Confirmed with Link: Leafs go 4-4-1 in expansion, Dermott, Kerfoot, McCann, exposed

[TheBeastCoast]

Maybe people feel like this was a chance to get a player for cheap that improves the team?
Whatever the Pens were planning is moot, Benning made a deal for a player that made the team better,was going to be exposed, got him for cheap and protected him. Dubas did the same but then exposes him to protectt a player that isn't all that good and probably won't get picked.

I don't think the difference between McCann and Kerfoot is worth freaking out about to be completely honest. If I were to tell you a week ago that as an organization we would lose Hallander and a 7th round pick to the expansion draft process would you have taken that well or no? If you think Kerfoot is such a dead asset why do you think they wouldn't just take I don't know...Dermott?

 

[TheBeastCoast]

This isn't about Kerfoot vs McCann. It's about Holl.

RDs available to Seattle that are better than Holl: Shattenkirk, Erik Johnson, Stecher, Nutivaara, Braun, Foote (potential)

That's not considering LDs. If I were to list defencemen without minding handedness, there would be about 12-14 guys ahead of Holl.

I mean...a couple of those are pretty god damn arguable lol. If we made Holl available they were taking Holl. I get it some of you hate him...but they would be taking him.

 

[Brobust]

The only logic here is that Dubas wants a $2M guy in the top four because he wants to spend $5M+ on another forward. That's the only slim hope that I have that this team didn't just piss away a good 25 year old player.

They better add a Landeskog or a Garland for any of this to make sense.

 

[francis246]

This isn't about Kerfoot vs McCann. It's about Holl.

RDs available to Seattle that are better than Holl: Shattenkirk, Erik Johnson, Stecher, Nutivaara, Braun, Foote (potential)

That's not considering LDs. If I were to list defencemen without minding handedness, there would be about 12-14 guys ahead of Holl.

The only difference is that Hakstol has coached Holl. So he knows exactly what he is getting in Holl

 

[Kurtz]

We lose Hallander and a 7th to protect a 3rd line Center who paced for 11 goals/30 points last year at a 3.5 mil cap hit?

Guys, I can’t overstate this.

Kerfoot paced for ELEVEN goals and THIRTY points last year. At 3.5 mil.

no chance in HELL Seattle takes him over McCann.

If your assessment is shared by Seattle front staff, then they would not take Kerfoot in the first place. Especially given that there are several solid 2/3rd line centres that went unprotected.

So then they would have taken Dermott. So then who would you rather hang onto - Dermott or Hallander+7th?

 

[Brobust]

I mean...a couple of those are pretty god damn arguable lol. If we made Holl available they were taking Holl. I get it some of you hate him...but they would be taking him.

The only one arguable one is Johnson because of injury history. Shattenkirk, Nutivaara and Stecher all had better seasons and two of the three are younger.

The fact is that Justin Holl is a 30 year old rover type of defenceman and he's at the age where those types of guys fall off a cliff. Unless Hakstol desperately pleads for him, there isn't a chance.

Anyway, let them choose him. For the reason I stated there's no reason to protect him.

 

[Isaac Nootin]

Holl while limited is on a good contract.

Seattle grabs him no doubt were he to be exposed.

Guys like Erik Johnson being listed is a joke, he's terrible and making a fortune. There's a reason he volunteered to waive his NMC for the ED.

 

[zeke]

This isn't about Kerfoot vs McCann. It's about Holl.

RDs available to Seattle that are better than Holl: Shattenkirk, Erik Johnson, Stecher, Nutivaara, Braun, Foote (potential)

Holl is quite literally better than all of them - not one of those guys could play on a top shutdown pairing as well as Holl has, unless EJ has a miracle recovery.

 

[zeke]

I think what's bothering people is that Dubas clearly likes Holl, Kerfoot, and Dermott more than they do.

 

[bossram]

Honestly was kind of hoping we'd lose Holl so Liljegren could start getting some NHL games.

If there isn't a side deal where we keep both Kerfoot and McCann, or Holl has some kind of crazy trade value going into the draft, then that is terrible asset management.

Yep. If there's not some kind of assurance that McCann (and ideally Kerfoot) are protected, this is a colossally stupid move. Honestly the single worst move Dubas has made, in terms of thought process and player evaluation.

Holl is easily replaceable. He's just not that good and was carried by Muzzin. Sacrificing one of their few quality non-Core Four forwards to protect a 3rd pair defenseman is a mistake. I was literally saying yesterday how great of a trade Dubas pulled off with McCann, yet now he seems set on completely undoing that.

I've tried to give Dubas the benefit of the doubt in the past, but he's simply made way too many unforced errors for me to really believe he knows what he's doing.

 

[Brobust]

Holl is quite literally better than all of them - not one of those guys could play on a top shutdown pairing as well as Holl has, unless EJ has a miracle recovery.

Stecher, Braun and Nutivaara are definitely better. And none of them have the privilege of playing with Muzzin.

 

[rojac]

I found it interesting that Vegas is excluded from the ED. So in a nutshell every other team loses a player and is slightly weakened. Keep doing what you do Gary.

Vegas also doesn't get the $21.66M ($650M/30) that every other team gets. Given a choice, I suspect Foley would have preferred to lose a player and get $2o.96M ($650M/31).

 

[bossram]

I think what's bothering people is that Dubas clearly likes Holl, Kerfoot, and Dermott more than they do.

I quite like that latter two. The Leafs should keep them.

The issue is Dubas has seriously overvalued Holl, to a detrimental level.

 

[Brobust]

I think what's bothering people is that Dubas clearly likes Holl, Kerfoot, and Dermott more than they do.

Dude, don't group Holl with Kerfoot and Dermott to muddy the issue. Two of the three were left unprotected.

 

[TheBeastCoast]

The only one arguable one is Johnson because of injury history. Shattenkirk, Nutivaara and Stecher all had better seasons and two of the three are younger.

The fact is that Justin Holl is a 30 year old rover type of defenceman and he's at the age where those types of guys fall off a cliff. Unless Hakstol desperately pleads for him, there isn't a chance.

Anyway, let them choose him. For the reason I stated there's no reason to protect him.

Johnson isn't arguable. Get off the damn sauce. He is one of the worst defensemen in the league being paid many times over what Holl is making. I think it is arguable Holl is better then Shattenkirk as well. Holl is 30 but he isn't signed deep into his 30's and is making absolutely nothing. Have you seen some of the good but high ticket players available to Seattle? They would have taken Holl. They will likely take Dermott from us as it is and we will end up with both Kerfoot and McCann.

 

[zeke]

The only one arguable one is Johnson because of injury history. Shattenkirk, Nutivaara and Stecher all had better seasons and two of the three are younger.

The fact is that Justin Holl is a 30 year old rover type of defenceman and he's at the age where those types of guys fall off a cliff. Unless Hakstol desperately pleads for him, there isn't a chance.

Anyway, let them choose him. For the reason I stated there's no reason to protect him.

Lol.

Stecher was a bad #6 dman on one of the worst teams in hockey this year.

Nutivaara was the #8 dman on Florida.

Shattenkirk has been a dman sheltered from top matchups his entire career.

Braun was absolutely caved in last time he faced tough matchups in SJ, and has now found a spot as a decent veteran bottom pair dman a la Bogosian.

What are you talking about?

 

[nuck]

Seattle gets Jared McCann
Pittsburgh gets Filip Hallander and a 7th
Toronto gets to run it back as is because the roster inspires so much f***ing confidence.

I am always poised to skewer Kyle but so far all we know is McCann for Hallander which looks like a steal. 25g and 60pt pace guy with the Pens which Kerfoot will never approach, and under $3M AAV. Why be in a rush to worry about a bad move that hasn't happened yet? There are lots of other dominos to fall and I don't believe KD trades for McCann unless he knows they will be keeping him.

 

[ottomaddox]

The only difference is that Hakstol has coached Holl. So he knows exactly what he is getting in Holl

I don't think Seattle will overthink on Holl or whoever they choose. I think Dubas can be guilty of overthinking this moment.

Hakstol (and NHL coaches) don't draft, trade, or sign players. They can make their recommendations, but this is The GM's moment. All the way.

 

[zeke]

Dude, don't group Holl with Kerfoot and Dermott to muddy the issue. Two of the three were left unprotected.

They clearly valued Kerfoot and Dermott more than they valued Hallander.

 

[ottomaddox]

I think what's bothering people is that Dubas clearly likes Holl, Kerfoot, and Dermott more than they do.

I don't know what the perfect solution is but he clearly likes Holl more than Kerf the turf, and Dermutt.

 

[Brobust]

Lol.

Stecher was a bad #6 dman on one of the worst teams in hockey this year.

Nutivaara was the #8 dman on Florida.

Shattenkirk has been a dman sheltered from top matchups his entire career.

What are you talking about?

Stecher - some of the forwards he was most matched up against. Huberdeau, Verhaeghe, Svechnikov, Gurianov

 

[zeke]

I don't know what the perfect solution is but he clearly likes Holl more than Kerf the turf, and Dermutt.

Given that Holl has been part of one of the better tough usage matchup pairings in hockey the past couple years, I get why.

 

[justashadowof]

Regardless of whether the Kraken would want to use Holl on their defense, he is a mature 21 minute per night right side defender who will be making $2M aav for 2 more seasons. With the cap crunch across the league, that's uber-valuable on the trade market. Undoubtedly Holl has more trade value than Kerfoot and Dermott.

 

[rojac]

Stecher, Braun and Nutivaara are definitely better. And none of them have the privilege of playing with Muzzin.

If they feel that Holl is capable of performing the role they use him in, then I can see how it might make cap sense to keep him. He has a cap hit of $2M for each of the next wo years before he becomes a UFA.

Stecher, Braun, and Nutivaara have cap hits of $1.7M, $1.8M, and $2.7M for this season and are then UFAs. So, you're looking a resigning them or finding another similar player next year again.

 

[The Podium]

Given that Holl has been part of one of the better tough usage matchup pairings in hockey the past couple years, I get why.

It’s strange that the argument is

“Holl plays really well with Muzzin but sucks without him”

They are acknowleding Holls value in a pairing with Muzzin with a caveat that doesn’t matter because he will remain paired with Muzzin