Leafs need to get more physical and not just fighting

[LeafsNation75]

The reason those teams "get away with it", as you see it, is because they constantly play that way.

The refs come to expect that to be the game with grittier stlyle teams and they make the calls based on the relative temperature they play at.

When Toronto does anything in the way of showing push-back, character, and aggresiveness, it really stands out for the refs because the other 98% of the time, they play a pretty unabrasive, wimpy style.

If Matthews constantly played on the edge, mixed it up, took the odd roughing call once in a while, doesn't laugh when he's being bullied by players, etc., all of a sudden that cross-check to the neck against big bad Rasmus Dahlin last year probably doesn't get a suspension. He probably also would have just fought him and not done that in the first place either but regardless..

Much like with their fellow players and watchers of the sport, the Leafs need to earn the respect from the refs that are calling the game as well.

Since it was Dahlin who first cross checked Matthews and we saw him retaliate which is what got him suspended, that's the problem when others say he should be more physical and fight back.

Earlier this season when Matthews refused to fight in that game against the Flyers, that turned into a whole debate if he needed to do it.

 

[ACC1224]

Since it was Dahlin who first cross checked Matthews and we saw him retaliate which is what got him suspended, that's the problem when others say he should be more physical and fight back.

Earlier this season when Matthews refused to fight in that game against the Flyers, that turned into a whole debate if he needed to do it.

Had he retaliated without his stick he wouldn't have been suspended.

 

[Nineteen67]

The problem is the Leafs just don’t stick up for each other, enough.

If memory serves, when McAvoy tripped (dangerously, IMO) Jankrok near the boards in the first period, another Bruin came over and crosschecked Marner, not too viciously, but it was enough that every Leafs player on the ice should have gang tackled him.

 

[LeafsNation75]

Had he retaliated without his stick he wouldn't have been suspended.

I agree 100%. The problem is the one time Matthews did retaliate he got suspended. If he didn't there would be others who say he's not tough enough. So, doesn't that mean he's in a no win situation?

 

[ACC1224]

I agree 100%. The problem is the one time Matthews did retaliate he got suspended. If he didn't there would be others who say he's not tough enough. So, doesn't that mean he's in a no win situation?

No. He could have retaliated without using his stick.
In my experience, guys who use their sticks aren't considered tough, they are considered the opposite.

 

[mikeyz]

Ah yes more false narratives that Leafs haven't won a round because they aren't physical enough. Do we really need a thread every week about something that isn't true?

...... How is it not true? And let's just say for argument's sake that it isn't true. Then how do you explain them constantly losing in the first round?

 

[AvroArrow]

When the Leafs get physical our guys get suspended and 5 minute majors, no thanks. We just need a quality shutdown D and a 2nd line LW.

 

[ToneDog]

...... How is it not true? And let's just say for argument's sake that it isn't true. Then how do you explain them constantly losing in the first round?

1. Untimely/weak goals against
2. Lack of depth scoring
3. Untimely mistakes
4. Poor referees
5. Unlucky
6. Outcoached
7. COVID
8. Babs
9. Jumbo/Marleau
10. Injuries to Tavares/Muzzin
11. Lub
12. Holl over Lily
13. Kadri suspensions
14. Lack of killer instinct (vs Habs)
15. Impotent PP
16. Hyman
17, Rask
18. Elvis and Korpi
19. Price
20. Vasi in game #7
21. Chara
22. Jones and Werenski
23. Weber
24. Hedman
25. Not hard to play against (vs Jackets)

 

[Gilmour1996]

1. Untimely/weak goals against
2. Lack of depth scoring
3. Untimely mistakes
4. Poor referees
5. Unlucky
6. Outcoached
7. COVID
8. Babs
9. Jumbo/Marleau
10. Injuries to Tavares/Muzzin
11. Lub
12. Holl over Lily
13. Kadri suspensions

Might be missing a few but it has never been due to lack of scoring in closeout games by the 4 amigos

14. Heart and dedication.
15. Not enough money left for depth players after the stars have been paid so handsomely.
16. Not initiating regular physical play but rather reacting only (and sheepishly so) or letting a few guys do it all instead of everyone. Having a 'big 4" needs those 4 playing big!
17. Lack of focus which increases giveaways and missed defensive assignments, even from their best players.
18. Lack of experience in winning the most important games that can get them past round #1.
19. Poor choices at trading. Veteran players acquired aren't mean enough.
20. Trading, scouting and development could be better.

Now we have an even twenty!

 

[ACC1224]

1. Untimely/weak goals against
2. Lack of depth scoring
3. Untimely mistakes
4. Poor referees
5. Unlucky
6. Outcoached
7. COVID
8. Babs
9. Jumbo/Marleau
10. Injuries to Tavares/Muzzin
11. Lub
12. Holl over Lily
13. Kadri suspensions
14. Lack of killer instinct (vs Habs)
15. Impotent PP
16. Hyman
17, Rask
18. Elvis and Korpi
19. Price
20. Vasi in game #7
21. Chara
22. Jones and Werenski
23. Weber
24. Hedman
25. Not hard to play against (vs Jackets)

Forgot Lou Lam and the Illuminati.

 

[LeafsNation75]

No. He could have retaliated without using his stick.
In my experience, guys who use their sticks aren't considered tough, they are considered the opposite.

So, I guess you apply that same type of thinking to Dahlin who started all of that when he first cross checked Matthews with his stick.

 

[Morbo]

Nah. they need more scoring.

 

[barilko05]

The reason those teams "get away with it", as you see it, is because they constantly play that way.

The refs come to expect that to be the game with grittier stlyle teams and they make the calls based on the relative temperature they play at.

When Toronto does anything in the way of showing push-back, character, and aggresiveness, it really stands out for the refs because the other 98% of the time, they play a pretty unabrasive, wimpy style.

If Matthews constantly played on the edge, mixed it up, took the odd roughing call once in a while, doesn't laugh when he's being bullied by players, etc., all of a sudden that cross-check to the neck against big bad Rasmus Dahlin last year probably doesn't get a suspension. He probably also would have just fought him and not done that in the first place either but regardless..

Much like with their fellow players and watchers of the sport, the Leafs need to earn the respect from the refs that are calling the game as well.

Sorry, but I'd rather Matthews laughs at his opponents, which btw is a sure fire way to piss them off and get them to do something stupid...then have our best player, and one of the best in the league, not available for 5 minutes (or more) at a time because he fought some 3rd or 4th liner who's contribution to the other team is negligible. And what if he broke his hand...or got concussed? This place would BLOW UP...not at AM, but at Keefe and Dubas for "allowing him to take matters into his own hands." I can just HEAR the collective whine from the haters. BTW..,.the same goes for Marner, JT, Willie, and Rielly. Let the plumbers and the bottom six deal with the other teams agitators. I want our best to be on the ice as much as possible...to play, score, and win.

And also...the refs should all be fired if they officiate games based on "who's a rat and who's not." The rulebook is the rulebook...your personal bias as to who gets a call..,or doesn't...shouldn't enter into it. That's GB's game management edict, and it's ruined this game. IMO, of course.

 

[LeafsNation75]

Sorry, but I'd rather Matthews laughs at his opponents, which btw is a sure fire way to piss them off and get them to do something stupid...then have our best player, and one of the best in the league, not available for 5 minutes (or more) at a time because he fought some 3rd or 4th liner who's contribution to the other team is negligible. And what if he broke his hand...or got concussed? This place would BLOW UP...not at AM, but at Keefe and Dubas for "allowing him to take matters into his own hands." I can just HEAR the collective whine from the haters. BTW..,.the same goes for Marner, JT, Willie, and Rielly. Let the plumbers and the bottom six deal with the other teams agitators. I want our best to be on the ice as much as possible...to play, score, and win.

And also...the refs should all be fired if they officiate games based on "who's a rat and who's not." The rulebook is the rulebook...your personal bias as to who gets a call..,or doesn't...shouldn't enter into it. That's GB's game management edict, and it's ruined this game. IMO, of course.

Does anyone say that Connor McDavid should fight? So, I agree that Matthews doesn't need to fight because it's not worth the risk. Now that doesn't mean he can't throw some hits when given the chance, because that's completely different.

 

[ACC1224]

Sorry, but I'd rather Matthews laughs at his opponents, which btw is a sure fire way to piss them off and get them to do something stupid...then have our best player, and one of the best in the league, not available for 5 minutes (or more) at a time because he fought some 3rd or 4th liner who's contribution to the other team is negligible. And what if he broke his hand...or got concussed? This place would BLOW UP...not at AM, but at Keefe and Dubas for "allowing him to take matters into his own hands." I can just HEAR the collective whine from the haters. BTW..,.the same goes for Marner, JT, Willie, and Rielly. Let the plumbers and the bottom six deal with the other teams agitators. I want our best to be on the ice as much as possible...to play, score, and win.

And also...the refs should all be fired if they officiate games based on "who's a rat and who's not." The rulebook is the rulebook...your personal bias as to who gets a call..,or doesn't...shouldn't enter into it. That's GB's game management edict, and it's ruined this game. IMO, of course.

His laughing wouldn’t piss anyone off. They’ll be laughing at him at the bench knowing they are in his head.
At worse he should handle it like Tavares and just skate away stoned face, not with the sissy giggle.

 

[JL17]

His laughing wouldn’t piss anyone off. They’ll be laughing at him at the bench knowing they are in his head.
At worse he should handle it like Tavares and just skate away stoned face, not with the sissy giggle.

If you watch Tavares is a scrum the guy takes a couple shots to face in every scrum lol and very very very rarely does he ever do anything back. Just hang on for dear life.

 

[ACC1224]

If you watch Tavares is a scrum the guy takes a couple shots to face in every scrum lol and very very very rarely does he ever do anything back. Just hang on for dear life.

Yeah I'm not really a fan of that either but I imagine he has been doing that his whole life, very disciplined.
I like a little pushback once in a while.

 

[613Leafer]

This has been a problem for the Leafs for a good 15+ years. Legit going back to when Burke was brought in and talked about "pugnacity" and "truculence".

The problem is, barring a handful of exceptions (e.g. Muzzin), when we do add legit physical players, they're almost always 3rd/4th liners (e.g. Orr, Rosehill, Simmonds, Clifford, Martin, Brown, etc) or #4-7 dmen (e.g. Polak, Lyubushkin, Fraser, Komisarek, etc).

We don't even need Lucic in his prime, but just getting a couple of more legitimately physical guys, especially for the playoffs, would help a lot IMO. Our blueline doesn't even have room for someone else, so I'm of the mindset that we could benefit from trading from our blueline to fill a hole up front because we have a surplus of pretty solid D who aren't overly physical (e.g. trade Sandin for a similar age/similar upside forward who plays with some grit to address the issue up front), and then trade picks/prospects to add a more physical top 4 dman (e.g. Gavrikov).

 

[ACC1224]

This has been a problem for the Leafs for a good 15+ years. Legit going back to when Burke was brought in and talked about "pugnacity" and "truculence".

The problem is, barring a handful of exceptions (e.g. Muzzin), when we do add legit physical players, they're almost always 3rd/4th liners (e.g. Orr, Rosehill, Simmonds, Clifford, Martin, Brown, etc) or #4-7 dmen (e.g. Polak, Lyubushkin, Fraser, Komisarek, etc).

We don't even need Lucic in his prime, but just getting a couple of more legitimately physical guys, especially for the playoffs, would help a lot IMO. Our blueline doesn't even have room for someone else, so I'm of the mindset that we could benefit from trading from our blueline to fill a hole up front because we have a surplus of pretty solid D who aren't overly physical (e.g. trade Sandin for a similar age/similar upside forward who plays with some grit to address the issue up front), and then trade picks/prospects to add a more physical top 4 dman (e.g. Gavrikov).

Now you've done it.

Troops are rallying down at the D.D.L.

 

[LeafSteel]

Looks like Dubas disagrees, or just didn't read this thread.

Dryden Hunt on waivers......... because you don't need anyone who hits or forechecks, particularly in the playoffs.....

 

[OVO16]

Looks like Dubas disagrees, or just didn't read this thread.

Dryden Hunt on waivers......... because you don't need anyone who hits or forechecks, particularly in the playoffs.....

We need more small skilled wingers with a high corsi in bottom 6. Get the memo bro

 

[ACC1224]

Looks like Dubas disagrees, or just didn't read this thread.

Dryden Hunt on waivers......... because you don't need anyone who hits or forechecks, particularly in the playoffs.....

he was waived today?

 

[LeafSteel]

he was waived today?

https://twitter.com/intent/follow?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1617237486811648000%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=&screen_name=joshuakloke

 

[Dekes For Days]

Looks like Dubas disagrees, or just didn't read this thread.
Dryden Hunt on waivers......... because you don't need anyone who hits or forechecks, particularly in the playoffs.....

I sure hope Dubas isn't reading this horrible thread, but what a weird comment, considering that Hunt went on waivers because McMann - a bigger player with a similar style of play - came up and beat him out for a spot.

 

[LeafSteel]

I sure hope Dubas isn't reading this horrible thread, but what a weird comment, considering that Hunt went on waivers because McMann - a bigger player with a similar style of play - came up and beat him out for a spot.

Not even going to bother with you my man.

Have a great day!