Line Combos: Leafs roster [Before] & [After] and work in progress

[Racer88]

That's a completely baseless statement. In fact, there were multiple articles that outlined Marner's intense workouts last offseason. You don't become one of the best players in the world by not working hard.

Then why does his arms look like little twigs

 

[Racer88]

Chicago, LA, Pittsburgh and Tampa all multiple cup winners the last few years. Apparently thanks to luck. Who knew

Ya, why would anyone waste their time working out and having an insane work ethic like Crosby or Gary Roberts when luck has so much to do with success

 

[Bomber0104]

Then why does his arms look like little twigs

Ectomorph body type, IMO.

Otherwise known as a "hard-gainer".

Marner was never going to be a big player and we all knew that going into drafting him.

If he was bigger, he'd have went 2nd or 3rd overall as a centre.

 

[Racer88]

Ectomorph body type, IMO.

Otherwise known as a "hard-gainer".

Marner was never going to be a big player and we all knew that going into drafting him.

If he was bigger, he'd have went 2nd or 3rd overall as a centre.

Great word…..I might use it a few times. Lol

 

[Dekes For Days]

Then why does his arms look like little twigs

They don't. They look like normal hockey player arms for an individual of his size, body type, and player type. This shouldn't need to be said, but you don't judge hockey fitness and preparation by looking at arm size in instagram photos online.

 

[Racer88]

They don't. They look like normal hockey player arms for an individual of his size, body type, and player type. This shouldn't need to be said, but you don't judge hockey fitness and preparation by looking at arm size in instagram photos online.

Give me a break. In the engagement picture his girlfriend had bigger arms

 

[The Hanging Jowl]

Without something surprising coming (either a coaching change or a major trade moving one of the big contracts), is anyone here expecting somehing to be different in the coming season? It absolutely won't. If this is the team they're icing and with the same coaching staff, only a dreamer would expect better results.

If this is our team, my interest is at an all time low.

 

[Racer88]

Without something surprising coming (either a coaching change or a major trade moving one of the big contracts), is anyone here expecting somehing to be different in the coming season? It absolutely won't. If this is the team they're icing and with the same coaching staff, only a dreamer would expect better results.

If this is our team, my interest is at an all time low.

I agree with you. Without a significant change we are doomed to the same thing as last year only probably worse as out in season opposition will be much tougher. I fully expect the leafs will struggle to even make the playoffs let alone beat anyone in them.
It’s obvious that Dubas refuse to fix the makeup of the team so a chia Ching change is probably the only thing available to him now but even that is almost to late as most of the teams have chosen their coaches

 

[Guided by Veseys]

I mean, the Habs went to the finals and it isn’t like they “dominated” the leafs. Did anybody watch that series and really think that the Habs were the better team? They hardly carried the play at all. Just saying they won the series and that’s end of argument is a touch simplistic. The leafs stomped them but let off the gas up 3-1 and hopefully they have learned from that experience, especially the coach.

I’d expect the leafs to be one of the better teams in the league next year regular season and god forbid serious injuries and weak performance they will finally get somewhere with this core.

 

[francis246]

Wouldn't mind them taking a look at Bozak if he's cheap, or circle back on Galchenyuk or maybe a Kahun or Svechnikov (the other one).

Galchenyuk or Ho-Sang, someone with some offensive upside would be nice. Maybe move Bunting or Ritchie down and have Simmonds/Spezza rotating in

 

[leafsfan5]

I mean, the Habs went to the finals and it isn’t like they “dominated” the leafs. Did anybody watch that series and really think that the Habs were the better team? They hardly carried the play at all. Just saying they won the series and that’s end of argument is a touch simplistic. The leafs stomped them but let off the gas up 3-1 and hopefully they have learned from that experience.

I’d expect the leafs to be one of the better teams in the league next year regular season and god forbid serious injuries and weak performance they will finally get somewhere with this core.

We've been hearing this for a long time now. Just assume they won't learn from this experience. They clearly haven't from past failures

 

[Guided by Veseys]

We've been hearing this for a long time now. Just assume they won't learn from this experience. They clearly haven't from past failures

I can’t disagree with that. It wouldn’t be surprising if they finished first in the league regular season next year only to lose once again first round. However looking at the Montreal series it wasn’t a blow out and this team could get there; no guarantee for any team in the playoffs, upsets happen always. Take the 2013 pitts/Boston series: penguins were swept only scoring 2 goals. That core went on to go back to back cup wins. yes Crosby and Malkin but still an example of an unexplainable playoff upset that can happen in a 7 game series.

 

[meefer]

What I'd try to run:

Ritchie - Matthews - Kase
Bunting - Tavares - Marner
Spezza (Galchenyuk?) - Kerfoot - Nylander
Mikheyev - Kampf - Engvall

If Kase can stay healthy I'd do this and let Matthews carry like we know he can (big if because Kase will likely get hurt, in that case we'd put Willy back up). This gives us 3 lines that can score with a play driver on each. The third line is my favourite, it'll get optimal matchups against weak competition where Nylander can feast (similar to Kessel's line in 2016). Plus, we know Kerfoot/Nylander already works. Galchenyuk was solid with them in the playoffs but it appears the team doesn't want to retain him so we could run Spezza there. The 4th line has 3 defensive forwards who we put out to matchup against top lines for the opposition.

This way spreads the scoring out as best as we can imo, makes for very tough matchups in the playoffs too. The opposition will want to focus on Matthews or Marner which opens up Willy's line

I like the balance, but would fear the Kase injury scenario. For the 3rd line, I'd try...

Kerfoot Nylander Spezza (and you could sub in Simmonds the odd games to give JS a break)

 

[GoLeafsGo96]

I can’t disagree with that. It wouldn’t be surprising if they finished first in the league regular season next year only to lose once again first round. However looking at the Montreal series it wasn’t a blow out and this team could get there; no guarantee for any team in the playoffs, upsets happen always. Take the 2013 pitts/Boston series: penguins were swept only scoring 2 goals. That core went on to go back to back cup wins. yes Crosby and Malkin but still an example of an unexplainable playoff upset that can happen in a 7 game series.

Just speaks to the parity in this league that if a team gets hot at the right time despite being below .500 that they can go on a run to the finals.

People are rightfully upset with the failures but the hyperbole of "can't get it done and will never get it done obviously" is pretty funny to me. I get that this loss hurt more than any of the rest... but seriously?

Price went vintage for 3 rounds and the Leafs lost their captain and one of the core 4 salaried players in g1. They still should have won but they overall carried the play in the series despite losing. It's awful and shitty but doesn't change the fact that margins are thin and there is a lot of variance year to year as you mentioned with your Pittsburgh example.

Another one is how Washington finally broke through the 2nd round and won the cup with frankly - a roster everyone thought was worse than the two years preceding.

 

[leafsfan5]

I can’t disagree with that. It wouldn’t be surprising if they finished first in the league regular season next year only to lose once again first round. However looking at the Montreal series it wasn’t a blow out and this team could get there; no guarantee for any team in the playoffs, upsets happen always. Take the 2013 pitts/Boston series: penguins were swept only scoring 2 goals. That core went on to go back to back cup wins. yes Crosby and Malkin but still an example of an unexplainable playoff upset that can happen in a 7 game series.

I mean we haven't been blown out in any series, the problem is we can't close when we've had the chance to. The team just doesn't hit that next gear that others can. As for the Pens, 2013 stung but they knew the core worked based on their 2009 cup and 08 final appearance. Much easier to stick through heartbreak when you know the formula has been successful in the past.

At this point the Leafs need to take the next step before belief is back. 4 straight first round losses in game 7 (CBJ was basically a game 7) wears down hope

 

[Stonehands1990]

Ectomorph body type, IMO.

Otherwise known as a "hard-gainer".

Marner was never going to be a big player and we all knew that going into drafting him.

If he was bigger, he'd have went 2nd or 3rd overall as a centre.

Ectomorphs can still put on size. They just have to be more dedicated with their nutrition. Marner’s arms look like little twigs because he’s weak

 

[deprw]

Ectomorphs can still put on size. They just have to be more dedicated with their nutrition. Marner’s arms look like little twigs because he’s weak

If you look where Crosby or Jagr has their muscles you see that they aren't top heavy either. Hockey player doesn't need bulked up arms. It's waste of time and weight, if your built correctly and don't want to gain additional muscle mass that slows you down. So I think it's kind of funny criticizing hockey players conditioning based on his arm width. All should start from legs and core, even more so if you have hard time gaining muscle and weight.

 

[Stonehands1990]

If you look where Crosby or Jagr has their muscles you see that they aren't top heavy either. Hockey player doesn't need bulked up arms. It's waste of time and weight, if your built correctly and don't want to gain additional muscle mass that slows you down. So I think it's kind of funny criticizing hockey players conditioning based on his arm width. All should start from legs and core, even more so if you have hard time gaining muscle and weight.

Agreed Crosby is all legs. But if Marner was doing intense strength training he’d look a bit more like Nylander. He’s a complete twig up top. His arm looks like it’ll break if he goes into a corner

 

[NJG]

Ritchie - Matthews - Marner
Bunting - Tavares - Nylander
Kerfoot - Kampf - Kase
Gabriel - Spezza - Simmonds

Rielly - Brodie
Muzzin - Holl
Dermott - Liljegren

Campbell - Mrazek

 

[deprw]

Agreed Crosby is all legs. But if Marner was doing intense strength training he’d look a bit more like Nylander. He’s a complete twig up top. His arm looks like it’ll break if he goes into a corner

I might be wrong, but I think Nylander is bit off a show off and likes to look that way. Which is okay and good for us, but like said it's still unnecessary weight for a hockey player. Would I like to see Marner to be build up that way, yeah sure, but rather all legs and you can't judge that from that picture. Also if Marner is ectomorph like it seems, it damn hard to gain muscle and he probably loses it bit faster during the season. I think Selanne, who was fitness freak, said that he always lost few kilograms of muscle during season. You can't train hard enough and playing +80 games takes it tolls to your body. You can try to slow it down and it easier to gain it back during summer, after you have once put it on, but it's still slowing that bulking process down.

 

[Stonehands1990]

I might be wrong, but I think Nylander is bit off a show off and likes to look that way. Which is okay and good for us, but like said it's still unnecessary weight for a hockey player. Would I like to see Marner to be build up that way, yeah sure, but rather all legs and you can't judge that from that picture. Also if Marner is ectomorph like it seems, it damn hard to gain muscle and he probably loses it bit faster during the season. I think Selanne, who was fitness freak, said that he always lost few kilograms of muscle during season. You can't train hard enough and playing +80 games takes it tolls to your body. You can try to slow it down and it easier to gain it back during summer, after you have once put it on, but it's still slowing that bulking process down.

Hockey players benefit mostly from functional strength. I wouldn’t be knocking Marner if he was an explosive skater or could play heavy playoff hockey. He can’t do either. And his stature is a tell to me that he’s not that serious about the gym in comparison to other professionals. Look at the way guys like Marchand, MacKinnon or Ehlers took massive steps forward. It was all training

 

[Bomber0104]

Agreed Crosby is all legs. But if Marner was doing intense strength training he’d look a bit more like Nylander. He’s a complete twig up top. His arm looks like it’ll break if he goes into a corner

Marner's edge-work is almost directly lifted from Sid or whoever his skating coach is/was...

It's hard for me to sit here and say that Marner's skating is a problem here.

Of all the things there is to nit-pick, this isn't it.

 

[Stonehands1990]

Marner's edge-work is almost directly lifted from Sid or whoever his skating coach is/was...

It's hard for me to sit here and say that Marner's skating is a problem here.

Of all the things there is to nit-pick, this isn't it.

I’m sorry where did I critique his skating? Lol

It’s his off season training that I’m scrutinizing. He’s a twig

 

[cookie]

I honestly don’t even care for set lines for this season - I’m looking for something completely different. We have multiple players that can fill in given roles/ niches ala grinders, fore checkers, special teams specialists, etc., to round out the core players. The biggest blind spot is usage: the coach has shown us that he sticks with a given lineup through and through, even to the detriment of the team. Not only does this imply that the PTOs aren’t going to be making it, it also implies that the journeymen the Leafs acquire won’t be given a fair shake. I’m expecting a lineup near identical to last year’s, where we minimize prospects’ play time (sorry Sandin/Liljegren/Robertson) and fail to tap into the Marlies. Dermott will be the fall guy that will continue to see minimal minutes, oftentimes conceding these minimal minutes to Sandin. At the very least we can expect a save this year.

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

I just hope this team has the cap space to experiment more, not like last season where Keefe stuck to one lineup because they were so pressed to the cap.