Value of: Kevin Fiala and Matt Dumba

[Digitalbooya]

Seems like a big overpay by the Sabres.

Wild fans have been offering up Dumba for a 2nd and a 4th.

Unsigned high scoring RFA wingers have not returned much value the last few seasons. Reinhart went for late 1st + a prospect. Buchnevich only returned a 2nd and Blais

Sabres offer pick #28, Ryan Johnson, a 2nd and a 4th. For Fiala and Dumba

Perhaps the "keep Fiala at all cost" fans would be willing to trade Dumba for a 2nd and a 4th. I think that is a horrible way of going about things. Look at the Lindholm trade for what Minnesota should ask for Dumba. Hell, Chiarot got more than a 2nd+4th in return at the deadline.

#28+Johnson+2nd+4th is an absolute dog water proposal for Fiala AND Dumba. I don't think I'd pull the trigger on that for Fiala alone.

Dumba, based on the Lindholm and Chiarot trades, should get some variation between 1st+future 2nd+future 2nd+prospect and 1st+4th+prospect.

 

[BFLO]

Perhaps the "keep Fiala at all cost" fans would be willing to trade Dumba for a 2nd and a 4th. I think that is a horrible way of going about things. Look at the Lindholm trade for what Minnesota should ask for Dumba. Hell, Chiarot got more than a 2nd+4th in return at the deadline.

#28+Johnson+2nd+4th is an absolute dog water proposal for Fiala AND Dumba. I don't think I'd pull the trigger on that for Fiala alone.

Dumba, based on the Lindholm and Chiarot trades, should get some variation between 1st+future 2nd+future 2nd+prospect and 1st+4th+prospect.

Yeah, I mean I did couch my offer ahead of time by saying that some Minny fans have offered up Dumba for that little.

And high scoring unsigned RFA wingers should be worth more, but they haven't been.

Given those facts, why would I offer more? Yeah, in a vacuum players as good as Fiala and Dumba should be worth more than that, but the flat cap exists and their contract situations exist and the cap crunch for Minny exists.

If you can get rid of Dumba, that does open up the cap space to just extend Fiala which you absolutely should.

 

[Sebastien]

Yeah, I mean I did couch my offer ahead of time by saying that some Minny fans have offered up Dumba for that little.

And high scoring unsigned RFA wingers should be worth more, but they haven't been.

Given those facts, why would I offer more? Yeah, in a vacuum players as good as Fiala and Dumba should be worth more than that, but the flat cap exists and their contract situations exist and the cap crunch for Minny exists.

If you can get rid of Dumba, that does open up the cap space to just extend Fiala which you absolutely should.

Guerin, gm of wild has already signaled or made it clear fiala is being traded, and fiala said goodbye on Instagram. It seems there's more to tye fiala situation than most wild fans are aware of ..it's at least clear for now , like Minnesota's gm said, rd like Dumba is more important to the team and his leadership also.

 

[Digitalbooya]

Yeah, I mean I did couch my offer ahead of time by saying that some Minny fans have offered up Dumba for that little.

And high scoring unsigned RFA wingers should be worth more, but they haven't been.

Given those facts, why would I offer more? Yeah, in a vacuum players as good as Fiala and Dumba should be worth more than that, but the flat cap exists and their contract situations exist and the cap crunch for Minny exists.

If you can get rid of Dumba, that does open up the cap space to just extend Fiala which you absolutely should.

Some Wild fans are off their rockers trying to do anything to keep Fiala. Even if they trade Dumba, we are gonna be right back to square one next offseason when Boldy needs a new contract. Trading Fiala for a player like Holtz is definitely ideal. Hope he can contribute next season AND his ELC lasts through the entire bad part of the dead cap years. Fiala is buddies with Hischier and I believe they would play extremely well together.

I don't think trading Dumba is the answer. In fact, I'd argue trading Zuccarello is more the answer than trading Dumba. I'd argue trading Middleton, Goligoski, Kulikov, Greenway, Jost, etc (enough to fit the cap) is a better answer than trading Dumba given the prospects we have that will be making a push for an NHL spot in the coming years (Rossi, Beckman, Addison, Lambos, O'Rourke, Hunt, Peart).

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Guerin, gm of wild has already signaled or made it clear fiala is being traded, and fiala said goodbye on Instagram. It seems there's more to tye fiala situation than most wild fans are aware of ..it's at least clear for now , like Minnesota's gm said, rd like Dumba is more important to the team and his leadership also.

We're all aware of it. Many of us just disagree with it.

 

[Sebastien]

We're all aware of it. Many of us just disagree with it.

I liked fiala, but this playoffs turned me off too him. Maybe it's just me and having played team sports, but to me; there was a lack of passion, lacked of caring by him on playoffs. At this seemed checked put during the playoffs.

One of my other thoughts, that Anthony L brought up on recent podcast, maybe Dean Evason and fiala need to go their own separate ways. Because one thing that is clear; wild have put kaprizov's need above fiala since day 1.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

I liked fiala, but this playoffs turned me off too him. Maybe it's just me and having played team sports, but to me; there was a lack of passion, lacked of caring by him on playoffs. At this seemed checked put during the playoffs.

One of my other thoughts, that Anthony L brought up on recent podcast, maybe Dean Evason and fiala need to go their own separate ways. Because one thing that is clear; wild have put kaprizov's need above fiala since day 1.

I always cringe when people say things like this from their couches.

I'd choose Fiala over Evason 10 times out of 10, all things being equal.

 

[Bazeek]

I always cringe when people say things like this from their couches.

I'd choose Fiala over Evason 10 times out of 10, all things being equal.

It blows my mind that this keeps getting brought up at all. Evason's won nothing as a coach, at any level, and earned an extension after a mostly-okay stint as an interim HC. And now we're trading away PPG wingers because they might not see eye to eye on stuff?

There were more than a few nights where Lemaire probably wanted to throw Gaborik out a damn window, and somehow they managed to do okay. And Lemaire was a coach worth trading away players for.

 

[Webster]

I liked fiala, but this playoffs turned me off too him. Maybe it's just me and having played team sports, but to me; there was a lack of passion, lacked of caring by him on playoffs. At this seemed checked put during the playoffs.

One of my other thoughts, that Anthony L brought up on recent podcast, maybe Dean Evason and fiala need to go their own separate ways. Because one thing that is clear; wild have put kaprizov's need above fiala since day 1.

I believe you touched the real conflict here...Evason and Fiala don't get along.

 

[Nico Hischier]

Keep in mind with a holtz for fiala trade that would be lots of salary coming in for NJ and not a lot of salary leaving. A recent top 10 pick who’s on an elc and team control for years. We hope that holtz becomes as good as fiala is now he has shown flashes but he’s still very young. Fiala just had one of his best seasons and will get paid.

I’m not sure exactly how I feel about the trade 1 for 1. I absolutely would not add anything more. Nj gets the better player now but also really affects their salary cap and potential other moves they could make. Fiala about to get paid and Minnesota at the cap ceiling should definitely bring fialas value down as Minnesota appears to be trading from a disadvantage. Trading holtz for fiala would be a big win for the wild and honestly might be the best offer they get.

 

[Digitalbooya]

Keep in mind with a holtz for fiala trade that would be lots of salary coming in for NJ and not a lot of salary leaving. A recent top 10 pick who’s on an elc and team control for years. We hope that holtz becomes as good as fiala is now he has shown flashes but he’s still very young. Fiala just had one of his best seasons and will get paid.

I’m not sure exactly how I feel about the trade 1 for 1. I absolutely would not add anything more. Nj gets the better player now but also really affects their salary cap and potential other moves they could make. Fiala about to get paid and Minnesota at the cap ceiling should definitely bring fialas value down as Minnesota appears to be trading from a disadvantage. Trading holtz for fiala would be a big win for the wild and honestly might be the best offer they get.

I’m not sure it would be the best if Ottawa comes to play with #7+. Holtz is probably the best NHL ready prospect the Wild could get though.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Keep in mind with a holtz for fiala trade that would be lots of salary coming in for NJ and not a lot of salary leaving. A recent top 10 pick who’s on an elc and team control for years. We hope that holtz becomes as good as fiala is now he has shown flashes but he’s still very young. Fiala just had one of his best seasons and will get paid.

I’m not sure exactly how I feel about the trade 1 for 1. I absolutely would not add anything more. Nj gets the better player now but also really affects their salary cap and potential other moves they could make. Fiala about to get paid and Minnesota at the cap ceiling should definitely bring fialas value down as Minnesota appears to be trading from a disadvantage. Trading holtz for fiala would be a big win for the wild and honestly might be the best offer they get.

Holtz isn't a big win until he turns into something. You're sacrificing cap space (for a couple years) to basically ensure your team seeing Holtz's likely best case scenario. We're left hoping that Holtz can come close to what Fiala is.

There is a lot about Holtz that we should like, skillset-wise and contract-wise, but him alone would be a touch disappointing. Probably not a deal breaker though.

 

[IAHockey25]

Keep in mind with a holtz for fiala trade that would be lots of salary coming in for NJ and not a lot of salary leaving. A recent top 10 pick who’s on an elc and team control for years. We hope that holtz becomes as good as fiala is now he has shown flashes but he’s still very young. Fiala just had one of his best seasons and will get paid.

I’m not sure exactly how I feel about the trade 1 for 1. I absolutely would not add anything more. Nj gets the better player now but also really affects their salary cap and potential other moves they could make. Fiala about to get paid and Minnesota at the cap ceiling should definitely bring fialas value down as Minnesota appears to be trading from a disadvantage. Trading holtz for fiala would be a big win for the wild and honestly might be the best offer they get.

If there are multiple bidders then his value will not go down. It's a supply vs demand scenario. I don't know if there are many more talented players out there to be had.

 

[IAHockey25]

Holtz isn't a big win until he turns into something. You're sacrificing cap space (for a couple years) to basically ensure your team seeing Holtz's likely best case scenario. We're left hoping that Holtz can come close to what Fiala is.

There is a lot about Holtz that we should like, skillset-wise and contract-wise, but him alone would be a touch disappointing. Probably not a deal breaker though.

Yes if I was on the other side of the foot and my team could get Fiala. I would definitely be trading young prospects and picks. This is 3 years now that Fiala has been trending up and trending up with bad linemates and a coach who doesn't like him.

Unfortunately my team has to trade him and I think you are high on 50/50. I would say 20/80 that we would get a prospect who gets 85 by 25 if ever.

Yes he didn't play well in playoffs but that was the case of everyone on the Wild except Ek, KK and Brodin

 

[bashbros32]

7th overall + Ridley Greig? would that do it? really don't want to lose Pinto and swapping Zub for Dumba doesn't address anything on the D side for OTT. Would also be willing to throw in one of Thomson/JBD as well.

 

[Irie]

Buffalo <-- Fiala (extended), Dumba (extended)

Minnesota <-- #9, #16, #28


Sabres get a 1st line calibre winger, and a top pairing calibre Dman

Minnesota add 3 1st round picks without having to take back any salary

No thanks.

Buffalo has finally shown the ability to draft and develop high end prospects. They need to stay the course and not try to cheat the rebuild again.

Keep the pipeline filled with quality ELCs, not rushing any prospects, and let the team develop.

Maybe in a year or two they will be ready to mortgage the future for instant help, but they are not at that stage yet.

 

[PatLaFontaineASMR]

Buffalo <-- Fiala (extended), Dumba (extended)

Minnesota <-- #9, #16, #28


Sabres get a 1st line calibre winger, and a top pairing calibre Dman

Minnesota add 3 1st round picks without having to take back any salary

No way we do that

 

[Neutrinos]

No thanks.

Buffalo has finally shown the ability to draft and develop high end prospects. They need to stay the course and not try to cheat the rebuild again.

Keep the pipeline filled with quality ELCs, not rushing any prospects, and let the team develop.

Maybe in a year or two they will be ready to mortgage the future for instant help, but they are not at that stage yet.

I generally prefer that approach as well, but I've heard this is a weak draft, and Fiala is only 25, and Dumba is just 27, so I would expect them to both be long term contributors

Maybe I'm wrong, but I would think Dumba + Fiala will produce more on-ice value over the next 7 years than whoever the Sabres draft with those 3 1st rd picks

And hopefully I am wrong, I hate seeing GMs swing and miss on their picks

 

[Irie]

I generally prefer that approach as well, but I've heard this is a weak draft, and Fiala is only 25, and Dumba is just 27, so I would expect them to both be long term contributors

Maybe I'm wrong, but I would think Dumba + Fiala will produce more on-ice value over the next 7 years than whoever the Sabres draft with those 3 1st rd picks

And hopefully I am wrong, I hate seeing GMs swing and miss on their picks

Timing is everything when changing gears from draft and develop to target holes and trade.

I think it would be wise to continue to roll with Dahlin, Sameulsson, Jokiharju and Power as a top four. They are all 22 or younger, and have shown to be effective, and they have not even begun to scratch the surface of their prime potential.

This team isn't contending for a cup this year, even with Fiala and Dumba, so they can afford to be patient.

Find some goaltending and see what the team looks like with another season of the young guys making progress.

From a forward persepctive, It is my opinion that up front they are in need of more physical forwards in their top 9 if they don't want to get steamrolled in the postseason once they make it. Fiala does not really bring anything they are seriously lacking, so I question the logic of giving up a lot of assets for a player that plays the way he does.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Timing is everything when changing gears from draft and develop to target holes and trade.

I think it would be wise to continue to roll with Dahlin, Sameulsson, Jokiharju and Power as a top four. They are all 22 or younger, and have shown to be effective, and they have not even begun to scratch the surface of their prime potential.

This team isn't contending for a cup this year, even with Fiala and Dumba, so they can afford to be patient.

Find some goaltending and see what the team looks like with another season of the young guys making progress.

From a forward persepctive, It is my opinion that up front they are in need of more physical forwards in their top 9 if they don't want to get steamrolled in the postseason once they make it. Fiala does not really bring anything they are seriously lacking, so I question the logic of giving up a lot of assets for a player that plays the way he does.

One could make the argument that Buffalo is lacking a high-end, high-skill offensive forward.

 

[Irie]

One could make the argument that Buffalo is lacking a high-end, high-skill offensive forward.

Fiala is not what puts Buffalo over the hump.

Olofsson scored 20 goals and he couldn't even shoot the puck for half the season due to a nagging injury.

Skinner had 33.

Thompson had 38

They have Quinn coming in who had 26G 61P in 45 games in Rochester.

On the wing they have Skinner, Olofson, Quinn, Asplund, Tuch, Peterka and Krebs or Cozens.

Don't get me wrong, Fiala is a good winger, but Buffalo is not desperate for a Winger requiring a huge contract while they are still in the development stage and trying to sort out what they have in all these young players.

Anyone that watches the team that doesn't say they need some size and grit added to this group is not being honest. I really like this core, but I have no illusions, they are likely to get manhandled their first trip to the playoffs, and if they hope to have playoff success, they are going to have to infuse some grit and physicality into this group.

While Fiala might be a better version of their current wingers, he is still a small, perimeter winger that does not play a physical game. He just is not really what they need.

They would be much better served overspending in free agency and saving all their 1st round picks than overpaying and then overspending on RFA Fiala to convince him to sign long term in Buffalo.

 

[PatLaFontaineASMR]

One could make the argument that Buffalo is lacking a high-end, high-skill offensive forward.

We are lacking a top 6 center. Fiala isn't that. It doesn't really make any sense for us to go after him.

 

[Digitalbooya]

Buffalo has finally shown the ability to draft and develop high end prospects.

I'm not convinced this is true. However, I believe in Don Granato based on what I saw from him coaching at Wisconsin.

 

[tsujimoto74]

Buffalo <-- Fiala (extended), Dumba (extended)

Minnesota <-- #9, #16, #28


Sabres get a 1st line calibre winger, and a top pairing calibre Dman

Minnesota add 3 1st round picks without having to take back any salary

Yeah that's gonna be a hard no from me.

 

[57special]

7th overall + Ridley Greig? would that do it? really don't want to lose Pinto and swapping Zub for Dumba doesn't address anything on the D side for OTT. Would also be willing to throw in one of Thomson/JBD as well.

I would do it as a Wild fan, but I fear that Guerin might be locked in getting a player who can play now to get the most out of the Kaprizov years. I also don’t know how much money OTT is willing to spend on a Fiala deal.
Basically, I think a 7oa + Grieg is fair, though.