Line Combos: Leafs roster [Before] & [After] and work in progress

[Leafs87]

I feel most of the leafs competition got stronger and the leafs got weaker. I like the Ritchie add. The rest is up in the air

 

[zeke]

It's sad that your reaction to not understanding something is to accuse people of lying. Again, your calculations are lacking common sense which says that when others are playing while you are a healthy scratch, those guys are ahead of you on the depth chart.

Total minutes of ice time in the playoffs:
Bogo - 105
Sandin - 66
Dermott - 45
Liljegren - 0

Bogo played almost as much as the other 3 put together, it doesn't get much more clear than that. You never admit to being wrong about anything but ... you're wrong.

Heh. Truly amazing how dedicated you are to your spin that you can't admit what's obvious to literally everyone else.

But keep maintaining that he was a borderline #4 dman despite being nothing close to that, to fit you narrative if you need to.

Everyone else can see that a 14mpg dman is nothing remotely close to a top4 dman.

 

[ULF_55]

I think that Matthews and Marner are breathing a sigh of relief that Hyman is gone, and they will finally get a winger that can 'play' and doesnt just hang onto the puck and never give it back to either of them.

I'd like to see Mikheyev there.

I know many think Ritchie is the guy, or maybe Bunting.

Mihkeyev has great speed, and can get to the puck, shooting hard to know if the injury has had an impact.

 

[Mess]

I think that Matthews and Marner are breathing a sigh of relief that Hyman is gone, and they will finally get a winger that can 'play' and doesnt just hang onto the puck and never give it back to either of them.

Wait until you see Nick Ritchie lumbering around out there trying to replace Hyman. His skating and playmaking will be a noticeable downgrade and more hitting and fighting then passing and playmaking.

Be careful what you wish for and you're really don't appreciate something till its gone and see what you have lost.

If it wasn't about the money and cap Leafs would have loved to have Hyman back and all his teammates always asked that he play on their line.

 

[ULF_55]

Wait until you see Nick Ritchie lumbering around out there trying to replace Hyman. His skating and playmaking will be a noticeable downgrade..

Be careful what you wish for and you're really don't appreciate something till its gone and see what you have lost.

We don't know where Ritchie is playing, but his contract doesn't speak 1st. line. Hyman's new contract speaks top 6 winger on its own merit.

Ritchie's ice time in Boston says 3rd. liner and PP big body.

I think people are just trying to fill in holes with the new guys, without considering the existing players are going to be competing for those spots.

I don't see a lumbering forward sticking on the 1st. line of a Keefe line-up.

 

[4thline]

I personally love that the bar for every single winger we've acquired seems to be Hyman. Zach was great, but last I checked he was one player. Only one of our new crop can be a downgrade from him in the lineup at any one time.

Realistically it's Bunting as scrappy two way third wheel LW in the top 6, or Kase as two way 3rd liner.

Ritchie is just a silly comparison, he's more of a Thornton/Galchenyuk type.

 

[ULF_55]

I personally love that the bar for every single winger we've acquired seems to be Hyman. Zach was great, but last I checked he was one player. Only one of our new crop can be a downgrade from him in the lineup at any one time.

Realistically it's Bunting as scrappy two way third wheel LW in the top 6, or Kase as two way 3rd liner.

Ritchie is just a silly comparison, he's more of a Thornton/Galchenyuk type.

Hyman played his role well, and he earned it over the years, but you don't have to be a 1st. line talent to fill that role. Might actually be too little puck for 3 1st. line talents on a single line.

For me, skating, puck retrieval, and defensive awareness should be the requirement for that role. We know that is a high risk line, with blind passes, drop passes, soft passes keeping that 3rd. player on his toes to cover-up for those plays. Maybe why Hyman was on that line and on the PK.

 

[ToneDog]

Wait until you see Nick Ritchie lumbering around out there trying to replace Hyman. His skating and playmaking will be a noticeable downgrade and more hitting and fighting then passing and playmaking.

Be careful what you wish for and you're really don't appreciate something till its gone and see what you have lost.

If it wasn't about the money and cap Leafs would have had Hyman back and all his teammates always asked that he play on their line.

Fixed it for you.

 

[4thline]

Hyman played his role well, and he earned it over the years, but you don't have to be a 1st. line talent to fill that role. Might actually be too little puck for 3 1st. line talents on a single line.

For me, skating, puck retrieval, and defensive awareness should be the requirement for that role. We know that is a high risk line, with blind passes, drop passes, soft passes keeping that 3rd. player on his toes to cover-up for those plays. Maybe why Hyman was on that line and on the PK.

I agree. I was moreso making the point that certain posters are leaping though hoops using facetious comparisons to point this offseason in a certain light.

 

[ULF_55]

I agree. I was moreso making the point that certain posters are leaping though hoops using facetious comparisons to point this offseason in a certain light.

Yep, noticed that, but very little is surprising as most here play their character consistently.

I have liked the off-season signings, sure would have been nice to get into big game hunting, but realistically, they don't need big game. Rabbits and waterfowl are good enough when your freezer is already full of moose.

The team needs weatherstripping and some loose latches replaced, not the foundation being replaced.

In a couple years, it might be time for the foundation, but not now.

 

[LegChairGM]

Bunting - Matthews - Nylander
Ritchie - Tavares - Marner
Kerfoot - Kampf - Kase
Micheyev - Spezza - Simmonds

Rielly - Brodie
Muzzin - Holl
Dermott - Liljegren/Menell

Mrazek
Campbell

 

[kb]

I feel most of the leafs competition got stronger and the leafs got weaker. I like the Ritchie add. The rest is up in the air

More feeling than fact.

Let's run this through yet again.

Leafs were 8-3-2 wihout Hyman.
Leafs were 8-1-2 without Bogosian.

(The lone regulation loss for Bogosian and one of the Hyman losses was the final game of the season when seeding were locked in and players were being rested).

Leafs record with any goalie other than Andersen - 22-6-4.

Those are the 3 biggest player losses. The Leafs did not suffer without them in the lineup.

Tampa lost Gourde, Johnson, Coleman, and Goodrow.
Boston lost both goalies - Halak and Rask.
Florida lost the guy who was their #1G stats wise, along with many having unforeseen career years.

The Leafs arguably are in the best shape of all Atlantic teams heading into the 21/22 season.

 

[mydnyte]

Wait until you see Nick Ritchie lumbering around out there trying to replace Hyman. His skating and playmaking will be a noticeable downgrade and more hitting and fighting then passing and playmaking.

Be careful what you wish for and you're really don't appreciate something till its gone and see what you have lost.

If it wasn't about the money and cap Leafs would have loved to have Hyman back and all his teammates always asked that he play on their line.

I have always despised Hyman in the top 6 ...he is a world beater as a 3rd liner, but on the top 2 lines, he devastates offense.
It would make me sick to my stomach to see Matthews pass to Hyman for the zone entry (at the blue line) then watch Mathews skate to an open spot in the slot area, and look for a return pass that never ever came!
Hyman would do Hyman things and just swallow the puck and keep it for himself, he never looked for his teammates, and never made a quick pass to them, he just is not capable of doing that.

If you watch and analyze games in regards of Hyman NOT passing the puck to an open Matthews/Marner you would discover that Hyman is the most selfish player on the team by a country mile.

I've heard commentators, and reporters say how everyone wanted Hyman on their line, but, I've never heard any player say it, unless they are towing the team line of course.
I hope McDavid pads Hyman's stats even more, but, in all seriousness, i have a feeling, that Hyman on McD's wing will not be long suffered.

Hyman will continue to look good as he's fighting for the puck, and forechecking in the corner and trying to get to the net, but, while he's doing that. McD will have done a dozen laps in the zone, and gone for a change out of frustration.

 

[mydnyte]

Hyman played his role well, and he earned it over the years, but you don't have to be a 1st. line talent to fill that role. Might actually be too little puck for 3 1st. line talents on a single line.

For me, skating, puck retrieval, and defensive awareness should be the requirement for that role. We know that is a high risk line, with blind passes, drop passes, soft passes keeping that 3rd. player on his toes to cover-up for those plays. Maybe why Hyman was on that line and on the PK.

for me, you need to add one more Key requirement, FEED the Stars!!
Hyman may have done the rest, but, he never passed the puck.
On occasion he would lose the puck trying to do a spin shot and it would get to a teammate by accident, but, as far as looking for his teammates and passing, he never did that, and with Matthews as your C, you should have tunnel vision, and try to get him the puck ever second you are on the ice.

 

[ToneDog]

for me, you need to add one more Key requirement, FEED the Stars!!
Hyman may have done the rest, but, he never passed the puck.
On occasion he would lose the puck trying to do a spin shot and it would get to a teammate by accident, but, as far as looking for his teammates and passing, he never did that, and with Matthews as your C, you should have tunnel vision, and try to get him the puck ever second you are on the ice.

Mitch does that on the PP. How's that working out ?? So you think any of our LWers are going to fill the role better than Hyman ?? There is a reason why Hyman more than doubled his salary. Let's see how it plays out this season playing with McDavid. Pretty sure McD won't be as frustrated as you think he will be playing with Hyman.

 

[zeke]

Tbh ideally we'd take a few from the 1-3 row, add one to the 3-5 row, and a few to the <1 row.

 

[mydnyte]

Mitch does that on the PP. How's that working out ?? So you think any of our LWers are going to fill the role better than Hyman ?? There is a reason why Hyman more than doubled his salary. Let's see how it plays out this season playing with McDavid. Pretty sure McD won't be as frustrated as you think he will be playing with Hyman.

That is exactly what they did at the start f the season, and it worked great until they tried to change the recipe. and become 'less predictable' ...when feeding Matthews they were a top 3 PP, when trying to diversify, they became a bottom 3 ...i guess you can partially blame the Matthews wrist injury and his inability to take a 1-timer for the reason to change it up, but, once he was healthy, they should have gone right back to non stop feeding him the puck.

It's not like it hasnt worked for OV over the past decade, Washington's PP is always just setup OV for a 1-timer, unless they give you an open look/shot

 

[Magic Man]

I like most of the signings. I'll give it a solid B.

Before FA opened I considered Mrazek and Raanta to be the two options I preferred given the cap space they had to use on the position. I feel comfortable with a Campbell/Mrazek tandem. I thought the price was on the high side, but that wasn't uncommon this FA period. Still think they did the best they could here.

Ritchie and Bunting were both high on my personal sign list. The Leafs needed a large injection of grit up front and LW'ers. I wanted Foligno back also. They tried on him, but didn't have the cap room. I'm happy with each of them. I would've given Ritchie an extra year at that price to keep him in the fold for longer. I don't consider the Leafs a tough team now, but I think they're adequate in the area. Interesting to see them after Hakanpaa as well on a multi year offer.

I'm not high on Kase. He's soft and concussion prone. From a roster perspective a 3rd line RW with a defensive game made sense and he fits the bill. With considerable scoring upside. He's cheap and an RFA at years end. But, I think if I was to gamble it would be that he hurts himself or he's not the same as he was before his last concussion.

Kampf is interesting. I think a lot of fans had their eye on Kuraly and Glendening. Kuraly signed for too much. They signed Kampf for the same price as Glendening. I think his takeaway/giveaway ratio is ridiculous. Should be on the top PK unit with Marner.

The draft was okay. I thought they would try to bring in more picks. Only 3 prospects is disappointing considering what we're accustomed to. Really happy with the route they went with the Knies pick. Big, gritty and talented, what they lack in the pool. They did partially make up for a lack of picks with the signing of Pavel Gogolev.

The Expansion draft bothered me. I wanted to dump Kerfoot and spread his cap around the FA grouping. Truthfully, I don't know if a good replacement was out there. But, they may have had enough for someone like Foligno if they had a touch extra.

 

[Dekes For Days]

There is a reason why Hyman more than doubled his salary.

Yeah. Matthews and Marner.

 

[The Podium]

Wait until you see Nick Ritchie lumbering around out there trying to replace Hyman. His skating and playmaking will be a noticeable downgrade and more hitting and fighting then passing and playmaking.

Be careful what you wish for and you're really don't appreciate something till its gone and see what you have lost.

If it wasn't about the money and cap Leafs would have loved to have Hyman back and all his teammates always asked that he play on their line.

I think the intention is having Bunting replace Hyman as they play a closer style than Ritchie and Hyman.

Ritchie is more of a Thornton or Simmonds replacement, except Ritchie still has gas in the tank and some untapped potential.

 

[mydnyte]

I think the intention is having Bunting replace Hyman as they play a closer style than Ritchie and Hyman.

Ritchie is more of a Thornton or Simmonds replacement, except Ritchie still has gas in the tank and some untapped potential.

he's 25, i should hope he has some gas left in the tank... no idea if he'll be any good, but, he has decent hands, so, should be able to produce.
not sure if Bunting is ready for prime time ...#1 LW may be a hard sell, Simmonds may even get a look there.
Ideally, someone injects adamantium into Robertson and he slots in there, otherwise he may be too fragile to ever take a regular shift.

 

[Mess]

View attachment 459044

Tbh ideally we'd take a few from the 1-3 row, add one to the 3-5 row, and a few to the <1 row.

Sort of like what Boston just did and released RFAs Ritchie @ $1.5 mil and Kase at $2.6 mil (@ $4.1 mil) and added Foligno at $3.8 mil.

I suppose Leafs could have re-signed Foligno and achieved what you suggest is ideal for the same cap space and cap level salaries.

The old quality for quantity debate here.

 

[zeke]

Sort of like what Boston just did and released Ritchie @ $1.5 mil and Kase at $2.6 mil (@ $4.1 mil) and added Foligno at $3.8 mil.

I suppose Leafs could have resigned Foligno and achieved what you suggest is ideal.

If you like Foligno at $3.8m, then sure.

Ritchie QO was $2.0m btw.

 

[Leafidelity]

I think the biggest thing for me is prying Matthews and Marner away from each other. Marner might just be one of those players that plays better elevating scrubs. I don't know if you even start him with Tavares, or just attempt three scoring lines.

 

[crump]

Ritchie . Matthews. Marner
Bunting. Tavares. Nylander
Kerfoot. Kampf. Kase.
Mikheyev. Spezza. Simmonds

1st line adds Ritchie, a face puncher to protect Star players, but also cleans up garbage in front of the net.

Bunting is sort of a Hyman Lt, but also adds a pest element which I really like. Also cleans up garbage around the crease and should work well with Tavares/Nylander cycle game

DOA line (fist initials) kills opposition offense in arrival. Good mix of speed and foreheck. From what I have read, Kase is like a Connor Brown that has even better hands..I pray is is healthy because I think we will love this line. A proper shutdown line with deadly transition offensive ability.

4th line gives honest safe 5/5 minutes but with some Pp and Pk time as well.