Kesler puts Detroit on a list of teams he'd like to be traded to | UPD: Kesler to ANA

[Zetterberg4Captain]

kuklaskorner.com/tmr/comments/red-wings-afternoon-news-on-mattias-backman-fan-loyalty-chit-chat-and-alumn

that is exactly what we should do

as much as kesler would be nice we could get an equally offensively contributing forward for free in ufa if need be with cammy, moulson, iggy, all available

fix the defence once and for all and we have a chance to make some noise, dont do that and we're good as out after no more then 6 first rd playoff games

 

[Winger98]

that is exactly what we should do

as much as kesler would be nice we could get an equally offensively contributing forward for free in ufa if need be with cammy, moulson, iggy, all available

fix the defence once and for all and we have a chance to make some noise, dont do that and we're good as out after no more then 6 first rd playoff games

Yeah, I'm not getting why would pursue a trade for a forward at this point, either. Maybe later in the summer, if we were really looking for a specific piece and missed in free agency, but until some guys start signing the UFA crop is still pretty decent.

I don't think we need a long term D fix, though. We know we can have a chance at a cup only for as long as we know we have Z&D, imo. While I'd like the security of getting someone we can build the blueline around for the next 5-8 years, I also don't mind a two year fix. Especially if it doesn't cost us assets and we can slide the kids into the lineup and see if maybe we can hit a homerun that way.

 

[Flowah]

kuklaskorner.com/tmr/comments/red-wings-afternoon-news-on-mattias-backman-fan-loyalty-chit-chat-and-alumn

Why is he so light? 170 at 6'2? Jeebus.

 

[Frk It]

Why is he so light? 170 at 6'2? Jeebus.

Don't know if that's an old number or not? Seems off.

Regardless. We really should encourage these European kids to come over to the US for some kind of off season training programs.

Seems like they don't really put on weight during their summers in Europe.

 

[sully6one]

He looks closer to 180. Either way he looks thicker than DeKeyser and he holds his own.

 

[Zetterberg4Captain]

Yeah, I'm not getting why would pursue a trade for a forward at this point, either. Maybe later in the summer, if we were really looking for a specific piece and missed in free agency, but until some guys start signing the UFA crop is still pretty decent.

I don't think we need a long term D fix, though. We know we can have a chance at a cup only for as long as we know we have Z&D, imo. While I'd like the security of getting someone we can build the blueline around for the next 5-8 years, I also don't mind a two year fix. Especially if it doesn't cost us assets and we can slide the kids into the lineup and see if maybe we can hit a homerun that way.

yah for sure i get the reason why we dont want to expend assets when we can hopefully find the same within our system but, generally speaking quality top pairing dmen who can log 25 mins and put up 40 plus pts consistently are few and far between in this league so i would wager such a player does not exist in our system that we can comfortably hedge our bets on.

i mean should one come up one day then at that point we can look to move a player or two to free up cap space and roster room from a position of strength

my fear is we sign a dan boyle for two years and still accomplish nothing, waste 2 of datsyuks final 3 years only to find our sproul or ouellete or marchenko or backman are not yet or ever going to be such a player(like i described above) and then what? then do we make a move and if so what would be the point given any window of success with the eurotwins would be all but gone

 

[Chance on Chance]

yah for sure i get the reason why we dont want to expend assets when we can hopefully find the same within our system but, generally speaking quality top pairing dmen who can log 25 mins and put up 40 plus pts consistently are few and far between in this league so i would wager such a player does not exist in our system that we can comfortably hedge our bets on.

i mean should one come up one day then at that point we can look to move a player or two to free up cap space and roster room from a position of strength

my fear is we sign a dan boyle for two years and still accomplish nothing, waste 2 of datsyuks final 3 years only to find our sproul or ouellete or marchenko or backman are not yet or ever going to be such a player(like i described above) and then what? then do we make a move and if so what would be the point given any window of success with the eurotwins would be all but gone

Agree, Were at an awkward stage right now. No put us over the top FA or openly available Dmen. I'd prefer to run with the rookies and hope they surprise or at least let us know where we stand going forward on D

 

[Retire91]

Agree, Were at an awkward stage right now. No put us over the top FA or openly available Dmen. I'd prefer to run with the rookies and hope they surprise or at least let us know where we stand going forward on D

Me too I am with you on this

 

[joe89]

Don't know if that's an old number or not? Seems off.

Regardless. We really should encourage these European kids to come over to the US for some kind of off season training programs.

Seems like they don't really put on weight during their summers in Europe.

Scandinavians typically hit puberty later, so that's a factor especially close around draft age. And the second reason is that the big ice requires other attributes than extra lbs.

 

[evolutionbaby]

I havent really watched Kesler much lately but would acquiring him not help the defense? He was a Selke winner and two time runner up.

 

[ArGarBarGar]

I havent really watched Kesler much lately but would acquiring him not help the defense? He was a Selke winner and two time runner up.

If you are expecting your forwards to compensate for a poor defensive unit, you are doing it wrong.

 

[XxTatar21SaucexX]

I wouldn't trade for Kesler. Too many assets, some with a potentially higher ceiling, would be involved. As many others said, the focus should be on the blue line.

 

[Winger98]

yah for sure i get the reason why we dont want to expend assets when we can hopefully find the same within our system but, generally speaking quality top pairing dmen who can log 25 mins and put up 40 plus pts consistently are few and far between in this league so i would wager such a player does not exist in our system that we can comfortably hedge our bets on.

i mean should one come up one day then at that point we can look to move a player or two to free up cap space and roster room from a position of strength

my fear is we sign a dan boyle for two years and still accomplish nothing, waste 2 of datsyuks final 3 years only to find our sproul or ouellete or marchenko or backman are not yet or ever going to be such a player(like i described above) and then what? then do we make a move and if so what would be the point given any window of success with the eurotwins would be all but gone

valid fear, but we don't know how well a traded player will work out for us, either. For example, look at how long it took Goligoski to really settle in Dallas and start producing how they expected him to, and how Burns was moved to forward in San Jose rather than played on the blueline.

Also, I'm leery of what teams are asking for us. I don't want to get into another Jarnkrok debate, but we did pay a premium for Legwand. But on top of that, look at the reported offers Calgary turned down from us. For the longest time, it was rumored we offered Sheahan, Jurco, 2nd for J-Bo. Now it's reported that Nyquist and Tatar may have been brought up in that discussion as well. Vancouver reportedly wanted four pieces from us for Edler. I know people want to string Holland up, but it looks like teams ask a premium from us that they don't ask from other teams.

Aside from the pay, I wouldn't want to be in Holland's shoes this summer.

 

[Bench]

I know people want to string Holland up, but it looks like teams ask a premium from us that they don't ask from other teams.

That's because the Wings "premium" players are 2nd rounders and project players. The only bluechipper they have is Mantha. Maybe Mrazek, but goalies, who knows.

So if you're a GM trading with Detroit, I kinda get that. Sure a guy like Nyquist was groomed in the mold of Zetterberg, a glove fit for Red Wing hockey, but who is to say that pans out in Calgary.

Unless you're drafting players with a lot of hype around them, you're not going to see big returns on them until they show something at the NHL level. Of course if they show something at the NHL level, that's probably in the best interest they remain in Detroit.

 

[Winger98]

That's because the Wings "premium" players are 2nd rounders and project players. The only bluechipper they have is Mantha. Maybe Mrazek, but goalies, who knows.

So if you're a GM trading with Detroit, I kinda get that. Sure a guy like Nyquist was groomed in the mold of Zetterberg, a glove fit for Red Wing hockey, but who is to say that pans out in Calgary.

Unless you're drafting players with a lot of hype around them, you're not going to see big returns on them until they show something at the NHL level. Of course if they show something at the NHL level, that's probably in the best interest they remain in Detroit.

If the GMs are still looking at draft position for these guys two, three, years after the draft, they aren't doing their job, imo. Nyquist wasn't a blue chip prospect when he was drafted, but scouts would have probably been saying otherwise the past couple of years while he was in GR.

I think Calgary took a lesser offer from St. Louis, and Vancouver probably will end up taking less for Edler than what we offered. Then again, how many of those GMs have either been canned since then or stand a good chance of seeing the unemployment line within the next year?

 

[Zetterberg4Captain]

valid fear, but we don't know how well a traded player will work out for us, either. For example, look at how long it took Goligoski to really settle in Dallas and start producing how they expected him to, and how Burns was moved to forward in San Jose rather than played on the blueline.

Also, I'm leery of what teams are asking for us. I don't want to get into another Jarnkrok debate, but we did pay a premium for Legwand. But on top of that, look at the reported offers Calgary turned down from us. For the longest time, it was rumored we offered Sheahan, Jurco, 2nd for J-Bo. Now it's reported that Nyquist and Tatar may have been brought up in that discussion as well. Vancouver reportedly wanted four pieces from us for Edler. I know people want to string Holland up, but it looks like teams ask a premium from us that they don't ask from other teams.

Aside from the pay, I wouldn't want to be in Holland's shoes this summer.

yah i suppose thats true

though i sometimes wonder if the reason it seems we do or have to pay a premium is because holland isnt a good trade negotiator and other GM's simply feel they can take adavantage of him over lets say a brian burke(more of a bully)?

 

[Bench]

If the GMs are still looking at draft position for these guys two, three, years after the draft, they aren't doing their job, imo. Nyquist wasn't a blue chip prospect when he was drafted, but scouts would have probably been saying otherwise the past couple of years while he was in GR.

I think Calgary took a lesser offer from St. Louis, and Vancouver probably will end up taking less for Edler than what we offered. Then again, how many of those GMs have either been canned since then or stand a good chance of seeing the unemployment line within the next year?

That's true. But remember there's a big push for those massive Canadian-style forwards that use the body, ala Krieder or Kassian. Most of the Red Wings best prospects don't have that element to their game. I think NHL teams worry the skilled European will translate to the NHL when the 6'5" defenders are throwing their body at full speed.

Two years ago, maybe even 1 year, I bet you get more value out of Abdelkader than Nyquist.

 

[Run the Jewels]

kuklaskorner.com/tmr/comments/red-wings-afternoon-news-on-mattias-backman-fan-loyalty-chit-chat-and-alumn

Agreed, I'd take Ehrhoff over Edler since we've already been boned twice by the Nucks with regards to Edler. Don't Hassle the Hoff.

 

[Bench]

yah i suppose thats true

though i sometimes wonder if the reason it seems we do or have to pay a premium is because holland isnt a good trade negotiator and other GM's simply feel they can take adavantage of him over lets say a brian burke(more of a bully)?

I think it's more likely nobody wants to be another notch on the Red Wings belt. 20 years of success in the league would make you a little gunshy to help them out.

On top of that, I think Holland and the Wings are criminally straight shooters. Being honest and respected among your peers is a virtue, but it doesn't always maximize returns. Wouldn't seem like the Wings to embellish, withhold or downplay information... and as a consequence your returns suffer.

What I'm saying is I have my doubts the Wings have much interest in game theory.

 

[Thats My Hat]

Hmm, I just got an idea that's probably not going to be well liked, but I'm just going to say it anyways.

How would you guys feel about trading Howard and Weiss as part of a package (other players can be determined later) for Kesler and/or Edler and then see if we can sign either Miller, Hiller or even Vokoun on July 1st.

I know it's risky, but it was just a thought that occurred to me.

 

[Bench]

Hmm, I just got an idea that's probably not going to be well liked, but I'm just going to say it anyways.

How would you guys feel about trading Howard and Weiss as part of a package (other players can be determined later) for Kesler and/or Edler and then see if we can sign either Miller, Hiller or even Vokoun on July 1st.

I know it's risky, but it was just a thought that occurred to me.

Any deal that involves Weiss and has something good coming back is amazing. Truly amazing. I think Weiss needs to string together a decent half-season or so before other teams would gamble. Or the Wings would need to retain salary.

I've been vocal about moving Howard if Miller wants to play in Detroit, but that's basically the only condition I'd want him moved. Miller would need to be a lock. I wouldn't gamble on the other goalies.

In my perfect world, you get Miller for cash then flip Howard for assets. Win-win. Barring that, I think Howard is still more than capable as a starter and he's worth keeping.

 

[silkyjohnson50]

Weiss isn't moveable. And if he gets to the point that he is moveable, we'd probably no longer have reason to.

All we can do at this point is hope that he becomes a player again. If he becomes a solid 3rd line center, you take it and run. If he becomes the 2nd line center we were hoping for, look out.

But does anyone really think he's going to be better than Sheahan or Helm at this point? Let's hope.

 

[drw02]

Any deal that involves Weiss and has something good coming back is amazing. Truly amazing. I think Weiss needs to string together a decent half-season or so before other teams would gamble. Or the Wings would need to retain salary.

I've been vocal about moving Howard if Miller wants to play in Detroit, but that's basically the only condition I'd want him moved. Miller would need to be a lock. I wouldn't gamble on the other goalies.

In my perfect world, you get Miller for cash then flip Howard for assets. Win-win. Barring that, I think Howard is still more than capable as a starter and he's worth keeping.

Why would you want Miller here? He's basically another version of Jimmy Howard....aka highly inconsistent...The franchises best goalie prospect in decades is just waiting to be given a bigger role. He's already shown he can play in the NHL in his limited viewings last season. And people want to block his path with another overpaid, underperformer? I don't understand it.

 

[Bench]

Why would you want Miller here? He's basically another version of Jimmy Howard....aka highly inconsistent...The franchises best goalie prospect in decades is just waiting to be given a bigger role. He's already shown he can play in the NHL in his limited viewings last season. And people want to block his path with another overpaid, underperformer? I don't understand it.

Well, if I thought Miller was another version of Howard, that wouldn't make much sense, would it? I think he's better. That's why I'd want him here. I like upgrades. Ultimately, though, I wouldn't worry too much about it. The odds the Wings can both move Howard and sign Miller are quite slim. I just like talking about it during a slow part of the year.

As for Mrazek, it's going to take more than 400 minutes for me to anoint him an NHL starter. I've seen plenty of top goalie prospects not pan out. He's on track, no question, but it's not a sure thing. And Miller is at an age where he wouldn't block Mrazek forever...

Mrazek fans should really be hoping trade talks for Howard start to develop, because Howard is signed until 2019. Mrazek will turn 27 when Howard's contract runs out.

 

[RedWingsDad]

I havent really watched Kesler much lately but would acquiring him not help the defense? He was a Selke winner and two time runner up.

Yes, he would help us on defense... seems like exact type of forward we look for and try to cultivate.