Joshua Ho-Sang, Center/Right-wing, 1st Round

[BroadwayJay*]

This right here is what separates JHS from Kabanov or Schremp or PAP or any other small skilled forward that you want to bring up that hasn't done too much in the NHL. From what I have seen of him in juniors he drives the play for Windsor and then Niagara and he was looking to do so all the time. When there is a chance to breakout of the zone at 5v5 or PP his teammates are always looking to him to lead the rush and make plays. When he has the puck in the O-zone he's looking to not just beat his man or make the pass but beat his man to a dangerous spot or make a pass to create a scoring chance.

Does he need to sometimes make the safer play? Yes but what makes him so productive is his ability and willingness to make the play other players can't or won't to get chances and goals. Just look at the scrimmage. Some fans I talked to said they weren't happy that Ho-Sang probably led all players in turnovers during the game. However, he also led all players in assists too. He doesn't just make high risk plays bc they are high risk. He does it bc they are high reward. If he can start making more of his "dangerous" or "risky" passes going toward the net rather than away and shoot more when given the chance he will become much more of a net positive player than he already is and will limit the potential negative consequences of his turnovers since there will be fewer odd-man rushes against.

Just as a note, "turnover" is really of very little value. You can't turn it over if you don't have the puck. Subban, Doughty, and Burns are the "turnover" +/- leaders from last season.

I would stay away from citations of turnover volume. The most useful bit of information about turnovers is that if you have a lot of turnovers you have the puck a lot; which is good.

 

[Islesfan22]

Just saw the highlights Ho-Sang with some awesome playmaking to set up the goals.

 

[rockhouse15]

Just as a note, "turnover" is really of very little value. You can't turn it over if you don't have the puck. Subban, Doughty, and Burns are the "turnover" +/- leaders from last season.

I would stay away from citations of turnover volume. The most useful bit of information about turnovers is that if you have a lot of turnovers you have the puck a lot; which is good.

Agree. Judging turnovers are all about when, where, and how. Are you turning it over by driving towards the net and trying to hit your teammate in a tight window for a scoring chance or are you throwing the puck blindly away from the net? Are you losing the puck trying to beat a man to get into open space or scoring position or did you try to make a move around a guy after you stopped moving your feet? In both scenarios and many others one is a relatively "good" turnover while the other is "bad" but you can't find this on a stat sheet. JHS from what I've seen does much more of the "good" turnover relatively speaking and he has the assists #s to back that up.

 

[rh71]

Easily the most notable player from today's scrimmage at Twin Rinks. He carried the puck with confidence in the O-zone and even tried a spin-o-rama pass that didn't quite connect, but he's going to be a good one.

 

[Lame Lambert]

The only way he will stay with this club past two years is if a major injury happens. Manchuks, Leddy, Hamonic, CdH, Pulock, Mayfield, & Hickey. There is no more room.

The problem is that you're basing that on logic. Jay based his argument on #CapuanoLogic which would say to trade Leddy in order to retain Strait.

 

[redbull]

I like red bull, good poster. Just think he was wrong about JHS, JHS is obviously way more talented, all you have to do is watch. As far as JHS and goals, yeah I was concerned. I also feel JHS painted himself into a corner by proclaiming himself as the best player in the draft and ONLY scoring 81 points (still a wonderful season). I think talent wise, he was one of the most talented players from the 2014 season, but he needed to dominate more stats wise to live up to his own proclamation.

As far as Kabanov, you probably won't find a bigger fan, nobody wanted him to succeed and live up to his ridiculous hype more than me. BUT, I feel his ONLY talent was he was a great stick handler. He had a weak shot, was not a great skater, not even above average, not a good passer, just really not good at anything.

JHS has obvious talents. His skating and stick handling are elite, and he's an excellent playmaker, especially his passing. Goal scoring may never be his forte though, I think he will be a setup man playing wing. I think he will always have twice as many assists as goals. Which isn't a bad thing.

I like redbull too.

And point of clarification, the post that I was recently (after the scrimmage) quoted was from April, during the CHL playoffs where Ho-Sang had played well. And it was after some questioning (by the media) about Ho-Sang's commitment to defense and his defensive lapses during games. At times his commitment to a team game has been questioned.

The scrimmage means less to me than Justin Papineau's 5 goals in pre-season game not too long ago. I find that some are reading into that a bit too much. Some posters get offended when I try to temper expectations about a prospect - Ho-Sang is NOT McDavid.

I'm a huge Ho-Sang fan. I went to high-school with his father, who coaches Tennis where my kids took lessons. They are a great family, level headed and the kid has a Brett Hull like personality and there's nothing wrong with that. I think Ho-Sang still has a ways to go before he will play in the NHL. He's got the skills and the vision and hockey sense. I think his attitude won't be a problem once he matures - seems to me like it's some old-school Canadian (junior) hockey media that latches on to controversy and an opinionated, quotable 17 year old just permeates that.

I expect him to have a monster year offensively and hopefully work on his all-around game. I'd love to see Mitch Marner like numbers from Ho-Sang this year. And I agree with you scott99, in the bolded particularly.

 

[SLAPSHOT723]

He plays like he wants to impress everyone, and I was very impressed.

I can't wait for him to wear #66 and give a huge middle finger to Lemieux.

 

[rockhouse15]

He plays like he wants to impress everyone, and I was very impressed.

I can't wait for him to wear #66 and give a huge middle finger to Lemieux.

Does anyone know why JHS switched to 26 when he was traded to Niagara? I know he wore 66 at prospect scrimmage but not sure why he wore a different number last year.

 

[SLAPSHOT723]

Does anyone know why JHS switched to 26 when he was traded to Niagara? I know he wore 66 at prospect scrimmage but not sure why he wore a different number last year.

I'm actually not sure. Maybe Niagara didn't like it?

Either way, he wore it again at the prospect camp, so that's a good sign that he'd wear that in the NHL.

 

[SI90]

Does anyone know why JHS switched to 26 when he was traded to Niagara? I know he wore 66 at prospect scrimmage but not sure why he wore a different number last year.

I'm pretty sure NIA is like the Devils. They don't allow high numbers. I think only 1-30

 

[1Gold Standard]

Always loved the player's skillset and felt there were a few yahoos at Hockey Canada who judged him a little too harshly...but a few of those same yahoos didn't like Nathan Mackinnon that much either. Thankfully some of those yahoos have been weeded out and am looking forward to seeing Josh getting a fair shot making Team Canada this year. another year in junior is what this player needs, imo. And on a line with MDC.

 

[SI90]

Would love to see Ho-Sang Dal Colle Barzal and Beuavillir all on Team Canada.

They might as well wear Royal Blue and Orange if that's the case lol

 

[rockhouse15]

Would love to see Ho-Sang Dal Colle Barzal and Beuavillir all on Team Canada.

They might as well wear Royal Blue and Orange if that's the case lol

MVS might make the team too since he was invited to the camp. Hopefully the next year we have MVS, Wotherspoon, and Pilon on the team to make an all LHD Islander Canada team.

 

[Lame Lambert]

He plays like he wants to impress everyone, and I was very impressed.

I can't wait for him to wear #66 and give a huge middle finger to Lemieux.

Oh I can't wait to hear all the Penguins fans on here *****ing for weeks about it. I hope there's an interview that goes like this:
Guy: Josh, what made you decide to pick #66?
Josh: Well guy, I picked 66 because I know that I'm a better player than Lemieux ever was
*Canadian media as well as HFB disintegrates*

 

[SLAPSHOT723]

Would love to see Ho-Sang Dal Colle Barzal and Beuavillir all on Team Canada.

They might as well wear Royal Blue and Orange if that's the case lol

If anyone's changing their colors to Royal Blue and Orange, it's the Generals. God I love that organization. I really want to see Ho-Sang end up there to play with MDC.

MVS might make the team too since he was invited to the camp. Hopefully the next year we have MVS, Wotherspoon, and Pilon on the team to make an all LHD Islander Canada team.

That would be really cool to see.

Oh I can't wait to hear all the Penguins fans on here *****ing for weeks about it. I hope there's an interview that goes like this:
Guy: Josh, what made you decide to pick #66?
Josh: Well guy, I picked 66 because I know that I'm a better player than Lemieux ever was
*Canadian media as well as HFB disintegrates*

This is exactly what I'm hoping for. I will totally buy his jersey. **** Lemieux.

 

[Levi Walking Bear]

Oshawa, the Capital of Islander Country in Canada.

They have the coolest team bus.

 

[WinhallVT124]

MVS might make the team too since he was invited to the camp. Hopefully the next year we have MVS, Wotherspoon, and Pilon on the team to make an all LHD Islander Canada team.

Pilon will either be in Bridgeport or playing an overage season in the WHL next season. Hes a late 96 so I think this is his last chance to make it.

 

[rockhouse15]

Pilon will either be in Bridgeport or playing an overage season in the WHL next season. Hes a late 96 so I think this is his last chance to make it.

That's a good point. He played for the U-18 team in 2013-2014 so obviously this year would be his last one for U-20. Kind of surprised he was not even picked for the camp this year considering he had a very strong year for Brandon. Probably in small part (along with playing with Provorov, his combine, and "body language" whatever that means) contributed to him falling down the draft from 2nd round to 5th.

 

[Doshell Propivo]

Just as a note, "turnover" is really of very little value. You can't turn it over if you don't have the puck. Subban, Doughty, and Burns are the "turnover" +/- leaders from last season.

I would stay away from citations of turnover volume. The most useful bit of information about turnovers is that if you have a lot of turnovers you have the puck a lot; which is good.

Is there a statistic that measures time of possession and turnover ratio? Subban may have a lot of turnovers but he probably also possess the puck a lot more. Would be interesting to see who gives it up more and has it less.

 

[rockhouse15]

Is there a statistic that measures time of possession and turnover ratio? Subban may have a lot of turnovers but he probably also possess the puck a lot more. Would be interesting to see who gives it up more and has it less.

The NHL debuted something similar in the All-Star game to track player and puck movement throughout the game but I don't think we have anything like that available right now.

 

[charlie1]

Is there a statistic that measures time of possession and turnover ratio? Subban may have a lot of turnovers but he probably also possess the puck a lot more. Would be interesting to see who gives it up more and has it less.

If you believe Corsi For % is proportional to possession then you could estimate turnover per possession as

(Turnover per TOI) / (Corsi For %)

 

[The Underboss]

http://thehockeywriters.com/new-york-islanders-possess-valuable-asset-in-ho-sang/

When it comes to being a professional hockey player in the NHL, it takes much more than just skill to transform into an elite player. We have seen time after time individuals with an incredible amount of talent come up short or not meet the high expectations that have been bestowed upon them. In order to be considered great or elite, a player must also demonstrate a superb work ethic, always looking to improve his game, as well as a large amount of confidence in his own ability. Luckily for the New York Islanders, they have a prospect that meets all three of these criteria in Joshua Ho-Sang.

 

[redbull]

Is there a statistic that measures time of possession and turnover ratio? Subban may have a lot of turnovers but he probably also possess the puck a lot more. Would be interesting to see who gives it up more and has it less.

turnovers are one stat where context is crucial. A Matt Donovan turnover in his own end or the neutral zone can be crippling where Tavares turning it over in the offensive zone in trying to generate offense isn't as crippling. Takeaways work the same way but aren't as glaring (in highlight reels) like a poor turnover.

At some point maybe we'll be able to measure the impact of one type of turnover versus another, just like quality of shot or scoring chance. If you've heard Steve Valiquette talk about goaltending analytics he's working on it's extremely impressive.

 

[Tavares2TheRescue]

If you believe Corsi For % is proportional to possession then you could estimate turnover per possession as

(Turnover per TOI) / (Corsi For %)

That would certainly be a step in the right direction, but that statistic would definitely have it's flaws because Corsi measures your team's possession while you're on the ice, not how many times you individually have the puck. What would be really cool is if we had data for every time a player touched a puck and then things like how that possession ended (e.g; shot, pass, turnover) and how long the possession was.

 

[charlie1]

That would certainly be a step in the right direction, but that statistic would definitely have it's flaws because Corsi measures your team's possession while you're on the ice, not how many times you individually have the puck. What would be really cool is if we had data for every time a player touched a puck and then things like how that possession ended (e.g; shot, pass, turnover) and how long the possession was.

Yep but you'll have to wait for SportVU for that. Although you could probably pull some of that out of the Passing Project.