Confirmed with Link: Leddy + Witkowski for Sundqvist + Walman + 2nd 2023

[Majorityof1]

The idea that Sunny was cap dump wasn't just fan fancy. Army basically said as much. In flat cap era you can't pay his $ for 4th liner. You just can't.

As to whether Leddy name came up, I've mentioned him multiple times. I even predicted last night we would deal for him (and Braun, who went to Rangers). I'm not saying he is the solution, but I do think he can help. I don't love dealing 2nd, but adding Leddy and shedding $ this summer are both positives that combined probably justify it.

Sunqvist is a 3rd liner on most other teams in the league. $2.75m is not too much for a 3rd liner who is good on the PK. Army was justifying the move. Of course he is, he just made it. I think Army is wrong. I'm not on calls with him, so he might know better. I just have seen teams take cap for less than a 2nd, and lesser players (with smaller cap hits granted) return positive assets. Something could have been worked out to move Sundqvist in the off season without paying a 2nd in a good draft year. And that's based on his performance so far this year. It would be even easier to move him if he improves over the rest of the year.

 

[Bye Bye Blueston]

Sunqvist is a 3rd liner on most other teams in the league. $2.75m is not too much for a 3rd liner who is good on the PK. Army was justifying the move. Of course he is, he just made it. I think Army is wrong. I'm not on calls with him, so he might know better. I just have seen teams take cap for less than a 2nd, and lesser players (with smaller cap hits granted) return positive assets. Something could have been worked out to move Sundqvist in the off season without paying a 2nd in a good draft year. And that's based on his performance so far this year. It would be even easier to move him if he improves over the rest of the year.

Don't you think if other teams valued Sunny as positive asset at that price and offered us picks for him we woulda taken them up on it? We have been trying to clear space for a while. National reporters been saying as much. Army isn't always right, but he's not an idiot.

 

[parliamentlite]

Sucks to lose Sunny, I've grown to really like him as a player but I'd be lying if I said I saw that guy this year. Wish him all the best.

Clearly the front office is looking for more puck moving on LD, that's been a trend.

Scandella was an absolute monster his first season here before a steady decline and I'm hoping Leddy finds himself similarly rejuvenated with this chance and plays his ass off for a contract *somewhere*.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

 

[Majorityof1]

Don't you think if other teams valued Sunny as positive asset at that price and offered us picks for him we woulda taken them up on it? We have been trying to clear space for a while. National reporters been saying as much. Army isn't always right, but he's not an idiot.

Depends what other teams were offering for him. If they were offering a 4th or a 5th, then he may have liked Leddy better than a 2nd and a 5th. He'd be wrong, but that could be his position.

 

[Bye Bye Blueston]

Depends what other teams were offering for him. If they were offering a 4th or a 5th, then he may have liked Leddy better than a 2nd and a 5th. He'd be wrong, but that could be his position.

Let's go with that. Let's suppose we were offered 4th to dump Sunny, which I think is generous. Has Army ever done anything to indicate he values 4th round picks highly? If he knew that Sunny was positive asset (which I doubt) when he made trade today, he wouldn't have hesitated to deal 2nd and 4th for player he was willing to deal 2nd for. Not saying Army is infallible, but you need to understand how he views different assets and why. Either he knew Sunny was negative asset and was willing to pay more for Leddy because of it or he knew he was only slight positive asset and was willing to throw that in. Either way, everything Army has done over past several years has shown us he doesn't place significant value on picks beyond top 40 or so because that is where tipping point seems to be as to whether it's likely you get legit NHLer.

 

[Majorityof1]

Let's go with that. Let's suppose we were offered 4th to dump Sunny, which I think is generous. Has Army ever done anything to indicate he values 4th round picks highly? If he knew that Sunny was positive asset (which I doubt) when he made trade today, he wouldn't have hesitated to deal 2nd and 4th for player he was willing to deal 2nd for. Not saying Army is infallible, but you need to understand how he views different assets and why. Either he knew Sunny was negative asset and was willing to pay more for Leddy because of it or he knew he was only slight positive asset and was willing to throw that in. Either way, everything Army has done over past several years has shown us he doesn't place significant value on picks beyond top 40 or so because that is where tipping point seems to be as to whether it's likely you get legit NHLer.

My point wasn't that we could get something Army would value, it was that we could get something. I don't care if we get future considerations for Sunny in the off-season, that is much better than getting Leddy and spending a 2nd. Ledy is not worth a 2nd. Leddy isn't worth a 3rd and he isn't worth a fifth. The fact we gave up any asset to get Leddy isn't helped by moving Sunqvist. We could have moved him for less than the 2nd after the season. We got worse for this playoff and gave up more assets than would have been required in the off-season for the privalage of being worse. Losing Sunny hurts, not a ton, but it hurts. Gaining Leddy hurts because he is bad and trading for him means we will try to use him.

 

[Stupendous Yappi]

Too many teams are close to the Cap to expect to deal Sundqvist at the trade deadline for a positive asset AND recoup all his cap space. Only teams that are sellers could take on his salary without sending salary back. If you look at those facts, its no surprise that he was a throw-in in a slight overpayment trade. Armstrong valued his cap space above any return for him. And Detroit didn't necessarily want Sundqvist as much as the future asset of a 2nd.

I see this as a good trade for both sides. Blues overpay slightly, but that Cap space is going to allow them to keep another asset on the team who won't show up on the trade balance sheet, but will be possible because of moving Sundqvist.

 

[DatDude44]

Yes, the 2nd is annoying to give up but Walman is nothing for me, just doesn’t have the brain and Sunny as much as I love him is only getting worse, has two bum hips and acl surgery while also carrying a 2.75 mill cap hit.

Leddy isn’t sexy, leddys analytic results don’t look great, but a lot of that can be contributed to the team he’s on and how he’s been deployed, I’m interested to see what a rejuvenated guy that can skate and move the puck like this can do, I luv the fit given his strengths and skill set with paraykos as well as the cap flexibility we’ll have in the off-season. And it’s still a message to the room that we want to contend and at worst we only cost ourselvrs a 2nd rd pick in two years

My thought was if we were gonna have any chance at contending we needed to add a LHD that can move the puck. Would I have loved Lindholm, gio or chycrun? Absolutely, but I’m happy we didn’t outbid any of those final offers for those guys. But my plan C was hoping we’d get Leddy at 50% retained for cheap, I don’t love how much we gave up which is why I don’t love the trade, but for now, I like it and am low key excited to see how it plays out. NYI went to back to back eastern conference finals with leddy on their top pair I believe

 

[Bye Bye Blueston]

My point wasn't that we could get something Army would value, it was that we could get something. I don't care if we get future considerations for Sunny in the off-season, that is much better than getting Leddy and spending a 2nd. Ledy is not worth a 2nd. Leddy isn't worth a 3rd and he isn't worth a fifth. The fact we gave up any asset to get Leddy isn't helped by moving Sunqvist. We could have moved him for less than the 2nd after the season. We got worse for this playoff and gave up more assets than would have been required in the off-season for the privalage of being worse. Losing Sunny hurts, not a ton, but it hurts. Gaining Leddy hurts because he is bad and trading for him means we will try to use him.

We shall see, but I expect that adding Ledy will do the opposite of hurt.

 

[HighNote]

Kind of a head-scratcher for me. There must be a long-term plan as far as making a bigger splash at the draft or in the offseason. Otherwise this trade is just...meh. I don't mind Leddy the player, and I think he has more to give on a playoff team with better teammates. However, Sundqvist, Walman and a 2nd is just too much for what I can only assume will be 21 games + playoffs of Leddy and an even older defenseman that can't crack a bad Detroit lineup in Witkowski. This trade might make us better for the rest of the year/playoffs, but we'll see. Obviously it will also free up some cap space for next season with Sunny being gone, but I can't help but think there were better ways to free up that space.

Let's see how Leddy plays down the stretch and/or if the extra bit of cap space at the end of the year opens the door for whatever Army has up his sleeve. Otherwise this is looking like a bad trade.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Leddy is gonna score a hatty in game seven of the cup finals. And the Blues fanbase is going to have a collective aneurysm

Leddy is going to wear number 4 for the Blues. The last Blues player to wear number 4 did this.

 

[Pizza!Pizza!]

Witwowski plays wing as well, he's not just a D. If you can even call him a wing or a D. He is a talentless thug.

He'll be invaluable if the Blues play the Flames in the playoffs.

 

[ChicagoBlues]

He'll be invaluable if the Blues play the Flames in the playoffs.

Throw in some Crazy Sauce and we’re good!

 

[Thallis]

Too many teams are close to the Cap to expect to deal Sundqvist at the trade deadline for a positive asset AND recoup all his cap space. Only teams that are sellers could take on his salary without sending salary back. If you look at those facts, its no surprise that he was a throw-in in a slight overpayment trade. Armstrong valued his cap space above any return for him. And Detroit didn't necessarily want Sundqvist as much as the future asset of a 2nd.

I see this as a good trade for both sides. Blues overpay slightly, but that Cap space is going to allow them to keep another asset on the team who won't show up on the trade balance sheet, but will be possible because of moving Sundqvist.

I don't see why we'd have to deal Sundqvist now. 2.75 is absolutely movable at the draft or over the off-season.

 

[ChicagoBlues]

Thank you, Sunny! We are also...ahem...great full.

 

[Bye Bye Blueston]

Thank you, Sunny! We are also...ahem...great full.

That’s what happens after a good steak. You feel great full.

 

[LGB]

I don't see why we'd have to deal Sundqvist now. 2.75 is absolutely movable at the draft or over the off-season.

I think salary had to be moved out to fit Leddy. I assume Scandella was the first cap dump Army offered them but they wanted too much to take him.

 

[ChicagoBlues]

That’s what happens after a good steak. You feel great full.

Happy Birthday to Sunny (March 23).

 

[simon IC]

Meh. Another smallish defenseman that will need sheltering. Can't get enough of those, I guess. At least we gained some cap space, which I think (hope?) was DA's priority. Not thrilled.

 

[jura]

love u sunny! #champs4ever

 

[ChicagoBlues]

Meh. Another smallish defenseman that will need sheltering. Can't get enough of those, I guess. At least we gained some cap space, which I think (hope?) was DA's priority. Not thrilled.

That's pretty much where I'm at, except I'm a little more hopeful than others that Leddy will fit in well and has plenty left to give.

Otherwise...meh...cap space....cool. Leddy is here to help out for only the rest of the season, right? Please say yes, DA!

 

[Pizza!Pizza!]

Leddy did look good for Detroit whenever he was rested. Shelter his minutes a bit and he should be a contributor for the Blues.

 

[Xerloris]

I don't see why we'd have to deal Sundqvist now. 2.75 is absolutely movable at the draft or over the off-season.

Can't always guarantee that. Sunny's health is also in question considering we had to start sitting him a intermittently just so he could handle playing.

That's pretty much where I'm at, except I'm a little more hopeful than others that Leddy will fit in well and has plenty left to give.

Otherwise...meh...cap space....cool. Leddy is here to help out for only the rest of the season, right? Please say yes, DA!

I'm fairly optimistic. I always hope for the best and I try not to get to down on the team except for Sanford, f*** that guy.

Leddy did look good for Detroit whenever he was rested. Shelter his minutes a bit and he should be a contributor for the Blues.

A new team heading to the playoffs might rejuvenate him enough for a good run here at the end of the season.

 

[Novacain]

It's possible he was awful on red wings, good on isles, and can be good again on better team than wings. likely even.

The biggest problem with this argument is there is no real advanced statistical info I can find that says he actually was good on the Islanders.

https://img-s-msn-com.akamaized.net/tenant/amp/entityid/BB1gL3wN.img?w=768&h=475&m=6

There isn't much evidence Leddy's play really dipped in Detroit, so much as he just happened to move away from a Barry Trotz coached team which always managed to outprodue there advanced statistics. It is true he is good in transition, but that's basically his one real defining skill at this point. The rest of his game isn't good enough, and he's past 30 and multiple years off from his peak already.

We are also in a pickle here. Because let's say he does show up and play well for a stretch. We saw what happened the last time we made a trade to fill a gapping void on D and the player came in and played well for a short amount of time: Army over reacted to a short sample size and committed too much money. So even if he plays well, it miht not end up being good for us past this season, and I don't think this really does anything to get us over the hump into being a true contender.

Hmm... This reads real doom and gloomy, but that wasn't my intention. Basically, I don't despise this trade overall, but I just wish we picked a lane. This is a hedge trade, to me. It feels like Army knew he had to do something to get a LHD brought in no matter what, but the market was very seller heavy, and he decided to not touch the Gio prices, which I can understand. But I also don't see a good road forward either. The value is clearly not very good imo, but we've been surprised before. If the idea is to give us more cap room to get the LHD fix this off-season, then I also don't really buy it. If we get an upgrade there in the off-season it would have been through trade anyway, unless we are all confident going into next season with 37 year old Alex Gologoski as our partner with Colt. So giving up Sunny and a 2nd for Leddy just feels off to me, like Army felt like he had to make a move but ran out of names and this was what he was left with.