Confirmed with Link: Kyle Dubas Not Returning

[Stephen]

It's no surprise. Dubas was well liked. He also brought in the majority, if not everyone, in their current roles. Pridham probably being one of them not overly happy.

I'm sure there were plenty of unhappy people when Brian Burke was fired at the time.

I have the horse eye on Dubas...

He's certainly built a massive front office in his time here, but it's not exactly like he co-existed for very long with other established NHL front office or coaching people. It's all young, inexperienced executives and guys who have history with him. Unlike his roster, he never supplemented his staff with other industry veterans who might give a veteran take on roster construction.

Lou Lamoriello, Mike Babcock, Mark Hunter, with each of those guys leaving in a cloud of controversy. In his time, he outmaneuvered a Stanley Cup winning coach with $25 million left on his deal, a HHOF GM mentor and an AGM partner on what had then been one of the most successful rebuilds of this era. Maybe he doesn't play well with others and needs to be king of the castle?

 

[AvroArrow]

So who is unhappy? That Dubas wasn't resigned?
Are they upset at Dubas or Shanny?

They wanted Shanny to just pay Dubas absurd money while holding a gun to the orgs head?

Yes, didn't you know ? This is the Toronto Maple Dubases. Team success does not matter, winning a cup doesn't matter. We need to make sure Dubas gets paid whatever he wants and has complete control over the organization, we gotta bend over for Mr. Dubas.

 

[rumman]

I think Shanny has 2 years left, if there aren't any results he's gone as well.

And so he should be…….

 

[therealkoho]

He's giving the entire story, what is this lol.....

It's like Mick told Rocky, "hit em in the ribs don't let him breathe!" In other words he's closing off all Dubas avenues of counter punching his way out of it and putting it back on Shanny.

 

[ITM]

I would have much rather kept Dubas (and Spezza etc) over Shanahan.

We're set up to mess everything up really bad. I can imagine us losing matthews for nothing if they're not careful. The timeline is crazy here.

What exactly does Shanahan do here? I'm sure there are things but he sure seems irrelevant.

Avatar notwithstanding...I think Shanahan making a definitive decision and removing the sense of lingering confusion is exactly the right first step.

It feels providential given his initial intention and the ability to make the hard, right choice.

One member mentioned the degree of Dubas' tone deaf declaration and behavior on the heels of it to counter an apparently agreed to offer as something (my word) repulsive...And he's right. That's not exercising freedom...

...that's greed.

And like Keefe pointing to the phantom missed opportunity of playing for the Cup when we weren't even at win number six, there's a delusional, self-centeredness that appears systemic throughout the organization - Dubas revealing that unknown side, was a very happy accident.

Best of intentions and all that, some times charity feels terrible. Just like the truth. I think that's the penny that dropped for Shanahan.

Credit the man for doing the hard thing. We are very fortunate that with new information he came to a new conclusion.

 

[BallardEra]

So who is unhappy? That Dubas wasn't resigned?
Are they upset at Dubas or Shanny?

They wanted Shanny to just pay Dubas absurd money while holding a gun to the orgs head?

Keep in mind that there are two sides to every story.

Let's see what Dubas has to say.

 

[Stephen]

Dubas had a playbook in mind all along.

Shanny clearly told him dont do the Monday presser until we have something signed. But Dubas knew what he was doing. He played the ole Wifey card and had the city eating out of this hand.

What I really don't like about this is he cited his family in public, his wife by name, and put the spotlight on them, and made Toronto look like the looney bin in a negotiation where he could have expressed the family pressures, made the contract demands all quietly to a president he's got a decade of history with. Why spotlight your family like that if they were struggling with the pressures of the job?

 

[thewave]

Lukewarm at a presser, hockey decision, pick one. Shanahan was prepared to extend him after the Tampa series, which means Shanahan approved of his decision making, which means this is not a hockey decision except in a way that is abstract and superstitious, that a loyalty that supercedes any financial or work-life considerations somehow makes a more competent and able GM, which we both know is bullshit, unless you just really buy into "the power of friendship" and the indomitability of the will manifest.

This is not a monkey bar, there is no rung in hand. This is a high dive, where how much the landing is likely to hurt depends entirely on how good you are at twisting yourself in mid-air. You want to manoeuvre the franchise into its terminal velocity with Mitch Marner's NMC kicking in a month? The most consequential personnel decision this team has faced in 5 years? Hey, good luck. Of all the options, that's certainly one of them.

I don't take what people like Shanahan say at face value.

For all we know he wasn't going to be extended. This was a narrative that was worked out that would preserve Kyle's reputation and explain Shanahan's reasoning. This is what I actually believe to be what happened here.

I don't think there is much risk at all with the contracts so long as Pridham is made acting GM. He is very competent and excellent with the numbers. Hunter could be brought in, Shanahan could also oversee it himself.

I don't believe there will be a remarkable difference in contract negotiations or draft considerations. It's simply a changing of the guard.

 

[Mr Knies Guy]

 

[TheBeastCoast]

Jason Spezza was Dubas intern. Him leaving shouldn't be surprising or concerning.

 

[ITM]

The Dubas arrogance and sense of entitlement permeates top-down into all levels of the organization.

It is clear now that Dubas is the real problem and this is coming from a fan of his…. prior to today’s revelations.

You and me both.

I've been a glass half-full guy myself...but this revelation (as a couple of my posts indicate) is a watershed moment writ large.

And I'm elated Shanahan did a "Waaaaaaait a minute." just when we needed it. Just when we couldn't afford another moment of it.

Maybe there's light at the end of this after all.

 

[LaPlante94]

This is just obvious though. Toronto media trying to make a bigger issue out of this. I think most staff know when a new GM comes in they'll bring in their own staff.

 

[thewave]

I got a feeling there is more happening at the top level of the club then anyone is letting on.

Of course! lol they don't tell us chit down here.

 

[Rare Jewel]

Well if the team flames out in round 1 again, or in an embarrassing fashion in round 2 he'll be gone next year. If there's a respectable run, he gets at least another shot.

So then you could have a new president with a GM and coach he did not pick?

For me, clear the lot out.

 

[robertmac43]

Of course! lol they don't tell us chit down here.

How i wish I could be a fly on the wall.

 

[Stephen]

Avatar notwithstanding...I think Shanahan making a definitive decision and removing the sense of lingering confusion is exactly the right first step.

Results need to follow obviously, but I do appreciate that Shanahan basically reinforced the hierarchy and will proceed accordingly, nothing off the table for the good of the franchise. You can't have a powerplay at the top.

 

[Rudy Russo]

Disappointing. I trusted him to partially dismantle and build back up. I hope they don't hire some dip shit.

 

[3blizzard4]

Keep in mind that there are two sides to every story.

Let's see what Dubas has to say.

True. Two sides to every story. Doubt we get Dubas's side though.

Quote frankly everyone was surprised Shanny gave the play by play.

 

[AvroArrow]

Man they're getting rid of everyone Dubas brought in lol. I like it, a new identity, new image and new culture for this team.

 

[Larcos_Unal]

So the era of incredibly skilled, overly greedy players likely ends with the incredibly skilled and overly greedy GM being let go...kinda fitting tbh.

 

[ToneDog]

Keep in mind that there are two sides to every story.

Let's see what Dubas has to say.

Shanny could have taken the high road and simply said, we are going in a different direction. His spelling it out tells me he was pissed at Dubas and threw him under da' bus.

 

[rumman]

What I really don't like about this is he cited his family in public, his wife by name, and put the spotlight on them, and made Toronto look like the looney bin in a negotiation where he could have expressed the family pressures, made the contract demands all quietly to a president he's got a decade of history with. Why spotlight your family like that if they were struggling with the pressures of the job?

Guys going to be a hockey pariah, you don’t pull that shit and get many more chances imo…….

 

[Twine Tickler]

It's a new GM and new coach, I can live with that. I highly doubt whoever comes in will make no core changes, but assuming that's the case I'm ok with it. There's a different team philosophy and identity with a GM/Coaching change.

But lets be real, no GM is gonna come in to this situation and not do anything, Shanny and the owners obviously want change that's why Dubas' was let go. If they wanted a guy to just run it back again they would've re-signed Dubas.

No disrespect, but that's not exactly what the press conference indicated

The board, and Shanny wanted to extend Kyle at the conclusion of the Trade Deadline. Kyle said he did not want that to distract from the team at the time, and that Shanny should deal with his agent. There as a mutual interest at this point. Shanny then expressed at the conclusion of the season that despite the disappointing ending to the season, that Kyle did a good job and that he wanted to extend him. Kyle was again still interested, but wanted to talk to his family about it. Kyle has his press conference, and does not give Shanny an immediate answer on his offer. Keep in mind, Kyle went into the season as a lame duck GM, and does not owe Shanny f*** all. Kyle then counters 3 days later, and Shanny feels hard done by and decides to move on.

Shanny and the board felt like Kyle was the right man to continue the job as of Monday.... This same group that had decided to wait till this moment in time to even offer Kyle an extension becasue they wanted him to be "judged on his entire 5 years as GM". Yet they changed their minds in a matter of 5 days???

This is bush league managing from MLSE and Shanny. If your feelings were hurt by Kyle's counter demands, maybe don't f***ing back yourself into a corner like you did by taking your GM into his last year of his deal when you have one of the busiest off-season's to date coming up. Not exactly a position of leverage. Or better yet, maybe if you just extended him for a short term deal last off season, you wouldn't be in this f***ing mess now to begin with.

Again, if Shanny came out and said: "Kyle is not the guy for the Job. We need a new voice, and a new set of eyes". I would respect that, and I would accept that decision. But that's not what happened. Shanny made an emotional decision and let go of a guy he's believed to be the right guy for the job for 5+ years, and as recent as 4 days ago.

 

[ITM]

Results need to follow obviously, but I do appreciate that Shanahan basically reinforced the hierarchy and will proceed accordingly, nothing off the table for the good of the franchise. You can't have a powerplay at the top.

Most certainly not. And moreover when its obvious that Shanahan couldn't have been more collegial...and no less the reason for Dubas' opportunities!

 

[rumman]

Man they're getting rid of everyone Dubas brought in lol. I like it, a new identity, new image and new culture for this team.

This my friends is what blowing it up looks like…….