Speculation: LA Kings News, Rumors, Roster Thread 2022-23 Season

[SmytheKing]

I think a lot of us look back at what DL did and don't fully realize that it was lightning in a bottle. Rarely do teams draft a HOF level C, D, and G in short order. This iteration of the team is going to be much different.

The Kings didn't have the draft positions they needed to draft a bunch of prospects who were ready to be thrown in the fire. I think they've done quite well based on their draft slots, not to mention that recent drafts have been on the crappy side. The last really good draft was 2016, and teams that have drafted high since then haven't gotten the quality teams in the early 2010's got.

A good amount of prospects could have been handled better, but this was never going to be a team where you dump all the vets and exclusively play the youth. We'll never know how that may have turned out, but with the level of player we've seen in recent drafts in similar slots it likely would have been a road to nowhere.

That's actually often how Stanley Cup winners are built.

Lightning: Hedman in 2009, Stamkos in 2008, Kucherov in 2011, Vasi in 2012.
Penguins: Fleury in 2004, Malkin and Letang in 2005, Crosby in 2006.
Blackhawks: Keith in 2002, Seabrook and Crawford in 2003, Toews in 2006, Kane in 2007.
Capitals: Ovechkin in 2004, Backstrom in 2006, Carlson and Holtby in 2008.

If you aren't drafting your best players and then fitting in FA's once they're hitting their stride, you're going to have a very hard time doing it. Even the Avs are mostly built from within. Their best players were all drafted by them (albeit over a larger span of time).

We're not going to know which teams out of the 2015+ drafts are going to be the top teams until probably these next five years but I'd be willing to bet most of them will have a core that they drafted. I mean, you're already starting to see the Sabres and Leafs getting ready to take that next step.

 

[YP44]

So here’s a bit of Ziggy Palffy trivia..
in his last season the the NHL while playing for the Pens…
Zigmund Palffy assisted on Super Mario’s last goal and Sid the Kid’s first..

I like that

 

[Sol]

I doubt Blake will be trading these players for picks, but even if he does, that's not the core of the plan. You're still focused on prospect development and prospect value. I mean I get it. This board used to be "Hockey's Future". Everyone wants to see our prospects developing into all-stars. They are simply not all going to do that.

All I'm trying to tell you is that Blake's plan, as I see it, is not primarily focused on prospect development and retaining prospect value. He's building the Kings using prospects and picks, but he's using most of them as assets to construct the big league team, not just so they can play on the Kings in the future. The development system is there and Blake has filled it to the brim. Since 2021 you have seen him start to use some the capital he has amassed in the Arvidsson and Fiala trades.

Sure there are some keepers (Byfield and maybe Spence), but almost everyone on your list can be viewed as possible trade bait at this point. Maybe a couple of the prospects get moved in a trade for a LHD in the next three weeks. That wouldn't surprise me at all. Maybe Madden or Turcotte go in a package for Jake McCabe. Or maybe Lias Andersson gets you an Olli Maatta back. Who knows. There's still a ton of value in that list, and it's time for Blake to use it. Use it or lose it.

The goaltending, well, that plan got blown up by Cal Petersen. No idea where that's going.

There is a lot of things that just aren’t true. How can you convince anyone that the core of Blake’s plan at the draft wasn’t development? You can even list some of the trades he’s made because they’ve had difficulty developing players to take the roles he ends up trading for. Kings prospects have seriously struggled a lot until Vilardi had some lucky rebound effect after his value as a player was super low?


The plan should be and probably is or was, to develop these extremely high picks into players that end up becoming regulars. That’s how it’s been and that’s how it will always be. Building a team via trade is not right. Trading is supplemental. The strength and foundation of the team is always draft. Kings have been a shitty drafting/development organization and it shows. This isn’t some high brow Blake playing 5D chess. Blake has not ever had a clear plan that he’s stuck to. Blake is making changes to this teams structure on the fly. There’s nothing methodical about him, and pretending this falls into his grand plan is just not true.

 

[Sol]

Do you want to win or just watch exciting hockey?

They aren't the same thing. And you must not be remembering the impact made by Carter and Gaborik on teams that had their structure in place and acquired the right players at the right time to maximize their value AND that of the team.

The manner in which Fiala most resembles Palffy isn't on ice, it is in the acquisition. A terrific player added at a significant cost without fitting into a plan. Activity for sexy activity's sake. Fans pop at his skill, team goes nowhere because management is grasping at straws.

What are you trying to say? Fiala plays exciting hockey that has been a massive factor to why the Kings have been winning. Fialas acquisition is based on the fact the Kings were going to need to make a trade with Minnesota for Faber so that was set. And Fiala isn’t here to be a supplemental piece on a read team. He’s here and has become the foundation of this team. He’s lightyears better than any other player on the Kings.

Fiala has single handedly won more games with his skill. Gaborik was lightning in a bottle. Comes to the Kings and turns up for the playoffs. That’s all they needed him for and that’s all he did.

 

[KingsHockey24]

For whatever reason I'm fairly confident we'll end up landing Chychrun and probably within the next 3 days or so.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

There is a lot of things that just aren’t true. How can you convince anyone that the core of Blake’s plan at the draft wasn’t development? You can even list some of the trades he’s made because they’ve had difficulty developing players to take the roles he ends up trading for. Kings prospects have seriously struggled a lot until Vilardi had some lucky rebound effect after his value as a player was super low?


The plan should be and probably is or was, to develop these extremely high picks into players that end up becoming regulars. That’s how it’s been and that’s how it will always be. Building a team via trade is not right. Trading is supplemental. The strength and foundation of the team is always draft. Kings have been a shitty drafting/development organization and it shows. This isn’t some high brow Blake playing 5D chess. Blake has not ever had a clear plan that he’s stuck to. Blake is making changes to this teams structure on the fly. There’s nothing methodical about him, and pretending this falls into his grand plan is just not true.

Such horseshit.....So this is who is on the team right now....playing...that the Kings have either drafted......or traded for while they were still developing (ala Grundstrom etc) or signed as a college FA.

Vilardi
Lizotte
Durzi
Kaliyev
Roy
Anderson
Grundstrom
JAD
Byfield
Walker
Kupari

That's not including the Kopitar, Doughty, Quick, or the guys who have played Bjonrfoot, Fagemo, Turcotte etc.

That's 11 players out of a 23 player roster.....but yea, LA is not a team that is drafted...jesus Christ....

 

[Bandit]

For whatever reason I'm fairly confident we'll end up landing Chychrun and probably within the next 3 days or so.

Landing him where? Ronald Reagan or Cedars Sinai?

 

[KingsHockey24]

Landing him where? Ronald Reagan or Cedars Sinai?

I just don't think any team could offer the assets that we could.

I hear Toronto fans saying they could get JC for Kerfoot + Sandin + 3rd like huh???

 

[lumbergh]

I just don't think facts align with this.

If Blake's plan isn't focused on prospect development and retaining value, why has he tried to bring in:
Alex Turcotte
Samuel Helenius
Quinton Byfield
Rasmus Kupari
Brock Faber (before they traded him)

In to play in the AHL as soon as they were 19 years old or younger? Why not just let them play in their respective leagues and marinate? Why not send Brandt Clarke down to the OHL right away, instead of using a conditioning stint as an excuse to get him time in the AHL.

I'd expect a GM not interested in developing players to be hands free and let them do their thing in lower leagues. Not try to bring them in to the AHL ASAP so they can control the instruction.

Quinton Byfield is a keeper. You can see from their management of his play that they're giving him every opportunity to take a spot. They did the same for Vilardi. To make it on the the big club roster, you have to show you belong when you have the chance. It took Vilardi quite a while to get there, but he's there now. Byfield is also getting there. Kupari is showing signs of becoming a regular bottom-six, speedy, physical center. Clarke is not quite ready, but needs marinating. The cream rises to the top, and these are so far the Kings top prospects.

Turcotte, to me, has not been able to show he belongs yet. Fagemo is also in the same boat. Another GM of another team might just make room for these prospects and let them work it out in the big leagues during a rebuild, but Blake is not going to do that. I understand that lots of people here want that to happen, but Blake has other plans.

I'm not saying that Blake isn't interested in developing players. I'm saying that that's not the primary focus. Developing several young prospects into legit NHL players is essential, but it's only a fraction of the puzzle for Blake. He really values having an AHL affiliate in Ontario. When possible, he wants the prospects they're doing their development under the eye of the organization's coaches. The tension is between spots on the big club and staying in the AHL. That's frustrating to watch for fans, but Blake's not going to create spots for the prospects automatically.

The one player for whom it's been a real issue is Jordan Spence, in my opinion. He's absolutely dominated at the AHL level, but because Blake can't seem to find a landing spot for Sean Walker, Spence sits in purgatory. I'm sure Spence must be frustrated.

 

[lumbergh]

For whatever reason I'm fairly confident we'll end up landing Chychrun and probably within the next 3 days or so.

Chychrun won't move until either the price comes down, or someone panics at the deadline. Being that Blake isn't a panic buyer, and it's not yet the deadline, I'm not nearly so confident.

 

[AbsentMojo]

About the only thing that could be considered an increase in probability Chychrun ends up here (which overall I think is < 5%).. is that the yotes are not the in same division anymore (something Kopi didnt even realized when he said after a win, nice to beat a division rival)

 

[Sol]

Supposedly the Kings are looking into Edmunson. Not a bad idea especially if the Kings can trade edler for like a 5th. Edmunson is pretty much who we want edler to be. Plays with an edge, decent movement, and good stay at home D. Bring up Spence, get Edmunson for the cheap. And get rid of Edler.

 

[AbsentMojo]

Supposedly the Kings are looking into Edmunson. Not a bad idea especially if the Kings can trade edler for like a 5th. Edmunson is pretty much who we want edler to be. Plays with an edge, decent movement, and good stay at home D. Bring up Spence, get Edmunson for the cheap. And get rid of Edler.

3.5 mil signed thru next year... not a rental. He's so stay at home, he gets all his food grubhub... but thats actually what we need on the left side in general since all the talent is right handed. Still 3.5 for bottom pair is sort of alot.

 

[DoktorJeep]

Montreal press bloggers are speculating a pick and prospect for Edmundson. Pick needs to be a first or second depending on the prospect. Top prospect sounds like Spence, or Grans if it’s a first going the other way.

All signs point to Bergevin making his big splash as a part time contractor.

 

[Fishhead]

That's actually often how Stanley Cup winners are built.

Lightning: Hedman in 2009, Stamkos in 2008, Kucherov in 2011, Vasi in 2012.
Penguins: Fleury in 2004, Malkin and Letang in 2005, Crosby in 2006.
Blackhawks: Keith in 2002, Seabrook and Crawford in 2003, Toews in 2006, Kane in 2007.
Capitals: Ovechkin in 2004, Backstrom in 2006, Carlson and Holtby in 2008.

If you aren't drafting your best players and then fitting in FA's once they're hitting their stride, you're going to have a very hard time doing it. Even the Avs are mostly built from within. Their best players were all drafted by them (albeit over a larger span of time).

We're not going to know which teams out of the 2015+ drafts are going to be the top teams until probably these next five years but I'd be willing to bet most of them will have a core that they drafted. I mean, you're already starting to see the Sabres and Leafs getting ready to take that next step.

Yes, it's how a lot of cup winners are built, but look how short that list is. I don't think often is a good word, because if you throw the Kings in there that's 5 teams in 20 years of drafting. It's uncommon and extremely difficult to do, which is why I said it rarely happens.

I do think it's the best way, those 5 teams have won half the cups in that time period. But it takes a very specific set of circumstances to do so. You need to absolutely suck at the right time and have those top players available in the right draft, and you usually need to have multiple top picks to get them, which means you have to sustainably outsuck everyone and still not lose the lottery.

There are other ways to do it obviously, because cups have been won by teams not following that formula. It's just an unrealistic expectation to think you just suck, draft guys, develop, fill in the holes, and win. It happened here and it really spoiled us because it seemed so damn simple. But looking back how the Kings did that with a single top-5 pick is beyond impressive. And if that's the standard the organization is held to, we are going to be disappointed for a long, long time.

 

[All The Kings Men]

Supposedly the Kings are looking into Edmunson. Not a bad idea especially if the Kings can trade edler for like a 5th. Edmunson is pretty much who we want edler to be. Plays with an edge, decent movement, and good stay at home D. Bring up Spence, get Edmunson for the cheap. And get rid of Edler.

Edler has a no move clause

 

[Fishhead]

Re: Byfield - the year AFTER he played in the AHL due to COVID, the OHL allowed any player who played in the AHL to stay in there. The OHL was back up. Blake had the unique opportunity to send him down to the OHL, AHL, or keep him in the NHL. Heck... Byfield was technically eligible to go back to the OHL this year as an overager, that's just how young he is.

Re: Kupari and Helenius having better developmental opportunities in the AHL, but the question is, we're talking about the argument that Blake doesn't prioritize development. Which is the point of the post.

Faber was given an opportunity to play his first game against Minnesota in the NHL. Not that he'd be guaranteed an NHL spot henceforth. And with how they've kept Spence and Clarke down in lesser leagues to save a spot for Walker, Durzi, etc, do we REALLY think Faber would be playing in the NHL right now?

The point is that the prospect allocation decision isn't aligning with this assertion that Blake's not prioritizing prospect development. He's prioritizing it at the AHL level, trying to get them all to play in the farm team where they dictate the instruction. There are questions about HOW they're developing and if it's the right path, but I think it's inaccurate to suggest Blake's not focused on development and retaining prospect value.

Yeah I completely agree with the overall focus on development, especially at the AHL level, I definitely wasn't disagreeing with that. I actually think Blake is worried about value so much it's a detriment, he seems to be hesitant to pull the trigger on things unless it's a no brainer (Fiala). We will find out soon if it's just his nature or if he feels the time isn't quite right yet.

I was just adding some things to consider about just how much things were screwed up by the pandemic - to the point where it's really difficult to nail down what may have been the correct path for some of these guys. I would assume (hope) that the organization looks closely how their development paths affect player outcomes, analyze it, and use that to shape future development.

 

[All The Kings Men]

Yes, it's how a lot of cup winners are built, but look how short that list is. I don't think often is a good word, because if you throw the Kings in there that's 5 teams in 20 years of drafting. It's uncommon and extremely difficult to do, which is why I said it rarely happens.

Without weighing in on the veracity of the argument one way or the other...

It's not just 5 teams it's 11 championships spread out over 13 seasons

3 for Pittsburgh
3 for Chicago
2 for the Kings
2 for Tampa Bay
1 for Washington

It may not be the way to do it moving forward but it worked for those teams in the immediacy of the New Cap Era of the NHL (starting in 2005-06)

 

[All The Kings Men]

It's just an unrealistic expectation to think you just suck, draft guys, develop, fill in the holes, and win. It happened here and it really spoiled us because it seemed so damn simple. But looking back how the Kings did that with a single top-5 pick is beyond impressive. And if that's the standard the organization is held to, we are going to be disappointed for a long, long time.

Cap circumvention and salary retention helped too...

The detail I think gets most frequently ignored in the remembering of the Cup winning Kings is that Carter and Richards were both acquired on contracts that are no longer allowed because the league decided they circumvented the cap.

Pittsburgh acquired Phil Kessel while Toronto retained salary
Tampa used LTIR

I'm sure there's other examples I'm forgetting about

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

Without weighing in on the veracity of the argument one way or the other...

It's not just 5 teams it's 11 championships spread out over 13 seasons

3 for Pittsburgh
3 for Chicago
2 for the Kings
2 for Tampa Bay
1 for Washington

It may not be the way to do it moving forward but it worked for those teams in the immediacy of the New Cap Era of the NHL (starting in 2005-06)

It still is....look at the top teams,

Boston - Pastrnak, Marchand, Krecj, Bergergon, McAvoy, Swayman etc

COL - Rantanen, MacKinnon, Makar, Landeskog, Newhook, Byram

etc.....

The notation that LA isn't filling out their team via draft...is bullshit.....

There's not a single team that hasn't fulfilled their team via draft, maybe Vegas and Seattle because they are too new.....but every other team, even lowly PHX

Keller, Crouse, Chycrun, Veljemakic, Fischer, Hayton,

 

[Surf Nutz]

Blah blah blah

Montreal press bloggers are speculating a pick and prospect for Edmundson. Pick needs to be a first or second depending on the prospect. Top prospect sounds like Spence, or Grans if it’s a first going the other way.

All signs point to Bergevin making his big splash as a part time contractor.

 

[Seattle King]

Montreal press bloggers are speculating a pick and prospect for Edmundson. Pick needs to be a first or second depending on the prospect. Top prospect sounds like Spence, or Grans if it’s a first going the other way.

All signs point to Bergevin making his big splash as a part time contractor.

The big splash is the toilet water hitting your backside.
Someone please buy Bergevin a bus ticket out of town if he is going to have say in deals I am terrified.

 

[All The Kings Men]

It still is....look at the top teams,

Boston - Pastrnak, Marchand, Krecj, Bergergon, McAvoy, Swayman etc

COL - Rantanen, MacKinnon, Makar, Landeskog, Newhook, Byram

etc.....

The notation that LA isn't filling out their team via draft...is bullshit.....

There's not a single team that hasn't fulfilled their team via draft, maybe Vegas and Seattle because they are too new.....but every other team, even lowly PHX

Keller, Crouse, Chycrun, Veljemakic, Fischer, Hayton,

I think as the economics of the league shift and change the strategies may shift and change with it.

It would be interesting if Boston won the CUp without a drafted goalie and defenseman, then wandered in the desert for 13 years then finally won again once they had their own drafted goalie and defenceman.

but there's Colorado using mercenary goalies...

not saying it proves or disproves anything just observing with curiosity.

 

[King'sPawn]

Haha, a pile of shit. I see your posts are getting better. I guess you needed to practice a bit before returning to the Clarke thread.

 

[Surf Nutz]

Haha, a pile of shit. I see your posts are getting better. I guess you needed to practice a bit before returning to the Clarke thread.

Actually I thought it was the emoji for you and Bergevin
My HF emoji button got confiscated.
I am pretty worn out from trying to read your posts.
They are like a traffic accident at a traffic circle on the road to nowhere.

I say what I want, when I want and do not care what 95 percent of the posters here think.
Especially the ones acting like they could do a better job than Blake and Company.
It may not be this year but the Kings will be in the second round in the next few years and may even go further.