Speculation: LA Kings News, Rumors, Roster Thread part VII

[johnjm22]

Richards violated his contract in more ways than one.

He made out with a very good deal.

I have sympathy for him in terms of his possible health or addictions issues. But he got the better end of the deal financially.

To act like the Kings wronged him is ridiculous IMO.

 

[Statto]

Just skip the first 20 min where Hoven drones on and on about his trip to Edmonton and using an electric scooter.

Haven't finished all of it, they are going through every draft pick from this past draft. So if you are into that kind of thing...and like I mentioned above, they talked about the '12 reunion event which had some pretty cool stuff.

There was a mention of some big kid, 6'8...Jack Sparkes? Drafted in like the 6th round....Johnny Utah should like that.

I like Hoven but the filler stuff is starting to make me skip vast parts of his podcasts. Sometimes less is more… I skipped the whole first period which I never do… plus I was driving so was otherwise bored as hell.

However it was a great interview with Yannetti and again reinforced my belief that this might just prove to be a very good draft for us. Several of the picks were lower on the board than their true value due to injuries, so that if they hit could be very good pieces. Definitely interesting prospects. The guys he interviews seems to be quite relaxed talking to him in all fairness although I’d prefer he focused more on the hockey detail rather than some of the segways. That said I understand the need for ‘new’ content and the need to differentiate the content from Jesse for example.

He needs to work on his music taste too

Jesse, out of interest do you guys speak to ensure you don’t produce content that is too similar to each other? You seem to cover some areas that overlap but even then seem to approach them from a different angle.

 

[Statto]

He was on a murder mission here and I've replayed this so many times for both him and Byfield



You can see the moment Kupari makes him shit his pants

That shift shows so much from both QB and Kupari. It was elite play from both of them, QB wasn’t thinking he just reacted whilst Kupari initiated the whole thing. Its why I think these guys will ultimately be fine, because the talent is there it just needs to come consistently and for them to be trusted.

If it were to click for Kupari it wouldn’t just be Iaffalo we discuss moving on but Arvi also. Nothing against either player but moving middle 6 guys will be how we ultimately make room for the likes of Kupari, Turcotte etc. We need to keep managing the cap and both have trade value, so once (if) they show they are ready then we will end up moving those guys and their salary.

It’s the same with Clarke because if he’s clearly NHL ready they will have to move Durzi or Roy. If Durzi isn’t prepared to sign for a number that works for our cap the decision will be made. I suspect they will now be waiting to see Clarke in rookie camp before deciding on the Anderson and Durzi contracts.

 

[KingsFan7824]

It’s unfortunate that there is no true media presence that could have done something like this sooner. But better late than never.

The chapter(s) about what happened with Richards will be worth the cost of the book. The failed hockey decision to not buy him out will I’m sure be discussed and the justification will be the same ones many here come up with. To much faith in the player, not wanting to rattle the room, keeping the band together, AEG not wanting to cut the big lump sum. I can understand those reasons for the hockey decision. I can still to this day find no justification for what DL attempted to do to Mike Richards financially to make up for his poor decision to not buy him out the year before. People talk about Hossa and Pronger and what-not but what DL tried to do went beyond any of that, I think sometimes it gets lost in all the debates just how much money DL attempted to deny MR. No other player on the roster would have been subjected to that, I thought Richards was completely useless his final 2 years here, but he didn’t deserve what happened to him, he made a mistake but what the Kings tried to do was shameful. It was a black eye on the organization and Lombardi himself and I’m curious to see how it’s addressed in this book.

Also, the 2014 playoff run, truly one of the craziest runs in league history. Down 0-3 in round 1, down late in Game 1 of round 2, down 3-2 in round 2 after losing 3 in a row, winning twice in Chicago while trailing by multiple goals including Game 7. Has any team in league history had two consecutive 3 game losing streaks and still won a SC? 2012 was just total dominance, no one player or “what-if” game would change that, 2014 was literally the exact opposite. So many things could have prevented that from happening and it’s fascinating to think about. Curious to see what DL has to say about that run.

Always funny how we don't include the Rangers series in with the miracle run of 2014. As though the Kings ran through them because it didnt take 7 games. They needed to win 3 games in OT on home ice. They could've easily lost any or all of those games. Plus weren't they down 2-0 in all 3 home games? They were certainly trailing at some point in all 3. That series could've been a 4-1 loss. Any other playoff run and it probably would've been.

Richards violated his contract in more ways than one.

He made out with a very good deal.

I have sympathy for him in terms of his possible health or addictions issues. But he got the better end of the deal financially.

To act like the Kings wronged him is ridiculous IMO.

If Richards was even a $6m 3C by 2015, nobody cares about his border incident. Likely don't even hear about it. Hell, an effective 4C, and DL doesn't mind. He's the same guy who let Voynov openly practice with the team while suspended and got fined for it. If Richards could still play, he could've abused whatever drugs he wanted and kept his job.

 

[Peter James Bond II]

Richards violated his contract in more ways than one.

He made out with a very good deal.

I have sympathy for him in terms of his possible health or addictions issues. But he got the better end of the deal financially.

To act like the Kings wronged him is ridiculous IMO.

I think there's more to the story and we will never know. After the story broke, someone (cannot recall who - a well known hockey writer) tweeted 1 word and later removed it.... "ICKY" Did anyone see that? 'Icky' is not used for anything related to elements in the reported story. I will not go into possibilities.

 

[Matt13]

I think there's more to the story and we will never know. After the story broke, someone (cannot recall who - a well known hockey writer) tweeted 1 word and later removed it.... "ICKY" Did anyone see that? 'Icky' is not used for anything related to elements in the reported story. I will not go into possibilities.

I remember this. It was Bob McKenzie, a well known stoner. He was in California hanging with Snoop Dog. The reference was to the "sticky icky" and had nothing to do with Richards.

 

[Peter James Bond II]

I remember this. It was Bob McKenzie, a well known stoner. He was in California hanging with Snoop Dog. The reference was to the "sticky icky" and had nothing to do with Richards.

This must have been another tweet. I would have remembered if it was McKenzie. I know the tweet I saw was not McKenzie...and I do know, it was regarding the Richards story, as it was a tweet response to the story...it may have been EJ Hradek. Maybe Friedman. or Pierre Maguire. I do know the one I saw was not McKenzie and it was pertaining to the Richards story...I don't think it was a press story, but a tweet from someone else about the incident, mentioning the border crossing and some exrtra details.

There's a thread out there about it and seems some are deleted...and here;'s another post:

level 2
pluckydame
·7 yr. ago

PIT - NHL

The sick fukkk.

 

[All The Kings Men]

Jesse, out of interest do you guys speak to ensure you don’t produce content that is too similar to each other? You seem to cover some areas that overlap but even then seem to approach them from a different angle.

We don't.

I wish all the Kings content producers (independent and otherwise) would communicate better and be aware of what the others were doing but I'm told I hold people to unreasonable standards.

 

[johnjm22]

If Richards was even a $6m 3C by 2015, nobody cares about his border incident. Likely don't even hear about it. Hell, an effective 4C, and DL doesn't mind. He's the same guy who let Voynov openly practice with the team while suspended and got fined for it. If Richards could still play, he could've abused whatever drugs he wanted and kept his job.

Yep. Playing competent hockey is part of the player's end of holding up the deal.

The Kings are paying Mike Richard 40M for about 2 seasons worth of competent play.

 

[unicornpig]

richards even got a contract after the buyout, and he sucked. people need to stop feeling sorry for him and placing him on a pedestal

 

[Bjornar Moxnes]

Would it be possible to do a deal around one of Ottawa's forwards and one of LA's RHD?

 

[KingsFan7824]

Yep. Playing competent hockey is part of the player's end of holding up the deal.

The Kings are paying Mike Richard 40M for about 2 seasons worth of competent play.

Yeah, but even though I understood why it was done, and was kind of ok with keeping Richards after June 2014 because he still had a few moments, you knew the right move was to buy him out for free. Sutter finally put him at 4C for a half a season for a reason. That less than a year later, DL uses the border issue to get out of the contract, to the extent that it goes to an arbitrator or whatever it was, that's a bit much. Either get rid of him in June 2014 like a man, keep him and live with your loyalty flaw, or trade him. Which he was apparently trying to do(I believe there were varying stories on how close they were to it though), but then the border happens. All of a sudden DL is going to take some moral stand on contractual integrity or drug use?

 

[KingsFan7824]

Would it be possible to do a deal around one of Ottawa's forwards and one of LA's RHD?

The Kings have too many bodies everywhere. Some 1 for 1 swap of depth guys doesn't do much for the Kings. Anyone Ott would trade, the Kings probably have 5 similar guys already here.

 

[lumbergh]

Would it be possible to do a deal around one of Ottawa's forwards and one of LA's RHD?

Wouldn't it be easier to just offer sheet Sean Durzi?

Or is Ottawa looking to get rid of a forward at the same time? The Kings already have too many forward prospects. I can't imagine the Kings adding another forward before training camp.

 

[Herby]

Yep. Playing competent hockey is part of the player's end of holding up the deal.

The Kings are paying Mike Richard 40M for about 2 seasons worth of competent play.

Falling off a cliff does not qualify the team to attempt to deny a player contracted money. Had Richards come to LA and scored 90 points for 4 straight years would the Kings have changed around his contract? No.

Also, according to most legal experts and previous precedents they did not have the grounds to terminate based on what he did. It was a desperation move by a GM based on a horrific nonsensical move made the year before to try to get cap space for the other nonsensical moves made the year before (Gaborik, Greene). No other player on the roster would have been put through what Richards was, as others have mentioned look at Voynov and what he did vs. what Richards did. Richards was without question the worst contract in the sport at the time.

BTW, Richards traditional buyout was going to be for $14 million over I believe 5 years and he ended up getting paid $9 over like 15 years.

Also, the rumors of there being more to the story were almost surely just rumors. It has been over 7 years and nothing has come out or been leaked, you would think someone would have said something about a high profile case. Also had it been some of the stuff that was speculated the Kings would have used that to further their case for a full termination. And yes, some of the wild speculation about what it was online, which included things like child pornography were shameful. The guy brought some prescription drugs over the border.

 

[Bjornar Moxnes]

Wouldn't it be easier to just offer sheet Sean Durzi?

Or is Ottawa looking to get rid of a forward at the same time? The Kings already have too many forward prospects. I can't imagine the Kings adding another forward before training camp.

That is fair.

 

[All The Kings Men]

Yeah, but even though I understood why it was done, and was kind of ok with keeping Richards after June 2014 because he still had a few moments, you knew the right move was to buy him out for free. Sutter finally put him at 4C for a half a season for a reason. That less than a year later, DL uses the border issue to get out of the contract, to the extent that it goes to an arbitrator or whatever it was, that's a bit much. Either get rid of him in June 2014 like a man, keep him and live with your loyalty flaw, or trade him. Which he was apparently trying to do(I believe there were varying stories on how close they were to it though), but then the border happens. All of a sudden DL is going to take some moral stand on contractual integrity or drug use?

Just for the sake of accuracy... It didn't go to an arbitrator...

the NHLPA filed a grievance against the Kings for terminating his contract and the Kings and Mike Richards reached a settlement.

I hate the narrative that Lombardi was done in by his own "loyalty". He was done in by the exact same impulses that made him successful.

Signing a player to a 5 year contract with a no trade clause then trading that player to Edmonton the day before the no trade clause kicks in is not "loyalty" nor is publicly humiliating and financially punishing a player you claimed was your "own Derek Jeter" when you could have supported them and helped them through a personal challenge.

 

[Axl Rhoadz]

Just for the sake of accuracy... It didn't go to an arbitrator...

the NHLPA filed a grievance against the Kings for terminating his contract and the Kings and Mike Richards reached a settlement.

I hate the narrative that Lombardi was done in by his own "loyalty". He was done in by the exact same impulses that made him successful.

Signing a player to a 5 year contract with a no trade clause then trading that player to Edmonton the day before the no trade clause kicks in is not "loyalty" nor is publicly humiliating and financially punishing a player you claimed was your "own Derek Jeter" when you could have supported them and helped them through a personal challenge.

What are we talking about when we say 'done in'? When I think of done in, I'm thinking of the reason(s) why he was fired...and with that, I would bet my house that it's solely due to him refusing to fire Sutter.*

* I have no evidence to back this up, just using my common sense which some might argue is very minimal

 

[All The Kings Men]

What are we talking about when we say 'done in'? When I think of done in, I'm thinking of the reason(s) why he was fired...and with that, I would bet my house that it's solely due to him refusing to fire Sutter.*

* I have no evidence to back this up, just using my common sense which some might argue is very minimal

I meant the success of the team. I'm not ever going to speculate about the events surrounding his termination because I know enough to know that I don't know anything about it and that the public discourse I have seen is either completely wrong or at the very best over simplified.

 

[Herby]

What are we talking about when we say 'done in'? When I think of done in, I'm thinking of the reason(s) why he was fired...and with that, I would bet my house that it's solely due to him refusing to fire Sutter.*

* I have no evidence to back this up, just using my common sense which some might argue is very minimal

I would guess the whole picture of what happened between June 2014 and April 2017 was the reason DL was fired and not specifically the Sutter thing. I don't know if that was what Jesse was alluding to with the impulse thing. But look at what happened

- The ridiculous decision to not buyout Richards
- The 6 year extension for Gaborik
- The 3 year extension for Greene
- The Lucic trade which we now know cost them a pick that was going to be used on Barzal
- The 7-8 year contract extension offer to Lucic
- The Bishop trade which cost them Cernak.
- The Sekera trade, when you trade a 1st for a rental and miss the playoffs its awful

And then the off-ice stuff. You can't really blame Dean for Voynov beating up his wife, but the refusal to not only immediately terminate him, but having him back with the team practicing was another black eye on the franchise. The Richards border situation and DL's comments afterwards playing dumb about the long-rumored problems that Richards had with substance abuse. Really Dean, you weren't aware of those things? Or you just only started to care that Richards had a problem when it started to effect his play on the ice? And ofcourdse the subsequent termination and attempting to deny Richards what was owed to him (which was 14, not 20 as I forgot about the buyout cutting it down). Throw in the Stoll thing in Vegas and the player revolt/locking Sutter out and it just seemed that the Kings had lost control of the organization both on and off the ice.

People love to pile on Luc and AEG, but I don't think there is a single organization in the entire NHL that wouldn't have made changes with both the coach and GM after those 3 years.

 

[Axl Rhoadz]

I would guess the whole picture of what happened between June 2014 and April 2017 was the reason DL was fired and not specifically the Sutter thing. I don't know if that was what Jesse was alluding to with the impulse thing. But look at what happened

- The ridiculous decision to not buyout Richards
- The 6 year extension for Gaborik
- The 3 year extension for Greene
- The Lucic trade which we now know cost them a pick that was going to be used on Barzal
- The 7-8 year contract extension offer to Lucic
- The Bishop trade which cost them Cernak.
- The Sekera trade, when you trade a 1st for a rental and miss the playoffs its awful

And then the off-ice stuff. You can't really blame Dean for Voynov beating up his wife, but the refusal to not only immediately terminate him, but having him back with the team practicing was another black eye on the franchise. The Richards border situation and DL's comments afterwards playing dumb about the long-rumored problems that Richards had with substance abuse. Really Dean, you weren't aware of those things? Or you just only started to care that Richards had a problem when it started to effect his play on the ice? And ofcourdse the subsequent termination and attempting to deny Richards what was owed to him (which was 14, not 20 as I forgot about the buyout cutting it down). Throw in the Stoll thing in Vegas and the player revolt/locking Sutter out and it just seemed that the Kings had lost control of the organization both on and off the ice.

People love to pile on Luc and AEG, but I don't think there is a single organization in the entire NHL that wouldn't have made changes with both the coach and GM after those 3 years.

But you are leaving out the two championships in the previous 3 years as if that has no merit at all.

Every GM makes head scratching mistakes...not every GM wins a Stanley Cup or TWO.

I really hope his book exposes some of this stuff as I've been very curious for a long time. I loved Lombardi and still believe he would have righted the ship. I absolutely hated the decision to promote Blake -- but I feel differently about that in 2022.

 

[All The Kings Men]

I would guess the whole picture of what happened between June 2014 and April 2017 was the reason DL was fired and not specifically the Sutter thing. I don't know if that was what Jesse was alluding to with the impulse thing. But look at what happened

- The ridiculous decision to not buyout Richards
- The 6 year extension for Gaborik
- The 3 year extension for Greene
-etc etc etc

Alls I meant was I don't see a substantially different approach from when Lombardi took over to the post-Cup years.

He gambled, took massive swings and all of his vaunted "culture" went straight out the window just as quickly as it arrived.

There were massive "failures" throughout his tenure but when he arrived there was no infrastructure to inhibit flexibility. The more success the team had the less maneuverability there was to correct or cope with mistakes.

 

[Herby]

But you are leaving out the two championships in the previous 3 years as if that has no merit at all.

Every GM makes head scratching mistakes...not every GM wins a Stanley Cup or TWO.

I really hope his book exposes some of this stuff as I've been very curious for a long time. I loved Lombardi and still believe he would have righted the ship. I absolutely hated the decision to promote Blake -- but I feel differently about that in 2022.

Championship winning GM's and coaches have been fired while not being nearly as awful as the Kings were between 2014-2017.

The organization was in a tail-spin both on and off the ice. When you just give life-long security to people who win in the past you end up with what the Angels had with Mike Sciosca.

The mishandling of Voynov and Richards situations alone could be grounds for termination.

 

[Axl Rhoadz]

Championship winning GM's and coaches have been fired while not being nearly as awful as the Kings were between 2014-2017.

The organization was in a tail-spin both on and off the ice. When you just give life-long security to people who win in the past you end up with what the Angels had with Mike Sciosca.

I hear what you are saying -- still don't believe that's why he was fired.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

I meant the success of the team. I'm not ever going to speculate about the events surrounding his termination because I know enough to know that I don't know anything about it and that the public discourse I have seen is either completely wrong or at the very best over simplified.

Public discourse wrong..........when talking about the internal workings of a pro sports franchise.....naw....say it ain't so Joe....say it ain't so......lol