Confirmed with Link: Leafs sign F Auston Matthews to extension (4 years, $13.25M AAV)

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Not true, if Matthews went to UFA next summer he'd get way more than what he recently signed for, therefore he left money on the table and did not go for every penny anyway.
Possibly true as far as just NHL salary goes, but would he get the endorsements in Buffalo that he gets in Toronto? Would $15M plus $500,000 endorsements in Columbus be better than $13M + $3M in Toronto?

(All numbers pulled out of a hat by the very annoyed rabbit who usually lives there.)
 
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I thought he would want to play in a better city in a US market but probably couldn’t get the same deal. Toronto lifestyle fits him to an T and there’s no pressure to win.

My guess is the NHL would have loved to see him go to Detroit, NY, Philly and it’s too bad he McDavid are hidden in Canada.

Pressure, yes: expectations. no.

Is there a better city in the States than Toronto (excluding the traffic, and taxes, and media)?
 
I will never for the life of me understand why signing bonuses remain such a touchy subject for some.

There's literally zero downside to do it, unless you think the team will need to buy the player out (which is never going to be an issue for a player of Matthews age/status). Otherwise it doesn't matter in the slightest to the team or the fans.
 
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I am assuming winning will be simple in 2 years' time then...

I have my doubts.

Also, we started spending draft capital first year of Matthews... that is when we stopped the rebuild. Rebuilding teams don't start spending draft capital to acquire rentals.
Probably won’t win in two years just because Tavares comes off the books but it will be a start to fixing things. The 11 million spent properly the last 5 years might have put us in a better position to go deep and possibly win it all.
Much like Burke with the Kessel deal they jumped the gun with this rebuild and starting selling the future to soon
 
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Probably won’t win in two years just because Tavares comes off the books but it will be a start to fixing things. The 11 million spent properly the last 5 years might have put us in a better position to go deep and possibly win it all.
Much like Burke with the Kessel deal they jumped the gun with this rebuild and starting selling the future to soon
Why not begin to fix things this year? I still think Dubas’ plan was to win a round and then start the cull.
The worst thing that could happen is to waste time and the cap space they’ll have after next two season and continue mired in no man’s land
 
There absolutely is pressure here and it’s an utter joke to suggest otherwise
Not in Toronto.
For 58 yrs the arena is sold out and the fans clap along when they’re told.….Everybody clap your hands….CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP….They travel and watch them.

There are in the fanbase that believe the Leafs are “the model franchise” and they act accordingly. The reality, since expansion, they are the worst franchise in the league. It continues because there’s no pressure to win from the fans or media.
 
The front loading and bonuses really don't impact the team at all as they don't affect the cap, and to the owners the difference isn't a drop in the ocean.

It means far more to the player - if the bonus is paid while he's in Arizona, it gets taxed at the rate applicable there, rather than here, and front loading just means his accountant has more time to steal it (oops, I mean invest it).

Amount and term are relevant.

The only person who wants front loaded and full of signing bonuses is matthews. Getting most of your money up front makes such a big difference since you're giving it that much more time to grow in investments. Giving it to him is a concession. We don't need to.

Aav and term matter to the team and the player.

Yet we gave both of those to matthews as well.

By the end of his next contract he will have been with the Leafs for 12 years, your theory and the truth seem to be at odds.

You know what they say .... You're wrong ....

Wrong about what exactly?
 
Everyone wants to win a cup more than they care about Matthews setting records - doesn’t mean the latter isn’t a much more interesting discussion than debating whether a player who literally just committed to being here for the next 5 years actually in fact wants to be here.

It’s very clear from all your posts that you’re just looking to be as miserable as possible about this so I’ll just leave you to it.

Based on your posts, it doesn't sound like it.

You and the rest of the dubas fan boys have been wrong for the last 5 years. Some of you even wanted dubas to stay despite so many failures.

The fact you think this is a good deal and we should be excited about Matthews becoming the Leafs leading scorer is absolutely terrifying to anyone who's been paying attention.

I thought he would want to play in a better city in a US market but probably couldn’t get the same deal. Toronto lifestyle fits him to an T and there’s no pressure to win.

My guess is the NHL would have loved to see him go to Detroit, NY, Philly and it’s too bad he McDavid are hidden in Canada.

Hopefully we get lucky and mcdavid wants to come here.
 
Not in Toronto.
For 58 yrs the arena is sold out and the fans clap along when they’re told.….Everybody clap your hands….CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP….They travel and watch them.

There are in the fanbase that believe the Leafs are “the model franchise” and they act accordingly. The reality, since expansion, they are the worst franchise in the league. It continues because there’s no pressure to win from the fans or media.

I've said this for awhile.

When you look at the lack of success and yet we have still been the hockey mecca of the world, it really shows how little pressure or incentive there is to win.
 
The only person who wants front loaded and full of signing bonuses is matthews. Getting most of your money up front makes such a big difference since you're giving it that much more time to grow in investments. Giving it to him is a concession. We don't need to.

Aav and term matter to the team and the player.

Yet we gave both of those to matthews as well.



Wrong about what exactly?
You're agreeing with me, but your tone feels like you aren't.
 
Not in Toronto.
For 58 yrs the arena is sold out and the fans clap along when they’re told.….Everybody clap your hands….CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP….They travel and watch them.

There are in the fanbase that believe the Leafs are “the model franchise” and they act accordingly. The reality, since expansion, they are the worst franchise in the league. It continues because there’s no pressure to win from the fans or media.
This is completely wrong, not even close. Players here and in Montreal easily have the most pressure on them league wide.
 
Why not begin to fix things this year? I still think Dubas’ plan was to win a round and then start the cull.
The worst thing that could happen is to waste time and the cap space they’ll have after next two season and continue mired in no man’s land
I’m not saying they should’nt fix things right now but they have no real money with Tavares sucking the 11 million out of the cap
 
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Based on your posts, it doesn't sound like it.

You and the rest of the dubas fan boys have been wrong for the last 5 years. Some of you even wanted dubas to stay despite so many failures.

The fact you think this is a good deal and we should be excited about Matthews becoming the Leafs leading scorer is absolutely terrifying to anyone who's been paying attention.

Not now, nor was I ever a Dubas fanboy but whatever you say.

I care more about Matthews being a Leaf for the next 5 years than I do about him committing right now to the 4 years that will come after. While moves still need to be made, I view the next 5 years as our contention window and having Matthews signed is a big part of that.

And for the third time, I said talking about Matthews potentially being able to set franchise records by the end of this extension is more interesting than debating whether he actually wants to be here on the heels of him committing the rest of his prime years to this club. Anyone questioning his desire to play for this team right now are seriously grasping at straws.
 
The only person who wants front loaded and full of signing bonuses is matthews. Getting most of your money up front makes such a big difference since you're giving it that much more time to grow in investments. Giving it to him is a concession. We don't need to.

Aav and term matter to the team and the player.

Yet we gave both of those to matthews as well.



Wrong about what exactly?

Why would you not want to treat your star player and possibly the greatest Leaf of all time with some small concessions, your suggestion is to alienate our star center and make negotiations come to a stand still and have him walk to UFA status? He wanted 3 years we asked for 5, we got 4, he could have got 15 mil easily on the UFA market we got him for 13.5, sounds like both sides gave a little. Did he take 11 mil @ 8 years, of course not, that would be insulting to even suggest that to a player who has done so much for the Leafs. This is not a Kerfoot Tre was negotiation with, it was the guy who has scored more goals than any player since AM entered the league, he is the best of the best and the best of the best gets paid like the best of the best. When McDavid is up he will get 15 to 16 mil per, and that will be a home town discount. Elite players get paid Elite dollars, you dont have to like it, at teh end of the day what you or I think is fair is meaningless. the deal is done. time to move on and enjoy five straight 50 goal seasons :)

Not sure your experience in contract negotiations but you don't approach them like the other side is trying to get one over on you therefore you dig in and make it hostile negotiation, there is a give and take and clearly there was give and take in these negotiations. You look for one small nugget that both sides agree on and then from there you expand your discussions.
 
Possibly true as far as just NHL salary goes, but would he get the endorsements in Buffalo that he gets in Toronto? Would $15M plus $500,000 endorsements in Columbus be better than $13M + $3M in Toronto?

(All numbers pulled out of a hat by the very annoyed rabbit who usually lives there.)

The money he will make from endorsements in Toronto will be stupid high and well he should. I have yet to hear anyone say "No that's OK I have enough money." ;)
 
Matthews is a great player, no doubt about it. That said, the Calder is irrelevant, as is the All Rookie team.

Re. the bolded - I'm pretty sure there's no standard that says how much the best goal scorer in the league should be paid. To justify being the highest paid player, I think you should have a claim to being the best player period, not just best at one aspect of the game.

See the pic below, note the PTS/60 column. I'd say that PTS counts for a lot more than goals, and this seems to indicate that Matthews had one year where he won the hardware that really counts where he was the best player in the league but that was a bit of an outlier.

View attachment 741131

I just had a peek at the Ted Lindsay award voting, if I'm not mistaken that's what the Pearson is now called. I assume that's more meaningful than the Hart voting as it's done by the players who presumably are better judges than the press (though I suspect there's probably not a lot of difference in the voting for those two awards). Here's where Matthews has finished over the last 5 years.

2019 - no votes
2020 - 10th
2021 - 2nd
2022 - 1st
2023 - 16th

If we accept that the players votes are meaningful, this indicates that he had not one, but two years where he played at an elite level that justifies paying him top dollar. Still, that's just two years out of the last five and last year was a big step in the wrong direction.

We're kind of damned if we do and damned if we don't so we pay the man and hope for the best. Maybe he'll turn out to be worth it and maybe we won't. I do think it's fair to say that in order for this contract not to be an overpayment his overall performance needs to better than it was over the last 5 years.

Edit - I just looked up Hart voting and I must admit I was a bit surprised to see that the results were exactly the same as the Lindsay voting. I expected similar results, not exact but whatever, these were the results.

2019 - no votes
2020 - 10th
2021 - 2nd
2022 - 1st
2023 - 16th

End of the day goals get the fans out of their seats, you cant win if you cant score. Every GM will tell any causal fan they pay higher for goal creation than goal suppression. It is what it is.
 
Not in Toronto.
For 58 yrs the arena is sold out and the fans clap along when they’re told.….Everybody clap your hands….CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP….They travel and watch them.

There are in the fanbase that believe the Leafs are “the model franchise” and they act accordingly. The reality, since expansion, they are the worst franchise in the league. It continues because there’s no pressure to win from the fans or media.


... ah yes the contrarian for the sake of being contrary... no pressure playing for the Leafs... LOL... suuuurrrre buddy ...
 
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Not now, nor was I ever a Dubas fanboy but whatever you say.

I care more about Matthews being a Leaf for the next 5 years than I do about him committing right now to the 4 years that will come after. While moves still need to be made, I view the next 5 years as our contention window and having Matthews signed is a big part of that.

And for the third time, I said talking about Matthews potentially being able to set franchise records by the end of this extension is more interesting than debating whether he actually wants to be here on the heels of him committing the rest of his prime years to this club. Anyone questioning his desire to play for this team right now are seriously grasping at straws.

Well said .... Did you hear Matty has not signed his 50 year old to 55 year old contract yet.... the sky is falling ... OMGZ

He hasn't event played a single year in his next contract and fans are bitching we want him longer but we paid too much... but we want him longer ... (head shake)

Big body centers tend to break down in their early to mid 30's, its a good thing he's not locked in for those years. People please stop mindlessly bitching for the sake of bitching, the guy clearly wants to be here, 12 years of his life will be in a Leaf uni, lets have a little faith that he will want to stay. you know what will make him leave, silly Leaf fans bitching about his salary and the term of his contract. This innate self loathing many Leaf fans have, where they have to spew vitriol towards their best players, for signing a fair market contract, blows my mind, are you a fan or are you just a whiny hateful unhappy person, you cant be kinda pregnant, you're a fan our your not..

People we have the greatest goal scorer of the last 7 years and he chose OUR TEAM for 12 years ... be thankful for what you have.
 
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I’m not saying they should’nt fix things right now but they have no real money with Tavares sucking the 11 million out of the cap
Brodie, Nylander?

This is completely wrong, not even close. Players here and in Montreal easily have the most pressure on them league wide.
Montreal is, or at least was, a pressure packed city. Toronto, no.
 
Why would you not want to treat your star player and possibly the greatest Leaf of all time with some small concessions, your suggestion is to alienate our star center and make negotiations come to a stand still and have him walk to UFA status? He wanted 3 years we asked for 5, we got 4, he could have got 15 mil easily on the UFA market we got him for 13.5, sounds like both sides gave a little. Did he take 11 mil @ 8 years, of course not, that would be insulting to even suggest that to a player who has done so much for the Leafs. This is not a Kerfoot Tre was negotiation with, it was the guy who has scored more goals than any player since AM entered the league, he is the best of the best and the best of the best gets paid like the best of the best. When McDavid is up he will get 15 to 16 mil per, and that will be a home town discount. Elite players get paid Elite dollars, you dont have to like it, at teh end of the day what you or I think is fair is meaningless. the deal is done. time to move on and enjoy five straight 50 goal seasons :)

Not sure your experience in contract negotiations but you don't approach them like the other side is trying to get one over on you therefore you dig in and make it hostile negotiation, there is a give and take and clearly there was give and take in these negotiations. You look for one small nugget that both sides agree on and then from there you expand your discussions.

You sound a lot like dubas and we all know how good he was at negotiations.

Paying matthews more than mack, pasta, ect and for far fewer years is a huge disadvantage.

If your goal is retain matthews, mission accomplished.

If you want to win the cup, this definitely was not the right move.
 

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