Rumor: KINGS 2018-19 Season - The Luc and Rob ****show

[Sol]

Or maybe it’s the Doughty effect???
Muzzin was a 1A Dman when paired with DD, hell everyone has looked good next to him but at his best Forbort is was shutdown guy that plays best next to another defensive Dman.. remember that Forbort-Gravel tandem during the Monarchs AHL championship run.. put him next to a Pesce and we’d have something real nice

Well it's definitely Doughty. I remember some people actually trying to convince me that Forbort was good .

 

[CowMix]

Muzzin is extremely overrated here, he was never a #2. Doughty made him a top pairing defenseman because Doughty is elite. Muzzin has also heavily declined since being seperated from Doughty. Times they've tried reuniting the pair he hasn't really looked better than Forbort either.

I consider a #1 and #2 as players who can anchor their d-pairing. So I would consider Voynov to be our #2 during the cup years. I would also argue that currently Martinez is closer to a #2 than Muzzin.

 

[Sol]

Muzzin is extremely overrated here, he was never a #2. Doughty made him a top pairing defenseman because Doughty is elite. Muzzin has also heavily declined since being seperated from Doughty. Times they've tried reuniting the pair he hasn't really looked better than Forbort either.

I consider a #1 and #2 as players who can anchor their d-pairing. So I would consider Voynov to be our #2 during the cup years. I would also argue that currently Martinez is closer to a #2 than Muzzin.

Bring back VV

 

[kings11]

Muzzin is extremely overrated here, he was never a #2. Doughty made him a top pairing defenseman because Doughty is elite. Muzzin has also heavily declined since being seperate from Doughty. Times they've tried reuniting the pair he hasn't really looked better than Forbort either.

I consider a #1 and #2 as players who can anchor their d-pairing. So I would consider Voynov to be our #2 during the cup years. I would also argue that currently Martinez is closer to a #2 than Muzzin.

Voynov was never a #2, hell he regressed badly until he self deported! Muzzin is a legitimate #2. The stats back it up for the stats geeks and the eye test confirmed it. Now he play has fallen but that can be associated to him not having an ideal partner in Martinez. You give Amart and Muzz defensive Dman and they’ll likely shine again but that pairing is not optimal..

 

[KingsFan7824]

I think the league cracking down more on interference hurt Muzzin a lot. He did it constantly. So did Greene. I'm sure Sutter had them all doing it.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Remember when Muzzin was on Team Canada at the World Cup and looked out of place and was unanimously the worst player on the roster?

Muzzin has never been as good as he was in 2014, and playing with Doughty certainly elevated his performance.

 

[WHOneedsSOX]

Voynov was never a #2, hell he regressed badly until he self deported! Muzzin is a legitimate #2. The stats back it up for the stats geeks and the eye test confirmed it. Now he play has fallen but that can be associated to him not having an ideal partner in Martinez. You give Amart and Muzz defensive Dman and they’ll likely shine again but that pairing is not optimal..

Yup, always having to cover Martinez's mistakes brings his play down. He's no Doughty where he can cover for his partner and still look great.

 

[YP44]

Remember when Muzzin was on Team Canada at the World Cup and looked out of place and was unanimously the worst player on the roster?

Muzzin has never been as good as he was in 2014, and playing with Doughty certainly elevated his performance.

I like to bring up the fact he made that team as why he value is good and then hope that whomever I am talking with doesn't remember his play

 

[Herby]

Blake should ask himself "What would Bill Belichick do if he were in my spot"

Belichick would have traded Carter and Muzzin when their value was at its highest.

 

[KingsFan7824]

Blake should ask himself "What would Bill Belichick do if he were in my spot"

Belichick would have traded Carter and Muzzin when their value was at its highest.

So June 2014.

 

[Herby]

So June 2014.

Could have been any time between June 2014 and June 2017. Carter had a huge 2017 and it should have been apparent by then the team was never going to contend again until he was past his prime.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Muzzin was absolutely excellent through at least 2015. Since then, his play has been uneven, but still better than the vast majority of #2s around the league. There's a reason we call them #2s and not low-end #1s.

The revisionist history around here based on players' current performance is nothing but "see I told you so" performative outrage or selective ignorance, full stop.

 

[Herby]

Muzzin was absolutely excellent through at least 2015. Since then, his play has been uneven, but still better than the vast majority of #2s around the league. There's a reason we call them #2s and not low-end #1s.

The revisionist history around here based on players' current performance is nothing but "see I told you so" performative outrage or selective ignorance, full stop.

Muzzin started to fall off in 2016-2017 season and has never come close to returning to that level. Odd that a guy's career falls off at 27, but it is what it is.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Muzzin started to fall off in 2016-2017 season and has never come close to returning to that level. Odd that a guy's career falls off at 27, but it is what it is.

I think he's had spikes of being excellent even this season, but I agree that the consistency has been rough. Hard to tell if that's a symptom of or cause of this team though.

 

[Herby]

The problem with the management of the Kings the last four years is the complete failure to make moves while guys still have high value. GM's will still give value for guys even if they have had a bad season, a guy like Muzzin would have still returned something nice in the summer of 17, same thing with Pearson. But Blake and Lombardi just could never figure it out and they just waited until guys values just cratered. I think many here are going to be extremely disappointed with what the return for Carter might be.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

On the flipside--I think some people here are going to be surprised at returns when some of these guys get moved. GMs know these players are worth more than their last 20 games, even if much of HF doesn't.

 

[YP44]

Muzzin is not a #2 on a contending team IMO, but that does not take away from the fact he is a great 2nd pair guy on a good contract. Should command a decent return.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

Blake should ask himself "What would Bill Belichick do if he were in my spot"

Belichick would have traded Carter and Muzzin when their value was at its highest.

Just like he did with Brady, Gronkowski, Edelman, oh wait....what?

 

[KopitarFAN]

On the flipside--I think some people here are going to be surprised at returns when some of these guys get moved. GMs know these players are worth more than their last 20 games, even if much of HF doesn't.

This.

Not to mention everybody's value gets inflated at or near the deadline. We've seen 3rd line players return 1st round picks or top prospects.

 

[Docgonzo]

I consider a #1 and #2 as players who can anchor their d-pairing. So I would consider Voynov to be our #2 during the cup years. I would also argue that currently Martinez is closer to a #2 than Muzzin.

From those cup years I’d take Mitchell over Voynov all day. I think he was our #2.

 

[KINGS17]

Muzzin was absolutely excellent through at least 2015. Since then, his play has been uneven, but still better than the vast majority of #2s around the league. There's a reason we call them #2s and not low-end #1s.

The revisionist history around here based on players' current performance is nothing but "see I told you so" performative outrage or selective ignorance, full stop.

I thought Muzzin was great in his role with Doughty during that time. He may have lost a step or two. Sometimes the prime years for players aren't as big a slice of their career as we would hope.

On the flipside--I think some people here are going to be surprised at returns when some of these guys get moved. GMs know these players are worth more than their last 20 games, even if much of HF doesn't.

Let's hope so, I would like to be surprised by having three 1st round picks in the next draft.

 

[Bandit]

Blake should ask himself "What would Bill Belichick do if he were in my spot"

Belichick would have traded Carter and Muzzin when their value was at its highest.

Should Blake also ask himself how to get the greatest player in the history of the game on his team for the next 20 years? Or maybe just a DeLorean so he can go back and get Gretzky.

 

[ScoreZeGoals]

Just like he did with Brady, Gronkowski, Edelman, oh wait....what?

He tried to trade Gronk, but he threatened to retire. Edelman's value is much lower outside the Patriot's system, and he makes basically peanuts (less than their kicker). Brady has been the only real untouchable because the owner would never let it happen. There was talk Belichick wanted to move on from Brady and go with Garoppolo but the owner shut that down and forced the Garoppolo trade

 

[kings11]

I thought Muzzin was great in his role with Doughty during that time. He may have lost a step or two. Sometimes the prime years for players aren't as big a slice of their career as we would hope.



Let's hope so, I would like to be surprised by having three 1st round picks in the next draft.

I think 3 - 1st rounders are possible in the upcoming draft. My biggest thing is accumulating as much as possible so we can move out of Phaneufs contract... dealing at the deadline gives the Kings tremendous leverage. We have the ability to offer difference makers in Toffoli, Carter, Martinez, Muzzin plus key role players in Thompson, Lewis and Haglin... Teams like the Avs, TBL, TML, Hurricanes, PHI, MTL and BUF will all be looking for these types of players and all have multiple assets they can offer... and if past deadline craziness is any indication, we could change our fortunes quickly

 

[johnjm22]

Muzzin has been one of our best players this year and is well regarded around the league.

He should be traded.