Speculation: LA Kings News, Rumors, Roster Thread 2022-23 Season Part 2

[Schrute farms]

that's a $15M 3rd line next season, ain't gonna happen

i feel like we're looking at the current forward lineup playing next season as well barring injuries. some decisions to be made when kopitar and arvidsson's contracts are up but yeah. ain't a meritocracy around here..

I'm not sure i understand your point. With GVs new contract (say $4-5M), that 2nd line (Fiala/Byfield/GV) would be about $14-15M as well.

 

[King'sPawn]

I understand what it is. I just don’t think it’s as big a deal or makes a player that much more valuable vs someone who is more of a finisher, like Caufield or Vilardi. I think it’s comparable to other sports, like in baseball who is more valuable the guy who hits .300 or the guy who hits 40 home runs, or in football who is more valuable the wr who moves the chains or the one who makes the big plays. Not saying a .300 hitter or a possession wr is not valuable, but these guys have limitations too. Unless they have the skill to do those things and also score at a prolific rate, of which those players are rare. If a guy wins board battles or possesses the puck in the offensive zone but it doesn’t translate to more offense for themselves and in many cases their teammates is that more valuable than guys like Caufield, Vilardi, Boldy, Zegras etc who were all criticized for not being “line drivers”. Nick Suzuki is a great player, he reminds me a lot of a young Mike Richards, but he benefits from playing with someone with Caufield’s combination of elite offensive zone IQ and world class shooting skills just as Caufield benefits from someone who does it all like Suzuki. It’s all about complimenting each other.

I just think we often fall back to the line driver thing, either to minimize someone who is usually a big offensive difference maker (which Vilardi has been this season) or to overhype someone who isn’t really doing much offensively. Turcotte does many things well on a hockey rink, but his inability to be an offensive player at any level above the USHL kind of negates his “line driving” because a line driver who is an offensive black hole is just Blake Lizotte, and that is a player you took very high in the draft, passing over some players who aren’t line drivers, but are quite clearly more valuable assets. (Zegras, Caufield, Kaliyev, Boldy).

And switching to another topic, everyone mentions whatever line Danault is on is the 2nd line, but it seems to me you can interchange the Kings top 9.

Is your 1-2-3 lines just defined by who the C is, or do you factor in the wingers. Fiala and Vilardi as a duo have been better players this season than Arvy/Moore and Kempe/QB, but obviously Liz as the C kind of drives that line down, especially in comparison to AK. But I think you can easily make a case that the “3rd line” which features our leading scored and our 3rd best goal scorer is a better line than our “2nd line” It’s kind of splitting hairs.

Anyone who says Boldy, Zegras, or Vilardi aren't line drivers don't know what they're talking about.

Turcotte, at this point, seems to be more of a victim of circumstance, for lack of a better word. Health issues every year, playing for a mediocre college coach, rushed into an AHL system by a team that focuses on a cookie-cutter approach. He had mono early, if I remember correctly he got COVID, multiple concussions - that's a lot for the past 4 years when trying to grow into an NHL player, which is a physically demanding career.

As for line numbers, I just go by average ice times of the line mates and deployment/role. Because of Danault's ice time and deployment on both the PK and PP, I just assume he's still the No. 2 center.

 

[Herby]

Anyone who says Boldy, Zegras, or Vilardi aren't line drivers don't know what they're talking about.

Turcotte, at this point, seems to be more of a victim of circumstance, for lack of a better word. Health issues every year, playing for a mediocre college coach, rushed into an AHL system by a team that focuses on a cookie-cutter approach. He had mono early, if I remember correctly he got COVID, multiple concussions - that's a lot for the past 4 years when trying to grow into an NHL player, which is a physically demanding career.

As for line numbers, I just go by average ice times of the line mates and deployment/role. Because of Danault's ice time and deployment on both the PK and PP, I just assume he's still the No. 2 center.

I would agree that Zegras is a line driver by how it’s defined, but if you go back there were many comments that he wasn’t and benefitted at the WJC from Turcotte’s line driving.

Vilardi’s skating and inability to play C say that he’s better suited for a role that focuses more on offense and finishing as a winger. Not saying wingers can’t be a line driver, in fact his linemate Fiala is an example that one can be, but Vilardi is excelling on a role playing off of one rather than being the driver of his line, and that is fine, he’s provided a ton of value to the Kings by providing a ton of traditional stats and also excellent advanced ones.

Caufield’s advanced numbers, traditional numbers and eye test to me atleast do show a player worthy of being picked very high. If his PP numbers were to return to expected levels (they were poor for some reason) he has 50 goal seasons in his future. And I think he would with many centers in the league, including a guy like Kopitar, that is why I think it’s unfair to give Suzuki to much credit for his success. Suzuki is a very good player but he’s not rising seas to make non-star players into star ones.

As far as Turcotte, yeah unfortunate circumstances for sure. I think had he been able to stay healthy and had been developed like 30 other teams would have, he is certainly the 4C and maybe even is ahead of BL as the 3C. But even with the injuries, there is a much lower ceiling than all of us thought based on his age 17 season. There have been other players who faced injury challenges and it didn’t cause them to be this ineffective offensively in junior/NCAA and the AHL. Even when healthy there hasn’t really been anything across 3 different leagues now that screams 2nd liner. And I think the Kings have known that for awhile, hence the Fox comments to Jessie. And Fox was exactly right, Turcotte’s upside is as a good 3rd line center. It freaked people out at the time, but I think people are accepting of that now.

 

[DapperDan]

I think we need to prepare for getting very underwhelming returns for the likes of Iafallo and Walker. There aren't many suitors with the cap space and willingness to take on role players. And that $6.6m in space will be crucial for next season.

 

[Herby]

I think we need to prepare for getting very underwhelming returns for the likes of Iafallo and Walker. There aren't many suitors with the cap space and willingness to take on role players. And that $6.6m in space will be crucial for next season.

Yeah I just can’t see to many fits for AI.

Maybe a younger team with more cap flexibility trying to make the playoffs might feel he’s a good piece for the bottom six. But the issue is, AI has very little playoff experience. Hopefully that changes this spring but normally teams looking to add vets like that want playoff proven pieces. AI has 11 career playoff games.

 

[LeftKinger]

What kind of a run would y’all be happy with this season? I’d be good with a trip to the conference finals as far as TMac and the team is concerned. Anything short of that is a failure considering the trade deadline moves. Also, not resigning Gavrikov and carving a clear path for the lineup to fall into place much better next season would be a failure by Blake in my eyes.

 

[Fishhead]

Yeah I just can’t see to many fits for AI.

Maybe a younger team with more cap flexibility trying to make the playoffs might feel he’s a good piece for the bottom six. But the issue is, AI has very little playoff experience. Hopefully that changes this spring but normally teams looking to add vets like that want playoff proven pieces. AI has 11 career playoff games.

At his salary he's cheap for what he brings. I could see somewhere like Washington or Pittsburgh, or even the Islanders wanting him.

 

[Lt Dan]

What kind of a run would y’all be happy with this season?

I was hoping to see Forrest run back and forth across America a few times

 

[DapperDan]

Running through different scenarios, I could see something like the following happening due to cap constraints:

Trade: Iafallo, Arvidsson, Walker for low picks/prospects
RFA signings: Vilardi ($4m), Kupari ($1.3m), JAD ($1m), Bjornfot ($900k)
Re-sign: Gavrikov ($5m), Korpisalo ($2.9m)
Free agent signing: Garnet Hathaway ($1.75m)

Byfield - Kopitar - Kempe
Moore - Danault - Kaliyev
Fiala - Kupari - Vilardi
Grundstrom - JAD/Lizotte - Hathaway
JAD/Lizotte

Anderson - Doughty
Gavrikov - Spence
Durzi - Roy
plug/Bjornfot

Korpisalo
Copley

Roughly $82m in cap. Leaves space for bonuses and small moves

edit: forgot JAD

 

[Piston]

So Zach Dooley writes an article As the points rack up, the Kings are thriving behind a team-wide defensive buy-in - LA Kings Insider on how the Kings all of a sudden magically went multiple games without allowing more than two goals without once mentioning the #1 reason why this is so - Vlad Gavrikov. Unbelievable oversight.

 

[Herby]

Running through different scenarios, I could see something like the following happening due to cap constraints:

Trade: Iafallo, Arvidsson, Walker for low picks/prospects
RFA signings: Vilardi ($4m), Kupari ($1.3m), JAD ($1m), Bjornfot ($900k)
Re-sign: Gavrikov ($5m), Korpisalo ($2.9m)
Free agent signing: Garnet Hathaway ($1.75m)

Byfield - Kopitar - Kempe
Moore - Danault - Kaliyev
Fiala - Kupari - Vilardi
Grundstrom - JAD/Lizotte - Hathaway
JAD/Lizotte

Anderson - Doughty
Gavrikov - Spence
Durzi - Roy
plug/Bjornfot

Korpisalo
Copley

Roughly $82m in cap. Leaves space for bonuses and small moves

edit: forgot JAD

I really like this idea a lot . But I think we have to deal in reality and take the Kings and the people who cover the team at their word that QB is at C next season. As much as you and I may disagree that is probably what it will be.

That puts you pretty thin on wing, I think the expectation is that Kaliyev moves up and replaces QB. Either that or they try Fiala again, but there wasn’t a ton of chemistry with him and Kopi and Kempe. Either way, next season has To be a big step forward for Kaliyev, he needs to be a top 6 forward next season.

Kaliyev - Kopitar - Kempe
Fiala - Byfield - Vilardi
Moore - Danault - Grundstrom
JAD - Lizotte - Kupari

Anderson - Doughty
Gavrikov - Roy
Bjornfot - Spence
Walker

I expect Durzi is the odd man lit, but it could also be Toby. I wonder if management has written him off or is they give him another shot. Clarke unfortunately is probably drawing dead to make the team lit of camp but my hope is he just forces his way on the roster after “paying his dues” in Ontario and can be a force for next years stretch run and playoffs.

If Durzi is traded, would the Kings have room to keep VA? Because right now with my potential lineup my biggest concern is Grundy as a 3rd line winger. Love him in a 4th line role, but we will still need to get some offense from the Danault line.

 

[tny760]

So Zach Dooley writes an article As the points rack up, the Kings are thriving behind a team-wide defensive buy-in - LA Kings Insider on how the Kings all of a sudden magically went multiple games without allowing more than two goals without once mentioning the #1 reason why this is so - Vlad Gavrikov. Unbelievable oversight.

hey, he's a company man. posturing for contract negotiations!

 

[KingsOfCali25]

I really like this idea a lot . But I think we have to deal in reality and take the Kings and the people who cover the team at their word that QB is at C next season. As much as you and I may disagree that is probably what it will be.

That puts you pretty thin on wing, I think the expectation is that Kaliyev moves up and replaces QB. Either that or they try Fiala again, but there wasn’t a ton of chemistry with him and Kopi and Kempe. Either way, next season has To be a big step forward for Kaliyev, he needs to be a top 6 forward next season.

Kaliyev - Kopitar - Kempe
Fiala - Byfield - Vilardi
Moore - Danault - Grundstrom
JAD - Lizotte - Kupari

Anderson - Doughty
Gavrikov - Roy
Bjornfot - Spence
Walker

I expect Durzi is the odd man lit, but it could also be Toby. I wonder if management has written him off or is they give him another shot. Clarke unfortunately is probably drawing dead to make the team lit of camp but my hope is he just forces his way on the roster after “paying his dues” in Ontario and can be a force for next years stretch run and playoffs.

If Durzi is traded, would the Kings have room to keep VA? Because right now with my potential lineup my biggest concern is Grundy as a 3rd line winger. Love him in a 4th line role, but we will still need to get some offense from the Danault line.

Lineup looks good but I don't think Kaliyev has fully developed his 2way game enough for top line minutes.

Kupari--Kopitar--Kempe
Fiala--Byfield--Vilardi
Moore--Danault--Kaliyev
Grundstrum--Lizotte--JAD
Fagemo, Tough Guy

Anderson--Doughty
Gavrikov--Spence
Bjornfot--Roy
Veteran LHD (not Edler)

Korpisalo
Copley/Campbell

 

[lumbergh]

I really like this idea a lot . But I think we have to deal in reality and take the Kings and the people who cover the team at their word that QB is at C next season. As much as you and I may disagree that is probably what it will be.

That puts you pretty thin on wing, I think the expectation is that Kaliyev moves up and replaces QB. Either that or they try Fiala again, but there wasn’t a ton of chemistry with him and Kopi and Kempe. Either way, next season has To be a big step forward for Kaliyev, he needs to be a top 6 forward next season.

Kaliyev - Kopitar - Kempe
Fiala - Byfield - Vilardi
Moore - Danault - Grundstrom
JAD - Lizotte - Kupari

Anderson - Doughty
Gavrikov - Roy
Bjornfot - Spence
Walker

I expect Durzi is the odd man lit, but it could also be Toby. I wonder if management has written him off or is they give him another shot. Clarke unfortunately is probably drawing dead to make the team lit of camp but my hope is he just forces his way on the roster after “paying his dues” in Ontario and can be a force for next years stretch run and playoffs.

If Durzi is traded, would the Kings have room to keep VA? Because right now with my potential lineup my biggest concern is Grundy as a 3rd line winger. Love him in a 4th line role, but we will still need to get some offense from the Danault line.

I know everyone loves Gavrikov right now, but I am afraid he's going to price himself off the team. I'm actually in favor of signing Carson Soucy for the 3rd pairing instead, if he becomes available. I think the Kings very much like Arvidsson; I can't see why they would want to trade him. Trade Durzi for a pick or to move up in the draft, and you could keep the Danault line together and have this defense:

Anderson-Doughty
Clarke-Roy
Soucy-Spence
Bjornfot-Walker (spare)

 

[AbsentMojo]

Lineup looks good but I don't think Kaliyev has fully developed his 2way game enough for top line minutes.

Kupari--Kopitar--Kempe
Fiala--Byfield--Vilardi
Moore--Danault--Kaliyev
Grundstrum--Lizotte--JAD
Fagemo, Tough Guy

Anderson--Doughty
Gavrikov--Spence
Bjornfot--Roy
Veteran LHD (not Edler)

Korpisalo
Copley/Campbell

The thing about Fiala, is he loves to have the puck on his stick and set up his linemates..he could lift 2 scrubs to 40 pt seasons. So what I think would be best is to have Kaliyev with him because Kaliyev is always looking to get open and shoot. The main question is who centers Fiala's line because he essentially distributes like a center. Someone great on faceoffs and defensively responsible (since Fiala tends away from it)... I guess Danault is closest thing to it

 

[SettlementRichie10]

Fiala-Danault-Kaliyev is an interesting line.

As far as RHD goes, you need to move on from THREE of the following: Roy, Durzi, Walker, Spence, Clarke.

Durzi and Walker are obvious. But that leaves you with a really difficult choice between Roy, Spence, and Clarke.

The Kings will need to eventually move on from one of those players.

 

[kilowatt]

Running through different scenarios, I could see something like the following happening due to cap constraints:

Trade: Iafallo, Arvidsson, Walker for low picks/prospects
RFA signings: Vilardi ($4m), Kupari ($1.3m), JAD ($1m), Bjornfot ($900k)
Re-sign: Gavrikov ($5m), Korpisalo ($2.9m)
Free agent signing: Garnet Hathaway ($1.75m)

Byfield - Kopitar - Kempe
Moore - Danault - Kaliyev
Fiala - Kupari - Vilardi
Grundstrom - JAD/Lizotte - Hathaway
JAD/Lizotte

Anderson - Doughty
Gavrikov - Spence
Durzi - Roy
plug/Bjornfot

Korpisalo
Copley

Roughly $82m in cap. Leaves space for bonuses and small moves

edit: forgot JAD

I like most of your plan. Trading Iafallo, Walker, and Durzi is a must. I agree with @Herby, we need Byfield to step into a second line center role. Moving Arvidsson might not be worth it, but I'll play along here.

Kaliyev - Kopitar - Kempe
Fiala - Byfield - Vilardi
Moore - Danault - Kupari
JAD - Lizotte - Grundstrom

Anderson - Doughty
Gavrikov - Clarke
Bjornfot - Roy

Korpisalo
Copley


The big issue I see is that Kaliyev has yet to show that he can play top six minutes. If he can't, what is he? Not sure Kupari is good enough to play there. Turcotte hasn't shown that he stay healthy. I almost wish we'd trade for a 2C and keep Byfield at 1LW. Maybe Turcotte will surprise us all and take the 1LW spot? That'd be great. How about this for wishful thinking?

Turcotte - Kopitar - Kempe
Fiala - Byfield - Vilardi
Moore - Danault - Kaliyev
JAD - Kupari - Grundstrom

I think this defense could be pretty good though, and if Bjornfot's not the guy then we should trade him and some of these other pieces and find someone who is. How hard is it to find a left-handed third-pairing guy? Maybe Soucy? Not sure where Spence fits in, but he's got another year of waivers eligibility and Roy has another year on his contract, so I think it's either Clarke or Spence, and I'm sorry to say that I'd choose Clarke every time.

Anderson - Doughty
Gavrikov - Roy
Soucy - Clarke

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[Herby]

I like most of your plan. Trading Iafallo, Walker, and Durzi is a must. I agree with @Herby, we need Byfield to step into a second line center role. Moving Arvidsson might not be worth it, but I'll play along here.

Kaliyev - Kopitar - Kempe
Fiala - Byfield - Vilardi
Moore - Danault - Kupari
JAD - Lizotte - Grundstrom

Anderson - Doughty
Gavrikov - Clarke
Bjornfot - Roy

Korpisalo
Copley


The big issue I see is that Kaliyev has yet to show that he can play top six minutes. If he can't, what is he? Not sure Kupari is good enough to play there. Turcotte hasn't shown that he stay healthy. I almost wish we'd trade for a 2C and keep Byfield at 1LW. Maybe Turcotte will surprise us all and take the 1LW spot? That'd be great. How about this for wishful thinking?

Turcotte - Kopitar - Kempe
Fiala - Byfield - Vilardi
Moore - Danault - Kaliyev
JAD - Kupari - Grundstrom

I think this defense could be pretty good though, and if Bjornfot's not the guy then we should trade him and some of these other pieces and find someone who is. How hard is it to find a left-handed third-pairing guy? Maybe Soucy? Not sure where Spence fits in, but he's got another year of waivers eligibility and Roy has another year on his contract, so I think it's either Clarke or Spence, and I'm sorry to say that I'd choose Clarke every time.

Anderson - Doughty
Gavrikov - Roy
Soucy - Clarke

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Well, just to clarify, I wish Byfield would stay at wing. I think it's the best position for him in the short and long term. I am not sure his game translates as well to C in the NHL as it does to wing, but I was just being realistic, all indications are they are going to move him back to C.

Turcotte just doesn't have the offensive game to be a first line player in the NHL, especially not at his un-natural position, and with Kopitar being a year older it's tougher to expect him to carry anyone who is miscast. Kopitar/Kempe need another highly skilled guy. I expect they have Turcotte in the AHL for most of the season and just hope he can stay healthy, if he challenges for a roster spot it would probably beating out Kupari or JAD for a 4th line C or winger spot in your lineup.

If they do end up trading both Iafallo and VA (which could be possible depending on how the $$$ situation looks) you have to figure that Kaliyev is going to be in a scoring role, most likely replacing Byfield on the 1st line, or next to Byfield and Vilardi on what would be expected to be the Kings 2nd scoring line.

 

[KingsCrunch]

Kings are all evens today.
Pts 90 GP 70 W 40 L 20 OTL 10 RW 30

 

[Steve Zissou]

@DapperDan stealing @kilowatt's job by posting said lineup changes and I love it.

It's a shame b/c Kaliyev should be given the same chance to shine as Byfield imo. I know Byfield has been good there but he will eventually move to C anyway.

Kempe - Kopitar - Kaliyev
Fiala - Byfield - Vilardi
Moore - Danault - Arvidsson
Iafallo/Grundstrom - Lizotte - Kupari

Only bummer is that KKK line (eesh) doesn't have someone like Byfield to go into the boards and dig the puck out. We've seen how successful that line has been because of this very reason.

Kempe and Kaliyev are the opposites of that – though Kaliyev is learning that to stay in the lineup you have to get your hands dirty every once in a while.

 

[DapperDan]

@DapperDan stealing @kilowatt's job by posting said lineup changes and I love it.



Only bummer is that KKK line (eesh) doesn't have someone like Byfield to go into the boards and dig the puck out. We've seen how successful that line has been because of this very reason.

Kempe and Kaliyev are the opposites of that – though Kaliyev is learning that to stay in the lineup you have to get your hands dirty every once in a while.

Wouldn't dream of it. Kilowatt is lineup sensei

 

[Brownie to Pancakes]

Maybe Roy or Spence could switch to the left side to avoid losing anyone.

 

[tny760]

i just don't see them trading arvidsson like you guys pencil in quickly. would it be a good idea? probably yeah, but he's a (relatively) cheap 20 goal scorer on a playoff team. i don't think you ship that unless it's a deadline rental deal. no doubt AI has to go somehow, even at a loss, but i still don't know what you gain from that - that you don't gain from just letting it ride. maybe the cap space ain't there unless you let gavrikov walk? that would be a mistake too. kinda backed into a corner by these extensions kicking in.

can you convince vilardi to take a kevin labanc deal? then all the big deals are kicked in and the UFAs are out and you have a better course of action. probably wouldn't agree to that unless the kings go deep this playoffs

 

[johnjm22]

Trade: Iafallo, Arvidsson, Walker for low picks/prospects

Easier said than done.

The chances that you could trade away 10.9M in cap, with out taking any back, are extremely low.

 

[SettlementRichie10]

Easier said than done.

The chances that you could trade away 10.9M in cap, with out taking any back, are extremely low.

These players all have value, though. You’re saying no one will trade a pick or two for someone like Iafallo?