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Player Discussion Leo Carlsson

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Hockey Duckie said:
I think the model PV is doing is the NCAA model. Play two games close together and then four to five days off to work out and rest. It's not dependent on how weak or strong the opponent is.

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Carlsson played against the Stars (Oct 19th) and Yotes (Oct 21). Missing the Columbus game makes sense if following the NCAA model. The next two games Carlsson will be playing in will be against the Bruins and Flyers. He won't play for a week between Oct 29th to Nov 4th. Afterwards, his next two games will be at home against VGK and Pitt.

Welp, that's my guess.
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Lol this is all nonsensee.
 


7. Can’t help but think of Steven Stamkoswhen it comes to Leo Carlsson. During Stamkos’s rookie year of 2008-09, he played less than 10 minutes in three of his first four games and seven of the first 40. It was clear the Lightning didn’t think he was ready, but weren’t going to send him back to OHL Sarnia. When Rick Tocchet took over as head coach, he scratched Stamkos three times, with the purpose of using that time as a teaching/fitness tool. It wasn’t easy on the player, who eventually admitted it was a very good thing for him. (Tocchet also put Stamkos on a line with Martin St. Louis. You have to put scorers with creators.)

Ducks GM Pat Verbeek was hired by Tampa Bay the following season, so he saw first-hand the aftermath. He’s made it very clear that, to start the year, Anaheim will be even more aggressive in sitting out Carlsson as he adapts to North America. Seeing Montreal’s Juraj Slafkovsky take physical punishment last season — and Toronto’s Roni Hirvonen take a massive hit during development camp — there’s such an adjustment to the NHL game for Europeans.

Verbeek’s idea is very intriguing, and you know other teams are watching. Key is to have the player and agent (Matt Keator) buying in, which is the case. One thing we’re learning about Verbeek: he commits to what he believes across the organization whether you like it or not. Head coach Greg Cronin did not like Trevor Zegras’s carelessness during Tuesday’s win over Columbus, and the talented forward did not play the final 25 minutes.
 
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Ducks in a row said:
He needs to be playing games either in the NHL or elsewhere.
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I don’t think the number of games in the nhl is for optimal player development. It is for optimal $$$. I’m pretty confident that fewer games with more S&C plus more practice and video review is better for development.
 
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I actually think the load management is a great idea for all young players and rookies with the amount of rest dependent on how much s&c needed. What are great way to get several days of technical skating, in depth video review and skill refinement. I wouldn’t mind Minty and Mac taking a day off every other week.
 
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I don't get how it's so hard for some of you to believe that the load management talk is actually what it says. The Friedman bit about Verbeek having learned from how Stamkos was brought into the league only makes it clearer.

And at the same time, I don't think any of us should be screaming murder when he's not out there every game. Playing 82 games a season is gruelling. It's not necessarily "necessary for development" for a guy to be out there every single game if there are other things they can do while sitting out. Especially for someone with the IQ of Carlsson.

I'm all for what they're doing, honestly.
 
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Verbeek has been unconventional before.

We started Mac at left wing in his rookie season last year. Then after 9 games, we decided to start Mac at center.

  • Mac playing center
    • Gm 10 vs SJ: 4C at 6:31 TOI. Line: Jones-Mac-Leason
    • Gm 11 vs Van: 4C at 9:41 TOI. Line: Jones-Mac-Leason
      ...
    • Gm 18 vs StL: 2C at 19:00 TOI. Line: Vatrano-Mac-Strome
    • Gm 19 vs StL: 4C at 15:46 TOI. Line: Jones-Mac-Leason

When we made Mac 2C in the first game against the St Louis back-to-back series, Mac's line was the only line who held up in the game and the rest of our centers were being completely dominated. In the 3rd period of that first game, we separated Mac and Strome to make Strome a center again. That gave the team a second line of beef at center in the third period that we carried that same setup in the second game of the b2b. We looked decent in the second game instead of being completely dominated.

Many on here were mad that Mac only got 6:31 in his first game as center. Me, I was just happy that we were playing Mac at center b/c I thought he should have started at center to begin with. Mac did show early that he was physically up for playing center as a 19-year old. Although he did lose steam around game 50, he was still able to put up points to close out the season with 15 points in the last 30 games.

McTavish2022-23Splits
Game setPositionGamesPointsPPG+/-
1 to 9LW
9​
4​
0.44​
-5​
10 to 384C to 2C
29​
16​
0.55​
-8​
39 to 501C
12​
8​
0.67​
2​
51 to 80Top-6C
30​
15​
0.50​
-8​

Part of the reason we were unconventional with Mac was because he was an 19-year old, CHL prospect who cannot play in the AHL due to the CHL-NHL agreement. A CHL prospect can only play in the AHL if they turned 20 before Jan 1st of that season. Mac turned 20 years old in Jan, disqualifying him from playing in the AHL.

Verbeek got a trial run with Mac last year. When playing with top players in game set 39-50, Mac's production went up and the defensive play was positive. Then he crashed. Mac had a long D+1 season and no proper summer for rest, recovery, and training.

With Carlsson, it's even more unconventional. We're treating his first two months as a training ground in the NHL instead of sending him down to the AHL. NHL reps at an NCAA schedule, with the hopes that stamina can build within two months to become a full-time NHL 1C.
 
Dryish said:
I don't get how it's so hard for some of you to believe that the load management talk is actually what it says. The Friedman bit about Verbeek having learned from how Stamkos was brought into the league only makes it clearer.

And at the same time, I don't think any of us should be screaming murder when he's not out there every game. Playing 82 games a season is gruelling. It's not necessarily "necessary for development" for a guy to be out there every single game if there are other things they can do while sitting out. Especially for someone with the IQ of Carlsson.

I'm all for what they're doing, honestly.
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It was pretty obvious Mac was exhausted by end of last yr. I have no issues with them managing Leo early on.
Also don't mind side effect of seeing how shit Z is so far. Missing most of camp definitely did not help his play so far.
 
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Dryish said:
I don't get how it's so hard for some of you to believe that the load management talk is actually what it says. The Friedman bit about Verbeek having learned from how Stamkos was brought into the league only makes it clearer.

And at the same time, I don't think any of us should be screaming murder when he's not out there every game. Playing 82 games a season is gruelling. It's not necessarily "necessary for development" for a guy to be out there every single game if there are other things they can do while sitting out. Especially for someone with the IQ of Carlsson.

I'm all for what they're doing, honestly.
Click to expand...

And I don't know how some of you believe everything that comes out of the GM's/coaches mouth. Verbeek said he'd be letting our prospects season before they got to the NHL, turns out that isn't true.
 
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JeffreyLFC said:
How many of them were taken 2nd overall?
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2021 draft, the Michigan players and soon to be player (L. Hughes).

1st OA. D Power
2nd OA. C Beniers
4th OA. D L. Hughes
5th OA. C Kent Johnson

All four stayed two seasons with the Michigan program.

If we throw in 3rd OA McTavish, then between the top-5 selections of the 2021 draft class, a total of 9 NHL games were played before their D+2 season started. Those 9 NHL games all belong to McTavish.

2022 draft, another Michigan 1st round player staying two seasons: 14th OA RW McGroarty

Fantilli foregoing the second season with Michigan bucks the recent trend of staying a second year with Michigan 1st round selections.
 
Dryish said:
I don't get how it's so hard for some of you to believe that the load management talk is actually what it says. The Friedman bit about Verbeek having learned from how Stamkos was brought into the league only makes it clearer.

And at the same time, I don't think any of us should be screaming murder when he's not out there every game. Playing 82 games a season is gruelling. It's not necessarily "necessary for development" for a guy to be out there every single game if there are other things they can do while sitting out. Especially for someone with the IQ of Carlsson.

I'm all for what they're doing, honestly.
Click to expand...
This needs to be a 'dont make me tap the sign' sign posted up all over whenever people here, and ESPECIALLY the main boards give insane takes over why the handling of Carlsson is worth criticizing
 
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