LD Juuso Valimaki (2017, 16th, CAL)

[Daximus]

I think his year is gone anyway. 9 games means nothing.

If he plays 41 games he loses a year of RFA... maybe... I'm terrible with that stuff. I might be remembering a different player even.

Yeah he's 20 so no contract slide. If he hits 26 games he just loses his rookie status for next year.

 

[OvermanKingGainer]

I think his year is gone anyway. 9 games means nothing.

If he plays 41 games he loses a year of RFA... maybe... I'm terrible with that stuff. I might be remembering a different player even.

Actually, if he plays fewer than nine games, his ELC slides for the 2018-19 season however...

Outsider here in peace. What is the general feeling around here will he get more than 9 games?

with how well he's played from games 2-6... there's no way he gets sent down. He's playing too well and the Flames already let Brett Kulak go.

 

[Daximus]

Actually, if he plays fewer than nine games, his ELC slides for the 2018-19 season however...

Valimaki turned 20 on October 6th.

If a player turns 20 between September 16 and December 31 of the season in question, their contract does not slide.

Edit: Actually you're right that rule only counts if it's the first official year of his contract. Valimaki is in his 2nd official year after it slid last year so he will be eligible to have his contract slide again this year.

 

[BB88]

Why exactly? What makes him a better prospect, especially "clearly".

Looking at their overall point totals year by year since back in Finland U16, their stats are pretty much identical in the corresponding seasons.
Heskainen is 9 months younger, but Valimaki is ~40 lbs heavier and 3 inches taller.

One played in the Dub and one stayed in Finland, that's the only difference I can see. So doing well in the finish league catapults him to clearly better prospect status even though Valimaki dominated the dub and captained the international squad?

I disagree but look forward to your reply.

Miro is the youngest ever to win D-man of the year award in Liiga, he completely dominated the stats last season, was one of the best blueliners for mens national team and is an insane skater with elite IQ.

 

[King In The North]

Outsider here in peace. What is the general feeling around here will he get more than 9 games?

He's looked very calm and makes smart outlet passes. Offense will come but it seems Peters trusts him a lot.

 

[King In The North]

Miro is the youngest ever to win D-man of the year award in Liiga, he completely dominated the stats last season, was one of the best blueliners for mens national team and is an insane skater with elite IQ.

I saw highlights from Miro's first game in Dallas. That guy is insane. Likely won't see Valimaki do that, and that's not a knock on Valimaki.

 

[BB88]

I saw highlights from Miro's first game in Dallas. That guy is insane. Likely won't see Valimaki do that, and that's not a knock on Valimaki.

I hope all the best for Valimaki but Heiskanen looks like a next level D-man for Finland, his skating is effortless and his game looks effortless overall.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Yet another thread where we have to be lectured how Heiskanen is better than this measly prospect.

 

[Johnny Hoxville]

Heiskanen is a clearly better prospect, and younger as well. It's not really all that close.

I don’t think clearly is an appropriate choice of words. Regardless I don’t think either player is going anywhere anytime soon. Both teams love their players.

 

[ookhaab]

Yet another thread where we have to be lectured how Heiskanen is better than this measly prospect.

Must be those biased, delusional finns again!

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Must be those biased, delusional finns again!

Maybe so. How many of you watch WHL games? Didn't almost none of you see Jokiharju's season coming? You guys saw Heiskanen do great in your league, and now you think he must be better than everyone, regardless of who it is and where they played.

Why does every rookie defensemen have to be compared to Heiskanen? I don't understand it. Can't Valimaki be discussed without hearing about Heiskanen?

 

[ookhaab]

Why does every rookie defensemen have to be compared to Heiskanen? I don't understand it.

Flames fan brought up Heiskanen, it's not hard to look it up.

Didn't almost none of you see Jokiharju's season coming?

I dont think anyone saw Jokiharju's "season" coming, not even hawks fans. We did see him play in WJC and EHT, his talent was not under the radar to anyone really.

You guys saw Heiskanen do great in your league, and now you think he must be better than everyone, regardless of who it is and where they played.

I cant even comprehend this... It's not just finnish fans who talk highly of Heiskanen. Everyone have had Heiskanen as the 2nd best D prospect in every list, that is just a fact.

Him playing in Liiga has nothing to do with his hype, why dont finnish fans hype up any other finnish players that play in Liiga? It's not like there isnt good prospects, they are just not even close to the level of Heiskanen.

Edit: Nvm, I see why you are so offended. Välimäki is good and sure, he can become the best dman of this draft, that stuff is not predictable.

However, he is not on the same tier as Heiskanen currently.

 

[Wings4Life]

Why exactly? What makes him a better prospect, especially "clearly".

Looking at their overall point totals year by year since back in Finland U16, their stats are pretty much identical in the corresponding seasons.
Heskainen is 9 months younger, but Valimaki is ~40 lbs heavier and 3 inches taller.

One played in the Dub and one stayed in Finland, that's the only difference I can see. So doing well in the finish league catapults him to clearly better prospect status even though Valimaki dominated the dub and captained the international squad?

I disagree but look forward to your reply.

Valimaki is an elite prospect, don't get me wrong. I feel like the Flames might be rushing him a bit, but he is worthy of his draft ranking for sure. As to why Heiskanen is better though, see below. Liiga may be only the 5th best pro league in the world, but it's still a level above junior hockey. And even within his junior league, Valimaki was not a top 3 defender, whereas Heiskanen was tops in Liiga last year. Just my opinion based on what I've seen of both guys. The season is still too young this year to make any final conclusions atm.

Heiskanen didn't just do well in Liiga, he was the best defender there. Välimäki has the size advantage, but Heiskanen's skating and IQ make up for it and then some. I like them both, but Heiskanen is the better player.

Well said.

 

[izzy]

Maybe so. How many of you watch WHL games? Didn't almost none of you see Jokiharju's season coming? You guys saw Heiskanen do great in your league, and now you think he must be better than everyone, regardless of who it is and where they played.

Why does every rookie defensemen have to be compared to Heiskanen? I don't understand it. Can't Valimaki be discussed without hearing about Heiskanen?

read how the discussion began eh

 

[Lepardi]

You guys saw Heiskanen do great in your league, and now you think he must be better than everyone, regardless of who it is and where they played.

As a Finn I didn't watch Heiskanen's games in the Finnish league but I have watched many of his NHL games. That's how I came to the conclusion that he is clearly the cream of the crop in this group of young Finnish defensemen.

 

[Johnny Hoxville]

Judging Valimaki and Heiskanen by how both have looked to start their NHL careers, I’ve seen nothing that puts Heiskanen in another tier.

I won’t dispute that Heiskanen is trending to be a franchise dman some day, but Valimaki also looks to be trending as a top pairing dman. Given the Flames drafted him and invested their time in him, I’d see no reason to move him for a like prospect. Posters can criticize my opinion if they like, but it’s my opinion.

 

[Hokinaittii]

Judging Valimaki and Heiskanen by how both have looked to start their NHL careers, I’ve seen nothing that puts Heiskanen in another tier.

I won’t dispute that Heiskanen is trending to be a franchise dman some day, but Valimaki also looks to be trending as a top pairing dman. Given the Flames drafted him and invested their time in him, I’d see no reason to move him for a like prospect. Posters can criticize my opinion if they like, but it’s my opinion.

That's fine, not everyone is here to attack you if you have different opinions on players than them.

Both players are studs and it will take many years before we can see who became the more valuable player.

 

[Critical13]

Judging Valimaki and Heiskanen by how both have looked to start their NHL careers, I’ve seen nothing that puts Heiskanen in another tier.

I won’t dispute that Heiskanen is trending to be a franchise dman some day, but Valimaki also looks to be trending as a top pairing dman. Given the Flames drafted him and invested their time in him, I’d see no reason to move him for a like prospect. Posters can criticize my opinion if they like, but it’s my opinion.

The background stats paint a similar picture to what you said, but I did notice that Valimaki is getting much easier starts, has better relative stats, has worse teammates and plays against harder competition.

The eyetest tells me that Miro is on a different level, and some of the analytics back that up, but I don't see enough of a gap to outright say I think you're wrong. Might get a clearer picture around game 30. Will be interesting to see if they start icing Valimaki on harder assignments.

 

[Johno]

Why exactly? What makes him a better prospect, especially "clearly".

Looking at their overall point totals year by year since back in Finland U16, their stats are pretty much identical in the corresponding seasons.
Heskainen is 9 months younger, but Valimaki is ~40 lbs heavier and 3 inches taller.

One played in the Dub and one stayed in Finland, that's the only difference I can see. So doing well in the finish league catapults him to clearly better prospect status even though Valimaki dominated the dub and captained the international squad?

I disagree but look forward to your reply.

how about you try again. Difference is like 25lbs and 1-1,5 inches

 

[Lepardi]

Liiga may be only the 5th best pro league in the world, but it's still a level above junior hockey.

I'm not so sure about that. It might also be the case that Aleksi Heponiemi has just heavily regressed cause he had 2.07 PPG in the WHL last season but now he only has 0.93 PPG in Liiga.

 

[Johnny Hoxville]

The background stats paint a similar picture to what you said, but I did notice that Valimaki is getting much easier starts, has better relative stats, has worse teammates and plays against harder competition.

The eyetest tells me that Miro is on a different level, and some of the analytics back that up, but I don't see enough of a gap to outright say I think you're wrong. Might get a clearer picture around game 30. Will be interesting to see if they start icing Valimaki on harder assignments.

Unless Hanifin or Gio goes down, Juuso is going to stay on the 3rd pairing. I feel confident in saying this because that’s how Peters used Hanifin back in Carolina. We could see him get him some PP time on the 2nd unit, but that will be about how he’s primarily used this season.

I actually have lots of respect for the Stars posters not losing their minds by the comment I made. I am not taking nothing away from Miro, I realize that he’s a franchise player in the making and think he’s just an excellent young player.

I also think the same about Juuso. I’m just floored by the poise and confidence this kid has. To be frank, in all my years watching the Flames (this goes back to 86), I don’t recall seeing a rookie dman playing for us the way the way he does. He doesn’t look like a rookie. He has no issues at all jumping into the play or pinching for a scoring opportunity. Yes he’s made mistakes, but it’s how he learns so quickly that’s amazing. I’m a massive Hanifin fan and I honestly feel like you could flip a coin between him and Valimaki if I had to guess which ends up being the better defender.

If I had to rank them, I think Miro will be the top defender for that draft with Valimaki being very closely behind. But I don’t see a ton of separation between them.

 

[ookhaab]

I'm not so sure about that. It might also be the case that Aleksi Heponiemi has just heavily regressed cause he had 2.07 PPG in the WHL last season but now he only has 0.93 PPG in Liiga.

Around 0.90+ PPG u20 forwards in Finland have almost exclusively had 60+ point production in NHL since the lockout, Pulkkinen is the only exception.

Wouldnt be surprised if he actually exceeds PPG in Liiga this season, which would be just amazing.

 

[Arcana]

Valimaki has been a pleasure to watch. Still so young, but he's not lacking in hockey IQ, so glad he's getting a taste of what it's gonna be like.

GO MAKIMAKI GO.

 

[teravaineSAROS]

I'm not so sure about that. It might also be the case that Aleksi Heponiemi has just heavily regressed cause he had 2.07 PPG in the WHL last season but now he only has 0.93 PPG in Liiga.

.......You don't believe a high-end major European league consisting of adults is on a higher level than College leagues were the talent is watered down and spread around 60ish teams?

 

[DJJones]

Who cares about comparing him to other Finns.

Last three games, him and Andersson have been playing some fantastic hockey. Exciting to think what they'll look like at the end of the season.