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Kopitar signs 8year/$80M contract confirmed with link

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Model62 said:
Lubo?
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I was thinking of someone other then Lubo, but you're right Lubo's situation fits the new rule perfectly. Signed an extension with an NTC, was traded before the new contract extension went into effect. He would have been eligible to negotiate a retroactive NTC as part of the extension.


On a related topic, the Lubo trade generated a lot of confusion over whether players with NMC/NTC's still keep them if they waive them to be traded.

(A) Lubo signed to extension with NTC by LA
(B) Traded to EDM before extension and NTC went into effect.
(C) Traded by EDM to ANA, the Oilers asked Lubo to waive his NTC for the trade and he agreed to do so.
(D) Traded by ANA to NYI
(E) Lubo and the PA file a grievance that Anaheim didn't get Lubo's permission to waive his NTC beforehand.
(F) Lubo loses his grievance and the trade is upheld.

A large number of members on the forums thought that because Lubo waived his NTC in (C) that meant his NTC was voided for any future trades. When what actually happened is Lubo lost his NTC when (B) he was traded to EDM before it kicked in. Haven't seen an explanation why the Oilers thought his NTC was in effect. To honor a future NMC/NTC requires the team to notify the NHL in writing that it is doing so. At the grievance hearing none of the Oilers, NHL nor Lubo/agent could produce a copy of a document where the Oilers did so.
 
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BigBrown said:
http://www.tsn.ca/dreger-report-inside-the-kopitar-contract-negotiation-1.424163

Not much you can do when your franchise player wants to bend you over a barrel. Take it with a smile :)
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Rather than an unwieldy precedent, that makes me wonder more what changed DL's mind seemingly suddenly and drastically. Does he see an out for Brown? Greene permanent LTIR? What in the big picture changed for him here, to not only give in to monetary demands but to make so few concessions overall? Keeping in mind Brisson is a great friend to many in the Kings org.

I mean it may be as simple as you say, "**** it, pay the man," but that is actually intriguing to me.
 
Raccoon Jesus said:
Rather than an unwieldy precedent, that makes me wonder more what changed DL's mind seemingly suddenly and drastically. Does he see an out for Brown? Greene permanent LTIR? What in the big picture changed for him here, to not only give in to monetary demands but to make so few concessions overall? Keeping in mind Brisson is a great friend to many in the Kings org.

I mean it may be as simple as you say, "**** it, pay the man," but that is actually intriguing to me.
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Maybe ownership stepped in and said to get it done. Remember, just one day before there were widespread reports in the media that negotiations weren't going well. The timing was curious.
 
KINGS17 said:
Well, there you have it. This is Kopitar's team now.

In Dean we trust. I trust Dean's initial instincts on this one.
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I think giving him extra responsibility like that may have the effect you were hoping about the night-in, night-out, season-in, season-out leadership, professionalism, and growth. I still actually see what The Mayor is saying about him being captain eventually too and I think this is a large step in that direction.

Edit also NBCLA said it so it must be going on now!
 
KingsKnight said:
What does NBC know that we don't...
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The crossing guard had something to do with this.

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mouser said:
I was thinking of someone other then Lubo, but you're right Lubo's situation fits the new rule perfectly. Signed an extension with an NTC, was traded before the new contract extension went into effect. He would have been eligible to negotiate a retroactive NTC as part of the extension.


On a related topic, the Lubo trade generated a lot of confusion over whether players with NMC/NTC's still keep them if they waive them to be traded.

(A) Lubo signed to extension with NTC by LA
(B) Traded to EDM before extension and NTC went into effect.
(C) Traded by EDM to ANA, the Oilers asked Lubo to waive his NTC for the trade and he agreed to do so.
(D) Traded by ANA to NYI
(E) Lubo and the PA file a grievance that Anaheim didn't get Lubo's permission to waive his NTC beforehand.
(F) Lubo loses his grievance and the trade is upheld.

A large number of members on the forums thought that because Lubo waived his NTC in (C) that meant his NTC was voided for any future trades. When what actually happened is Lubo lost his NTC when (B) he was traded to EDM before it kicked in. Haven't seen an explanation why the Oilers thought his NTC was in effect. To honor a future NMC/NTC requires the team to notify the NHL in writing that it is doing so. At the grievance hearing none of the Oilers, NHL nor Lubo/agent could produce a copy of a document where the Oilers did so.
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Poor old Lubo got chronically ****ed over in his career, wasn't he traded from the Kings the day before his NTC kicked in? Brutal.
 
I know the Lubo trade obviously worked out, but I was so sad when he was traded. During those crappy years he was such a bright spot.
 
zounds said:
I know the Lubo trade obviously worked out, but I was so sad when he was traded. During those crappy years he was such a bright spot.
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Vote for Lubo!

So, when does Brown's contract end again? It's times like these I really wish that CapGeek was still around.
 
I think Lombardi simply doesn't plan on being competitive in the latter half of Koipitar's contract.

So even if you had gotten Kopitar at say Five years, it still would have costed 10-13 million a year.
 
Reclamation Project said:
I doubt he would have even signed a five year deal.
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No, lets say the contracts were capped at (Five years), it still would have costed that much per year. The only difference is, the Kings are stuck with three more years on this new contract.

But does it matter ? Probably not in the long run. It might matter for depth reasons, in each of the next three years, but that probably would have happened anyway.
 
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I don't really care about 8 years to be honest. I know Kopitar will be a productive player for a long time. I wish the cap hit was a bit lower, but that's the market. Even if Kopitar is a bit overpaid (which I'm not saying he is), it's worth losing a depth player or two to retain a stud 1C. I wouldn't trade him for any other C in the game.
 
Suppose Kings are in full rebuild mode in five years. Whou would you like to teach your 2021 no. 1 pick? Kopitar or somebody like... ?
 
KINGS17 said:
Again, I will say it. NO PLAYER in the NHL is worth a $10M AAV given the current economic realities that will impact the salary cap for next year and perhaps many years. The cap will certainly not get to $80M as quickly as most people expected.

Signing Stamkos, who is a great goal scorer, but whose game is limited in many other ways, for an AAV of $10M+ is ludicrous asset management. Tampa has a number of young players that will require raises very soon.

This isn't the NBA where you pay three guys HUGE money and the rest are scrubs, and you can still win a title. In the NHL every player plays, and every player has to be competent in their role if the team is going to win. You don't get competent players on minimum salary contracts.

As an example, I challenge people to name a player of Lewis' caliber that can be had for his current cap hit, and Lewis does not make the minimum. Same could be said of Clifford and other players that have been on the roster over the last 3 years.
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Yet here we are in mid-January and the #1 team in the NHL has a $9.5M player and the #1 team in the West has TWO $10.5M players.

You're drawing an arbitrary line in the sand and making a doomsday proclamation for anyone that dares to cross it with zero supporting information. There is no data to back up your claims. There's just a notion that you have. That's fine but the reality is you've got two current examples of Stanley Cup contenders that fly in the face of your theory.

As for this comment "You don't get competent players on minimum salary contracts."

That's incorrect. Every season we see young cheap players edge out older established veterans. 2012 was a prime example for the Kings because those young cheap players did the impossible in your estimation and helped lead the Kings to a Cup. Voynov made Johnson expendable. Dwight King and Jordan Nolan made Ethan Moreau and Trent Hunter expendable. The CBA forces cost certainty on young players specifically for the team's Cap exploitation. If you have proper scouting, drafting and development programs in place, your depth will be fine.
 
Thrice said:
Yet here we are in mid-January and the #1 team in the NHL has a $9.5M player and the #1 team in the West has TWO $10.5M players.

You're drawing an arbitrary line in the sand and making a doomsday proclamation for anyone that dares to cross it with zero supporting information. There is no data to back up your claims. There's just a notion that you have. That's fine but the reality is you've got two current examples of Stanley Cup contenders that fly in the face of your theory.

As for this comment "You don't get competent players on minimum salary contracts."

That's incorrect. Every season we see young cheap players edge out older established veterans. 2012 was a prime example for the Kings because those young cheap players did the impossible in your estimation and helped lead the Kings to a Cup. Voynov made Johnson expendable. Dwight King and Jordan Nolan made Ethan Moreau and Trent Hunter expendable. The CBA forces cost certainty on young players specifically for the team's Cap exploitation. If you have proper scouting, drafting and development programs in place, your depth will be fine.
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In fact, I have posted numerous links regarding the facts that are going to lead to a stagnant salary cap. You must have been too lazy to read the supporting information. So, when you say I have been drawing arbitrary lines in the sand with no data to support my concerns, you are flat out wrong. I suggest you educate yourself before commenting further on this topic.

I suppose that by two Stanley Cup contenders you mean the Kings and the Blackhawks. The Kings are still operating with all of their depth, a fact that will change when the cap doesn't go up next season, and Kopitar is making $10M AAV.

The Blackhawks are fortunate that Kane is having a phenominal season. He is as close to a superstar as there is in the NHL today. Without Kane playing at his current level, the Blackhawks are not that scary. I doubt he will be able to maintain his current pace much longer.

Yes, there are always pleasant surprises in regards to young cheap players on Stanley Cup teams. That's usually one or two guys, not half the bottom six and a couple of defensemen. We'll see what the cap is going to be for the next couple of seasons, and how it affects the Kings strongest attribute, which is their depth. The Kings are built quite differently than the Blackhawks. In Chicago, if Kane or Toews aren't getting it done, it doesn't happen. Kopitar said it in his interview last night, "If everyone on the Kings plays well, no one has to be great." This sums up his philosophy in a nutshell. Anze better realize that he is going to have to be great far more often.
 
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KINGS17 said:
In fact, I have posted numerous links regarding the facts that are going to lead to a stagnant salary cap. You must have been too lazy to read the supporting information. So, when you say I have been drawing arbitrary lines in the sand with no data to support my concerns, you are flat out wrong. I suggest you educate yourself before commenting further on this topic.

I suppose that by two Stanley Cup contenders you mean the Kings and the Blackhawks. The Kings are still operating with all of their depth, a fact that will change when the cap doesn't go up next season, and Kopitar is making $10M AAV.

The Blackhawks are fortunate that Kane is having a phenominal season. He is as close to a superstar as there is in the NHL today. Without Kane playing at his current level, the Blackhawks are not that scary. I doubt he will be able to maintain his current pace much longer.

Yes, there are always pleasant surprises in regards to young cheap players on Stanley Cup teams. That's usually one or two guys, not half the bottom six and a couple of defensemen. We'll see what the cap is going to be for the next couple of seasons, and how it affects the Kings strongest attribute, which is their depth.
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Two things--one, it's not a certainty so you need to stop framing it as one. There's lots of supporting evidence that can affect it and it's likely, but you cannot pass that off as a fact. Two, thrice was actually pointing out that the Caps have someone with a gigantic cap, as do the Hawks, as will the Kings, and these are three of a handful of 'teams-to-beat' so that does actually get in the way of your idea about being able to compete with huge contracts. Now, the real issue isn't those contracts but the depth around them as OTHER salaries rise (i.e. Toffoli eventually, Kuznetsov, Panarin, etc.), which I think EVERYONE agrees with (the second part I mean), but the Hawks have shown one way around it over the last 6 years, and the Kings will have to find a way as well.

One benefit is that the Hawks have Keith/Hossa on long-term-era deals to slightly offset Toews/Kane and we have Carter to offset Kopi a bit. We'll have Muzzin to offset Doughty. I think our cap 'issues' are overstated from the core standpoint and the real issue will be replacing guys as depth.

To your last two paragraphs though, you're completely downplaying what the Hawks have been able to accomplish. Kane is simply fulfilling his salary. Their depth has been adequate. At this point, the Kings are clearly a more 'complete' team on paper and that's likely to change in the next couple of years, but let's not pretend there's not a model out there for how this works, even with a stagnant cap.
 
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