Confirmed with Link: Leafs sign F Auston Matthews to extension (4 years, $13.25M AAV)

[Nineteen67]

I doubt the players would go for that without getting something pretty good in return

There’s some benefit to owners as well. At least for older players.

Again

For the complainaners who all wanted Matthews to sign for 8 years and were livid that he didn’t

What did you want Matthews to sign for off his ELC over 8 years?

most people thought the cap hit was “good but should be for 8 years” now

He has given Toronto 12.35x9.
We got him at 11.634 x 5 when the cap was low a
13.25 and now.


If 11.64 x8 was good
How is 12.35 x9 bad? Especially with a staggered cap hit and after 2 rockets and a hart?

I think people think their own emotions matter to cap hit or something? This is more than fair.

Other ELC players signed for 8. We got Matthews for 9. Where is the issue?

8 X 10.5 would have been reasonable.

 

[Hellcat]

.

Do you think the next CBA will limit contracts to a 5 yrs max?

No idea.

You can slice it anyway you want to, management bowed to their demands on their last contract negotiations, and as a result have absolutely no leverage now, when they had all the leverage last time!

Why are we discussing something that happened half a decade ago? Tre can't use the trade card on Willie?

 

[Subway Schenn]

If we haven't won by Year 3 of this deal I guess we will trade him/ask him to waive to jumpstart a rebuild.

Not thrilled about the terms but the way for him to flip the opinion about it is to carry the team in the playoffs. I hope he does it.

 

[Sypher04]

If we haven't won by Year 3 of this deal I guess we will trade him/ask him to waive to jumpstart a rebuild.

Not thrilled about the terms but the way for him to flip the opinion about it is to carry the team in the playoffs. I hope he does it.

I’m willing to bet that will never happen unless they get the impression he’s not going to stay after this deal runs out. If his play keeps up the next 5 years and he wants to be then Matthews will be a life long Leaf and we will do everything we can to keep our contention window open

 

[Notsince67]

Oh I already asked that question, the response is "I don't have to give you a number" "I don't have to answer that" literally

Bitchy behavior never sounds rational.
There must be a bad virus going around because people seem to be losing their testicles.

 

[Legion34]

There’s some benefit to owners as well. At least for older players.


8 X 10.5 would have been reasonable.

There’s some benefit to owners as well. At least for older players.


8 X 10.5 would have been reasonable.

Ok. So what would that be for 9 years? 11

Also do you have any precedents you are basing that on?

Matthew was top 2 in goals per game. Top 5 in goals and top 10’ total point and ppg despite missing a bunch of games on his ELC for like 20 years.

He outplayed guys who were getting 14-17% on 5 year deals.

How did you come up with 10.5? Just out of curiosity?
10.5 is 12.8% of the cap for 8 years?

Can you show a single player remotely like Matthews who took that low?

 

[Legion34]

I’m willing to bet that will never happen unless they get the impression he’s not going to stay after this deal runs out. If his play keeps up the next 5 years and he wants to be then Matthews will be a life long Leaf and we will do everything we can to keep our contention window open

I think it’s the same as how.

Keep him for 4 years. Going into the last year of his deal. See if he signs long term (if healthy) and if not. Ask where he wants to go and work out a deal

Probably get eichel/karlson value back

Win win. Matty sets records. Hopefully wins a cup. Gives us his prime and goes back home.
We get 12 years and try to get good peices to stay competitive

 

[Al14]

1. You don't think that someone since signing his last contract has won: 2 Rockets / 1 Hart and 1 Ted Lindsay doesn't deserve a 1.6 million dollar raise yearly? There wasn't a chance in hell he wasn't going to get a raise.

2. I understand the term being a issue, it is for me as well, but it's not awful, he's still giving us his prime years of hockey for the next 5 years. He's taking a risk by not opting into 8 years, and it also could help Toronto in 5 years if he's not the same player at 31.

3. Nylander already held out once until the very last minute to make as much money as he could, that aspect isn't going to change anything.

If anything, at age 31 when 34 needs to resign again, would be the time for him to take less money if we still haven't won.

I don't give a flying truck what individual awards players achieve if the team they are on only wins one playoff series in seven years.

34 is only interested in making himself more money despite already having enough to set himself up for life. The same goes for Marner and Nylander!

Matthews, Marner, Nylander, and Tavares can't win a Stanley Cup without some very good D, including a decent goalie. These core 4 players can't win a SC without the proper skilled support players.

By the core 4 taking too large of a percentage of the cap doesn't allow our Leafs management to surround them with the right mix of talent to win a SC. A team needs to have a more balanced team salary wise.

IMHO, Matthews, Nylander, and especially Marner, were already overpaid coming off of their entry level deals. Matthews at $10M, Marner at $8M, and Nylander at $6M are where they should have been. Dubas was far too generous IMHO, especially since they never won a playoff round on their ELCs..

We shall see what happens this coming season. I hope for the best, however I expect more of the same results from the last half decade.

 

[Legion34]

I don't give a flying truck what individual awards players achieve if the team they are on only wins one playoff series in seven years.

34 is only interested in making himself more money despite already having enough to set himself up for life. The same goes for Marner and Nylander!

Matthews, Marner, Nylander, and Tavares can't win a Stanley Cup without some very good D, including a decent goalie. These core 4 players can't win a SC without the proper skilled support players.

By the core 4 taking too large of a percentage of the cap doesn't allow our Leafs management to surround them with the right mix of talent to win a SC. A team needs to have a more balanced team salary wise.

IMHO, Matthews, Nylander, and especially Marner, were already overpaid coming off of their entry level deals. Matthews at $10M, Marner at $8M, and Nylander at $6M are where they should have been. Dubas was far too generous IMHO, especially since they never won a playoff round on their ELCs..

We shall see what happens this coming season. I hope for the best, however I expect more of the same results from the last half decade.

This might surprise you. But multi billion dollar organizations do not give out contracts based on what you give a flying truck about.

NHL players contracts are based much more on regular season stats post season all star and awards than team playoff success

 

[Captain Crunch]

If Matthews gets a serious injury in the next 5 years or his performance declines but can still play but greatly affects his effectiveness, is the 4 year deal still a bad thing? Do you want to be carrying a 33, 34, 35 year old that is a shadow of his former self with a $13 mil, $14 mil cap hit? The 4 year deal is not all gloom and doom, there is actually some considerable upside to it.

Your perception is it is greedy, most people perception is its a win for AM and its a win for the Leafs. Again it’s not greedy to get paid LESS than fair market value. This is more than fair to the Leafs. The league GM's set the market value with what they are willing to pay, if AM went to UFA status next year he would get much more than $13.25, which if you remove your bias to mudsling and look at that fact with eyes wide open, when a person takes LESS than fair market value, he is not being greedy, he's actually being the opposite.

No idea.



Why are we discussing something that happened half a decade ago? Tre can't use the trade card on Willie?

My point was that these two, so far, have shown what they’re all about, which is looking out for themselves with no desire to leave some on the table. So even though Matthews “settled” for $13.25 million, it’s still too much because of what happened 5 years ago. However, I’m glad this one was for only 4 years.

I certainly hope that Tre can trade Nylander, hopefully for a top 4 dman and a top 9 RWer who can also PK. That would be ideal.

 

[Hellcat]

My point was that these two, so far, have shown what they’re all about, which is looking out for themselves with no desire to leave some on the table. So even though Matthews “settled” for $13.25 million, it’s still too much because of what happened 5 years ago. However, I’m glad this one was for only 4 years.

I certainly hope that Tre can trade Nylander, hopefully for a top 4 dman and a top 9 RWer who can also PK. That would be ideal.

How is signing less than UFA market value, "only looking out for themselves"?

The fact the roster has been more holier than a brick of Swiss cheese is because the GM and scouting staff have failed miserably to draft and develop effective complimentary players, it's not because AM has taken two less than UFA market value contracts. It's the GM's job to build the roster, it's not the players responsibly to subsidize the cap. You and a couple other posters on this forum have your thought process backwards.

 

[Hellcat]

I don't give a flying truck what individual awards players achieve if the team they are on only wins one playoff series in seven years.

34 is only interested in making himself more money despite already having enough to set himself up for life. The same goes for Marner and Nylander!

Matthews, Marner, Nylander, and Tavares can't win a Stanley Cup without some very good D, including a decent goalie. These core 4 players can't win a SC without the proper skilled support players.

By the core 4 taking too large of a percentage of the cap doesn't allow our Leafs management to surround them with the right mix of talent to win a SC. A team needs to have a more balanced team salary wise.

IMHO, Matthews, Nylander, and especially Marner, were already overpaid coming off of their entry level deals. Matthews at $10M, Marner at $8M, and Nylander at $6M are where they should have been. Dubas was far too generous IMHO, especially since they never won a playoff round on their ELCs..

We shall see what happens this coming season. I hope for the best, however I expect more of the same results from the last half decade.

When have fan expectations and reality ever been on the same plane? Why does it surprise you that an elite athlete who has spend tens of thousands of hours perfecting his craft, sacrificed a normal childhood/teenage years/young adult years all to chase his dream, wants to get paid fair market value?

Many of you need to read the book "Outliers" by Malcom Gladwell.

 

[Hellcat]

Bitchy behavior never sounds rational.
.

I tell that to my wife all the time but it only makes her more bitchy...

 

[Dave92]

Respectfully, there's surely no way any honest Leafs fan can LOVE this deal, of a guy whose done squat for them in the postseason year after year, signing for 13.25m (1 million more than McJesus per year) for only 4 years....

Or am I way off base?????

I think the chances Matthews is worth 13.5 six seasons from now are almost non-existent. So that could be viewed as a positive

 

[The Apologist]

Thing is with Boston losing their top 2 centers to retirement, Tampa losing a shit ton of depth over the last 2 years, and Florida's defense being gutted by injury until December.

I'd argue the door is more wide open for them now then It's ever been

Absolutely it is, and adding the likes of Bertuzzi, Domi and Klingberg (and to a lesser degree Reaves) tells me they think so too.

 

[Captain Crunch]

How is signing less than UFA market value, "only looking out for themselves"?

The fact the roster has been more holier than a brick of Swiss cheese is because the GM and scouting staff have failed miserably to draft and develop effective complimentary players, it's not because AM has taken two less than UFA market value contracts. It's the GM's job to build the roster, it's not the players responsibly to subsidize the cap. You and a couple other posters on this forum have your thought process backwards.

I don’t blame Matthews and Marner as much as I blame management. They set the wheels in motion by allowing these two prima donnas to bend them over backwards and take it up the ass on their previous contract negotiations. You have your opinion, you’re entitled to it. This is mine.

As far as Matthews and Marner are concerned, can’t argue with their regular season success, but their disappearing acts in the playoffs leaves something to be desired.

 

[Torontonian]

I don't give a flying truck what individual awards players achieve if the team they are on only wins one playoff series in seven years.

34 is only interested in making himself more money despite already having enough to set himself up for life. The same goes for Marner and Nylander!

Matthews, Marner, Nylander, and Tavares can't win a Stanley Cup without some very good D, including a decent goalie. These core 4 players can't win a SC without the proper skilled support players.

By the core 4 taking too large of a percentage of the cap doesn't allow our Leafs management to surround them with the right mix of talent to win a SC. A team needs to have a more balanced team salary wise.

IMHO, Matthews, Nylander, and especially Marner, were already overpaid coming off of their entry level deals. Matthews at $10M, Marner at $8M, and Nylander at $6M are where they should have been. Dubas was far too generous IMHO, especially since they never won a playoff round on their ELCs..

We shall see what happens this coming season. I hope for the best, however I expect more of the same results from the last half decade.

Then you don't have a leg to stand on when arguing about what he should make. This is a business, individual pay raises go off of what they have done in the sport and the regular season is apart of that. AM34 has shown he deserved and was going to get a raise. Just like Marner and both Nylander are going to get pay raises.

Finding the right mix and building a team takes luck that everything falls into place. Toronto has generally improved almost every year expect for the 2019-2020 year (COVID year). This year will be just like the past years, make the dance and hope the additions they made in Bert/Klingberg/Domi mesh well and help in the playoffs. It's impossible to look at free agency and make trades and say "oh ya these certain players are going to bring us the cup".

 

[ShaneFalco]

Then you don't have a leg to stand on when arguing about what he should make. This is a business, individual pay raises go off of what they have done in the sport and the regular season is apart of that. AM34 has shown he deserved and was going to get a raise. Just like Marner and both Nylander are going to get pay raises.

Finding the right mix and building a team takes luck that everything falls into place. Toronto has generally improved almost every year expect for the 2019-2020 year (COVID year). This year will be just like the past years, make the dance and hope the additions they made in Bert/Klingberg/Domi mesh well and help in the playoffs. It's impossible to look at free agency and make trades and say "oh ya these certain players are going to bring us the cup".

Yeah they're not even close to making it deep in the playoffs
It's not about luck, it's not about goalied, it's not about "we took the eventual SCF to game 7"
It's the wrong mix of the core. Not sure how anyone to argue that at this point

 

[pcruz]

When have fan expectations and reality ever been on the same plane? Why does it surprise you that an elite athlete who has spend tens of thousands of hours perfecting his craft, sacrificed a normal childhood/teenage years/young adult years all to chase his dream, wants to get paid fair market value?

Many of you need to read the book "Outliers" by Malcom Gladwell.

Does it consist of 30 second or less snippets of video?

Because the people you're arguing with have the attention span of about that long, as well has selective short term amnesia wherein they can't form new and original thoughts or memorieas relating to very specific events (in this case, hockey).



Reading some other comments on this contract has me shaking my head in utter disbelief.

How can someone actually relay their opinion that they don't care at all (paraphrasing here) about an individual player's individual performance and achievements when discussing that same player's individual contract?

It's just the epitome of Toronto fans.


They care about the collective success only. They have no clue that in order to win that collective trophy, the team must have at least 1 player who is consistently in consideration for a major trophy.

I can't think of a team that didn't have a player worthy of a Hart/ Art Ross/ Richard/ Selke / Norris / Vezina and won a cup.
Hell, I'm having a hard time thinking back far enough for a team without 2 of those players on the team...



Do player's who win a cup all deserve big contracts then?

Say, if Toronto wins a cup, do we offer Knies a $15 million AAV contract?

That seems to be the logic with some people.

 

[Gary Nylund]

So does he have a full NMC after all which means we can't trade him without his approval? Geez that sucks if true, oh well.

 

[Sypher04]

So does he have a full NMC after all which means we can't trade him without his approval? Geez that sucks if true, oh well.

Of course he does. Did anyone expect he wouldn’t?

 

[666]

Yeah they're not even close to making it deep in the playoffs
It's not about luck, it's not about goalied, it's not about "we took the eventual SCF to game 7"
It's the wrong mix of the core. Not sure how anyone to argue that at this point

What are you going to do if we win it all this season? With that perspective do you just say hey we got lucky and celebrate like the rest of us? That doesn't really make sense though because some of us actually believe that this season is our best chance in a very long time. We're excited for the season to start but why do you even watch if you're so miserable?

 

[Stephen]

I can't think of a team that didn't have a player worthy of a Hart/ Art Ross/ Richard/ Selke / Norris / Vezina and won a cup.
Hell, I'm having a hard time thinking back far enough for a team without 2 of those players on the team...

FYI, Vegas Golden Knights just won a cup with no Hart, Lindsay, Art Ross, Richard, Selke, Norris or Vezina candidate (finalist).

2023 NHL Awards finalists | NHL.com

League honors for Hart, Norris, Vezina, others will be announced June 26 in Nashville

www.nhl.com

 

[Stephen]

If we haven't won by Year 3 of this deal I guess we will trade him/ask him to waive to jumpstart a rebuild.

Not thrilled about the terms but the way for him to flip the opinion about it is to carry the team in the playoffs. I hope he does it.

Why would this even remotely be on the table?

You use the full five years to contend, and if you're still knocking on the door, in good contending shape you extend Matthews again and keep pursuing a title.

 

[MCR74]

So the shoe finally dropped. How long do you think the trade board thread will last?