Prospect Info: Joshua Roy Part 2

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Scriptor

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Jan 1, 2014
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Completely different management team and they did bring him up for two games and again at the end of the season for the playoffs.

People who parrott the nonsense of leaving players in the AHL for an entire season regardless of how well they play just don't understand what development actually is.

Roy is also a tricky player to evaluate as he will likely be better off playing with better players and might even be more productive in the NHL than in the AHL. I am totally on board with him starting in Laval and staying there until he can sustain a level of play for an extended period of time that justifies a move to the big club. I don't think calling him up after a spike in production is the wisest move but to keep him somewhere that he has outgrown is also a mistake. You always want to challenge young prospects without putting them over their heads. There comes a point where some players are better off developing at the highest level instead of exploiting the weaknesses of lower levels that they have figured out. This is where bad habits can form and non translatable patterns and tactics are unnecessarily embedded into their game.
Roy is also a tricky player to evaluate as he will likely be better off playing with better players and might even be more productive in the NHL than in the AHL.

Why?

I don't think calling him up after a spike in production is the wisest move but to keep him somewhere that he has outgrown is also a mistake.

Agree that a spike in play that, for all we know, could be based on a stretch of games against weaker opposition, is a bad indicator of when to call up a player, but it has been the way to go, promoting players on a good run. A spike, in production, followed by consistent play at that leveller a longer stretch is, arguably, the best time to call up a prospect, when confidence is up, for starters, and when the player has figured put a way to produce regularly.

When is the time where the player has outgrown his current environment and when does it become a risk for his development to keep him there?

Some players plateau at the AHL level, where they kill that league, and as soon as they take the step up to the NHL,lots of birds reheard chirping and prairie dust balls roll across the ice when they are there.

The step up always a turning point.Either it presents itself as a wall, or as slingshot onto better days.
 
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26Mats

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Jun 23, 2018
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Completely different management team and they did bring him up for two games and again at the end of the season for the playoffs.

People who parrott the nonsense of leaving players in the AHL for an entire season regardless of how well they play just don't understand what development actually is.

Roy is also a tricky player to evaluate as he will likely be better off playing with better players and might even be more productive in the NHL than in the AHL. I am totally on board with him starting in Laval and staying there until he can sustain a level of play for an extended period of time that justifies a move to the big club. I don't think calling him up after a spike in production is the wisest move but to keep him somewhere that he has outgrown is also a mistake. You always want to challenge young prospects without putting them over their heads. There comes a point where some players are better off developing at the highest level instead of exploiting the weaknesses of lower levels that they have figured out. This is where bad habits can form and non translatable patterns and tactics are unnecessarily embedded into their game.

If Tanner Pearson is too vanilla, he may find himself with Armia in Laval. A lot of young guys will be pushing for his spot.
 
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NotProkofievian

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Nov 29, 2011
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Roy is also a tricky player to evaluate as he will likely be better off playing with better players and might even be more productive in the NHL than in the AHL.

Why?

Yeah, I don't think people will end up saying that about Roy. Why? Because Roy will actually produce.
 

dcyhabs

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May 30, 2008
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Montreal
I think he will produce but he may excel even more playing with linemates who understand the game at his level.

I personally think he is a better fit in Montreal than Slaf although both should start in the AHL.
Exactly. You have players with individual skills, Isaac Howard was evaluated this way, guys who do best grabbing the puck and deking guys. It looks great in junior but it gets really hard to do in higher leagues.

Players who understand the game well will make plays that lower level players don’t expect and often can’t complete. They do better playing with good offensive players. It’s one of many reasons putting Leblanc on the third line in the AHL was so bad.
 
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DAChampion

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May 28, 2011
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t’s one of many reasons putting Leblanc on the third line in the AHL was so bad.

Lefebvre wanted to develop Hagel and Stortini, who got a lot of PP time.

Fortunately, that won't be an issue with Houle. People assumed JF Houle was a moron because of who his father is and because he was hired by Bergevin, but he seems to be doing ok as an AHL coach.

Roy will probably get good minutes, including minutes in all situations.
 

salbutera

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Sep 10, 2019
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Lefebvre wanted to develop Hagel and Stortini, who got a lot of PP time.

Fortunately, that won't be an issue with Houle. People assumed JF Houle was a moron because of who his father is and because he was hired by Bergevin, but he seems to be doing ok as an AHL coach.

Roy will probably get good minutes, including minutes in all situations.
Those people should realize Houle’s relationship w Hughes goes back 30+ years - Houle was a student at Hughes bros hockey camp and he was handed the program by them, taking over coaching duties & running the program
 

salbutera

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Sep 10, 2019
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@DAChampion @salbutera I don't follow Laval religiously but you guys are totally right I figured Houle was a total doofus just by being associated with bargain bin , thanks for the extra info I did not know he was a Hughes guy as well
The usual suspects in hockey ops all have long standing relationships with Gorton and/or Hughes:

Lapointe, Houle, Boullion, Ramage etc. all are “HuGo guys”, just because they were hired by MB doesn’t make them incompetent, nor will HuGo simply can them because they were w the previous administration
 

jfm133

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Nov 6, 2015
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It's incredible the stuff we can read here. Most of the scouting staff of the team is still the one Bergevin/Timmins hired, the AHL coach is the same, two assistants of MSL were hired by Ducharme, the third one left to be head coach for the Blackhawks.

But to get back to the topic of this thread, Roy is improving and maturing the way I was hoping for when I wanted the Habs to take him at the end of the second round that year. They took Kidney and Kapanen instead. Since his draft Roy improved on all his weaknesses, but he still has that high end offensive talent.

HuGo made the right decision to send him to Laval. There is no need to have him with the Habs right now. He is still not a dynamic player on the ice, but now it's not because his skating is bad, it's because it's a cerebral player with vision on the ice. He does not need to go 100% on forecheck all the time. He has anticipation. He will never be spectacular, with him it will come in flashes of genius, a pass à la Markov, a great shot for a goal, a nice move like yesterday before his goal.
 
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LaP

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Jun 27, 2012
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Quebec City, Canada
Lefebvre wanted to develop Hagel and Stortini, who got a lot of PP time.

Fortunately, that won't be an issue with Houle. People assumed JF Houle was a moron because of who his father is and because he was hired by Bergevin, but he seems to be doing ok as an AHL coach.

Roy will probably get good minutes, including minutes in all situations.
Wanted him gone with the rest but got to admit he is doing a good job. Kids don't seem to regress uner his tutelage like it was under Sly.
 

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