Confirmed with Link: Kyle Dubas Not Returning

[Buds17]

Here is a great post by "editor and leaf", where the author lists all the SOO employees and players Dubas had hired and signed as a GM (at the time which was before Bunting and Ritchie) The author later posted a listed of SOO players in the NHL that Dubas had yet to go after that may be on Dubas list. Since he posted, Dubas has signed 4 players from that list

Makes me believe that Dubas really doesnt have good pro scouting, and advanced stats confidence because certainly the SOO arent the only junior team with good players/employees.

It’s hard to imagine Dubas ever deviating, so here is a list of Soo Greyhounds alumni playing in the NHL that could be in the Leafs fixture sometime in the near future:

• Matt Murray (Senators)
• Tony DeAngelo (Rangers)
• Nick Cousins (Predators)
• Jeff Carter (Penguins)
• Darnell Nurse (Oilers)
• Conor Timmins (Avalanche)
• Robin Lehner (Golden Knights)
• Colin Miller (Sabres)
• Barrett Hayton (Coyotes)
• Nick Ritchie (Bruins)
• Michael Bunting (Coyotes)

If the Leafs are going to wheel and deal with any of these teams, you can be sure Dubas is going to consider picking up one of his own.

My hope now is simply that he won't be able to excessively poach from his former NHL team next. There's technically nothing wrong with bringing in those one has had a prior familiarity and rapport with. That said, such a pattern is fair to serve as the subject of scrutiny when the amount of team success doesn't quite reach the levels envisioned.

 

[DuklaNation]

For reference. Dubas' draft legacy with the Leafs.

View attachment 711163

Not exactly impressive. A good GM helps by scoring players in the 2nd & 3rd rounds. Its these guys full time jobs to scout and know their business. But you must wonder, how good they are actually at this job anyways?

 

[hamzarocks]

I stopped reading when you said Tverberg doesn't bring grit.

Talk about not having a clue about a players skillset.

Being an hyman/bunting type gritty player isn't what I'm pointing to.

He isn't a guy who can play a PWF-style drive to the net game and bring intimidation like a Tom Wilson/Prime Simmonds

If you are underproducing in the NCAA as a 3rd-year player then you need to tailor your game to be capable of working in the NHL. At 5'11/180-190lb, with limited skill you're not able to play a game beyond that of a good 4th liner (Acciari for example).

He's a guy that getting excited about makes no sense, as he's a project who has a limited ceiling. You can be happy to get that with a 7th, but he simply isn't a player that matters for the team at any point in his career likely (easily replaceable if he ends in the NHL)

 

[weems]

Being an hyman/bunting type gritty player isn't what I'm pointing to.

He isn't a guy who can play a PWF-style drive to the net game and bring intimidation like a Tom Wilson/Prime Simmonds

If you are underproducing in the NCAA as a 3rd-year player then you need to tailor your game to be capable of working in the NHL. At 5'11/180-190lb, with limited skill you're not able to play a game beyond that of a good 4th liner (Acciari for example).

He's a guy that getting excited about makes no sense, as he's a project who has a limited ceiling

He was one of the last picks in the draft who has a shot at making the NHL as a fast, high energy, physical bottom 6 player.

That's very good value for someone picked #213.

Acciari wish's he had Tverberg's explosiveness.

Noone is expecting some impact player but credit should be given that this was a very good selection at that point in the draft.

 

[hockeywiz542]

Okay I’ve been away for awhile, what exactly is the DDL and DDC I keep seeing here……..

If I had to hazard a guess, Dubasites, DDL, and DDC are all derogatory terms used to describe Hfboards posters who are extremely supportive and loyal to former Toronto Maple Leafs GM Kyle Dubas.

These people are willing to ignore all of Kyle Dubas' mistakes and get very defensive and agitated whenever Dubas is criticized by anybody in the anti-Kyle Dubas camp.

They will try to spin anything that reflects negatively or poorly on Kyle Dubas by any means necessary including making up positive stuff about Kyle which doesn’t actually exist or turning any valid negative comments into a positive one in Kyle Dubas’ favour even though it probably doesn’t have any merit at all.

Will the Dubasites, DDL, and DDC back the new Toronto Maple Leafs GM or crap on him like they did to Lou Lamoriello?

Hmm… we will all find out pretty soon!!

 

[TheGreenTBer]

That Matthews contract is a disgrace, walking him into free agency in his prime.

It sure is.

I wonder who negotiated that one?

 

[andora]

Being an hyman/bunting type gritty player isn't what I'm pointing to.

He isn't a guy who can play a PWF-style drive to the net game and bring intimidation like a Tom Wilson/Prime Simmonds

If you are underproducing in the NCAA as a 3rd-year player then you need to tailor your game to be capable of working in the NHL. At 5'11/180-190lb, with limited skill you're not able to play a game beyond that of a good 4th liner (Acciari for example).

He's a guy that getting excited about makes no sense, as he's a project who has a limited ceiling. You can be happy to get that with a 7th, but he simply isn't a player that matters for the team at any point in his career likely (easily replaceable if he ends in the NHL)

I really want the system and how we play to change and create a program where a tverberg is worth getting excited about. Developing hard forechecking gritty forwards to keep supplementing the bottom lines and when one hits they move up the lines - having success because everyone plays the same way

There is such a dichotomy in how this team is built it's no wonder that young players can look lost when they come up

 

[All Mod Cons]

you've said this no less than 3 times on this page alone. We get it. Enjoy Brad Travlivig..

Who?

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

Running a team with a punitive mindset is a surefire way to f*** your franchise.

 

[Trapper]

Running a team with a punitive mindset is a surefire way to f*** your franchise.

So is running it like a Paris Hilton spa day.
Like everything (including team build) there needs to be a happy medium.

 

[LeafGrief]

Good luck to Dubas, wherever he goes.

Excited to see a new direction and a new vision for this team. We desperately need it.

 

[hockeywiz542]

SIMMONS SAYS: Big skilled centres such as Auston Matthews are irreplacable

Everything about the Maple Leafs has to start with Auston Matthews.

torontosun.com

Everything about the Maple Leafs has to start with Auston Matthews.

Getting him signed. Getting him committed to Toronto long-term. Building this next phase of the Maple Leafs around an all-star calibre centre of size.

You don’t win the Stanley Cup without a front-line centre. And you don’t trade away Matthews — or let him walk in free agency — because you can’t replace a player of that calibre.

Colorado won the Cup last year with Nathan MacKinnon. Over the past 10 seasons, Jonathan Toews has won two Cups, as have Sidney Crosby, Evgeni Malkin and Brayden Point. Other Cup-winners include Anze Kopitar along with Nicklas Backstrom and Evgeny Kuznetsov. Big-time centres, all of them.

Without Matthews, the Leafs have nothing resembling a No. 1 centre. And maybe, after the stunning news of Friday, Matthews’ time in Toronto got more complicated when president Brendan Shanahan chose to remove Kyle Dubas as general manager.

Here’s the thing with Matthews: His agent and good friend, Judd Moldaver, is close to Dubas, but even closer to Dubas’ agent and friend, Chris Armstrong. Dubas and Armstrong went to Brock University together. Armstrong and Moldaver worked for IMG in Toronto together and went different ways before ending up at Wasserman Media, an agency that represents Connor McDavid and Matthews, among its largest NHL stars.

How much of the Moldaver-Matthews-Armstrong-Dubas relationship will impact Matthews’ future with the Leafs? That’s impossible to know without a general manager in place, with so much unknown about the Leafs’ immediate front-office circumstance and their most important player.

 

[MCR74]

Good luck to Dubas, wherever he goes.

Excited to see a new direction and a new vision for this team. We desperately need it.

Same.

No matter what anyone thinks of Shanahan, he's the president, and did what he had to. Kyle will land somewhere. lt'll be at a lower salary, but that's his doing.

 

[myleafs]

I think all that really needs to be said here is if Mirtle and CJ start becoming very knowledgeable about the events at Pittsburgh or Ottawa we’ll know why.

In Dangle’s defense even he finally had enough and was calling for Dubas to be fired after this season. The other two on his podcast not so much though sadly.

Ive never seen or thought of Dangle as a journalist but more just a broken hearted fan who has his opinions, some of which I agree and some I dont. Ive had no issues with CJ before but this latest tweet of how many of us are going to regret Dubas getting shown the door is not what a journalist or an objective observer would state. He is showing his true colors here.

Burke doesn’t leak stuff through media. He’s open and upfront. He doesn’t play that game.

this is true but man what a blowhard

 

[BallardEra]

I am not sure you offer a 5-year extension to a guy if you did not want him back. Unless that came from above Shanny's head. If that is the case, why is Shanny even here? This kind of decision is one of his core responsibilities. So I think there is more than enough evidence to suggest that Shanny planned on Dubas coming back and Dubas was the one who was pushing away.

The murkier part is from Dubas' perspective, as to why he was pushing away. I do not think it was money, especially since Shanny said in his press conference that it was not because of money.

This is speculation, but there is a lot of smoke around it being about power/control. I do not think Dubas necessarily wanted to leave Toronto purely because it was "too stressful" or how it impacted his family. If it really got to that breaking point, he probably wouldn't have negotiated at all. But I think it did get to the point where he thought "if I do not get what I want, then it is not worth it for me or my family to continue". Then he sent back an offer which reflected what he wanted to make it worth it for himself (both in terms of power/control and how he should be compensated accordingly), and Shanny said "no thanks".

Maybe it is more dramatic than that, but I am going to go with Occam's Razor on this one.

I agree and Shanahan knew that offering Dubas a contract was all for show. He might have structured that contract in such a way that Dubas wouldn't be interested.

This was a relationship that has been strained for almost 2 years now.

If both sides "truly" wanted a deal, they would have found a way to get it done.

 

[hockeywiz542]

Opinion | The Leafs have a long history of chaos, but this is no crisis

Making changes is what NHL teams do when they don’t win enough. There’s plenty of time to find the right GM and deal with the pressing business to come.

www.thestar.com

So suddenly, at least to the hysterical, the Leafs were in need of a total remake. The Core Four of Matthews, William Nylander, Mitch Marner and John Tavares absolutely had to be broken up, regardless of how difficult it is to do such a thing within the salary cap.

Now comes the departure of Dubas who, let’s face it, seriously overplayed his hand. The whisper campaign suggesting Brendan Shanahan was a domineering boss has already started, but there’s no actual evidence of that.

There’s a good case to be made that Dubas needed to be replaced even before he ignored his boss and publicly expressed uncertainty about whether he wanted to keep doing the job. Still, this has all happened at exactly the time when these things always happen, unless you believe Dubas should have been dismissed partway through the Florida series.

The Leafs now have their pick of the available GM candidates out there, plus those currently employed who might have an interest in jumping ship for the chance to run the NHL’s highest profile team.

The person who gets the job will likely have a full month before the big decisions start, more than enough time for a top-flight hockey executive to dig in and understand what needs to be done. The biggest call — what to offer Matthews — will be made as it was always intended: spearheaded by a GM working closely with Shanahan, MLSE chair Larry Tanenbaum and the rest of the hockey staff.

So again, what’s the crisis here exactly?

Now, if the new person comes in and immediately makes some seriously bad decision, a crisis might well be created by the fall, but that seems unlikely. The Leafs are a deep, talented team that has been among the NHL’s elite for some time. Their best players are just reaching their prime.

...........

This is clearly a big hire for Shanahan. If it doesn’t work, he knows he will become even more of a target for criticism than he is now, which is fair. A new set of experienced eyes to examine the organization and its goals couldn’t come at a better time.

The Leafs now have the chance to become stronger and move on from Dubas, his unbreakable bond with head coach Sheldon Keefe and much-criticized theories on possession hockey and salary-cap allocation.

They also have more than enough time to make it happen.

 

[myleafs]

If I had to hazard a guess, Dubasites, DDL, and DDC are all derogatory terms used to describe Hfboards posters who are extremely supportive and loyal to former Toronto Maple Leafs GM Kyle Dubas.

These people are willing to ignore all of Kyle Dubas' mistakes and get very defensive and agitated whenever Dubas is criticized by anybody in the anti-Kyle Dubas camp.

They will try to spin anything that reflects negatively or poorly on Kyle Dubas by any means necessary including making up positive stuff about Kyle which doesn’t actually exist or turning any valid negative comments into a positive one in Kyle Dubas’ favour even though it probably doesn’t have any merit at all.

Will the Dubasites, DDL, and DDC back the new Toronto Maple Leafs GM or crap on him like they did to Lou Lamoriello?

Hmm… we will all find out pretty soon!!

I think we already know the answer to this. Its already started and we haven't even picked a gm yet.

 

[andora]

God these guys pump out a lot of shit err.. articles

God these guys pump out a lot of shit err.. articles

And a shoutout to @hockeywiz542 for consistently keeping things current

Effort to benefit everyone..

 

[The Masters]

 

[Antropovsky]

Sounds like if it weren't for Shanahan, we wouldn't even have Knies to thank him for.

 

[leafs in five]

that doesn't stop him from being a dubas shill. Just look at when "The Athletic" actually gained popularity versus when Dubas talked about analytics.

The funny part of it all is that mirtle has no background in mathematics and yet talks about "models" as if he knows wtf he is saying and bunch of people buy the bs he sells.

honestly what are you even talking about

 

[leafs in five]

it sucks that the old HF burned and with it the posts of the Winter soldier and other headbangers about Clarkson and corsi and those built for the playoffs Nonis teams

 

[Rare Jewel]

If I had to hazard a guess, Dubasites, DDL, and DDC are all derogatory terms used to describe Hfboards posters who are extremely supportive and loyal to former Toronto Maple Leafs GM Kyle Dubas.

These people are willing to ignore all of Kyle Dubas' mistakes and get very defensive and agitated whenever Dubas is criticized by anybody in the anti-Kyle Dubas camp.

They will try to spin anything that reflects negatively or poorly on Kyle Dubas by any means necessary including making up positive stuff about Kyle which doesn’t actually exist or turning any valid negative comments into a positive one in Kyle Dubas’ favour even though it probably doesn’t have any merit at all.

Will the Dubasites, DDL, and DDC back the new Toronto Maple Leafs GM or crap on him like they did to Lou Lamoriello?

Hmm… we will all find out pretty soon!!

DDL...

Daniel Day-Lewis?

What are these?

 

[Gallagbi]

If I had to hazard a guess, Dubasites, DDL, and DDC are all derogatory terms used to describe Hfboards posters who are extremely supportive and loyal to former Toronto Maple Leafs GM Kyle Dubas.

These people are willing to ignore all of Kyle Dubas' mistakes and get very defensive and agitated whenever Dubas is criticized by anybody in the anti-Kyle Dubas camp.

They will try to spin anything that reflects negatively or poorly on Kyle Dubas by any means necessary including making up positive stuff about Kyle which doesn’t actually exist or turning any valid negative comments into a positive one in Kyle Dubas’ favour even though it probably doesn’t have any merit at all.

Will the Dubasites, DDL, and DDC back the new Toronto Maple Leafs GM or crap on him like they did to Lou Lamoriello?

Hmm… we will all find out pretty soon!!

Seems like there's spin on both sides.

At the end of the day, the new guy walks into a team with 3 top players in their prime, a top 5 team in the league overall, options to improve and cap flexibility. Its not perfect with the Murray and Tavares situation, but all considered a PPG center and a goalie with options leaves the new person in a good spot.

His job is to make this team into a cup winner.

 

[Turin]

Sounds like if it weren't for Shanahan, we wouldn't even have Knies to thank him for.

Yea.. you'd probably have beat Tampa last year and would have Brandon Hagel who was better than almost every Leaf vs Tampa this year lol.