Post-Game Talk: Leafs Lose in OT Again to Devils.

[fahad203]

I watched less than half the game, so don't have much angst.

Watched the highlights, Nylander's goal, and the lowlights marner in overtime.

Well, at least they got the point for the regulation tie.

These points gives the leafs false senses of confidence.
They were 1-5 in the powerplay what looked horrible after the 1st one.

You probably missed the best play of the game. Marner playing Defense and Hischer just reminded Keefe why he shouldn't have. He absolutely undressed him with a filthy, I mean filthy dangle

 

[wingman75]

Anyone know what our ot record is the last two seasons? Regular season and playoffs?

2020-2021
OT Record: 5-9 incl playoffs
SO Record: 1-0

2021-2022
OT Record: 5-8 incl playoffs
SO Record: 3-1

2022-2023
OT Record: 1-3

 

[robertmac43]

I mean they are the best team in the league...

 

[Aashir]

So what you're saying is a full rebuild

Not really, we need those pieces, but for example if someone like jarnkrok starts producing at his usual 30-40 pace that’s one bottom six guy, then we get one more and that gives us a solid third line with kampf. ZAR and Malgin with someone makes a decen fourth line

Top 6 winger has been needed since 2020-2021. 2nd LW was always a hole, kerfoot isn’t good enough there, but he’s ideal in 3rd line, so getting a top 6 winger addresses the third guy on the 3rd line.

Top 4 dman is just for muzzins replacement, he isn’t going to play probably and we will wanna look for a replacement.

These pieces are hard to find, but not impossible

 

[Larcos_Unal]

Slow, soft, disinterested, Murray was the only reason they got a point.

This is not a team that's built for playoff success.

 

[stickty111]

I'm at the point where we shouldn't stress about goalies too much. Another forward is a priority.

 

[Seath The Scaleless]

Kerfoot and his 3.5mil needs to go.
So is Holl.
Engvall too.
What are these three adding to the Leafs?

I still don't understand why Kerfoot wasn't traded in the summer after a career year.

 

[Ianturnedbull]

I went to the game tonight.

It could have been elite...



...instead of was...delete.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

Kerfoot and his 3.5mil needs to go.
So is Holl.
Engvall too.
What are these three adding to the Leafs?

Defensive value for all three. Kerfoot and Holl are both key PKers too.

Offensively... Well that is another thing, but it is a thing with everyone for pretty much everyone on this team. Even Matthews can't do anything at ES right now.

Right now, we need to find the right mix for the 3rd line. Maybe that is Engvall - Kerfoot - Jarnkrok? They have been pretty good together. All three can skate and have two-way ability. That is pretty much the only good combination which has worked for Jarnkrok. That also opens up a top 6 spot for Robertson again, this time with Tavares + Marner.

The other alternative is trying out some other Marlies. Holmberg has been fine individually, but he needs an extended stretch with the Marlies and we are not short on alternatives: Abruzzese, SDA, Anderson, and Steeves all look like they should get some kind of a chance at an NHL spot this year, and Gaudette may get a chance too.

Although a lot of it is needing the top guys to step up at ES too.

 

[Smif]

18 games in and it is pretty dubious that Dubas has gutted our forward depth. With Matty scoring at a 37 and Mitch at an 18 goal pace, there is no hiding this.

Because we're missing who...Mikheyev??

 

[Dreakmur]

Defensive value for all three. Kerfoot and Holl are both key PKers too.

Should we really be paying 7.75 million for 3 players that do nothing at ES and are decent PKers?

Right now, we need to find the right mix for the 3rd line. Maybe that is Engvall - Kerfoot - Jarnkrok? They have been pretty good together. All three can skate and have two-way ability. That is pretty much the only good combination which has worked for Jarnkrok. That also opens up a top 6 spot for Robertson again, this time with Tavares + Marner.

The other alternative is trying out some other Marlies. Holmberg has been fine individually, but he needs an extended stretch with the Marlies and we are not short on alternatives: Abruzzese, SDA, Anderson, and Steeves all look like they should get some kind of a chance at an NHL spot this year, and Gaudette may get a chance too.

Although a lot of it is needing the top guys to step up at ES too.

We need different kinds of players. Kerfoot, Jarnkrok, Engvall, Malgin, Holmberg.... they're all the same. Non-impact players. Having some versatility is nice, but when the majority of your forward group is made up of vanilla players, it just doesn't work.

 

[bax]

Was an evenly played game, thought the Devils defense is better than ours.

Hirshcher kid impressed.

He was fantastic

 

[leafsfan5]

Should we really be paying 7.75 million for 3 players that do nothing at ES and are decent PKers?



We need different kinds of players. Kerfoot, Jarnkrok, Engvall, Malgin, Holmberg.... they're all the same. Non-impact players. Having some versatility is nice, but when the majority of your forward group is made up of vanilla players, it just doesn't work.

Exactly, they're all soft, defensively responsible players who struggle to score. Those provide limited value in a playoff series

Having one is nice, maybe 2. We have an excess of them and it makes for a bad bottom 6

(Though I wouldn't include Malgin in that list, he uses his body on the forecheck and can drive play. Plus he actually shoots the puck on net unlike most of this team)

 

[Dreakmur]

Exactly, they're all soft, defensively responsible players who struggle to score. Those provide limited value in a playoff series

Having one is nice, maybe 2. We have an excess of them and it makes for a bad bottom 6

(Though I wouldn't include Malgin in that list, he uses his body on the forecheck and can drive play. Plus he actually shoots the puck on net unlike most of this team)

Swapping some of them out for guys like Max Comtois, Christian Fischer, Ivan Barbashev, Yakov Trenin, Adam Erne, or Austin Watson would improve the mix.

 

[Teeder Keon]

I agree with this, it may be one of only 4 or 5 posts that have anything to do with the reality of what happened in that game tonight.

A couple of things

Sandin looked more like himself than at anytime previously in this season. He was doing the little things, maybe he's turned a corner, it's about time and it means only good things going forward.

The Devils are for real, theyre healthy and all hands are on deck. The Devils were the favourite tonight on the road, yes that's right the favourite on the road. They have dominated in most games they've played so far, and the Leafs played them pretty even for a majority of that game.

Yes the Leafs have some deficiencies, we'd like to see more size in the bottom 6 and they need more physicality from the blueline. The big boys aren't even playing at their normal level, once they do start scoring at that elite level the 2 goal games will be in the rear view mirror.

The goaltending isn't yet settled but it looks like it might be once Sammy's back.

It's still early, they're sitting in a playoff spot and all is not lost. Take a puff, take a drink, meditate just do what you need to do to chill, life is way to short to be gnashing your teeth about stuff that will work itself out.

Relax

I like reading your balanced views and other points you bring , the positives and realities you brought up are valid .
I certainly take a bit harder stance on our overall makeup , but I also agree with what you observed .
GLG

Thankfully the Sabres roll into town next.

Be careful of what you wish …

 

[Gabriel426]

Defensive value for all three. Kerfoot and Holl are both key PKers too.

Offensively... Well that is another thing, but it is a thing with everyone for pretty much everyone on this team. Even Matthews can't do anything at ES right now.

Right now, we need to find the right mix for the 3rd line. Maybe that is Engvall - Kerfoot - Jarnkrok? They have been pretty good together. All three can skate and have two-way ability. That is pretty much the only good combination which has worked for Jarnkrok. That also opens up a top 6 spot for Robertson again, this time with Tavares + Marner.

The other alternative is trying out some other Marlies. Holmberg has been fine individually, but he needs an extended stretch with the Marlies and we are not short on alternatives: Abruzzese, SDA, Anderson, and Steeves all look like they should get some kind of a chance at an NHL spot this year, and Gaudette may get a chance too.

Although a lot of it is needing the top guys to step up at ES too.

That’s the problem.
Holl is in the PK bc Keefe doesn’t trust Lilly, and Reilly is not great at it. If Muz and TJ are playing while Reilly can be better in D, those three plus Gio and Lilly are good enough for the PK. Once again if Dubas actually did trade this summer or actually drafted a Dman instead of another forward three years ago when they failed to advance in the playins, Holl would not be on the team.
If you need to pay 3.5mil for a PKer, that’s overpaid. Kerfoot is a glue guy but we don’t need glue guy on the Leafs. Would much rather have Brown(I know he is injured) or Moore(not even talking about his hat trick last night) than Kerfoot on the team. Not to mention Kerfoot constantly making the dumbest decisions on the ice, don’t even understand how he graduated from Harvard.
Engvall needs to be coach to drive the net or take a hike bc if he doesn’t want to, there is no place for him on the team.

 

[Stephen]

Because we're missing who...Mikheyev??

They did get 47 goals out of Mikheyev, Kase, Spezza last year.

Will Jarnkrok, Malgin, Aston-Reese and Robertson give us 30 total?

 

[NJG]

Should we really be paying 7.75 million for 3 players that do nothing at ES and are decent PKers?



We need different kinds of players. Kerfoot, Jarnkrok, Engvall, Malgin, Holmberg.... they're all the same. Non-impact players. Having some versatility is nice, but when the majority of your forward group is made up of vanilla players, it just doesn't work.

Yep new people need to come in. The formula for the lines should be pretty simple:

Marner - Matthews - Bunting
Nylander - Tavares - Top 6 Forward
Kampf - Engvall - Defensive Winger with some offense
Defensive Winger- Defensive Center - Defensive Winger

Big/Physical Defensive Dman - Big/Physical Defensive Dman
Rielly - Brodie
Big/Physical Defensive Dman - Big/Physical Defensive Dman

Murray - Samsonov

Top six forward speaks for itself.
Right third line winger needs to be defensive player with some offensive upside with good size. Someone like another Kampf.
Fourth line needs to be all guys who are good defensive players with size.
The defence isn't good enough and it's not big/physical enough.

Needs to go: Muzzin - Kerfoot - Holl - Jarnkrok - Giordano
Marlies/Depth: Robertson - Malgin - Aston-Reese - Benn - Liljegren - Sandin

 

[Gabriel426]

One thing I really liked about NJ is that they seemed to have a purpose. They are also very tenacious
Nico Hischer doesn't just rely on his skills, he drives the net. He did that twice

Same with Hughes, drove the net few times

I was left impressed with that team.... Kudos to them

They play a simple and direct game. Leafs play a complicated game by holding possession as much as possible unless you are in OT. That’s all on coaching. In a way, the Devils is playing how Babs wanted the Leafs to play.

 

[notDatsyuk]

Starting Tavares and Marner in OT against one of the fastest teams in the league is quite the own goal. But credit for clawing back in a tight game against a team on a "heater."

Nylander leads the team in ES goals, so there is no reason to start him 3-on-3. Much better to start three of the five players with the most giveaways!

 

[djdev]

this is all i think when i think about justin holl..

 

[notDatsyuk]

Pretty demoralizing to get dominated by a younger & more structured team like that. It's crazy how we've ended up in a scenario where the Devils are much better than us.

If the top line isn't going, this team looks so mediocre. Difficult to be optimistic about this group.

The top line was going, and scored the only goal, but the rest weren't. We would have been better off to start AM and WN (and maybe Lilly) in OT.

 

[hfman]

Thankfully the Sabres roll into town next.

LOL!

Seriously?

This is Buffalo we're talking about...

you do know how the Leafs fare against the Sabres every single time, right??

The only bright side is that the game is in Toronto and not Buffalo. Because if the game was in Buffalo then it's an automatic Leaf loss, always has been always will be


Still, when they play the Sabres a chance of a win is never good no matter who's barn the game is in

 

[notDatsyuk]

Imagine two younger nasty Benn clones on Leafs defence? Trade one of the Big 4 to beef up the D, Kyle.

Apart from Benn, the only bodychecks in our own zone all night were from JT and Matthews. This is insane...

Sandin led the team in hits.

 

[notDatsyuk]

Didn't feel they were much better. They attacked with more speed and popped more but we held onto the puck and did a lot of the possession stuff they like to do. Almost felt like a playoff game where we traded offensive ability for defensive coverage and just short circuited.

The special teams PP is so bad though. That incompetence is going to burn this team if they don't stop the Half Asleep Globetrotter nonsense.

The only time the PP looked dangerous was when Bunting replaced Tavares. A couple of quick passes and Matthews going to the slot and they score.

I think part of the "pass it around and around and around" has to do with them knowing that if you give it to JT he will usually either shoot or lose the puck.