News Article: Johnny Gaudreau and brother Matthew Killed by Drunk Driver

[Spawn]

That's all well and good but expecting the kind of people to make the decision to drive drunk to make the right decision to not go to the bar is wishful thinking.

That doesn’t make them any less of a piece of shit though

 

[5 Mins 4 Ftg]

I mean yeah obviously the driver is the primary culprit. But he makes that decision in the context of many factors. Does the city they’re in have good public transportation? Do they have cheap ubers/taxis/rideshare options? Is there infrastructure in place to protect bikers?

There can be more than one party that shares accountability imo

When the driver has chosen to drive drunk and passing on the inside of a narrow road with no shoulder at night there is but one party that is to blame. The drunk driver.


There is zero equivalency here. Zero.

 

[Drivesaitl]

The thing is I believe young people are not drinking as much these days as in the past period, let alone drunk driving. Societally, getting plastered on the weekends is something that's become I think less of a thing over the last 10 years especially.

It's older people (35+) who drink more these days.

It's still incredibly sad, one death caused by drunk driving is one too many.

Wrong. After years of decrease drunk driving is now on the increase again in Canada, sadly. Worse, we now have a proliferation of drug impaired driving that is exploding. The problem is getting worse, far worse.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/las-vegas-driver-accused-fatal-211440346.html

Note that while the article states that drunk driving is on decline this changed subsequent to 2022. Its now on increase again.

Of course less of a proportion of drunk drivers are young. Many younger people increasingly do not drive or have vehicles.

 

[Nunymare]

Really? Educate yourself.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/las-vegas-driver-accused-fatal-211440346.html

DUI drivers getting released, or not charged at all, or at large, driving. Killing people.

Even in this specific instance the driver had prior suspension and charges due to DUI.

We need to do a better job of protecting civilians from this carnage.

Orgs like MAAD would disagree with your take. They've had to lobby hard for decades to try to make changes, legal changes and the work is endless.

The vehicular homicide is an individual crime. But societal problems are involved.

My take is that we'd be much better off if more people had the experiences of getting around on foot and/or on bike more regularly as opposed to just driving. At least personally, being on the other end of the power imbalance, and infrastructure designed to prioritize the convenience of vehicles has made me more careful and aware when driving. Waiting 10 extra seconds to pass someone safely can be the difference between life and death.

I sometime use the analogy of a driving a forklift or hauling pallets in a storeroom with other employees around on foot. You bet I'm going to be extra careful everywhere I'm going, despite it being common sense to give way.

 

[Soundwave]

Wrong. After years of decrease drunk driving is now on the increase again in Canada, sadly. Worse, we now have a proliferation of drug impaired driving that is exploding. The problem is getting worse, far worse.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/las-vegas-driver-accused-fatal-211440346.html

Note that while the article states that drunk driving is on decline this changed subsequent to 2022. Its now on increase again.

I think it's older people causing the crashes though, younger people don't drink as much period, the whole "you're not cool unless you get hammered at house parties and the club every weekend" isn't as much of a thing anymore with younger kids.

And sure enough the guy who did this is ... 43 ... a product of the 90s/2000s.

 

[McBigYak]

I mean yeah obviously the driver is the primary culprit. But they make that decision in the context of many factors. Does the city they’re in have good public transportation? Do they have cheap ubers/taxis/rideshare options? Is there infrastructure in place to protect bikers? Does the punishment for a DUI deter individuals from driving under the influence?

There can be more than one party that shares accountability imo

This is such a stupid reply on so many levels it is hard to comprehend.

City doesn't have good transportation. You drink anyway.

You then consciously make the decision to get behind the wheel, full well knowing there is laws in place for the exact reason that doing what you are doing literally kills people and destroys lives, and you choose to do it anyways.

There is absolutely zero accountability for anybody outside of the person that decides to drive impaired. Like none. Zero.

I'd sleep in my car in the middle of butt f*** nowhere before I'd decide to start it up and drive home. Because I'm not a complete dirtbag, and I don't have half a brain.

 

[5 Mins 4 Ftg]

Jesus it gets worse. Matthew G wife is pregnant, the boy will never know the dad.

The asshole behind the wheel has caused more pain in people’s lives than one can imagine.

Yet he sighs when he learns he that will be detained over the long weekend.

 

[AddyTheWrath]

When the driver has chosen to drive drunk and passing on the inside of a narrow road with no shoulder at night there is but one party that is to blame. The drunk driver.


There is zero equivalency here. Zero.

I’m not going to try and convince you otherwise if that’s what you believe. Agree to disagree

 

[5 Mins 4 Ftg]

I’m not going to try and convince you otherwise if that’s what you believe. Agree to disagree

Blaming society on this is next level ridiculous. People need to take reasonable and responsible actions in society. We live in an age where nobody wants to take responsibility anymore because it’s always societies fault. Personal responsibility doesn’t matter anymore. Drink and drive? Not my fault officer, there wasn’t a bike lane!

Will have to vehemently agree to disagree.

 

[TopShelfGloveSide]

Really? Educate yourself.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/las-vegas-driver-accused-fatal-211440346.html

DUI drivers getting released, or not charged at all, or at large, driving. Killing people.

Even in this specific instance the driver had prior suspension and charges due to DUI.

We need to do a better job of protecting civilians from this carnage.

Orgs like MAAD would disagree with your take. They've had to lobby hard for decades to try to make changes, legal changes and the work is endless.

The vehicular homicide is an individual crime. But societal problems are involved.

Educate myself. That’s great.

If you want to say society has a problem with being soft on crime in general. I’ll agree with you.

What do you suggest? Designating people dangerous offenders after a couple DUIs?

 

[AddyTheWrath]

There is absolutely zero accountability for anybody outside of the person that decides to drive impaired. Like none. Zero.

Based on this logic, any groups that are trying to reduce DUI incidents (MADD, AA) should just give up. If it’s all on the driver, what’s the point?

Blaming society on this is next level ridiculous. People need to take reasonable and responsible actions in society. We live in an age where nobody wants to take responsibility anymore because it’s always societies fault. Personal responsibility doesn’t matter anymore.

Will have to vehemently agree to disagree.

I guess you missed the part where I said it’s primarily the drivers fault multiple times lol. Either 0% or 100% with some of you

Bad actors will always exist. I don’t believe that you should just put your hands up and accept that you can’t do anything to mitigate their actions

 

[Little Fury]

What the f*** are you talking about?

If you make the decision to get behind the wheel after having too many drinks, you are personally accepting the fact that you may kill someone. You may ruin a family. You may ruin peoples lives.

And hundreds of people make that decision every day; do you think that's because they're bad people who don't care if they kill someone or because they don't think it's a big deal because they only had two or three drinks and they'll be fine? People are horrible at assessing risk to themselves and to other people and that's why public safety is largely about mitigating the impacts of individuals making bad choices.

 

[AddyTheWrath]

Okay I’ve derailed this thread enough so I’ll just close off by saying this is an absolutely tragedy and my thoughts are with those affected.

Just terrible timing and heartbreaking for everyone tied to the incident.

As someone on the smaller end, I enjoyed seeing Johnny Hockey defy the odds and succeed in a league that prioritized muscle and size.

RIP to both Johnny and Matthew

 

[Drivesaitl]

Educate myself. That’s great.

If you want to say society has a problem with being soft on crime in general. I’ll agree with you.

What do you suggest? Designating people dangerous offenders after a couple DUIs?

Mandated substance abuse treatment, incarceration if necessary to achieve that for repeat offenders. Required ignition detection devices be installed in vehicle. Probation, Drug alcohol testing mandated as part of probation. Things like that.

 

[McBigYak]

Based on this logic, any groups that are trying to reduce DUI incidents (MADD, AA) should just give up. If it’s all on the driver, what’s the point?

I guess you missed the part where I said it’s primarily the drivers fault multiple times lol. Either 0% or 100% with some of you

WTF do you think the point of MADD is? It is literally an organization that tries to encourage individuals to think about their decisions before they make them.

Had an individual drink at a bar in a town outside of YYC 6 years ago. And for the same dumbass decisions you claim are somehow logical, he drove home, went head on with my wife's friend on the highway and killed her.

f***. I guess I should have considered the context of his situation. He didn't have adequate public transportation. Society definitely failed him here. He had to drive home.

 

[Captain Fantastic]

Oof... Charged with two counts of death by Auto and no remorse. How is that charge different from Vehicular Homicide? ... Intention?

https://x.com/i/web/status/1829604774452600952

 

[BlackDogg]

I think you'll be there a bit longer than Thursday.

 

[AddyTheWrath]

WTF do you think the point of MADD is? It is literally an organization that tries to encourage individuals to think about their decisions before they make them.

Had an individual drink at a bar in a town outside of YYC 6 years ago. And for the same dumbass decisions you claim are somehow logical, he drove home, went head on with my wife's friend on the highway and killed her.

f***. I guess I should have considered the context of his situation. He didn't have adequate public transportation. Society definitely failed him here. He had to drive home.

Do you think people are inherently bad? Or do you think they make bad decisions because of the ways in which they are raised?

The difference in our answers probably has to do with why we disagree.

I can understand the charged response because you were personally impacted by a tragedy, but I’m not your enemy. Relax.

Anyway like I said I’ve derailed this thread enough and I know we’re never going to agree, but I’ll just state again that I find what Sean Higgins did abhorrent and I absolutely do not support drinking & driving.

 

[McBigYak]

And hundreds of people make that decision every day; do you think that's because they're bad people who don't care if they kill someone or because they don't think it's a big deal because they only had two or three drinks and they'll be fine? People are horrible at assessing risk to themselves and to other people and that's why public safety is largely about mitigating the impacts of individuals making bad choices.

Absolutely. 100%. Without question.

Again, if you make the conscious decision to get behind the wheel after drinking, you are personally accepting the fact that you could very well kill someone on the way home and you're accepting it as an appropriate risk. Whether it be to get to work in the morning, a wedding, a funeral, a tee time.

When the worst case scenario is killing someone, if you willingly accept the risk for such a miniscule reward of having your vehicle in your driveway in the morning, you are a bad person.

There is so much data on how much alcohol someone can consume before being impaired. There is no risk assessment here. Instead of having three, have one. And if you do have 3, don't drive. It's that simple.

 

[bobbythebrain]

Thinking a swerve is an excuse to pass is just stupid, booze or no booze

This guy deserves the book regardless of his blood alcohol. Being aggressive and using poor judgement is just as bad as being impairmed

 

[Kolja]

Just horrible!

 

[JordanGalhanth]

I don't know if it was irritated so much as a moment of "Oh dang...this is real. What have I done?" But perhaps that's wishful thinking on my part.

EDIT: Replying to the video in the Twitter link.

 

[TopShelfGloveSide]

Mandated substance abuse treatment, incarceration if necessary to achieve that for repeat offenders. Required ignition detection devices be installed in vehicle. Probation, Drug alcohol testing mandated as part of probation. Things like that.

Most of these things are a thing though.

 

[McBigYak]

Do you think people are inherently bad? Or do you think they make bad decisions because of the ways in which they are raised?

The difference in our answers probably has to do with why we disagree.

I can understand the charged response because you were personally impacted by a tragedy, but I’m not your enemy. Relax.

These are grown adults. Take some responsibility for your actions. Blaming any level of society, and to be honest anyone else besides the driver, is an absolute joke.

There is an endless amount of public information available of horrific deaths. Families being destroyed. Kids, parents, grandparents dead.

It does not take a high level of comprehension to understand if you drink too much and drive, you run the risk of killing someone. It's precisely why the law is in place.

 

[TopShelfGloveSide]

Oof... Charged with two counts of death by Auto and no remorse. How is that charge different from Vehicular Homicide? ... Intention?

https://x.com/i/web/status/1829604774452600952

They can hammer you with impaired driving causing death. Which is believe is under death by auto. I think it can be up to life in Canada.