Player Discussion Kevin Shattenkirk

[Idlerlee]

He's just not engaging, he's just there and he's being paid to lead this defense, not get punked out by a kid from Hartford

Most of Shattenkirks allure stems from his record of being a high scoring defenseman. Something the Rangers had diddly squat of outside of McDonagh. It's my understanding that he was brought here primarily to give the Rangers production from the D and quarterback the PP, not to be the best defensive player on the team.

Right now he's not doing any of that, which sucks. But I still think Shattenkirk can be a great asset to this team once he gets out of his rut.

 

[Hi ImHFNYR]

What if, what if... Yeah, No lol.

All the other vets are still playing their roles.
Even Staal..

If you think he's playing like a $6M defenseman, we have nothing else to discuss..

Yea no?

Yea no what? It's an intelligent, logical thought. Is that how you react when someone tries to have an adult conversation? You respond like a high school girl?

What is Staal's role? I want to know if you even know what you're talking about or if you're saying things that sound good to you.

Never even remotely said he was playing up to his contract. What you're doing is avoiding the conversation by creating arbitrary goalposts and a strawman to go with them. This suggests that you know VERY little about the subject at hand.

For the, what, 4th time? What is he doing wrong on the ice? I THOUGHT you might have some actual hockey analysis to provide here on a hockey discussion forum. Instead it seems all you have to offer is a vague, generalization about "engagement". But you cant even give specifics to support even THAT assertion.

Why do you even bother coming here? It cant be fun for your ego since people usually laugh at or insult your ideas.
Hockey? Well you cant seem to offer anything more than tangentially related to a discussion about play.
Comraderie? With who exactly? I'm usually more patient with you than most and obviously you can see I dont think very highly of your discussion skills so it cant be that.

You, Webster, pavel and especially nevergetagoodcoach should seriously take a few hundred steps back and re-evaluate pretty much everything.

 

[Vinny DeAngelo]

Shattenkirk a surpise addition to the list of 10 Worst Active Free Agent Signings

https://www.tsn.ca/beleskey-among-10-worst-active-free-agent-signings-1.1197995

 

[RGY]

Shattenkirk signed a team friendly deal. He was banged up last season. Lets see how this season plays out before calling him one of the 10 worst active contracts. Theres plenty others out there. The Islanders 4th line can account for a 3rd of the list.

 

[DanielBrassard]

Shattenkirk a surpise addition to the list of 10 Worst Active Free Agent Signings

https://www.tsn.ca/beleskey-among-10-worst-active-free-agent-signings-1.1197995

Would he be on this list if he had gotten the slam dunk assists Pionk has the past 3 games? Doubt it.

 

[Vinny DeAngelo]

Would he be on this list if he had gotten the slam dunk assists Pink has the past 3 games? Doubt it.

But he didnt, and it has nothing to do with anyone other than him.. Shattenkirk has struggled to make simple plays this year

 

[CaptBagel]

I laughed at all ranger fans that loved his signing
I hated it from day one and I knew this is exactly who we were getting
He's not terrible but he certainly isn't worth even half his contract...
He's a third pair RD, and second unit PP QB
Quinn is playing him right where he should be..
I just hope he starts scoring some so we can trade him at the deadline

 

[NYR]

Yea no?

Yea no what? It's an intelligent, logical thought. Is that how you react when someone tries to have an adult conversation? You respond like a high school girl?

What is Staal's role? I want to know if you even know what you're talking about or if you're saying things that sound good to you.

Never even remotely said he was playing up to his contract. What you're doing is avoiding the conversation by creating arbitrary goalposts and a strawman to go with them. This suggests that you know VERY little about the subject at hand.

For the, what, 4th time? What is he doing wrong on the ice? I THOUGHT you might have some actual hockey analysis to provide here on a hockey discussion forum. Instead it seems all you have to offer is a vague, generalization about "engagement". But you cant even give specifics to support even THAT assertion.

Why do you even bother coming here? It cant be fun for your ego since people usually laugh at or insult your ideas.
Hockey? Well you cant seem to offer anything more than tangentially related to a discussion about play.
Comraderie? With who exactly? I'm usually more patient with you than most and obviously you can see I dont think very highly of your discussion skills so it cant be that.

You, Webster, pavel and especially nevergetagoodcoach should seriously take a few hundred steps back and re-evaluate pretty much everything.

Ohh FFS..Did that take you all afternoon to come up with all of this because you really showed me

The reason I don’t engage with simple posters such as yourself is because you live in a f***ing fantasy land.

I could sit here and talk to you like you’re a 2 year old and explain every single little detail to you but in order to not waste my time, I flat out tell you that he’s played like nothing more than a 3rd pairing defenseman (WHICH IS THE f***ING PROBLEM! ) and all I get from you is..Yeah well, UH..but what if this, What if that..Blah blah..Bullshit, speaking of moving goal posts, Mr Strawman.

Coaches have called out Shattenkirk along with 2 entire fan bases.
There’s even an article a few posts up calling it one of the worst top ten signings.
I, myself was against this from the very first day of the signing and clearly I’m not alone with my opinion, yet, you clearly still haven’t figured it out.

Mean while I know nothing..Talk about calling the kettle black, Haa

Oh and lets not forget how you just love to defer to Staal in any and every single debate.

I got news for you, Staal is what he is..That will never change the fact that Shattenkirk still sucks.

Maybe you should just stop comparing ANY player all together because more than half the time, the comparison isn’t even remotely close to reality and just makes your argument look even more idiotic.

The mere fact that you're even arguing over such a mediocre player in the first place tells me that you know jackshit about much of anything and you’re the last person that should be calling out anyone, especially not half the board and who the f*** are you and when did you become the almighty HF Authority when it comes to posting anyway?

Maybe you should just go trade your high horse in for a rainbow colored unicorn and run along, Brainiac..

 

[NYR]

I can't believe I just wasted 3 mins of my life missing the game and writing that..SMH

 

[gorangers0525]

I laughed at all ranger fans that loved his signing
I hated it from day one and I knew this is exactly who we were getting
He's not terrible but he certainly isn't worth even half his contract...
He's a third pair RD, and second unit PP QB
Quinn is playing him right where he should be..
I just hope he starts scoring some so we can trade him at the deadline

He's never been either of these at any point in his career, so predicting that is a pretty bold take.

" Player struggles 10 games back from major injury, more at 11". Saying he's playing well right now is obviously false, saying that this is who Shattenkirk is as a player is equally moronic.

 

[TheGortonConspiracy]

Is it still an unpopular opinion that Shattenkirk is worse than Smith and Staal?

He’s a very non-DQ player (PP specialist, not very resilient or responsible, slow, not physical, etc). Will he have success in the next 2 years with the DQ system? Some suggest he currently has trade value if we retain 50%. Will that be the case next year, or the year after (trade deadline), if we hold onto him (do nothing) and continue deploying him in a system that doesn’t align with his strengths?

And stats guys - do consider Shatty plays a very sheltered role RE: matchups

 

[True Blue]

Is it still an unpopular opinion that Shattenkirk is worse than Smith and Staal?

He’s a very non-DQ player (PP specialist, not very resilient or responsible, slow, not physical, etc). Will he have success in the next 2 years with the DQ system? Some suggest he currently has trade value if we retain 50%. Will that be the case next year, or the year after (trade deadline), if we hold onto him (do nothing) and continue deploying him in a system that doesn’t align with his strengths?

And stats guys - do consider Shatty plays a very sheltered role RE: matchups

I was more than willing to give him time and think that this is just coming back slowly from injury. But the fact of the matter is that at best, he has been "meh". Taking a player that was kept away from the opposition's top lines and was playing sheltered minutes for his previous teams and then expecting him to be a top pairing defenseman was an exercise in futility.

I am not even sure that 50% retention is going to do it to trade him. If at all possible, I actually think that at 50-75% retention, there is a better chance of trading away Staal or Smith.

 

[SlapshotTheMovie]

I was more than willing to give him time and think that this is just coming back slowly from injury. But the fact of the matter is that at best, he has been "meh". Taking a player that was kept away from the opposition's top lines and was playing sheltered minutes for his previous teams and then expecting him to be a top pairing defenseman was an exercise in futility.

I am not even sure that 50% retention is going to do it to trade him. If at all possible, I actually think that at 50-75% retention, there is a better chance of trading away Staal or Smith.

You think two years of a 30-40 point RHD at 3.325m is worth less then marc staal? Yeah not going to take your opinion serious at all.

 

[True Blue]

You think two years of a 30-40 point RHD at 3.325m is worth less then marc staal? Yeah not going to take your opinion serious at all.

You can take someone's view seriously or not. Up to you. However, as of right now, Shattenkirk has 24 points. And the odds of reaching 30 do not seem to be going in his favor. So, yeah. I think that a 25-30 RHD at 3.325 who can't play a lick of defense is worth less than Marc Staal a a similar price point.

 

[Vinny DeAngelo]

Most of Shattenkirks allure stems from his record of being a high scoring defenseman. Something the Rangers had diddly squat of outside of McDonagh. It's my understanding that he was brought here primarily to give the Rangers production from the D and quarterback the PP, not to be the best defensive player on the team.

Right now he's not doing any of that, which sucks. But I still think Shattenkirk can be a great asset to this team once he gets out of his rut.

Idk if you can call it a rut at this point.. Its almost a full season.

At his age you could even call it the decline

 

[LeetchisGod]

No one should be surprised by what we've seen from this guy.

 

[NoQuitInNewMexico]

You can take someone's view seriously or not. Up to you. However, as of right now, Shattenkirk has 24 points. And the odds of reaching 30 do not seem to be going in his favor. So, yeah. I think that a 25-30 RHD at 3.325 who can't play a lick of defense is worth less than Marc Staal a a similar price point.

I also think most teams have a Pionk or a Gilmour in the minors that can play sheltered minutes and stay afloat on an NHL PP unit.

 

[McRanger]

You can take someone's view seriously or not. Up to you. However, as of right now, Shattenkirk has 24 points. And the odds of reaching 30 do not seem to be going in his favor. So, yeah. I think that a 25-30 RHD at 3.325 who can't play a lick of defense is worth less than Marc Staal a a similar price point.

If Shattenkirk and Staal were both UFAs seeking 2 year deals, how much interest would they each get and what would be their respective price points?

The answer to that question is the answer to whether or not either has trade value.

IMO we would have a hard time giving away Staal even with 50% retained while Shattenkirk would garner some interest at his full price and a lot of interest with 50% retained.

 

[SlapshotTheMovie]

You can take someone's view seriously or not. Up to you. However, as of right now, Shattenkirk has 24 points. And the odds of reaching 30 do not seem to be going in his favor. So, yeah. I think that a 25-30 RHD at 3.325 who can't play a lick of defense is worth less than Marc Staal a a similar price point.

Except that he is already on a 30+ point pace. Yeah he isnt getting to play a full 82 so he wont hit 30 but thats still not how stats work.

 

[SlapshotTheMovie]

If Shattenkirk and Staal were both UFAs seeking 2 year deals, how much interest would they each get and what would be their respective price points?

The answer to that question is the answer to whether or not either has trade value.

IMO we would have a hard time giving away Staal even with 50% retained while Shattenkirk would garner some interest at his full price and a lot of interest with 50% retained.

He isn't interested in logic or facts

 

[Off Sides]

I think part of the issue with trying to trade either even at 50% is the clauses would have to be transferred along in that trade, and they are there in the first place to limit the trade.

If they were UFAs any team offering them stuff is going to be on their terms and the offers could come from any team instead of just those they'd be willing to go to, or those who were not on their lists.

 

[True Blue]

IMO we would have a hard time giving away Staal even with 50% retained while Shattenkirk would garner some interest at his full price and a lot of interest with 50% retained.

I disagree. I think that if Staal was playing the same way next year, at 50-75% retained would get him on a third pair of a playoff bound team. If Shattenkirk would be playing the same exact way next year, 50-75% retained keeps him a Ranger. Of course this is my belief and not a tested fact.

 

[McRanger]

I think part of the issue with trying to trade either even at 50% is the clauses would have to be transferred along in that trade, and they are there in the first place to limit the trade.

If they were UFAs any team offering them stuff is going to be on their terms and the offers could come from any team instead of just those they'd be willing to go to, or those who were not on their lists.

The UFA thing was just about teams being interested in acquiring them at their salary and term. Their NMC/NTCs are a whole separate problem, so this discussion is really being made with the assumption that either would be willing to accept a move to a non-basement dweller.

 

[True Blue]

He isn't interested in logic or facts

Odd that logic and facts get to be prognosticated as such by the person stating the case. To what facts are you referring to? That Shattenkirk has 24 points? Agreed.

 

[True Blue]

The UFA thing was just about teams being interested in acquiring them at their salary and term. Their NMC/NTCs are a whole separate problem, so this discussion is really being made with the assumption that either would be willing to accept a move to a non-basement dweller.

Very true. The NMC/NMC fog up any such possibility.