakko has struggled and he was worlds more prepared than Kravtsov was.

Kravtsov needs to watch Artemi when he doesn't have the puck. that's a top NHL player who knows what he's doing. Kravtsov was the polar opposite. then he sulked.

as for Lias, he was demoted and he took it personally. he should know better. he reacted emotionally and let that effect his effort. he's not nearly talented enough to make it on talent alone. minus effort, we get what we got. no production.

maturity and feeling like they belonged when they didn't. that's the problem here.

I expect Lias to eat some crow similar to Kravtsov and both be in Hartford together playing soon.

this is a business boys. no room for emotional immature outbursts and tantrums. grow the f*** up.

 

[Brooklyn Ranger]

Oh, c'mon, Brooklyn. You know the coach isn't going to throw him under the bus.

I'm talking about what posters here who watch the Pack live and in person have said.

Yes, but D there's always a but) so much happens outside of games--Knoblauch is the only person in the organization who has been quoted directly about the situation. Plus, he sees all the things that happens within games and most importantly outside of them as well. If Andersson had been such a head case why wasn't his ice time reduced/sat out a game?

Knoblauch doesn't need to say anything, no one else in the organization has--but he did. If nothing else he left the door for Andersson to return to the Wolfpack--which would probably be the best outcome (short of a trade) for all parties.

 

[Chaels Arms]

I think something else that definitely got lost in translation with both Andersson and Kravtsov in coming over to North America is that being sent to the AHL is not a personal or professional insult to them as hockey players. They both seem to view playing in that league as the worst event in the world, as if it's "beneath" them. It's entirely possible this is a cultural difference stemming from having two young players who had already established themselves in the top league in their home countries. I think when dealing with NA players the AHL doesn't carry that same stigma. Moving forward the Rangers should be careful to make abundantly clear to all the prospects they bring in that getting sent to the AHL isn't a death sentence, it's a move done to ensure the player has the skills and experience needed to swim, not sink, at the next level.

 

[mike14]

I think something else that definitely got lost in translation with both Andersson and Kravtsov in coming over to North America is that being sent to the AHL is not a personal or professional insult to them as hockey players. They both seem to view playing in that league as the worst event in the world, as if it's "beneath" them. It's entirely possible this is a cultural difference stemming from having two young players who had already established themselves in the top league in their home countries. I think when dealing with NA players the AHL doesn't carry that same stigma. Moving forward the Rangers should be careful to make abundantly clear to all the prospects they bring in that getting sent to the AHL isn't a death sentence, it's a move done to ensure the player has the skills and experience needed to swim, not sink, at the next level.

Andersson played over 60 games for the Pack before this season. I think he was aware of what the AHL was like...