KHL Expansion Part VIII

[Jussi]

But listen to Chernyshenko!!!!!11!!

 

[SoundAndFury]

I will answer to all of you so that vorky doesn't have to. Each and every one of you doubting THE PLAN.

But do you have the full information?

I don't know why it's so funny to me to beat on this dead horse but I just can't stop.

 

[Peter25]

KHL will be lucky if its even around much longer. Probably will fold back into the old RSL + usual suspects (Belarus and Kazakhstan)

And where would Latvian hockey be without Dinamo Riga?

 

[Peter25]

Now that Slovan is gone, and it seems more likely that more teams will leave rather than join from Europe (praying that it will not happen), surely another team would need to fill the gap of Slovan the season after this one?

I know there has been some talk about a second St Petersburg team but I am badly informed on this. Just looking at the basic information it would seem like Dinamo St Petersburg and SKA-Neva could move up to KHL. Neva having done well in the regular season of VHL, having a sizeable arena, in a big city with only one other team in the league. Someone should fill the gap, and Neva/Dinamo is a lot sexier than Novokuznetsk or Yugra.

What do you guys think?

How would another St.Petersburg team draw attentance?

 

[Albatros]

How would another St.Petersburg team draw attentance?

Currently Dynamo draws on average 3.822, so probably 5k+.

 

[Section Netherlands]

As Albatros said, Dinamo has a decent crowd. Big city, so unless the ticket price is putting people off I think it would be managable. And a lot more fun than any other hypothetical Russian team.

 

[filip85]

And where would Latvian hockey be without Dinamo Riga?

Latvia made two quarterfinals at WC's after Dinamo Riga joined KHL. That is same number of QF apperances before DR joined KHL.

 

[SoundAndFury]

And where would Latvian hockey be without Dinamo Riga?

You can read the discussion in Dinamo Riga thread.

 

[hansomreiste]

Dynamo as a team doesn't sound that bad on paper and St. Petersburg definitely has the capacity to shoulder two teams but then it would go against KHL plans of having just "really good teams" in the league. I'm not saying Dynamo is bad but if there is Dynamo, then what's the point of kicking Novokuznetsk or Togliatti?

A lot of Russians are already pissed that KHL is trying too hard for foreigners while those said foreigners couldn't have cared less about the league. KHL needs a miracle to survive in the long run. Can it remain a very successful and top-tier hockey league? Sure, Russians has always had a thing or two to say in hockey. Can they do it as the pan-European league, embracing sides from different European countries? Eh, this sounds like a decent joke at best.

 

[lesremparts]

Hello all !

It looks like it's not going well in Paris according to Tardif :
Là, avec la relégation, la KHL n’est pas d’actualité. Il reste de toute façon le problème de patinoire : il n’y a pas assez de dates libres à l’AccorHotels arena. Nous travaillons pour que la nouvelle arena de Paris 2024 puisse accueillir la glace, mais ce n’est pas gagné, ils ne sont pas emballés.

Rough translation :
There, with the relegation (of the french team), the KHL is not relevant. The arena is still a problem anyway: AccorHotels arena have not enough free dates. We are working so that the new arena of Paris 2024 can include ice equipment, but it's a long shot, they are far from being overjoyd (about the idea).

(Paris 2024 will be an indoor sports arena with a capacity of 7500-8000 seats for the Olympics, it should host Paris Basket and PSG Handball teams in 2022)

Link : Luc Tardif : « Nous n’avons pas joué en équipe » | Equipes Nationales | Hockeyarchives

 

[mkev400]

Hello all !

It looks like it's not going well in Paris according to Tardif: [...]

Rough translation :
There, with the relegation (of the french team), the KHL is not relevant. The arena is still a problem anyway: AccorHotels arena have not enough free dates. We are working so that the new arena of Paris 2024 can include ice equipment, but it's a long shot, they are far from being overjoyd (about the idea).

(Paris 2024 will be an indoor sports arena with a capacity of 7500-8000 seats for the Olympics, it should host Paris Basket and PSG Handball teams in 2022 [...]

Well, guess that expansion is a dead horse as well then... (Maybe the UAE will miraculously become a very viable candidate after all)

But I. Relation to Paris 2024, I think (if it’s indeed him driving it) that Tardif is very optimistic for the Arena share. Both the basketball and handball seasons run concurrently with the hockey season. That’ll cover most of the prime dates. I don’t know how the leagues are structured in France but in Germany most sports play Friday’s to Sunday (the del e.g. plays a game friday and one Sunday). If you add an ice plant with the intention of adding an ice hockey team for the KHL, you need to find 31 dates in the calendar and if the team isn’t affiliated with/part of PSG, there is no way that they’ll get prime slots in the arena. Is there really enough support to get a decent crowd on Tuesday at 5/6pm to justify a team, given the amount of entertainment dollars/euros can be spent on other events in Paris (not just sports)?

 

[vorky]

Hello all !

It looks like it's not going well in Paris according to Tardif :
Là, avec la relégation, la KHL n’est pas d’actualité. Il reste de toute façon le problème de patinoire : il n’y a pas assez de dates libres à l’AccorHotels arena. Nous travaillons pour que la nouvelle arena de Paris 2024 puisse accueillir la glace, mais ce n’est pas gagné, ils ne sont pas emballés.

Rough translation :
There, with the relegation (of the french team), the KHL is not relevant. The arena is still a problem anyway: AccorHotels arena have not enough free dates. We are working so that the new arena of Paris 2024 can include ice equipment, but it's a long shot, they are far from being overjoyd (about the idea).

(Paris 2024 will be an indoor sports arena with a capacity of 7500-8000 seats for the Olympics, it should host Paris Basket and PSG Handball teams in 2022)

Link : Luc Tardif : « Nous n’avons pas joué en équipe » | Equipes Nationales | Hockeyarchives

Luc Tardif is very optimistic about expansion to France, he has been very active in that area.

Just a few days ago, he said to the Russian media: we will discuss (especially the arena) with the Paris city mayor & the Ministry of Sport, then we go to the KHL.

Everybody knows the KHL & Tardif are in touch with the French Ministry of Sport about the expansion to France. It has been known to everybody for a year at least.

 

[Toro2017]

Hello all !

It looks like it's not going well in Paris according to Tardif

Well, from all the rumour we heard last season, maybe Taskent (believe it or not) is the most credible option. They propably have ice rink, because they will play VHL next season. Maybe they are the next expansion site for KHL in 2019-20. Ofcourse it would be great for ice hockey globally, but it is hard to see, that it would be money making site for KHL.

 

[Nino33]

Just a few days ago, he said to the Russian media: we will discuss (especially the arena) with the Paris city mayor & the Ministry of Sport, then we go to the KHL.

You got a link for this? You're responding to someone who provided a link

The Russian media doesn't have much credibility, but you have even less, so something to support your claims would be a good thing

 

[amoboko]

KHL in France? Seriously.... The best Western European teams play in the CHL and even soo....
Instead of expending or replacing the current league they should see that the teams can stay in that league and be competitive at some level.

 

[Jussi]

You got a link for this? You're responding to someone who provided a link

The Russian media doesn't have much credibility, but you have even less, so something to support your claims would be a good thing

From today even so that is the latest information.

 

[Jussi]

Well, guess that expansion is a dead horse as well then... (Maybe the UAE will miraculously become a very viable candidate after all)

But I. Relation to Paris 2024, I think (if it’s indeed him driving it) that Tardif is very optimistic for the Arena share. Both the basketball and handball seasons run concurrently with the hockey season. That’ll cover most of the prime dates. I don’t know how the leagues are structured in France but in Germany most sports play Friday’s to Sunday (the del e.g. plays a game friday and one Sunday). If you add an ice plant with the intention of adding an ice hockey team for the KHL, you need to find 31 dates in the calendar and if the team isn’t affiliated with/part of PSG, there is no way that they’ll get prime slots in the arena. Is there really enough support to get a decent crowd on Tuesday at 5/6pm to justify a team, given the amount of entertainment dollars/euros can be spent on other events in Paris (not just sports)?

The linked article literally said the builders of the new arena aren't overjoyed about putting ice there as well and because of that, it's a long shot.

We are working so that the new arena of Paris 2024 can include ice equipment, but it's a long shot, they are far from being overjoyd (about the idea).

 

[lesremparts]

Well, guess that expansion is a dead horse as well then... (Maybe the UAE will miraculously become a very viable candidate after all)

But I. Relation to Paris 2024, I think (if it’s indeed him driving it) that Tardif is very optimistic for the Arena share. Both the basketball and handball seasons run concurrently with the hockey season. That’ll cover most of the prime dates. I don’t know how the leagues are structured in France but in Germany most sports play Friday’s to Sunday (the del e.g. plays a game friday and one Sunday). If you add an ice plant with the intention of adding an ice hockey team for the KHL, you need to find 31 dates in the calendar and if the team isn’t affiliated with/part of PSG, there is no way that they’ll get prime slots in the arena. Is there really enough support to get a decent crowd on Tuesday at 5/6pm to justify a team, given the amount of entertainment dollars/euros can be spent on other events in Paris (not just sports)?

For both sports the season start in September and end in June, handball has one game on sunday, the others on saturday, it's the same for basket ball games saturday and sunday, sometimes friday or monday night if I remember. We can expect PSG qualifying for the CL or the other european cup.

Luc Tardif is very optimistic about expansion to France, he has been very active in that area.

Just a few days ago, he said to the Russian media: we will discuss (especially the arena) with the Paris city mayor & the Ministry of Sport, then we go to the KHL.

Everybody knows the KHL & Tardif are in touch with the French Ministry of Sport about the expansion to France. It has been known to everybody for a year at least.

And ? The sports federations are under the supervision of the Ministry of Sport, as a president of a federation, Tardif has to discuss/report about his projects, linked to the KHL or not.
He's looking for a modification of an arena which has not been thought originally for the ice configuration, that means asking to the architects to throw away some part of their work (don't know how much) and increasing the costs.
The city of Paris will decide for hosting the KHL team or not I guess, since they will operate the arena.

 

[Jussi]

For both sports the season start in September and end in June, handball has one game on sunday, the others on saturday, it's the same for basket ball games saturday and sunday, sometimes friday or monday night if I remember. We can expect PSG qualifying for the CL or the other european cup.


And ? The sports federations are under the supervision of the Ministry of Sport, as a president of a federation, Tardif has to discuss/report about his projects, linked to the KHL or not.
He's looking for a modification of an arena which has not been thought originally for the ice configuration, that means asking to the architects to throw away some part of their work (don't know how much) and increasing the costs.
The city of Paris will decide for hosting the KHL team or not I guess, since they will operate the arena.

When it comes to Olympics, I would imagine that to be a very hard pass.

 

[mkev400]

From today even so that is the latest information.

He commented, so he must have all the details about the expansion talks, which really just happen in secret so that no one will know anything about the actual state of play. All hail Chernyschenko

To your response to me: I must admit I didn’t actually read the article that was linked, as I didn’t really have the time. I don’t think it’s all that much of a muchness to put an ice plant into the new arena in the grand scheme of things, it’s a whole other thing to place a team into the arena that has so much overlap with other sports using the same arena. It’s easier to plan for the extra requirement (ice) rather than retrofitting it (like they did at Barclays). After all, they need to change the floor out for basketball (hardwood) to handball (rubber) anyway. And in most multi use arenas the floor overlays the ice...

 

[vorky]

And ? The sports federations are under the supervision of the Ministry of Sport, as a president of a federation, Tardif has to discuss/report about his projects, linked to the KHL or not.
He's looking for a modification of an arena which has not been thought originally for the ice configuration, that means asking to the architects to throw away some part of their work (don't know how much) and increasing the costs.
The city of Paris will decide for hosting the KHL team or not I guess, since they will operate the arena.

That is good. Talks in progress.

 

[lesremparts]

Problem is the project started around 2017, I think, and they must deliver the arena in 2021.

If someone has real infos about the expansion plan in the west I'd like to read it, because it seems it was London and Paris, according to Tardif last year, now it's Germany/France.

 

[Jussi]

Problem is the project started around 2017, I think, and they must deliver the arena in 2021.

If someone has real infos about the expansion plan in the west I'd like to read it, because it seems it was London and Paris, according to Tardif last year, now it's Germany/France.

I think that would make it too late to add the ice surface equipment there or at least very expensive.

 

[Rigafan]

I wouldnt even say that a new Russian team is the best idea for the future. A few years ago when they started contracting teams, Im pretty sure a quote or article or some sort of source quoting Chernyschenko said that a feasibility study indicated 24 teams as an optimum for the KHL. The problem with the current 24 teams is unfortunately a huge geographic imbalance which wouldn't be solved by another team in the west (it doesnt matter if its European or Russian). If you look at a distribution map of the league, the East is very thinly spread past Chelyabinsk (furthest team east from the centre-west cluster) and russia being a bit of a more harsh and unforgiving climate area, the strip from Chelyabinsk to Vladivostok as a whole isn't populated enough to (successfully) expand in between.

Get the Chinese to put a team in Harbin? (where it should have been put anyway) and you close some of that gap...

Mongolia would be the prime candidate but let's not start dreaming again

 

[alko]

There is a talk, that Slovakia needs a new stadium if they wanted to host another WCH. Plan is, to build a new one between Zvolen and Banska Bystrica.

Lets give Slovakia a third chance in KHL!

There is a Airport in Sliac, iClinic will be the new official eye medical supporter to KHL.