Justin Holl

[Albus Dumbledore]

I hope Holl can learn a lot from Brodie and all our dmen. Holl's overall game is a bit more dynamic but the way Brodie reads the game, his active stick his defending 1 vs 1's and 2 vs 1's is uncanny.

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

TJ Brodie is getting a lot of deserved love, but we need to throw some the way of our man with the flow, Justin Holl.

 

[sittler rules!!!]

The short answer to that headline is. Yes.

Justin Holl has been the most consistent defensemen this year, and I am not too sure it is particularly close. I have been so impressed with him all year. He does so many little things, that allow our team not to have to defend at all. Plays seem to die when they go on his side of the ice in transition. His gaps are outstanding, and he seems to drive people to the corner more often than not, resulting in either a turnover or puck battle. He is a guy that reminds me so much of prime Chris Tanev. Just a calm, smooth skating, positionally sound, physical D-Man. He impressed me last year, and then kind of fizzled out a bit when he signed his ticket. But credit to him, he is earning every cent of his deal. He is getting better each game. Truly a great story. Very well deserving. You can never have too many guys like him and Hyman, who have had to scratch and claw for every bit of success they have earned.

My humble opibion only
In terms of defending as of March 04, I ranks as follows:
1) Brodie- his skating alone makes him premiere, but his IQ D wise is off the charts
2) Holl- Again can skate, is mobile, great gap and plays the one on one so well.
3) Muzzin- See Holl
4) Dermott- Has some lapses and brain cramps, but playing a bit of a nasty game - most likely because of his partner
5) Bogosian- The odd error, but in his own end, off the glass and out. Been consistent
6) Reilly- Logs the most ice time and because he has the puck all the time, does make some bad decisions. I have never been a fan of his D game.

Overall, when you watch the whole team in it's own end, there seems more structure. No more fire drills where they are hemmed in for 3 minutes

 

[Peasy]

I remember dubas being really high on Holl the year he took over. Babcock then proceeded to scratch him for nearly the entire year.

Now look at him. Kids a stud. It's like Babcock tried his best to prove dubas wrong, rather than work with him.

 

[Drytoast]

I remember dubas being really high on Holl the year he took over. Babcock then proceeded to scratch him for nearly the entire year.

Now look at him. Kids a stud. It's like Babcock tried his best to prove dubas wrong, rather than work with him.

Maybe Holl was a really gud pro.

Not to defend Babs here but defensemen do take time to ferment. Maybe Holl is a different player now then he was then? Maybe sitting for most of that year helped him strive to get better?

I dunno. One doesn't have much to do with the other.

 

[Twine Tickler]

My humble opibion only
In terms of defending as of March 04, I ranks as follows:
1) Brodie- his skating alone makes him premiere, but his IQ D wise is off the charts
2) Holl- Again can skate, is mobile, great gap and plays the one on one so well.
3) Muzzin- See Holl
4) Dermott- Has some lapses and brain cramps, but playing a bit of a nasty game - most likely because of his partner
5) Bogosian- The odd error, but in his own end, off the glass and out. Been consistent
6) Reilly- Logs the most ice time and because he has the puck all the time, does make some bad decisions. I have never been a fan of his D game.

Overall, when you watch the whole team in it's own end, there seems more structure. No more fire drills where they are hemmed in for 3 minutes

Hard to argue your rankings. In my mind everyone of our Defensmen have played great. Rielly of course is the polarizing one of the bunch for some. I really think people need to pump the breaks on him being "useless" or a "liability". He is a high risk/reward defenseman with average defensive zone abilities. But he logs a f*** ton of minutes, and generate a lot from the back end. Holl has been such a treat to watch, just does everything right it seems. Love what Derms and Bogo have brought to the table as well. I think the second Dermott realized he is better being a defense first D-man instead of a high risk puck mover he became a completely different player. Just remarkable watching his progression. at this point, I'd protect Rielly, Brodie, Holl, Dermott in expansion. If Seattle takes Muzz (which i'd imagine they would) then run the following D next year:

Rielly - Brodie
Dermott - Holl
Sandin - Liljegren
Bogo

 

[ShaneFalco]

I remember dubas being really high on Holl the year he took over. Babcock then proceeded to scratch him for nearly the entire year.

Now look at him. Kids a stud. It's like Babcock tried his best to prove dubas wrong, rather than work with him.

Exactly. Tried the same with Spezza, Leivo and Petan to an extent. Noone was telling Mikey who to play - which is part of the reason why I hope he never coaches in the NHL again

 

[Critical13]

TJ Brodie is getting a lot of deserved love, but we need to throw some the way of our man with the flow, Justin Holl.

Great post Jimmy.

I thought Holl struggled a bit in the 2nd half of February - seemed to be slower, and making some questionable decisions.

However, he's has bounced straight back into form these past few games.

I think you could make an argument that he's been our MVP on defence so far this season.

 

[Swervin81]

Exactly. Tried the same with Spezza, Leivo and Petan to an extent. Noone was telling Mikey who to play - which is part of the reason why I hope he never coaches in the NHL again

He even had the audacity to complain about the Muzzin trade, because how dare he be a left handed D.

 

[sxvnert]

Exactly. Tried the same with Spezza, Leivo and Petan to an extent. Noone was telling Mikey who to play - which is part of the reason why I hope he never coaches in the NHL again

He won't. That "interview" with Christine Simpson all but confirmed it.

 

[sxvnert]

If Seattle takes Muzz (which i'd imagine they would) then run the following D next year:

Rielly - Brodie
Dermott - Holl
Sandin - Liljegren
Bogo

Dubas is already setting the team up to protect 4x4x1.

Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Tavares
Rielly, Brodie, Muzzin, Holl
Campbell

Mikheyev is the most likely to be claimed unless Dubas offers Seattle a pick/prospects to select whoever they want (Hutchinson).

I believe Dermott doesn't need to be protected since hes not under contract:

The protection list can be either A) seven forwards, three defensemen, and one goaltender, or B) eight skaters and one goaltender. Players who have no-movement clauses have to be protected.
All first and second-year players do not need to be protected, as well as any unsigned prospects. However, teams do need to make sure that certain players are available.
Those players are:
– One defenseman who is under contract for the 2021-22 season and has played in 40 games this season or 70 games over the past two seasons.
– Two forwards who are under contract for the 2021-22 season and has played in 40 games this season or 70 games over the past two seasons.
– One goaltender who is either under contract for the 2021-22 season or is a restricted free agent (RFA) before the start of the 2021-22 season.

 

[Twine Tickler]

I believe Dermott doesn't need to be protected since hes not under contract:

It would be Dermott's rights can be claimed in expansion. He is a restricted free agent after the end of this year. So Seattle could select him and sign him, or if they cannot agree on a deal, they can move the player. That is my understanding at least.

If what i believe is true, it would be hard for me to believe seattle would select Micheyev over a 24 year old budding D-Man. But that's just my opinion. In my mind, if we plan on keeping Dermott beyond this year, we will have to protect him. I am certainly not interested in giving up assets to Seattle in place of them selecting one player over another. Not 1 trade in that fashion worked out for the team in Vegas expansion (see Marchsault, Theodore, Karlson)

 

[Stephen]

Exactly. Tried the same with Spezza, Leivo and Petan to an extent. Noone was telling Mikey who to play - which is part of the reason why I hope he never coaches in the NHL again

Honestly, I don’t mind the idea of Babcock coaching another NHL team at a sub-optimal level while creation friction with star players and management.

 

[zeke]

Dubas is already setting the team up to protect 4x4x1.

Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Tavares
Rielly, Brodie, Muzzin, Holl
Campbell

Mikheyev is the most likely to be claimed unless Dubas offers Seattle a pick/prospects to select whoever they want (Hutchinson).

I believe Dermott doesn't need to be protected since hes not under contract:

Mikheyev is exempt.

 

[Twine Tickler]

Mikheyev is exempt.

I am not trying to be a dick, this is news to me. How would Micheyev exempt?

 

[Randy Randerson]

Holl seems like he will be thought of by my kids the way I think of Todd Gill and Jamie Macoun. He will be a great bit of nostalgia, and looks like Keanu in Youngblood.

 

[Marmoset]

It would be Dermott's rights can be claimed in expansion. He is a restricted free agent after the end of this year. So Seattle could select him and sign him, or if they cannot agree on a deal, they can move the player. That is my understanding at least.

If what i believe is true, it would be hard for me to believe seattle would select Micheyev over a 24 year old budding D-Man. But that's just my opinion. In my mind, if we plan on keeping Dermott beyond this year, we will have to protect him. I am certainly not interested in giving up assets to Seattle in place of them selecting one player over another. Not 1 trade in that fashion worked out for the team in Vegas expansion (see Marchsault, Theodore, Karlson)

I believe this is correct. If the Leafs make no further moves or no arrangement with Seattle, we should expect to lose whoever we don't protect between Holl and Dermott. (Assuming 4/4/1, which I fully expect.)

Right now I would protect Holl and expose Dermott. I really like Dermott and he could very well end up having the better overall career. But - we're in win now mode. I think Holl is definitely the better defenceman today, plus he is a RD and has a great contract. Also, if we were to lose Holl to Seattle and Bogosian doesn't come back, RD starts to become a problem again.

I can't say enough how impressive Holl's leap has been after all those games being scratched. He has been a key piece of the improvement this season.

 

[Twine Tickler]

TJ Brodie is getting a lot of deserved love, but we need to throw some the way of our man with the flow, Justin Holl.

100%
Holl has been an absolute machine this year. Would have to be in consideration for most improved player in the NHL this year TBH

 

[Dekes For Days]

I am not trying to be a dick, this is news to me. How would Micheyev exempt?

Players with 2 years or less are exempt.

 

[zeke]

Holl seems like he will be thought of by my kids the way I think of Todd Gill and Jamie Macoun. He will be a great bit of nostalgia, and looks like Keanu in Youngblood.

He's my Bob Rouse.

 

[Critical13]

It would be Dermott's rights can be claimed in expansion. He is a restricted free agent after the end of this year. So Seattle could select him and sign him, or if they cannot agree on a deal, they can move the player. That is my understanding at least.

If what i believe is true, it would be hard for me to believe seattle would select Micheyev over a 24 year old budding D-Man. But that's just my opinion. In my mind, if we plan on keeping Dermott beyond this year, we will have to protect him. I am certainly not interested in giving up assets to Seattle in place of them selecting one player over another. Not 1 trade in that fashion worked out for the team in Vegas expansion (see Marchsault, Theodore, Karlson)

Agreed.
The idea of losing Mik hurts because we all love him, and he brings a great skill set to the team with his speed and tenacity. We can fill that spot, though.

It will hurt even more if we lose Dermott to this stupid expansion draft. Mik we can recover from, but we've been developing Dermott for what feels like a decade and he's finally blooming.

 

[Twine Tickler]

I believe this is correct. If the Leafs make no further moves or no arrangement with Seattle, we should expect to lose whoever we don't protect between Holl and Dermott. (Assuming 4/4/1, which I fully expect.)

Right now I would protect Holl and expose Dermott. I really like Dermott and he could very well end up having the better overall career. But - we're in win now mode. I think Holl is definitely the better defenceman today, plus he is a RD and has a great contract. Also, if we were to lose Holl to Seattle and Bogosian doesn't come back, RD starts to become a problem again.

I can't say enough how impressive Holl's leap has been after all those games being scratched. He has been a key piece of the improvement this season.

absolute protect Holl. That is non-negotiable in my mind. My theory is leave Muzz unprotected. I love Muzz as much as anyone on this board, but it might be the time to do it. I read somewhere on here that his new deal has a NMC however expansion is not included in the NMC becasue it changes to NTC after this year (select teams). So we would not need Muzz to agree, he already has. This would also free money up to resign Hyman, who in my mind has to be resigned. It also opens up a spot on the right side for timmy, who is clearly ready to take the next step. All the while not losing Derms, who the organization has put a lot of time into and is finally starting to play at a high level consistently. Would hate to see Muzz go, but that is exactly why we have organizational depth.

edit: sorry Muzz is left side, not right. But it would allow Derms to slot up the lineup

 

[Critical13]

Our expansion plans might change drastically between now and then. I still wonder what the plan is when it comes to dealing with Rielly's next contract.

 

[Twine Tickler]

Players with 2 years or less are exempt.

Nice, didnt know that. Thanks!

 

[Thissiteisgarbage]

I think we can all see - finally - that having some stay at home D is an absolute necessity.
I think Reilly is pretty expendable going into next season, tbh. Someone like Liljegren or Sandin can grow into his role eventually. I'd be more upset to see Brodie or Bogs go.