Player Discussion Juraj Slafkovsky, the high offensive potential edition.

[OnTheRun]

What the hell are you talking about? Nobody would expect him to be the best player of the rocket and one of the best player in the AHL at 18... Where are those expectations coming from and how is it a favorable argument to play him in a league he can't compete in?

Yzerman knows what's up and always say as long as you don't dominate a lower tier league, there is something to be learn. It's not sorcery, just logic.

If you want to play him 20+ minutes per game in the AHL... He kinda need to be the best player of the Rocket. If you give him the ice time; you give him the expectation and responsibilities that come with it.

Not exactly a new concept in hockey.

 

[Destopcorner]

I would imagine it comes from all the people crapping on him for never dominating a league, they would no doubt say a 1st OA player should dominate the AHL.

Well I think it's wise to say those people are wrong because overall rank has nothing to do with anything. It's a matter of learning curve and the reason why 99% of 18yo aren't ready for professional league. Once your player gets clocked 5-6 10 times, it only means he isn't aware of his surrounding, can't protect himself therefore ain't ready. Player safety first, points later.

 

[Destopcorner]

If you want to play him 20+ minutes per game in the AHL... He kinda need to be the best player of the Rocket. If you give him the ice time; you give him the expectation and responsibilities that come with it.

Not exactly a new concept in hockey.

I'm a firm believer ice time beats time on bench but you do you.

Btw what makes you think he wouldn't produce at the AHL level if given icetime and opportunity ?

 

[OnTheRun]

I'm a firm believer ice time beats time on bench but you do you.

Btw what makes you think he wouldn't produce at the AHL level if given icetime and opportunity ?

Never said that? Reformulate the question.
We're talking about the pressure that come with that ice time and his role on an AHL squad, not what he would or wouldn't do with it.

 

[417]

No that’s not the context.

First off, no matter how you want to look at it, MTL has more pressure and spotlight then Laval. The only way Laval would have more spotlight is if Mario Lemieux comes out of retirement and plays a game for the Rocket.

Then, Slaf knows the AHL is easier, like everyone else.

Which brings us to the quote.

Hughes said « Slaf would expect to produce because he is here [AHL]. What happens if he [Slaf] doesn’t… »

That is the reason he didn’t send him down!!!

That was his answer!

You've isolated a quote, one of many on the player, and decided that it was the reason they didn't send him down.

Trying to protect Slaf from himself or from something related to producing or not in a lesser league…. Which a #1 OVERALL should be able do to…. ( Otherwise, why is he 1st overall!) is a little crazy. Because a 1st overall, yes should work on a bunch of stuff…, but offence is one of them!

If you think about it, the offence and the degree to which it translates to the NHL is what separates the top players from the others!!! Why not work on that skill at least a little!!

Crazy. That is what it is.

So you think he wasn't working on his skills?

 

[Destopcorner]

Never said that? Reformulate the question.
We're talking about the pressure that come with that ice time and his role on an AHL squad, not what he would or wouldn't do with it.

He took the pressure really well when put in the spotlight as the go to guy, something he never was all year. Also i'm pretty sure management would set things right about production versus development just like they did with Roy.

 

[OnTheRun]

He took the pressure really well when put in the spotlight as the go to guy, something he never was all year. Also i'm pretty sure management would set things right about production versus development just like they did with Roy.

Either way, the setting management opted for was a low pressure role on a team with no aspiration in the NHL instead.

 

[NORiculous]

You've isolated a quote, one of many on the player, and decided that it was the reason they didn't send him down.

So you think he wasn't working on his skills?

What??

I didn’t decide it was THE reason he wasn’t sent down. Hughes was asked the question (with no ambiguity I might add) and that is THE answer HE gave.

Even it doesn’t fit YOUR narrative, you can’t change what Hughes said when answering the question because that is not what you THINK he thinks. lol

I said it earlier.

If the difference in skill is too big (which all signs are pointing too for Slaf in the NHL), the learning curve is slower.

We could see this with his play and also confirmed by advanced stats that he isn’t up too level.

 

[NORiculous]

Never said that? Reformulate the question.
We're talking about the pressure that come with that ice time and his role on an AHL squad, not what he would or wouldn't do with it.

Honestly if he can’t handle pressure in Laval… I don’t think he will survive long in MTL.

 

[OnTheRun]

Honestly if he can’t handle pressure in Laval… I don’t think he will survive long in MTL.

Not having to deal with it isn't the same as not being able to handle it.

 

[NORiculous]

Not having to deal with it isn't the same as not being able to handle it.

Ok. Let’s say I buy your argument.

What situation do you think has more pressure:

A #1 overall getting outclassed in Montreal vs.
A #1 overall most probably holding his ground and contributing to the team in Laval

?

 

[OnTheRun]

Ok. Let’s say I buy your argument.

What situation do you think has more pressure:

A #1 overall getting outclassed in Montreal vs.
A #1 overall most probably holding his ground and contributing to the team in Laval

?

Are you familiar with the concept of context? Because this isn't happening in a vacuum.

His job this year in the NHL was to get used to the NHL, that what he was tasked to according to his coach and management. He wasn't there to carry a line or the team, just getting NHL experience was the stated goal.

On an AHL squad his role would have been different, playing big minutes with the expectation of being one the best player on the squad and firsthand contribution in the team success, the pressure from within the org is higher here than in the situation above.

 

[BehindTheTimes]

I thought he looked completely lost and his IQ scares me. I didn’t see the same player as the OP.

I seen a kid who looked like he was drowning almost every night he was in the lineup.

 

[BehindTheTimes]

WTF are you talking about Sslaf averaged over 12 minutes a game in the NHL not 7-10. Atleast look shit up before making nonsense claims.

Also putting Slaf in the OHL would be beyond stupid, I would have been fine with him in the AHL but the O? He'd be the biggest player in the league by like 30lbs

He belonged in Jr. I don’t think he would have dominated there either.

 

[BehindTheTimes]

I am not arguing that its a great idea. I am arguing that its not an important factor in the outcome of a career.

Management judged that it was a good idea to expose him now to the NHL, to have him practices with the squad and be surrounded by the NHL coaches. They could live with his mistakes and its an excellent opportunity for him to learn the speed and processing of the game. An opportunity he would not have had with an NHL team who wants to play tight and compete for the playoff. You don't think its a defendable position ?

They were wrong and he should start in the AHL next year. No need to double down on this failed experiment. It’s over, it didn’t work, it’s time to adjust.

 

[SOLR]

They were wrong and he should start in the AHL next year. No need to double down on this failed experiment. It’s over, it didn’t work, it’s time to adjust.

It's not like 19 years old in the AHL is anything bad haha

 

[River Meadow]

I thought he looked completely lost and his IQ scares me. I didn’t see the same player as the OP.

I seen a kid who looked like he was drowning almost every night he was in the lineup.

If I'm being honest, I agree with you.

 

[Miller Time]

Are you familiar with the concept of context? Because this isn't happening in a vacuum.

His job this year in the NHL was to get used to the NHL, that what he was tasked to according to his coach and management. He wasn't there to carry a line or the team, just getting NHL experience was the stated goal.

On an AHL squad his role would have been different, playing big minutes with the expectation of being one the best player on the squad and firsthand contribution in the team success, the pressure from within the org is higher here than in the situation above.

Context is a difficult thing for many to grasp.

Many misread the impact of a player committed to evolving his game as "low IQ"... It's a narrative we'll keep on seeing over & over again till the fall, and worse, if Slaf shows big progression next year, rather than admit they were completely wrong, they'll double down on the poor assessment and claim his success occured despite the "mistake" made this season...

 

[River Meadow]

I hope Slafkovsky becomes a beast, because.... *gulp*

 

[BehindTheTimes]

Never said that? Reformulate the question.
We're talking about the pressure that come with that ice time and his role on an AHL squad, not what he would or wouldn't do with it.

Are we really arguing we shouldn’t send down an unready player to the minors because he may not be ready for that either, good grief. There will never be more pressure in Laval than Montreal, and even if there is, so what?

Pressure can be a good thing, that’s often how you bring out the best in someone.

 

[BehindTheTimes]

It's not like 19 years old in the AHL is anything bad haha

I don’t get it tbh. We’ve arguing about some of the poor development decisions over the last 20-30 years and there is a small group that will say anything to justify managerial decisions.

I mean arguing there is more pressure in Laval than Montreal, haha. I’ve heard them all for Slaf. I still think we got a good player here, he’s just going to need some time.

He’s not close to being NHL rdy. I never thought I’d see ppl agree that he’s not NHL ready, but defending that he needs to be here because there is less pressure than other leagues. It’s batshit crazy, the lengths some will goto in order todefend anything and everything management does.

 

[Breakfast of Champs]

I hope Slafkovsky becomes a beast, because.... *gulp*

Yeah , we messed up ... Cooley is better and it's not even close , that he looks like he could be something like a Marner or Hughes type offensively which would have been an amazing get for the Habs.

I have to say though that I'm far from low on Slaf, I still think he's got a unique skillset that can translate to being a very effective player at the NHL level especially in the playoffs.

But man, Cooley is just so skilled , we whiffed massively on KK on tkachuk this one would be another huge blow if he doesn't become a really good top 6er at the very least because Cooley is almost surely going to be putting up 70+ pts within 2-3 years

 

[PhysicX]

For the wrong reason according to you... of course.

The idea of keeping him in a low pressure environment in the NHL where he doesn't even need to be the best player on his line as opposed to the AHL where he kinda need to the best player of the Rocket and arguably one of the best player of the league is not without merit.

His confidence is fine because he knows and understand what the org wants from him at this stage of his career and the org supported him so far, not because he is oblivious to his achievement.

And seriously if he is the precious little flower whose confidence get destroyed after less than 4 months in the NHL, as some people make him to be. He needs to be traded, yesterday, you cannot work with something that brittle at that level.

Slafkovsky was 18 years old. You expect 18-year-olds to have the same mental fortitude and capacity to overcome obstacles as 25-30 year-olds?

 

[SOLR]

I don’t get it tbh. We’ve arguing about some of the poor development decisions over the last 20-30 years and there is a small group that will say anything to justify managerial decisions.

I mean arguing there is more pressure in Laval than Montreal, haha. I’ve heard them all for Slaf. I still think we got a good player here, he’s just going to need some time.

He’s not close to being NHL rdy. I never thought I’d see ppl agree that he’s not NHL ready, but defending that he needs to be here because there is less pressure than other leagues. It’s batshit crazy, the lengths some will goto in order todefend anything and everything management does.

They want to believe they know better, it's a reassuring feeling.

 

[NORiculous]

Are you familiar with the concept of context? Because this isn't happening in a vacuum.

His job this year in the NHL was to get used to the NHL, that what he was tasked to according to his coach and management. He wasn't there to carry a line or the team, just getting NHL experience was the stated goal.

On an AHL squad his role would have been different, playing big minutes with the expectation of being one the best player on the squad and firsthand contribution in the team success, the pressure from within the org is higher here than in the situation above.

The context is that it was pretty clear Slaf couldn’t do his (learning) job this year. That’s what a lot of people saw and that’s what his advanced stats confirm ( he was over his head).

That’s also why Hughes was asked if he thought about sending him down. Not just a few on HFB saw this.

The context is also that we didn’t see much progress from Slafkovsky during his stay. He doesn’t do something much better then he did at the beginning of the year. His progression is slow.

Some might say that big guys take longer and they would be right. But that doesn’t mean that trying to get the best out of him isn’t important.

Normally, players that get a cup of coffee of the NHL are being tested to see how far off they are from being able to hold their own. If they are close, the testing can last longer. If they are far, the testing doesn’t last very long. Then they get sent down to work on what they need to work on.

MSL hanged on to him for a little too long, and the context of the team being injured like never before caught up to Slaf.

What we don’t know is if Slaf’s dim light is outside of the ice. Was that one of the elements that made management want to keep him. He was supposed to have great character, so this shouldn’t be a problem but we don’t know. So context is we don’t know everything.

Talking about context when just about every stats and observation we have is pointing in the same direction, while trying to make it sound like the « special » thing not everyone sees correctly, is pretty weak argument and pretty out of context.