Confirmed with Link: Keith Jones actually set to be named real life part-time President of Hockey Operations, Danny Briere full-time GM

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Hollywood Cannon

I'm Away From My Desk
Jul 17, 2007
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It's insane that this is how they choose to run a gigantic business, but even more insane how predictable it all is. Like, there isn't anything Charlie said that someone on here didn't postulate months ago.
Litrilly one of the things that i've said for months is that in order for this to be an actual competent rebuild the new President and GM need to have the ability to fire the coach and pick their own if they wanted to.

The Flyers organization couldn't even clear that bar.
 

Larry44

#FlyersPerpetualMediocrity
Mar 1, 2002
12,178
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Can't wait for Torts to force Briere to draft someone like Stramel at 7th, just because he knows he can turn him into a grinder.
Torts wants grinders. Jones is fixated on fixing the D. Briere's best options at 7 are surely to be a forward. Draft day three-way wrestling should be fun, until Flahrsy jumps on the pile!
 

Rebels57

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Dubas is available and we just hired Briere and our f***ing color commentator.

Might not be a popular opinion here, but I don't think Dubas is some wunderkind like everyone else. I think he's pretty average. Didn't really handle the extensions for their top guys all that well, hasn't been able to solidify their goaltending, has made some questionable depth additions over the years. He's way better than what we have had in recent years, but that's not hard lol

Either way, he said either Toronto or he's taking the year off...so I guess he's taking the year off.
 

BernieParent

In misery of redwings of suckage for a long time
Mar 13, 2009
25,190
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It sure is a world of pure imagination for some.
Unfortunately, we have heard too much of:

iu
 

FatTugboatFlahr

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Apr 6, 2012
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Might not be a popular opinion here, but I don't think Dubas is some wunderkind like everyone else. I think he's pretty average. Didn't really handle the extensions for their top guys all that well, hasn't been able to solidify their goaltending, has made some questionable depth additions over the years. He's way better than what we have had in recent years, but that's not hard lol

Either way, he said either Toronto or he's taking the year off...so I guess he's taking the year off.
I just find it interesting how a GM who is clearly above average, is so easily being let go, but it takes a minor miracle for us to fire a coach or GM, who have essentially zero big wins in 15 years.
 

Hollywood Cannon

I'm Away From My Desk
Jul 17, 2007
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I just find it interesting how a GM who is clearly above average, is so easily being let go, but it takes a minor miracle for us to fire a coach or GM, who have essentially zero big wins in 15 years.
Dubas didn't bend the knee. He tried to make it worth his while in order for him to come back and the Leafs and Shanahan told him to get lost for not being a company man.

Sounds super familiar to how the Flyers act. *cough* Giroux *cough*
 

Magua

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Might not be a popular opinion here, but I don't think Dubas is some wunderkind like everyone else. I think he's pretty average. Didn't really handle the extensions for their top guys all that well, hasn't been able to solidify their goaltending, has made some questionable depth additions over the years.

I don't know about wunderkind, but I can count on a shark bitten hand the number of people I'd rather have as my GM in the NHL. He can't control Matthews wanting a 5 year contract, which directly affected the 6 year Marner deal. It was not precedent and, good for him, was intended to maximize earnings and not be team friendly (Nylander was a good contract though). They just had the 7th best goaltending in the league, even with Matt Murray (who the Flyers should acquire as a salary dump, after they trade Hart!) Questionable depth additions doesn't even make sense to me. They were objectively very good at churning through depth and finding replacements cheaply, along with finding draft steals with little capital.

Was he perfect? Obviously not. But I think he was held to this weird standard by HockeyGuys because he was young and analytical. He built top 5 teams that could've won, and I shrug after that. I think one thing he always did well was smooth over the missteps instead of compounding them.
 

Audible Velvet

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Jul 9, 2015
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Might not be a popular opinion here, but I don't think Dubas is some wunderkind like everyone else. I think he's pretty average. Didn't really handle the extensions for their top guys all that well, hasn't been able to solidify their goaltending, has made some questionable depth additions over the years. He's way better than what we have had in recent years, but that's not hard lol

Either way, he said either Toronto or he's taking the year off...so I guess he's taking the year off.
And yet, I would have him here in a heartbeat. It would be the first addition I could feel at all good about since not sure when. Like, wow! They did something that wasn't horrible!
I don't even know where he ranks among the others, but damn, he looks great at this point.
 

Rebels57

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I don't know about wunderkind, but I can count on a shark bitten hand the number of people I'd rather have as my GM in the NHL. He can't control Matthews wanting a 5 year contract, which directly affected the 6 year Marner deal. It was not precedent and, good for him, was intended to maximize earnings and not be team friendly (Nylander was a good contract though). They just had the 7th best goaltending in the league, even with Matt Murray (who the Flyers should acquire as a salary dump, after they trade Hart!) Questionable depth additions doesn't even make sense to me. They were objectively very good at churning through depth and finding replacements cheaply, along with finding draft steals with little capital.

Was he perfect? Obviously not. But I think he was held to this weird standard by HockeyGuys because he was young and analytical. He built top 5 teams that could've won, and I shrug after that. I think one thing he always did well was smooth over the missteps instead of compounding them.

Traded a 1st and two 4ths for Foligno and Noesen at the 2021 Deadline. Foligno was having a horrendous season in Columbus at the time. He was clearly cooked and did nothing for them in the Playoffs. Noesen had a good season now but at the time had little value and also did nothing for Toronto.

Signed guys like Wayne Simmonds, Joe Thornton, Alex Galchenyuk, etc to fill out the bottom lines then watched them get skated out of the building in the playoffs.

He just traded Rasmus Sandin for the corpse of Erik Gustafsson and a late 1st. It hardly made sense to downgrade their defense in a season they were going for it.

He inherited all of their best players except Tavares, who he substantially overpaid for leading to the massive contracts for Matthews and Marner. I guess the question really is, what has he actually done to be considered one of your top 1-5 GM's in the league (depending on the severity of the shark bite)?

Don't get me wrong, he's still way better than Fletcher and about 15 other GMs..but I think the fact that he IS young and analytical makes him a darling to the anti-hockey guy crowd despite not having the credentials to back that up.

And yet, I would have him here in a heartbeat. It would be the first addition I could feel at all good about since not sure when. Like, wow! They did something that wasn't horrible!
I don't even know where he ranks among the others, but damn, he looks great at this point.

Despite everything i've said about him, I do trust he would be more capable of learning from past mistakes then some of the other guys in the GM circle jerk. He also would have been a much better option than every rumored name tied to the Flyers..and i'd feel better about him than Briere too even if his slate is clean.
 

Larry44

#FlyersPerpetualMediocrity
Mar 1, 2002
12,178
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Might not be a popular opinion here, but I don't think Dubas is some wunderkind like everyone else. I think he's pretty average. Didn't really handle the extensions for their top guys all that well, hasn't been able to solidify their goaltending, has made some questionable depth additions over the years. He's way better than what we have had in recent years, but that's not hard lol

Either way, he said either Toronto or he's taking the year off...so I guess he's taking the year off.
Not sold in Dubas either, but I am hoping Shanahan hires Chuckles!
 

Magua

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Traded a 1st and two 4ths for Foligno and Noesen at the 2021 Deadline. Foligno was having a horrendous season in Columbus at the time. He was clearly cooked and did nothing for them in the Playoffs. Noesen had a good season now but at the time had little value and also did nothing for Toronto.

Signed guys like Wayne Simmonds, Joe Thornton, Alex Galchenyuk, etc to fill out the bottom lines then watched them get skated out of the building in the playoffs.

He just traded Rasmus Sandin for the corpse of Erik Gustafsson and a late 1st. It hardly made sense to downgrade their defense in a season they were going for it.

He inherited all of their best players except Tavares, who he substantially overpaid for leading to the massive contracts for Matthews and Marner. I guess the question really is, what has he actually done to be considered one of your top 1-5 GM's in the league (depending on the severity of the shark bite)?

Don't get me wrong, he's still way better than Fletcher and about 15 other GMs..but I think the fact that he IS young and analytical makes him a darling to the anti-hockey guy crowd despite not having the credentials to back that up.

Reb, I'd love to see the 15 GMs you'd rank above Dubas and play the same game of picking out their worst moves one-by-one. I'd wager to say they're much worse without the positive offset.

The Foligno trade was absolutely bad, but that's deady logic with Chiarot somehow nulling all the good moves Zito made, along with general philosophies. I didn't like the Sandin trade -- I wanted the Flyers to draft him way back when -- but they had Reilly and Brodie on the left side with term, and they made a decision to get a late 1st round pick over play him on the 3rd pair. I don't know if that's right, but they acquired McCabe too (a good player) to fill Sandin's minutes, not Gustafsson. It's not as simple as you're making it out with "downgrading". The reality is I'm sure Dubas had to answer to his bosses too, especially when the narrative around the Leafs was: "need grit."

They objectively did a great job cycling through depth on forward and defense. Again, my point was they understood the usefulness of depth turnover and were willing to fail to succeed on that front -- and they rarely were wedded to the failures. You just wanted to cite the worst examples and not the dozen positives because they churned through a lot of guys. Galchenyuk played 32 games -- Colorado also acquired him this year. Thornton was fine on the Leafs, so I don't even get that one. He fell off the cliff the next year with.....wait for it.....Florida and Zito. How about Spezza, Mikheyev, Kerfoot, Bunting, Samsonov, Giordano, Brodie, Engvall, Jarnkrok, O'Rielly, ZAR, Kampf, Timmins, Muzzin, NAK? These were all good players, useful pro level additions, and they did it with no cap breathing room. Those don't get voided because Wayne Simmonds was signed for $900k. It's simply not reality to say they didn't kill it on that front.
 

Rebels57

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Reb, I'd love to see the 15 GMs you'd rank above Dubas and play the same game of picking out their worst moves one-by-one. I'd wager to say they're much worse without the positive offset.

The Foligno trade was absolutely bad, but that's deady logic with Chiarot somehow nulling all the good moves Zito made, along with general philosophies. I didn't like the Sandin trade -- I wanted the Flyers to draft him way back when -- but they had Reilly and Brodie on the left side with term, and they made a decision to get a late 1st round pick over play him on the 3rd pair. I don't know if that's right, but they acquired McCabe too (a good player) to fill Sandin's minutes, not Gustafsson. It's not as simple as you're making it out with "downgrading". The reality is I'm sure Dubas had to answer to his bosses too, especially when the narrative around the Leafs was: "need grit."

They objectively did a great job cycling through depth on forward and defense. Again, my point was they understood the usefulness of depth turnover and were willing to fail to succeed on that front -- and they rarely were wedded to the failures. You just wanted to cite the worst examples and not the dozen positives because they churned through a lot of guys. Galchenyuk played 32 games -- Colorado also acquired him this year. Thornton was fine on the Leafs, so I don't even get that one. He fell off the cliff the next year with.....wait for it.....Florida and Zito. How about Spezza, Mikheyev, Kerfoot, Bunting, Samsonov, Giordano, Brodie, Engvall, Jarnkrok, O'Rielly, ZAR, Kampf, Timmins, Muzzin, NAK? These were all good players, useful pro level additions, and they did it with no cap breathing room. Those don't get voided because Wayne Simmonds was signed for $900k. It's simply not reality to say they didn't kill it on that front.

You make good points and I certainly dont think hes a bad GM. Ive been clear on that. There just isnt any proof that he's anything special.

Also, he traded two 2nds and a 3rd for Giordano prior to extending him. Thats a heck of a lot for a then 38 year old at the end of his career. Most of those guys you mentioned, he paid up for. A few others like Spezza and Thornton were just willing to take cheap deals while Cup-chasing.

Speaking of Engvall, why was he traded to the Islanders at the deadline for a 3rd? A solid 3rd liner they could have used im sure. Not that it was the difference between beating Florida or not. I just think Dubas was starting to lose sight of what he wanted. I think he was burned out. He sure looked it in his presser.
 

GKJ

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Feb 27, 2002
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You make good points and I certainly dont think hes a bad GM. Ive been clear on that. There just isnt any proof that he's anything special.

Also, he traded two 2nds and a 3rd for Giordano prior to extending him. Thats a heck of a lot for a then 38 year old at the end of his career. Most of those guys you mentioned, he paid up for. A few others like Spezza and Thornton were just willing to take cheap deals while Cup-chasing.

Speaking of Engvall, why was he traded to the Islanders at the deadline for a 3rd? A solid 3rd liner they could have used im sure. Not that it was the difference between beating Florida or not. I just think Dubas was starting to lose sight of what he wanted. I think he was burned out. He sure looked it in his presser.

Giordano wouldn’t have been extended if he didn’t sign for what he did. He was taking the Jason Spezza deal.
 
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Lindberg

Bennyflyers16 get a life
Oct 5, 2013
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This organization really flopped as hard as they could have when it came to hiring people. They knew all about the negative press around hiring ex Flyers and what the hell do they do? Hire two ex Flyers and give the coach a key to the gate.

I'd love to say I'm astonished by the amount of sheer incompetence that exists in high ranking white collars jobs but I'm not. Most of the time those people are useless anyways.
 
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