Junior players not loaned to the WJCs by their NHL team.

[Paxon]

Better? Come on....

At least people shouldn't be acting like RNH's performance blew Forsberg's and Teravainen's out of the water, ditto for a few guys from his own tournament, namely some guys from the victorious American squad. RNH was certainly a top player in the tournament and racked up points, but outside of a couple games I don't think he really dominated the action to the point where you sit back and say it was the most dominant WJC performance of the past few years.

 

[BusQuets]

I'm not really going to get into this argument, I could careless who is better, and I like Forsberg way more than Nuge, but there are lots of scoring leaders who put up the majority of their points against the weaker teams.

Forsberg put up 10 of his 12 points against Norway, Switzerland, and Slovakia.

Kuznetsov a couple years back scored 9 of his 13 points against Latvia. The other 4 came against Canada in the semis, so good for him there, but he went pointless in 5 other games.

Lots of good players have good tournaments by piling on the weaker teams.

I'm not sure but i think Teravainen scored pretty well in the sudden death games.

 

[Canada4Gold]

I'm not sure but i think Teravainen scored pretty well in the sudden death games.

yeah, he was pretty consistent through, my point was that it's easier to put up points on the weaker teams so Nuge isn't really an exception, he's the rule. Lots of good players do that

 

[BusQuets]

yeah, he was pretty consistent through, my point was that it's easier to put up points on the weaker teams so Nuge isn't really an exception, he's the rule. Lots of good players do that

Yeah no doubt about it.

 

[leafsfuture]

Biggest stat padding was 2 years ago -- the Finns crashed and didnt make it out of the group stages. They went to the Relegation zone and thats when Teravainen, Granlun, Armia and Barkov took over.

The first 3 players ended the tourny top 5 in scoring

 

[Davebo*]

Hate to break it to you, but age is the only consideration and restriction for this tournament. It is officially a U20 tournament, i.e. players under the age of 20... this is not a tournament exclusively for players playing in junior leagues.

It's not the only consdieration for teams with established young players. They 'considered' that he was of an age - then they 'considered' that he's a regular - and very important - member of their NHL team. Age be damned - no one would release McKinnon in his 2nd year.

Let's put it this way - not one single member of Hockey Canada expected McKinnon to be available.

 

[1Gold Standard]

It's not the only consdieration for teams with established young players. They 'considered' that he was of an age - then they 'considered' that he's a regular - and very important - member of their NHL team. Age be damned - no one would release McKinnon in his 2nd year.

Let's put it this way - not one single member of Hockey Canada expected McKinnon to be available.

I didn't expect him either...

but your take on this tournament as a tournament strictly for players still playing in junior leagues is incorrect.

 

[JackSlater]

Saw this in Friedman's latest 30 thoughts column.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/30-thoughts-cory-sarich-wants-one-more-shot-at-nhl/

"Sometimes I wonder if NHL teams take the heat for players who don’t want to go to the world juniors because they prefer to keep their big-league spot, or had a bad experience in previous year(s)."

Not that is matter all that much, but I can see this being true many years. Some players like Seguin and Horvat have implied their preference to just stay in the NHL (dancing around it a bit to avoid pissing many fans off) and I could see the bad experience aspect being applicable to someone like Drouin. Not necessarily saying that those thoughts apply this year, but it makes sense.

 

[UsernameWasTaken]

Saw this in Friedman's latest 30 thoughts column.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/30-thoughts-cory-sarich-wants-one-more-shot-at-nhl/

"Sometimes I wonder if NHL teams take the heat for players who don’t want to go to the world juniors because they prefer to keep their big-league spot, or had a bad experience in previous year(s)."

Not that is matter all that much, but I can see this being true many years. Some players like Seguin and Horvat have implied their preference to just stay in the NHL (dancing around it a bit to avoid pissing many fans off) and I could see the bad experience aspect being applicable to someone like Drouin. Not necessarily saying that those thoughts apply this year, but it makes sense.

I don't know whether that applies to Burakovsky or not, but the sentiment isn't surprising. I've long said people here seriously exaggerate how much an NHL player wants to leave his team for WJC. I think most don't...once they've made the NHL they want to be there, not at a U20 tournament.

 

[habsrule4eva3089]

I don't know whether that applies to Burakovsky or not, but the sentiment isn't surprising. I've long said people here seriously exaggerate how much an NHL player wants to leave his team for WJC. I think most don't...once they've made the NHL they want to be there, not at a U20 tournament.

[mod]

I mean why play in much more important games with millions and millions of viewers World wide tuning in, when you can play in the NHL for a 6 game stretch where games in Buffalo and Tampa Bay will apparently help develop you more.

It's outstanding to think people think playing 6 games in the NHL during WJC time will benefit a player more than playing in an International tournament.

It's the stage of the event that develops an athlete, and the WJC stage is a much much grander one than the NHL regular season.

 

[Urbanskog]

Edmonton is a classless organization

 

[UsernameWasTaken]

[mod]

I mean why play in much more important games with millions and millions of viewers World wide tuning in, when you can play in the NHL for a 6 game stretch where games in Buffalo and Tampa Bay will apparently help develop you more.

It's outstanding to think people think playing 6 games in the NHL during WJC time will benefit a player more than playing in an International tournament.

It's the stage of the event that develops an athlete, and the WJC stage is a much much grander one than the NHL regular season.

I'd be really interested to know all the non-Canadian players who are dying to leave the NHL to go play at world juniors. Last year, Lindholm didn't seem overjoyed and wjc was in his own country. Zadorov said this year that he didn't want to go. IIRC, Nichuskin wasn't interested last year.

I think the belief that all of the junior eligible players in the NHL are anxious to leave their teams is one that exists mainly in the minds of the fans.

Your post is mainly your own opinion of what is best for a player's development. It doesn't speak to what the players themselves actually believe.

 

[xxxx]

[mod]

I mean why play in much more important games with millions and millions of viewers World wide tuning in, when you can play in the NHL for a 6 game stretch where games in Buffalo and Tampa Bay will apparently help develop you more.

It's outstanding to think people think playing 6 games in the NHL during WJC time will benefit a player more than playing in an International tournament.

It's the stage of the event that develops an athlete, and the WJC stage is a much much grander one than the NHL regular season.

1) playing the NHL is a huge step forward in any player's career. I don't understand what is confusing here.
2) I am personally for making the players somehow available, but you cannot force it imo. If they don't want, they don't. And the only players imo who really rather stay in the NHL are the ones who already have played at the WJrs (Drouin would've been there for a third time, Horvat 2nd time, etc.) For example, Anthony Duclair is pretty excited about this opportunity. Because it's his first time. I really doubt to be honest that Barkov would easily go to the World Juniors and left Florida, if it was just up to him, I really doubt it.
3) No fan, or at least I haven't seen/heard anyone, is claiming that playing 6-8 another NHL games will necessarily help you to develop more than world junior games.

 

[Canada4Gold]

It's not the only consdieration for teams with established young players. They 'considered' that he was of an age - then they 'considered' that he's a regular - and very important - member of their NHL team. Age be damned - no one would release McKinnon in his 2nd year.

Let's put it this way - not one single member of Hockey Canada expected McKinnon to be available.

That's not hockey Canada saying that though, that's Colarado. If an NHL team is willing to release a player of Mac's caliber you'll be damned well sure HC would put him on the team.

The argument was what hockey Canada considers, and they're going to pick the best team available to them of the U20 players, NHL experiance or stardom or not as long as they're available

 

[Atas2000]

Imagine MacKinnon playing in WJC this year, lol. Scary.

Nichushkin and Zadorov aren't scrubs either, you know. It is what it is every year. The best are normally in the NHL already by that time and don't play in the WJC.

The lockout year was huge, because all of them were available.

 

[Atas2000]

Why is McKinnon being listed? He ceased to be a Jr level player when he was signed in Colorado. No one who's played a full season in the NHL should be considered Jr's eligible.

Age is not the only consideration.

It is age by the rules of the tournament. That's what matters. MacKinnon is eligible by the rules so he is listed.

I think the problem here is the popularity of the tournament which has grown a great deal in recent years. People stopped seeing it as just some junior tournament and seriously care for their team to win. also casual fans don't realize the huge difference in class between any junior game and the game in the big league. Still you have to look at the development value. If a guy plays like 10 mins in the NHL, he'd be better off at WJC. If he's indeed a NHL regular playing major minutes it's a different story.

 

[Davebo*]

It is age by the rules of the tournament. That's what matters. MacKinnon is eligible by the rules so he is listed.

I think the problem here is the popularity of the tournament which has grown a great deal in recent years. People stopped seeing it as just some junior tournament and seriously care for their team to win. also casual fans don't realize the huge difference in class between any junior game and the game in the big league. Still you have to look at the development value. If a guy plays like 10 mins in the NHL, he'd be better off at WJC. If he's indeed a NHL regular playing major minutes it's a different story.

Sure he's eligible. However, the title of thread is discussing players not being released from their teams. Of course McKinnon wouldn't be released - he's a regular roster player for a pro league.

Eligible? Of course.

But listed as not released by Colorado? Well - Duh No team in the league would!

At some point this thread title needs to be changed from 'teams who won't release players' to ' players who are eligible. You folks should work out what's actually being discussed.

 

[JimboA]

delete

 

[Paxon]

Sure he's eligible. However, the title of thread is discussing players not being released from their teams. Of course McKinnon wouldn't be released - he's a regular roster player for a pro league.

Eligible? Of course.

But listed as not released by Colorado? Well - Duh No team in the league would!

At some point this thread title needs to be changed from 'teams who won't release players' to ' players who are eligible. You folks should work out what's actually being discussed.

Every single person reading this thread is aware there's no chance MacKinnon would be released, so I don't know why you see the need to go on and on about it as if people are not aware. He is eligible for the tournament and was not released, the same as everyone else on the list. Just because he was the least likely to be released doesn't somehow make it absurd to actually put him on the list where he belongs.

No team in the league would release Ekblad, Drouin, or Barkov, either.

 

[roto]

Sure he's eligible. However, the title of thread is discussing players not being released from their teams. Of course McKinnon wouldn't be released - he's a regular roster player for a pro league.

Most Finnish and Swedish players are also regular roster players in pro leagues. Top Finns/Swedes may relatively be more important to their team than some NHL player for his team.

It's fair to mention MacKinnon in this thread, because he is eligible but isn't released and/or doesn't want to participate. The difference is that NHL doesn't want to release its players in Olympics or WJC, and doesn't care about international tournaments in general. European pro leagues release their players and have other international breaks in the middle of the season too.

Even though it's common here to talk like WJC tournament is a "best-on-best" tournament it's not. Ironically it's the best players of the age group who specifically are not playing in WJC, because they play in NHL. The definition could be "All except best U20 players". Playing in WJC means that you're not NHL caliber at the moment.

It's also true that many NHL players likely don't even want to go to WJC. It's hard to see how could some NHL caliber U20 player develop better in WJC than in NHL. You develop when you get a proper challenge. It's not a challenge to go and dominate against kids who will likely never make to NHL, and many won't even make to top European leagues.

 

[WarriorofTime]

All these guys would rather play in nhl games than a children's tournament. I think the competitor in these guys view it as some kind of personal failing to get released for this thing.

 

[WarriorofTime]

Is Canada still doing that thing where they claim theyd win every year with each game being 5-0 or more? I thought 2013 taught everyone that it depends on the year...

 

[New User Name]

Is Canada still doing that thing where they claim theyd win every year with each game being 5-0 or more? I thought 2013 taught everyone that it depends on the year...

yep all of Canada is. I personally phoned them all this morning and that's what they told me.

 

[New User Name]

I'll never forget when Justin Faulk (an American) was asked what if Carolina released him to play in the world juniors.

He said "it would be an honour and a privilege to play for my country"

When Tyler Seguin was asked the same question, his response was something like I dreamed of playing in the NHL and that's where I want to be.

Then there was American Eric Johnson who said he was going to ask his agent to put in his contract that he be able to play in the next world juniors so he could represent his country.
It didn't happen but the fact he said it speaks volumes.

 

[OttawaRoughRiderFan*]

...2013 taught everyone that it depends on the year...

Still amazed that team finished so poorly. Damn Dougie Hamilton was great for the Ice Dogs, terrific for the Bruins, but as soon as he puts on a Hockey Canada jerseys...