Proposal: Leafs - Canucks 3 for 3 block buster

[LeafingTheWay]

Hutton is already a number 4 at worst. It's not like it's unknown potential. Hutton has proven he has what it takes.

I don't know about that, but I'll take your word for it.

Everytime I watched Cancuks games (Against Leafs, Calgary and Edmonton), he wasn't great. Then you also look and see he had a 2.22 CAReltm with 34%O and 31%D. He also played most with your top Fs H.Sedin, D.Sedin and Horvat. Compare that to Tanev's -7.44 CAReltm with 27%O and 35%D. Even away from Sbisa, Hutton's numbers don't indicate he can handle harder usage.

 

[LeafingTheWay]

Gardiner just last year was considered a waiver foddler by many. On a last place team with no competition getting prime pp time and sheltered minutes he barely got 30 points. On a good team gardiner is not even a top 4 dman. The fact that many leafs fans are calling him a top pairing dman is an absolute joke. Hutton had almost the same amount of points while being only 22 and was much better defensivly and played a greater role. For any neutral fan who has watched both of them its hutton easily. The fact that you think its a joke to compare those 2 players shows that u know nothing outside of ur own leafs players

Yeah Gardiner was considered a waiver fiddler by many just like Rielly and Tanev were (FYI, literally almost every 'fact' you just said was incorrect, but sure go ahead and use them).

I considered Rielly a 2nd pairing calibre D last year (not future, only looking at last year), yet I'm biased? I've defended Tanev as a #1D and how he's one of the best DFD in the game, yet I'm biased?

 

[Currysux*]

wow you're really good at predicting the future aren't u? tell me more about the future of teenage players.

Watch Virtanen play and you will know what hes talking about. He hasnt shown the skills that make him worthy of a top 6 pick.

 

[Currysux*]

Gardiner just last year was considered a waiver foddler by many. On a last place team with no competition getting prime pp time and sheltered minutes he barely got 30 points. On a good team gardiner is not even a top 4 dman. The fact that many leafs fans are calling him a top pairing dman is an absolute joke. Hutton had almost the same amount of points while being only 22 and was much better defensivly and played a greater role. For any neutral fan who has watched both of them its hutton easily. The fact that you think its a joke to compare those 2 players shows that u know nothing outside of ur own leafs players

Yeah ok everything you have said is wrong. Do you just make up BS to put another player down when someone says someone on the Canucks isnt as good as you wish they were?

 

[PG Canuck]

Everyone has potential to be great. Is it highly likely he hits that potential? That poster just said the difference between Gardiner and Hutton isn't big because of that potential. I mean I could say the same about Marincin (I'm not being sarcastic, Marincin impressed).

Hutton is already a #3 on the Canucks, and arguably was as good as Edler last year. It's more likely that he becomes a low end #2, or high end #3 for sure.

 

[PG Canuck]

How on earth are Gardiner and Hutton close? You think he'll develop into a low-end #2/high-end #3? The difference between Gardiner and Hutton is like the difference between Tanev and Marincin.


Too many exaggerations from both sides on this thread.

Well unless Marincin is just magically one of the best defensemen in the NHL, then the gap between Gardiner/Hutton is definitely closer.

 

[PG Canuck]

Watch Virtanen play and you will know what hes talking about. He hasnt shown the skills that make him worthy of a top 6 pick.

Its been one season.

 

[lifelonghockeyfan]

Don't know why the Leafs really need two Dmen from a poor team like Vancouver.

The Leafs have two youngsters Rielly and Gardiner, one more year of Hunwick. Zaitsev might be a steady good Dman. Carrick looks like he can be NHLer. Marincin, Polak and Corrado can hold the fort till Valiev, Dermott, Neilson are NHL ready (hopefully for Leafs).

Leafs aren't going to trade Nylander.

PS. I think Canucks will regret taking the Finnish Dman from the London Knights.

 

[LeafingTheWay]

Just because you watched tanev play in the world's doesn't mean you're an expert on every canucks player, if u watched hutton play you would know whay he is (a 22 year old #4D) but obviously u haven't, since u think a hutton gardiner comparison is similar to a tanev Marincin comparison, this just proves u know nothing about him.

Yeah okay, now is it my turn to assume you haven't watched Gardiner at all? You're still stuck in 2012. And this proves you know nothing about Marincin?

Am I doing it right?

 

[CherryToke]

The Leafs have two youngsters Rielly and Gardiner, one more year of Hunwick. Zaitsev might be a steady good Dman. Carrick looks like he can be NHLer. Marincin, Polak and Corrado can hold the fort till Valiev, Dermott, Neilson are NHL ready (hopefully for Leafs).

Yikes that's bad.

 

[Semantics]

Gardiner just last year was considered a waiver foddler by many.

If Gardiner was waiver fodder then Tanev is an ECHL defenseman.

One of the "worst 6th OA picks in recent memory"?

Tkachuk, Monahan, Lindholm, Zibanejad... yeah, you have to go all the way back to Connolly to find a worse #6. I mean it could be worse, it could have been Filatov, or Luke Schenn at #5. But still pretty bad. I've never seen such a highly touted player do more to basically sabotage Canada's chances at the WJC.

 

[Leon Draisaitl]

Remember when you passed on Erik Karlsson to draft Cody Hodgson? Guess you wouldnt want him, since you could have drafted him instead!

Guess you dont want Larkin or Ehlers? Connor? No? Could have drafted them all but took Virtanen, what a great draft from some of the most clueless minds in sports. Linden is a plug for that franchise, just like he was as a player.

Good point, Canucks should have picked Connor a year before he was eligible

 

[LeafingTheWay]

i have actually, in the 20 or so leafs games i watched last year he made countless defensive errors reminds me of a poor mans hamilton.

Oh well, I guess we're stuck with our currently best D-man that significantly improves everyone of his teammate's play when he's on the ice vs when he's not.

 

[PG Canuck]

If Gardiner was waiver fodder then Tanev is an ECHL defenseman.

That makes no sense - Tanev is a top NHL defensemen as it stands.

 

[PG Canuck]

Don't know why the Leafs really need two Dmen from a poor team like Vancouver.

The Leafs have two youngsters Rielly and Gardiner, one more year of Hunwick. Zaitsev might be a steady good Dman. Carrick looks like he can be NHLer. Marincin, Polak and Corrado can hold the fort till Valiev, Dermott, Neilson are NHL ready (hopefully for Leafs).

Leafs aren't going to trade Nylander.

PS. I think Canucks will regret taking the Finnish Dman from the London Knights.

Yes, two poor defensemen from the Canucks. Tanev being a top NHL defener and Hutton having a stellar rookie season who was playing as good as a 3/4 defensemen already.

If you're comfortable going into the future with that kind of defense, by all means. Looks average, at best. That's if all of them even pan out too.

 

[Mystifo]

Well unless Marincin is just magically one of the best defensemen in the NHL, then the gap between Gardiner/Hutton is definitely closer.

Well actually in terms of Advanced stats yeah they are pretty close...

Both are not really well known for their primary P/60 and are excellent when it comes to shot suppression and possession. Which while it is excellent for a #4/#5 it is not the production you want out of your top pairing defenseman. You would probably want much better primary P/60 than Tanev say something similar to this...

Which if you are wondering is why analytics people are in love with Jake Gardiner.

 

[TOGuy14]

this post proves you haven't seen virtanen, he showed flashes of elite level skill last year in a year he should have been in junior, because i think power forwards need some extra time to develop. the fact that people are writing a 19 year old off as a definite bust baffles me.

To be fair his body of work in high profile games like the WJHC has been awful, which is where many people have watched him the most.

He has also gotten some hype for some goon plays this past season.

 

[eviohh26*]

To be fair his body of work in high profile games like the WJHC has been awful, which is where many people have watched him the most.

He has also gotten some hype for some goon plays this past season.

Guy who watches Canuck highlights.

 

[Killer Orcas]

How on earth are Gardiner and Hutton close? You think he'll develop into a low-end #2/high-end #3? The difference between Gardiner and Hutton is like the difference between Tanev and Marincin.


Too many exaggerations from both sides on this thread.

This thread got heated fast and yes I think Hutton can develop into a low 2 high 3 for sure this season and maybe more. You have to remember he was just a rookie this year. He played with poise on a weak team and will definitely get better. The Tanev and Marcicin comparison is either a bad joke or your Leafs glasses are broken im sorry. If Tanev is on the same level why on earth are so many Leafs posters asking for him? I apologize to Leafs fans as we have many homer fans as well so don't take this personal.

 

[CherryToke]

Well actually in terms of Advanced stats yeah they are pretty close...

Both are not really well known for their primary P/60 and are excellent when it comes to shot suppression and possession. Which while it is excellent for a #4/#5 it is not the production you want out of your top pairing defenseman. You would probably want much better primary P/60 than Tanev say something similar to this...

Which if you are wondering is why analytics people are in love with Jake Gardiner.

I guess QOC means nothing to you.

 

[Semantics]

I guess QOC means nothing to you.

Right, it's well established that QoC has very little effect on possession stats. Mostly because QoC differences aren't all that large in reality.

 

[Semantics]

That makes no sense - Tanev is a top NHL defensemen as it stands.

I happen to think so too, but Canucks fans seem to think Gardiner is waiver fodder when he's the Leafs best defenseman at defending.

 

[clunk]

QoC, zone starts, zone finishes, faceoff wins/losses not being taken into account? Typical.

 

[Semantics]

QoC, zone starts, zone finishes, faceoff wins/losses not being taken into account? Typical.

Ah but QoT matters as much as all of those combined and Edler is a much better teammate than Phaneuf/Polak.

 

[TOGuy14]

QoC, zone starts, zone finishes, faceoff wins/losses not being taken into account? Typical.

Phaneuf for years had the highest QoC in the league with terrible zone starts (way tilted to defensive) and actually played quite good in the circumstances but was often labeled as a second pairing D at best