Kyle Dubas discussion II

[Leaf Fans]

Thanks for the info. Can you tell us how many teams manage to win at least one playoff round?

Half the teams that make the playoffs will manage to win one playoff round.

 

[TheRumble]

Thanks for the info. Can you tell us how many teams manage to win at least one playoff round?

Yes but what do you want the fans to do in the meantime? Sit around and look for reasons that this team sucks? We literally have a guy in here claiming that the Leafs are faking Kase's concussion. Another one which I quoted has us as a 3-79 team because he doesn't count anything before Game 60 as a real win and no games with margins of victory of 4+ goals is real because they never happen in the playoffs. Another guy is watching games yet predicting that we're gonna get swept in the playoffs - how do you even enjoy sports like that?

Like if you can't enjoy hockey, stop watching.

 

[Leaf Fans]

NO.
You must praise all things all the time or you are not a proper fan.

No, you take the good with the bad. Like most people do. Sure, there are the nattering neighbobs of negativity,and I guess there might be some "dubites" as you imagine them, but most people know that Dubas has not been perfect.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Yes but what do you want the fans to do in the meantime? Sit around and look for reasons that this team sucks? We literally have a guy in here claiming that the Leafs are faking Kase's concussion. Another one which I quoted has us as a 3-79 team because he doesn't count anything before Game 60 as a real win and no games with margins of victory of 4+ goals is real because they never happen in the playoffs. Another guy is watching games yet predicting that we're gonna get swept in the playoffs - how do you even enjoy sports like that?

Like if you can't enjoy hockey, stop watching.

The extremists on both ends are annoying, both the ones who are as you say, looking for reasons the team sucks and also the ones who will praise every move Dubas makes no matter what and make a million excuses when we lose and roll out a bunch of "advanced" stats showing how awesome we are. I'm just a realist and when people excuse our failures with comments like "only one team wins the cup every year" I just roll my eyes.

I've enjoyed the regular season but I will also say that I'd have enjoyed it more if not for the memories of our recent playoff failures. Those will only be erased with some playoff success, I really hope this is the year it happens.

 

[zeke]

It’s not binary. You can think dubas has done a generally good job and also see flaws in the team. You can cheer for the team without being naive.

I hope this team overcomes the flaws I see and win the cup. Their strengths are elite and might good enough to potentially compensate for their weaknesses. At the same time, they do have pretty clear weaknesses that can be exploited.

Dubas has done a pretty good job learning from his mistakes, and even if we lose, I’m not sure I’d want him gone, though I would want him to break up the core.

Hey its you guys who started this whole bizarre binary "cheer for team not gm!!!" shtick.

It's not our fault you guys didn't realize it was more true of yourselves.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Half the teams that make the playoffs will manage to win one playoff round.

So the odds of winning are 50% then (all other things being equal). What are the odds then of losing 5 playoff series in a row (all other things being equal)?

 

[riffle]

So the odds of winning are 50% then (all other things being equal). What are the odds then of losing 5 playoff series in a row (all other things being equal)?

I don't know but I know we don't want to be the fans to witness it.

If you are the unfortunate team to be in that category, it's pretty hard justifying just "sticking with it". Changes have to be made, and not minor ones.

EDIT: Looking for info on longest series losing streaks. So far, can only find longest losing streaks (games) in the playoffs. The Leafs have 2-of-the-top-6 in NHL history. Playoff angst is in our DNA.

 

[Dekes For Days]

The Leafs have 2-of-the-top-6 in NHL history.

From 40-70 years ago... The team with the biggest dynasty in the cap era has 3.

 

[Gary Nylund]

I don't know but I know we don't want to be the fans to witness it.

If you are the unfortunate team to be in that category, it's pretty hard justifying just "sticking with it". Changes have to be made, and not minor ones.

EDIT: Looking for info on longest series losing streaks. So far, can only find longest losing streaks (games) in the playoffs. The Leafs have 2-of-the-top-6 in NHL history. Playoff angst is in our DNA.

View attachment 535812

I hate to be the one to break the bad news but ... we have already lost 5 playoff series in a row.

In case anyone cares, the odds of that happening are 31 to 1 or 3.125% (all other things being equal). All other things aren't equal in this case, for one thing we were big dogs in the 1st series against WSH but even so, our recent playoff picture is not a pretty one. Hopefully this is the year the narrative changes but I have to say, not happy at all to be facing TB in round one. Oh well, we had much easier opponents the last two seasons and couldn't do anything with that opportunity so maybe it's fair that we draw TB. Gotta be philosophical and say we have to beat the best to be the best I guess so GLG!!

 

[Mess]

So the odds of winning are 50% then (all other things being equal). What are the odds then of losing 5 playoff series in a row (all other things being equal)?

100%

Been there and done that with this core of the 3 Amigo's.

2016-17 - Toronto Maple Leafs - Lost in round 1
2017-18 - Toronto Maple Leafs - Lost in round 1
2018-19 - Toronto Maple Leafs - Lost in round 1
2019-20 - Toronto Maple Leafs - Lost in round 1
2020-21 - Toronto Maple Leafs - Lost in round 1

2021-22 - Toronto Maple Leafs - TBD

What are the odds of losing 6 straight playoff series in a row is now the question on the table.

 

[riffle]

From 40-70 years ago... The team with the biggest dynasty in the cap era has 3.

And?

This is yet another interesting reply from you. When confronted with a FACT about the Leafs, you reply with a reframing of the fact by mentioning Chicago and dismiss the fact by speaking to how many years ago it was.

Hopefully, you never ever mention the Leafs have ever won a Cup because that was over 50 years ago.

I don't think anyone had any issue looking at the dates, as I made sure to include them in the snip.

 

[riffle]

100%

Been there and done that with this core of the 3 Amigo's.

2016-17 - Toronto Maple Leafs - Lost in round 1
2017-18 - Toronto Maple Leafs - Lost in round 1
2018-19 - Toronto Maple Leafs - Lost in round 1
2019-20 - Toronto Maple Leafs - Lost in round 1
2020-21 - Toronto Maple Leafs - Lost in round 1

2021-22 - Toronto Maple Leafs - TBD

What are the odds of losing 6 straight playoff series in a row is now the question on the table.

I still consider it 4 as the loss to CBJ was a play in not a playoff series.

 

[ACC1224]

No, you take the good with the bad. Like most people do. Sure, there are the nattering neighbobs of negativity,and I guess there might be some "dubites" as you imagine them, but most people know that Dubas has not been perfect.

We all wish they were only imagined.

You’re correct that most people know Dubas and the team are not perfect. Perhaps you could ask those why it upsets them so that people would like to discuss, what they may perceive as both strengths and weaknesses, on a message board designed for that very thing.

Perhaps their lives wouldn be happier if they found a tribute site to post on that would frown at any negativity. This place seems to make them pretty miserable

 

[Dekes For Days]

And?

It's completely irrelevant. Nobody on the team was even alive, and the team that's on the list more than us is one of the most successful teams of the current era.

This is yet another interesting reply from you.

What's interesting is that you posted yet another negative thing about the Leafs - something from 40-70 years ago that has absolutely nothing to do with the current team, GM, or discussion.

 

[riffle]

It's completely irrelevant. Nobody on the team was even alive, and the team that's on the list more than us is one of the most successful teams of the current era.

What's interesting is that you posted yet another negative thing about the Leafs - something from 40-70 years ago that has absolutely nothing to do with the current team, GM, or discussion.

It is a FACT about the Leafs in the playoffs which is all the rage for discussion right now. I didn't set out to find it, I was looking for historical records on playoff series losses in a row when I found it.

Would you prefer I only post facts that are positive to you? Ignore facts that are negative to you, because that is exactly what it seems you would prefer as it seems to be your default mode when it comes to looking at Kyle and the team, and there's nothing wrong with that.

Sorry, the facts about this team are upsetting to you. Hopefully, they provide us with some facts in May that are to all of our liking.

So, all the Cup wins in the Leafs history are irrelevant and should never ever be discussed because they happened when you weren't alive? When a great Leaf from history passes on, his name shouldn't be spoken because you aren't familiar with him?

 

[Gary Nylund]

I still consider it 4 as the loss to CBJ was a play in not a playoff series.

That's fair as technically that is true. As far as the disappointment meter is concerned though, the fact that is was a playin not a playoff makes it worse as the quality of opponent is lower than in a standard playoff series.

Not that it matters, our recent history sucks any way you slice it.

 

[riffle]

How much do you think Kyle Dubas "coaches" the Leafs IE: is responsible for some/most/all of the decision Keefe makes? I don't get the sense that Keefe makes any decision in a vacuum. It seems like the Leafs are a very collaborative outfit.

The Leafs need a strong coach who is his own man. Should the Leafs fail again, and it is true that Keefe and Dubas are a joint coaching venture, then I see no reason to move on from them both after May's failure, should it come to pass.

 

[The Podium]

This was Keefe after the Sunday night Caps game. No swing and a miss.

Keefe is the coach, not the GM. I bet he understands the cap on a very superficial level.

Regardless, you didn’t address the fact that they have the cap to activate Kase if they needed to.

 

[Dekes For Days]

It is a FACT about the Leafs in the playoffs

It's a meaningless fact about the Leafs in the playoffs ~40 and ~70 years ago, which is completely irrelevant to the current team and discussion.

Would you prefer I only post facts that are positive to you?

I'd prefer if you didn't post exclusively negative things about the Leafs in the Leaf forum, but I guess a useless "fact" from a half century ago is at least a step up from the cap-related conspiracy theories you've been spreading in this thread.

Ignore facts that are negative to you, because that is exactly what it seems you would prefer

Actually, I didn't ignore anything. I responded to your statement and posted additional facts, noting the year it happened and how the other teams have done in the current era. Then you took issue with the facts I provided that put the negative framing you were doing in context.

 

[All Mod Cons]

It is a FACT about the Leafs in the playoffs which is all the rage for discussion right now. I didn't set out to find it, I was looking for historical records on playoff series losses in a row when I found it.

Would you prefer I only post facts that are positive to you? Ignore facts that are negative to you, because that is exactly what it seems you would prefer as it seems to be your default mode when it comes to looking at Kyle and the team, and there's nothing wrong with that.

Sorry, the facts about this team are upsetting to you. Hopefully, they provide us with some facts in May that are to all of our liking.

So, all the Cup wins in the Leafs history are irrelevant and should never ever be discussed because they happened when you weren't alive? When a great Leaf from history passes on, his name shouldn't be spoken because you aren't familiar with him?

Can you please respond to each word individually, and omit any paragraph you don't have an answer to, like Dekes does?

I find that generally helps, having to read responses that for the most part doesn't help the conversation or answer the question that was posed to someone.

 

[Shooter2x]

100%

Been there and done that with this core of the 3 Amigo's.

2016-17 - Toronto Maple Leafs - Lost in round 1
2017-18 - Toronto Maple Leafs - Lost in round 1
2018-19 - Toronto Maple Leafs - Lost in round 1
2019-20 - Toronto Maple Leafs - Lost in round 1
2020-21 - Toronto Maple Leafs - Lost in round 1

2021-22 - Toronto Maple Leafs - TBD

What are the odds of losing 6 straight playoff series in a row is now the question on the table.

Can't be serious calling out the '3 amigos' for the first 3. Three kids having to carry a team against the elite of the elite. Get real man. Those first 3 are reason to be optimistic about this year especially if the last 2 seasons end up being covid exclusive choking. Somehow the Islanders were good, so can't trust covid results fully. You can't fluke your way to 50 wins moving back to the Atlantic.