Leon Draisaitl vs Nikita Kucherov: Who is the Best European Forward?

[wasunder]

Give me kucherov but it’s really close. They produce similarly offensively, but Drai gets to play with the best player in the world by far on the PP which boosts his numbers, not that kucheroc plays with slouches, but I feel the McDavid-drai connection is more substantial. But Drai also the superior goal scorer. All in all a very slight edge to kucherov

 

[McVespa99]

We're not about to act like Stamkos or Point are better than McDavid who boosts all his teammate's stats. Kucherov is the best forward on his team. Draisaitl is not. Even then, they're still very close in stats

Noone is as good as McDavid. But Drai doesnt play with him all the time and Tampa has way better defencemen. And Depth. Quality of teammates goes to Tampa other than McD.

 

[Duke74]

Kucherov easily. Drai is a PP merchant and sucks defensively

Did you come up with that brilliant insight from actually watching games or from reading regurgitated narratives and merely parroting them?

Here's a newsflash: Elite players generally produce on the power play because their coaches trust them in that situation and they collaborate with other elite players, thus resulting in production bumps. This applies to Kucherov, MacKinnon, Makar, and every other star.

Here's another newsflash: Many elite forwards prioritize offence over defence, most notably Kane and Ovechkin. But I rarely or never hear people dismiss their talent or question their status. These narratives only apply to Draisaitl apparently.

 

[blundluntman]

Noone is as good as McDavid. But Drai doesnt play with him all the time and Tampa has way better defencemen. And Depth. Quality of teammates goes to Tampa other than McD.

McDavid and Hyman are actually Draisaitl's most common linemates over the season though. Not to mention they're on the same powerplay unit. I admit Tampa has a great team around Kucherov but I think Draisaitl's numbers are inflated since he plays with the best player in the world. Even Nugent Hopkins is on pace for 100 points last time I checked. I do think it could go both ways but I'm on Kucherov's side

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

If your team (who won the president's trophy that season) gets swept in the first round and you score 2 points in that series does that make you a good playoff performer? That's Kucherov.

We get it, you value team success over everything. That's not what the poll is asking. It doesn't take a genius to realize one player has more playoff experience than the other. In the games draisaitl has played he has outpaced Kucherov in PPG. Yeah his sample size isn't the same as Kucherov's but you go with what data is available.


Nothing gets past you.

You mean the same Kucherov who has 35 more playoff points than anyone else over the last decade, and has led the NHL in playoff scoring twice in the last 3 years? That guy?

And, I get it, you don't think success matters, as long as you put up big numbers while losing. Well, no, I don't get it, but I can at least recognize it. If you think putting up gaudy numbers against the Kings and Flames is more impressive than what Kucherov has done over the last decade, you have fun with that.

 

[PensandCaps]

Offense is basically the same. Kucherov isn't a turnstile defensively...so edge to him.

 

[BurnabyJoe7]

You mean the same Kucherov who has 35 more playoff points than anyone else over the last decade, and has led the NHL in playoff scoring twice in the last 3 years? That guy?

And, I get it, you don't think success matters, as long as you put up big numbers while losing. Well, no, I don't get it, but I can at least recognize it. If you think putting up gaudy numbers against the Kings and Flames is more impressive than what Kucherov has done over the last decade, you have fun with that.

Great strawman. I didn't say Draisaitl has a more impressive playoff record. I said he has a higher ppg average in the playoffs which is a fact.

You continue to move the goalposts when the discussion has always been who is the better player. Best to just not engage if your sole contribution is to argue something else.

Mike trout has been the best baseball player for almost the last half decade and likely won't be winning a world series anytime soon because management refuses to build a competitive team around him. That doesn't mean Alex Bregman is a better player than him.

 

[Tufted Titmouse]

I like Rantanen and Kaprizov over both. I think environment accounts for a lot of the production differences.

 

[J T Money]

I like Rantanen and Kaprizov over both. I think environment accounts for a lot of the production differences.

 

[PB37]

I think it's Drai.

Their career averages are very similar but I think Drai is the better goal scorer and he has the ability to play the more important position.

 

[Tufted Titmouse]

View attachment 670162

 

[McNuge]

Both are top 5 players in the game no matter which way you slice it imo. But... anyone claiming Drai playing with McDavid is more beneficial than what Kucherov is surrounded by is out to lunch.

McDavid also heavily benefits from Drai. He can hit stretch passes tape to tape, forehand or back hand, better than anyone in the league. It was literally them 2 and one other forward in RNH who would be considered a top 6 player and then dog shit. But despite that... Drai put up multiple 100+ point seasons. Multiple 50+ goal seasons.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

Great strawman. I didn't say Draisaitl has a more impressive playoff record. I said he has a higher ppg average in the playoffs which is a fact.

You continue to move the goalposts when the discussion has always been who is the better player. Best to just not engage if your sole contribution is to argue something else.

Mike trout has been the best baseball player for almost the last half decade and likely won't be winning a world series anytime soon because management refuses to build a competitive team around him. That doesn't mean Alex Bregman is a better player than him.

And I'm saying that a higher PPG rate in a much smaller sample size doesn't make you a better playoff performer than the guy with 35 more playoff points than anyone else in the league over the decade, so your "fact" is pretty much meaningless in context of which one is the better player. Kucherov is very clearly the better playoff performer up to this point, regardless of the 26 points Draisaitl scored in 12 games against the Flames and Kings last year.

Any chance you'd like to refute what I'm actually saying, or would you prefer to make more irrelevant baseball references?

 

[authentic]

Yeah the more I think about it Draisaitl is better. Just a much better goal scorer and he's been outproducing him the past 3 seasons in the regular season and playoffs. I don't think anyone who's claiming Kucherov is better defensively watches them both play much either. Draisaitl is +46 on Edmonton the past 3 seasons and Kucherov is +27 on Tampa. Draisaitl also putting up better powerplay numbers on top of that.

 

[BurnabyJoe7]

And I'm saying that a higher PPG rate in a much smaller sample size doesn't make you a better playoff performer than the guy with 35 more playoff points than anyone else in the league over the decade, so your "fact" is pretty much meaningless in context of which one is the better player. Kucherov is very clearly the better playoff performer up to this point, regardless of the 26 points Draisaitl scored in 12 games against the Flames and Kings last year.

Any chance you'd like to refute what I'm actually saying, or would you prefer to make more irrelevant baseball references?

Kucherov's playoff resume is more impressive, I've never refuted that. The reason for that is because he plays on a much better team. He wouldn't have that playoff resume if he played for the oilers because the oilers didn't make the playoffs for half of those years.

You're hopeless if you can't make that connection and remove your team performance bias in comparing players. But carry on with the strawman and keep fighting the good fight

 

[Three On Zero]

Offense is basically the same. Kucherov isn't a turnstile defensively...so edge to him.

Kucherov also dictates play a lot more when he’s on the ice. Draisiatl isn’t much of a threat if he doesn’t have McDavid with him. If you could add one guy to your roster for a playoff run, you always take Kucherov

 

[Mez]

Super close. Can't really be wrong choosing either. I'll go for the homer pick since he's about to compete his 3rd 50g50a season.

 

[AnInjuredJasonZucker]

kucherov, drai is a pee pee specialist at best

Draisaitl is 2nd in powerplay points. Kucherov is waaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy down the list at...(checks notes)...4th. Yeah, Drai is a only a powerplay guy and Kuch basically only scores at evens.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

Kucherov's playoff resume is more impressive, I've never refuted that. The reason for that is because he plays on a much better team. He wouldn't have that playoff resume if he played for the oilers because the oilers didn't make the playoffs for half of those years.

You're hopeless if you can't make that connection and remove your team performance bias in comparing players. But carry on with the strawman and keep fighting the good fight

If that's what you want to believe. I think the reason is that Kucherov's playoff performance has spanned multiple years and doesn't rely heavily on 2 playoff series against mediocre teams in a single season. Consistency matters, no matter how many excuses you can come up with about why your guy isn't consistent.

 

[McNuge]

If that's what you want to believe. I think the reason is that Kucherov's playoff performance has spanned multiple years and doesn't rely heavily on 2 playoff series against mediocre teams in a single season. Consistency matters, no matter how many excuses you can come up with about why your guy isn't consistent.

I don't like Calgary at all but how the hell do you think that team was mediocre last year? They were one of the best teams in the league full stop.

 

[Duke74]

Kucherov also dictates play a lot more when he’s on the ice. Draisiatl isn’t much of a threat if he doesn’t have McDavid with him. If you could add one guy to your roster for a playoff run, you always take Kucherov

The problem is, at least historically, that if Draisaitl doeesn't play with McDavid, he has had a wide selection of Ty Rattie, Alex Chaisson, Drake Cagguila, Toby Reider, Dominik Kahun, Milan Lucic, Jesse Puljujarvi, Jujhar Khaira, and, most recently, Kailer Yamamoto to drag around. If you put Draisaitl with real top 6 players, like Nugent-Hopkins, Hyman, or Kane, he produces without McDavid. Chiarelli gutted the team so badly that only recently have the Oilers begun to amass more offensive depth.

In contrast, Kucherov has always played with at least one of Point or Stamkos as well as a stud defenceman like Hedman to bolster the offence (in comparison to Klefbom or Nurse). So, by your logic, why isn't Kucherov punished for playing with stars? I'd be interested to see how he would perform with Kailer Yamamoto on one side and a centre like Ryan McLeod.

 

[Three On Zero]

The problem is, at least historically, that if Draisaitl doeesn't play with McDavid, he has had a wide selection of Ty Rattie, Alex Chaisson, Drake Cagguila, Toby Reider, Dominik Kahun, Milan Lucic, Jesse Puljujarvi, Jujhar Khaira, and, most recently, Kailer Yamamoto to drag around. If you put Draisaitl with real top 6 players, like Nugent-Hopkins, Hyman, or Kane, he produces without McDavid. Chiarelli gutted the team so badly that only recently have the Oilers begun to amass more offensive depth.

In contrast, Kucherov has always played with at least one of Point or Stamkos as well as a stud defenceman like Hedman to bolster the offence (in comparison to Klefbom or Nurse). So, by your logic, why isn't Kucherov punished for playing with stars? I'd be interested to see how he would perform with Kailer Yamamoto on one side and a centre like Ryan McLeod.

Flawed argument, a player supposedly that good should be noticeable even if he isn’t collecting as many points because of his line mates

 

[BurnabyJoe7]

If that's what you want to believe. I think the reason is that Kucherov's playoff performance has spanned multiple years and doesn't rely heavily on 2 playoff series against mediocre teams in a single season. Consistency matters, no matter how many excuses you can come up with about why your guy isn't consistent.

Leon is the epitome of consistent. You keep mentioning he was only good in the 2 playoff series last year but he had a higher career playoff ppg than Kucherov even before last year's playoffs. You're taking Ls even with your strawman arguments.

Playing on a team with a #1D, the best goalie in the league and another future HOFer in Stamkos is out of Draisaitl's control.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

I don't like Calgary at all but how the hell do you think that team was mediocre last year? They were one of the best teams in the league full stop.

Because it's Calgary, and they've been mediocre in the playoffs every year since 2003-04. The fact that they managed to put together a decent regular season doesn't change that.

 

[Le Magnifique 66]

Kucherov still