Kevyn Adams GM thread

[WhereAreTheCookies]

I question whether Granato can coach a veteran team. He's good at player development of younger players who more easily moldable.

I think next season is going to be a litmus test for that. The weak areas are pretty obvious (defensive play and the PK) along with more consistency from the PP unit. This is where we see how or if his system and the players can take the momentum and continue to evolve into a playoff team.

 

[Jim Bob]

I question whether Granato can coach a veteran team. He's good at player development of younger players who more easily moldable.

I have more questions about whether Adams is willing to add top tier veterans to the roster than I do about how Granato can coach a veteran team.

Last year's roster was the youngest in the NHL.

The roster they have coming out of camp could be even younger than the roster that left camp last season.

 

[TheMistyStranger]

I think next season is going to be a litmus test for that. The weak areas are pretty obvious (defensive play and the PK) along with more consistency from the PP unit. This is where we see how or if his system and the players can take the momentum and continue to evolve into a playoff team.

While I agree, I fully believe that he can coach this team to the playoffs and beyond. Not only that, but I think he's a Jack Adams finalist next year

 

[Jacob582]

I have more questions about whether Adams is willing to add top tier veterans to the roster than I do about how Granato can coach a veteran team.

Last year's roster was the youngest in the NHL.

The roster they have coming out of camp could be even younger than the roster that left camp last season.

I question Adams willingness to add veterans because of the coach he has.

This was an interesting quote from Granato:

"We went young for a reason. We wanted to be young for a reason....we wanted to be young because the young players have such a high ceiling. You don't need a lot of older guys; you need the right older guys...... and we have the right older guys. Sometimes too many older is too many cooks in the kitchen"

 

[TehDoak]

Lyubushkin was among those last year who the statistas in various places were saying was a shrewd deadline move, one which Toronto made specifically.

...and Lybushkin was promptly exposed as a liability Toronto and we signed him anyways.

They also stated their internal stuff showed Stillman in Florida fit better with what they wanted to do in Buffalo than systems used in Chicago/Vancouver.

Or did Kevyn's golf buddy ask him to do him a solid with his kid?

Neuchev at the draft was a player they pointed to as being a data find as well.

There has been no commenting with you in good faith though regarding this topic. We get it, you hate Adams.

I don't hate Adams. I just can see past all the inane bullshit he spews. Without two insanely lucky items (winning the draft lotto for Power and Thompson against all odds becoming an elite scoring center), we'd be a bottom 10 team still with the playoffs a distant hope.

His greatest asset (patience) is also his biggest liability. He will continue to sell trusting the 'process' as we spend 10+M under the cap next year and our window to compete while we still have a top draft picks on their ELC will officially slam shut. We'll aspire to mediocrity and hope to one day make the 2nd round when we get our teeth kicked in once we face a real team in the playoffs.

 

[TheMistyStranger]

...and Lybushkin was promptly exposed as a liability Toronto and we signed him anyways.


Or did Kevyn's golf buddy ask him to do him a solid with his kid?

1) Boosh was good to start the season, battled tough injuries, and ended pretty decently. He seems well-liked by teammates and Leafs fans, who pretty much hate everyone unless they wear blue and white. I remember quite a few Leafs fans in the signing thread lamenting his loss.

2) that's a ridiculous narrative, and Stillman did indeed play much better in Buffalo than Vancouver, giving more credence to Buffalo's analytics.

 

[Chainshot]

...and Lybushkin was promptly exposed as a liability Toronto and we signed him anyways.

There are folks in Toronto who thought they should've kept him, both press and stat blog folks.

Or did Kevyn's golf buddy ask him to do him a solid with his kid?

It would be appreciated if you would stop exaggerating.

I don't hate Adams. I just can see past all the inane bullshit he spews. Without two insanely lucky items (winning the draft lotto for Power and Thompson against all odds becoming an elite scoring center), we'd be a bottom 10 team still with the playoffs a distant hope.

I'm not sure what to tell you about this, yet it's been years of you complaining about Adams. You claim that you see things others don't is pretty funny. You're upset regularly by whatever he has said or whatever he has done, or not done. It's not clarity, it's a really strong bias. JB isn't laying out that he's pro or con Adams, more of just "what is". And that's not been good enough for you. It is tedious as f*** though.

His greatest asset (patience) is also his biggest liability. He will continue to sell trusting the 'process' as we spend 10+M under the cap next year and our window to compete while we still have a top draft picks on their ELC will officially slam shut. We'll aspire to mediocrity and hope to one day make the 2nd round when we get our teeth kicked in once we face a real team in the playoffs.

Same thing with Regier - winning the trade and waiting was far more important that make a move even when it was better to move sooner. It cost him Hasek with how the Peca situation dragged on. The waiting cost him both Briere and Drury. We don't know what Adams next phase will be like because we haven't seen him in it yet - this summer is that delineation.

 

[Dingo44]

There are folks in Toronto who thought they should've kept him, both press and stat blog folks.



It would be appreciated if you would stop exaggerating.



I'm not sure what to tell you about this, yet it's been years of you complaining about Adams. You claim that you see things others don't is pretty funny. You're upset regularly by whatever he has said or whatever he has done, or not done. It's not clarity, it's a really strong bias. JB isn't laying out that he's pro or con Adams, more of just "what is". And that's not been good enough for you. It is tedious as f*** though.



Same thing with Regier - winning the trade and waiting was far more important that make a move even when it was better to move sooner. It cost him Hasek with how the Peca situation dragged on. The waiting cost him both Briere and Drury. We don't know what Adams next phase will be like because we haven't seen him in it yet - this summer is that delineation.

The things you miss when you have someone on Ignore. I can only imagine to what you are responding.

 

[Gras]

There are folks in Toronto who thought they should've kept him, both press and stat blog folks.



It would be appreciated if you would stop exaggerating.



I'm not sure what to tell you about this, yet it's been years of you complaining about Adams. You claim that you see things others don't is pretty funny. You're upset regularly by whatever he has said or whatever he has done, or not done. It's not clarity, it's a really strong bias. JB isn't laying out that he's pro or con Adams, more of just "what is". And that's not been good enough for you. It is tedious as f*** though.



Same thing with Regier - winning the trade and waiting was far more important that make a move even when it was better to move sooner. It cost him Hasek with how the Peca situation dragged on. The waiting cost him both Briere and Drury. We don't know what Adams next phase will be like because we haven't seen him in it yet - this summer is that delineation.

Did Darcy really wait on Briere & Drury or did it have more to do with ownership not wanting to negotiate contracts in season.

 

[TehDoak]

There are folks in Toronto who thought they should've kept him, both press and stat blog folks.



It would be appreciated if you would stop exaggerating.



I'm not sure what to tell you about this, yet it's been years of you complaining about Adams. You claim that you see things others don't is pretty funny. You're upset regularly by whatever he has said or whatever he has done, or not done. It's not clarity, it's a really strong bias. JB isn't laying out that he's pro or con Adams, more of just "what is". And that's not been good enough for you. It is tedious as f*** though.

I'm certainly not alone in seeing through Adams song and dance. It's simply a minority opinion at this point.

Is there some bias? Probably, I think the term 'don't bullshit a bullshitter' applies here.

Same thing with Regier - winning the trade and waiting was far more important that make a move even when it was better to move sooner. It cost him Hasek with how the Peca situation dragged on. The waiting cost him both Briere and Drury. We don't know what Adams next phase will be like because we haven't seen him in it yet - this summer is that delineation.

I've joked that Kevyn has Regier sitting in the corner behind a curtain because it's eerily similar. Heck we even got the token forward for a 2nd round pick at the deadline this year that Regier always loved.

The issue is....it's not a winning strategy. It never was. it didn't work at all unless we had a HOF goalie or a weird confluence of rule changes that suited our exact roster makeup like the 04 lockout.

We'll see, Adams has his chance this summer to prove that he can be a big boy GM. I'm not hopeful, however, given his comments.

The things you miss when you have someone on Ignore. I can only imagine to what you are responding.

lol.

 

[Push Dr Tracksuit]

The things you miss when you have someone on Ignore. I can only imagine to what you are responding.

You don’t have to imagine. It’s the exact same post the poster makes all the time. Probably the exact same repetitive bs that caused you to put them on ignore in the first place.

 

[The Blunder Years]

I question whether Granato can coach a veteran team. He's good at player development of younger players who more easily moldable.

Looking at cup winners over the past decade.

Cooper, Quenneville, and Bednar were able to develop their team from the basement to cup champs without being replaced.

Trotz, Sullivan, Sutter, and Berube all had pretty developed rosters when they took over. The Kings might be the outlier here as they had not been an established winning team prior to their first cup. All these teams had the talent to win and cornerstone players on their roster but could not get over the hump with their previous coach.

I think it’s obviously too early to tell for the Sabres, but if we have as much trouble at team defense next year, I might start to doubt Don’s ability to take this team all the way. Stanley cup winning teams can beat opponents in multiple ways.

 

[Jacob582]

Looking at cup winners over the past decade.

Cooper, Quenneville, and Bednar were able to develop their team from the basement to cup champs without being replaced.

Trotz, Sullivan, Sutter, and Berube all had pretty developed rosters when they took over. The Kings might be the outlier here as they had not been an established winning team prior to their first cup. All these teams had the talent to win and cornerstone players on their roster but could not get over the hump with their previous coach.

I think it’s obviously too early to tell for the Sabres, but if we have as much trouble at team defense next year, I might start to doubt Don’s ability to take this team all the way. Stanley cup winning teams can beat opponents in multiple ways.

The players should be motivated to change their style of play after this season learning down the stretch that they need to lock it down to win games and make the playoffs.

 

[TehDoak]

You don’t have to imagine. It’s the exact same post the poster makes all the time. Probably the exact same repetitive bs that caused you to put them on ignore in the first place.

Subscribe

 

[beerme1]

He took over a .500 team with 3 top 5 picks that were productive. The nosedive back to last place happened under his watch.




He completely razed the front office and laid people off in a time when no sports teams were hiring to save a billionaire some money.



He hired a few more analytics people in lieu of scouts. There is very little evidence that they use these analytics for much other than lip service.



Huh? I'm not sure the rate of graduation of players is any greater than it was previously. If anything he's largely ignored the development program there to rush players to the NHL. Samuelsson and Krebs were both rushed up after small stints there. Cozens never stepped foot in Rochester. UPL didn't take significant steps forward. Quinn and Peterka are the only real examples of players who spent a full season there.



Stop.




- Giving a player with less than 70 games of NHL experience a 7 year contract is not some genius level of player management, it's an unneeded dice roll.

- He bridged Reinhart instead of extending him

- The Taylor Hall debacle.

- Craig Anderson (TWICE)

Stop.





Not addressing obvious and clear needs isn't an error of omission.




This is some kool aid shit right here.

The culture was rotten because of losing. And losing, and more losing.

The culture is 'fixed' because there are no expectations on the team. The team has played two full seasons of consequence free games. Yes there was a handful of 'meaningful' games in April, but they were largely out of it by the middle of march.

Being a bunch of good friends doesn't equate to a good culture in a professional sports league. This whole 'we want guys who want to be here' shit was more of a way to deflect blame away from the front office onto so called "malcontents" who, gasp, wanted to win games. A good culture is one that produces good results, that is self policing. If the team continues to fall short of modest goals, the culture will turn, just like it did in the Eichel/Reinhart era. Losing is a cancer and will destroy any efforts at creating a good culture.




A style of play that won't win them a single round in the playoffs, you mean?



Ah yes, we've pre-baked in excuses for next year already? Because the teams in front of them are better built, better managed, and better coached? I think the devil they've made their deal with might be called 'competent management and ownership'

Your whole front office take seems to be incorrect. The team stated that with covid shutting shit down and things being done online with meetings if I remember correctly. During covid it was time to get lean. Because Pegula says or not. Covid times. Nothing to see here. But your take is wrong.
And if Sammy gets us a Vezina goalie in Levi then I think I'm really good with making the mistake of drafting Sammy over The Duetch Dangler like I wanted to.

Thoughts and prayers will not get the Pegulas to replace Adams. I am sure they are more than happy with the job he has done to date.

They have no reason not to be overall happy with the job he's done. You want Ralph back as GM and coach or something?

There are always options. That does not mean that Adams agrees to the prices.

The signing of Comrie was preceded by the failed attempt to land Matt Murray in trade and Chad D says that they wanted a different UFA goalie who decided to sign elsewhere.

And we know that Ullmark was open to re-signing here, but Adams balked at the contract ask and he walked.

Just because something is of major importance to fans and media does not mean that it is of the same level of importance to Adams. And trades or UFA signings that fans and media want to happen may not be actual options to Adams and/or worth the cost in Adams's mind.


So, you don't buy all the evidence that they use analytics because you don't like the decisions they made. Got it.

You're right on Comrie but dead wrong on Linus. He did not want to re sign here or he never would have asked for a 5x5 contract that he had no business getting. Adams absolutely did the right thing with Linus in letting him go. He didn't want to be here, ( remember that kitschy thing) and somebody else paid him that demand. Are they happy now? Not too sure.

 

[joshjull]

He could've added short term guys that didn't necessarily fit his criteria of young and long term. Vets who are there for the rise but not for the actual winning happen all the time.

Blackhawks 07-08 Robert Lang is a for-instance.

My thoughts in list form.

1. They were going with youth and weren’t going to block any of them. What you think of that plan, or any of the youth in particular, is irrelevant to the fact that this was their plan.

2. They didn’t get the types of depth vets you keep talking about because they were never looking to acquire them. They would have blocked the youth.

3. None of this has anything to with missed opportunities to leverage cap space to add key pieces now and for the future. (Players on par or near the level of of someone like Chychrun). Which is what I’ve been asking about.

4. Even if those types of vets were in the cards (they weren’t). The way you’re framing them is kind of ridiculous. They would have made everything better than the struggling youths but you can’t name a single one. You just know they're out there. I mean come on.

 

[joshjull]

That same problem existed last summer and he did not solve it.

That same problem existed at the TDL and he did not solve it.

He also imposed restrictions on the type of dman he would add. Same age as the core with term. That was an extremely limiting condition with Chychrun as the only real option. I understood it in the context of last season’s approach. But it doesn’t make sense going forward.

He doesn’t seem to be focused on that based on his comments in his recent WGR interview That said, it’s only one interview and time will tell. But if you remove that restriction, it greatly expands the options to add a top 4 Dman. That wider range of options also comes with a wider range of prices. Thus increasing the chances he finds a top 4 dman at a price he likes.

 

[Push Dr Tracksuit]

He also imposed restrictions on the type of dman he would add. Same age as the core with term. That was an extremely limiting condition with Chychrun as the only real option. I understood it in the context of last season’s approach. But it doesn’t make sense going forward.

He doesn’t seem to be focused on that based on his comments in his recent WGR interview That said, it’s only one interview and time will tell. But if you remove that restriction, it greatly expands the options to add a top 4 Dman. That wider range of options also comes with a wider range of prices.

I understand it at forward. If you can’t get a player that fits the timeline, well, there’s 3-5 players that will be working their way into the lineup. I think there’s merit in not sitting on the first line until it’s in its mid 30’s waiting for prospects to develop but I understand the process.

On D there’s nothing more coming. Either you find someone, or you have no one. I can excuse it this year as a growing year. They were behind the 8-ball just based on the age of the roster so there’s no real harm running out Joker and friends in the 4/6/7 spots. Next season though, some will call it impatience but at some point you gotta go for it. My concern is that they might have 2 full lines of kids putting up 30 points next season. If you aren’t shoring up the D, that’s gonna be hard regression.

This year showed that the only thing standing between the draft lotto and ending the longest no playoff streak, is management. That was known by the tdl and management chose not to pull the trigger. So it’s fair to wonder how long is KA going to stick to this timeline when it’s pretty clear the timeline could be right now. It’s also fair to say the clock is already ticking whether Adams is ready to go or not. If he decides to ride or die with the youngest roster in the nhl again and the team finishes worse? Well my patience will personally be up.

 

[Jacob582]

He could've added short term guys that didn't necessarily fit his criteria of young and long term. Vets who are there for the rise but not for the actual winning happen all the time.

Here's my hindsight GM'ing for last summer (still cheap because that's what the owner wants, and not giving up any assets):

- Don't sign Hino.
- Trade or don't qualify Oloffson.
- Waive Asplund
- Claim Martinook* and Nick Foligno
- Claim Tolvanen.
- Peterka/Quinn to AHL if need be.


- Fitzgerald to AHL. Will clear at end of training camp.
- Replace Fitzgerald with Stecher, Pysyk, Benning or Tyler Myers. Vancouver needs to get rid of his cap hit should be free or trade them Bryson. Stecher rather play top 6 in Arizona so need to give him two years (2 x $1.5M). Tell Pysyk not to get hurt in the summer (1 x $1M). Benning (3 x $2M).

- Replace Bryson with Brendan Smith (2 x $1.5M) or Maata (1 x $2.5M) or Dennis Gilbert (1 x $1.25M) or ANYBODY!!

- Goalies. Still don't know!!
(Edit: don't sign Ben Bishop!)



* 9 points in four games against the Devils.

 

[WhereAreTheCookies]

He also imposed restrictions on the type of dman he would add. Same age as the core with term. That was an extremely limiting condition with Chychrun as the only real option. I understood it in the context of last season’s approach. But it doesn’t make sense going forward.

He doesn’t seem to be focused on that based on his comments in his recent WGR interview That said, it’s only one interview and time will tell. But if you remove that restriction, it greatly expands the options to add a top 4 Dman. That wider range of options also comes with a wider range of prices. Thus increasing the chances he finds a top 4 dman at a price he likes.

I think this is an area he really needs to be considering a vet more than another young player.

They need a strong vet presence on the blueline, they simply do not have it right now. Most young teams have this and often times those vets play an integral role. It also gives future prospects a path to crack the top 4 as that player starts to age. The only other defense as young as Buffalo I can think of is the Rangers, and they still have a Vet in Trouba who plays an important role for them. Even those young Blackhawk teams still had Campbell and Sopel.

 

[Gabrielor]

My thoughts in list form.

1. They were going with youth and weren’t going to block any of them. What you think of that plan, or any of the youth in particular, is irrelevant to the fact that this was their plan.

2. They didn’t get the types of depth vets you keep talking about because they were never looking to acquire them. They would have blocked the youth.

3. None of this has anything to with missed opportunities to leverage cap space to add key pieces now and for the future. (Players on par or near the level of of someone like Chychrun). Which is what I’ve been asking about.

4. Even if those types of vets were in the cards (they weren’t). The way you’re framing them is kind of ridiculous. They would have made everything better than the struggling youths but you can’t name a single one. You just know they're out there. I mean come on.

I give up. I'm not even sure what your position is, other than you hate mine.

They would have made everything better than the struggling youths but you can’t name a single one. You just know they're out there. I mean come on.

Alright...

2021 offseason:
David Savard
Patrick Nemeth
Ian Cole
Luke Schenn

2022 offseason:
Brendan Smith
Brad Hunt
(PK Subban before he retired)

That's just in Free Agency. All went short term, all Buffalo could've overpaid to add key depth that might lighten the 8 game losing streak when Sammy goes down in November.

YES, IT WASN'T 'PART OF ADAMS PLAN'. I disagree with his plan as it pertains to defense.

Anyways, this really isn't interesting. What's done is done. I'd rather talk about what he can do now than what he didn't do earlier.

 

[TehDoak]

Your whole front office take seems to be incorrect. The team stated that with covid shutting shit down and things being done online with meetings if I remember correctly. During covid it was time to get lean. Because Pegula says or not. Covid times. Nothing to see here. But your take is wrong.
And if Sammy gets us a Vezina goalie in Levi then I think I'm really good with making the mistake of drafting Sammy over The Duetch Dangler like I wanted to.

The Pegulas came in and talked about "One Buffalo", emphasis on the city and fans being a big family, and have used that in marketing for both the Bills and the Sabres.

The Pegulas have more money than they can ever spend. A quick google search shows the Pegulas are worth 6.7 Billion dollars currently

I have zero issues with them firing people for performance reasons. I don't expect them to be a capped out team every season. However, when the entire country, especially sports/entertainment outlets, are not hiring, for them to lay people off is cruel. The Sabres/PSE are not a small business that simply cannot pay people anymore. They could have ate the salaries of the people they fired in perpetuity, and certainly through the end of the pandemic with absolutely no impact on their lifestyle or any real sacrifice to them personally other than a slight blip in bank account.

But they didn't. They refused to pay hourly staff for cancelled games. They laid people off, furloughed workers, and then razed the front office to sustenance levels.

The Pegulas showed us who they were during the pandemic. Kevyn Adams did too, when he was their hatchet man and was rewarded for his fealty, putting advancing his career ahead of peoples livelihoods. And the city and people and fans of Buffalo should never, ever forget it.

 

[Bendium]

KA has been solid, but not great.

He did better than expected at the start.

He made a GREAT move rebuilding the analytics department.

Taking a group approach within the organization toward drafting has improved drafting.

He did a very good job trading Eichel, Risto, Reinhart.

Krueger made firing him easy. Hiring Granato might have fallen into his lap as the best of few options, but he made the choice to stick with him over old vet retreads, and it has worked out well so far.

His long term contracts so far have been very good. No anchors yet.

He has a plan and is sticking to it. I'll give him props for having a plan.


Now.....

He made a big organizational mistake not getting Ulmark signed to a long term contract. We had ZERO starting caliber choices behind him. All prospects were years out. Developing a team is made harder when the goaltending behind them is the worst in hockey. Giving him an overpay 5 year contract would have been blocking NOBODY, and would have stabilized the net.

After losing Ulmark, he has failed for two straight years to provide ANY starting caliber goaltenders for this team.

I am a fan of drafting best available vs drafting for need or pipeline balance. They seem to have done that, BUT then you have to trade some of those prospects as they pan out, to balance your pipeline and team. So far he has failed in this regard, leaving us about the worst defensive prospect pool in hockey.

I don't like part of his plan. The biggest part I do not like is I feel he is fast tracking our prospects, and holding to long to topped out assets. Argue all you want, but I would have preferred to leave JJP and Quinn in the AHL one more year, and have a few UFA or traded for journeyman or veteran wingers, because I thought giving Cozens, Mitts, Krebs support in their development was more important.

Last summer I wanted Aspland, Joker, and Olofsson traded and upgraded. They all had solid, but IMO topped out years. This was a good sell high point on three assets that didn't fit longterm. Aspland wasn't big enough, physical enough to fill a 4th line wing role, and not offensive enough to fill a third line wing role. Joker was also just a touch to small and soft to fill a top 4 spot, and not defensively good enough to fill a bottom pairing PK type role. Olofsson was showing some 2way potential, so I can see why they kept him, EXCEPT, he was clearly not going to be longterm core, and had plenty of forward prospects coming for his spot, AND was the most valuable rostered trade asset to use in acquiring a player that the team needed more.

It was clear going into last offseason that we did not have a good enough defensive core and goalie situation. It doesn't matter why they didn't get it done, or what they tried that didn't go thru. It only matter that they didn't get it done, which is his job.

IMO he should have done more this past deadline to get the team to the playoffs, even if that meant sending JJP/Quinn/UPL back down to Rochester for the remainder of the year.


He carried out his plan for this year...ok. Now the question is, can he shift the plan and his timeline to meet the current situation. Can he part with assets to fix the defensive corps, solidify goaltending, improve the bottom six. We will see.

 

[WiHockeyGuy]

I question whether Granato can coach a veteran team. He's good at player development of younger players who are more easily moldable.

The few vets that were on the team spoke in glowing fashion about Granato. I have no reason to believe he is a poor coach of veteran players.

 

[Club]

I think he's the right guy to guide us towards the promise land.

I stand by my statement.