John Tortorella Named (Part Time) Head Coach Discussion

[usahockey22flyers]

Small steps. Torts is here, and that's not without some positives.
He can't do anything about the FO situation, so I'm going to try to remember that his performance as a coach is a separate thing from management's misadventures.

At least he can light a fire under these players and demand some effort to secure their spot, and that doesn't have to mean simply favoring all the try-hard plugs....I hope

This… that’s about all I got too. Kind of sad we have such inept management. At least it seems the Flyers are genuinely trying to reconnect with fans. I can appreciate that.

 

[deadhead]

Stevens was beloved by players, it isn't something I consider a big selling point.

It is for a guy with a reputation for clashing with his players. That reputation may be a bit exaggerated.

For one thing, you can play your way out of Tort's doghouse, not sure anyone did out of AV's, can't say for Lavi.

 

[ajgoal]

I'm not doing this. I will not shut up.

But I will say that there are some where you can gain an advantage. Look for anything with construction required and assume it was done as cheaply as humanly possible, like the races to inflate the clown balloons with water guns. Watch a couple of rounds, paying close attention to the end seats. They're almost always constructed with one shared water line, so the first seat in the run will usually win if everything else is close.

Given I work a carnival every summer, I should pay more attention to these things.

 

[renberg]

I’m an old fart; been behind this club since 1967. Over the years it has had its ups and downs. Snider and Keith Allen understood that the NHL was a dog eat dog organization on and off of the ice. The Flyers had their cycles of great and awful over the years. The FO knew that and was aggressive with its operations to ensure that the down times were as short in duration as possible. Sure they used money to an advantage however that often angered other clubs and the NHL office. No one ever gave the Flyers any breaks with their operations and at times the League went out it’s way to rip them.
What‘s gone wrong with the club in the last decade is the lack of fight to win in the FO. Coaches were hired that were soft; GMs that never had the fire in the position that Allen had much less his skills; ownership went corporate seeming more interested in filling seats than winning the Cup.
My current hope is that Torts is a SOB in the way that Mike Keenan was when he first was hired. I have little hope for Fletcher as being a successful GM. There are thirty-one other GMs out there looking to rip off each other. Fletcher needs to be hip to that and be the guy that is the hammer and not the nail. Since coming here he may have done things to “win the respect of his peers” but he has tossed away too many assets. He needs to be aggressive or be gone. As for ownership, it seems to have forgotten that the only thing that fills seats is winning. Mascots are side shows. Wins are the thing. Maybe Scott is seeing this when he kicked AV to the curb and decided to eat $15M in the process. Hiring Tortorella could be another step in the correct direction of demanding accountability. Time will tell. He may have to write some checks in the near future to help move some floaters off of this roster. It’s going to get interesting here.

 

[Beef Invictus]

I’m an old fart; been behind this club since 1967. Over the years it has had its ups and downs. Snider and Keith Allen understood that the NHL was a dog eat dog organization on and off of the ice. The Flyers had their cycles of great and awful over the years. The FO knew that and was aggressive with its operations to ensure that the down times were as short in duration as possible. Sure they used money to an advantage however that often angered other clubs and the NHL office. No one ever gave the Flyers any breaks with their operations and at times the League went out it’s way to rip them.
What‘s gone wrong with the club in the last decade is the lack of fight to win in the FO. Coaches were hired that were soft; GMs that never had the fire in the position that Allen had much less his skills; ownership went corporate seeming more interested in filling seats than winning the Cup.
My current hope is that Torts is a SOB in the way that Mike Keenan was when he first was hired. I have little hope for Fletcher as being a successful GM. There are thirty-one other GMs out there looking to rip off each other. Fletcher needs to be hip to that and be the guy that is the hammer and not the nail. Since coming here he may have done things to “win the respect of his peers” but he has tossed away too many assets. He needs to be aggressive or be gone. As for ownership, it seems to have forgotten that the only thing that fills seats is winning. Mascots are side shows. Wins are the thing. Maybe Scott is seeing this when he kicked AV to the curb and decided to eat $15M in the process. Hiring Tortorella could be another step in the correct direction of demanding accountability. Time will tell. He may have to write some checks in the near future to help move some floaters off of this roster. It’s going to get interesting here.

I think this being Tortorella's last rodeo puts a limit on how much credibility he can have, and I don't think there will be a scrap of trickle-up.

 

[deadhead]

It's easy to forget that AV got this team on the same page in 2019-20, at least until the COVID break, then JVR shows up for the playoffs out of shape, and half the team was terrible.

AV got Voracek to play some of his best hockey, the best PO performance of his career, and maybe his best regular season performance since 2012-13. Then they filed for divorce. It fell apart the next season, partially due to a goalie meltdown, partially due to AV giving up. His solution wasn't to change (and get better assistants) it was for Chuck to change the team for him. Bad move.

So this team has needed accountability, but it also needed to move on from Giroux, Voracek, JVR and Ghost (and now Ellis, Atkinson and Hayes in the near future). They had their shots in 2016, 2018, and 2020 playoffs. They weren't good enough. Can't live in the past.

Torts needs a clean slate where he can mold a team, one that can incorporate top young talent into a viable winning culture.
While Atkinson is fine this year as his pipeline to the team, at 33 he's not the future, JVR lacks fire, Hayes has to either get with Torts or get out.
Ellis, can he be trusted to get back to a high level of play?
Couts is the one I see as the veteran anchor, because he internalizes the traits Torts emphasizes.
But it's the young players who are key, maybe they can't carry a team, but they can be the foundation on which you add a few top draft picks.

At this point it's just about consistency, game to game, season to season, whatever level they can reach, they need to stay there, and then build upon it.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Let's not blame the players for the real reason why the Flyers sucked, and it was AV going fully AV with his systems after they had a single loss.

 

[DancingPanther]

Also the rims are 11 feet high on the 3 point contests with a real backboard/rim so your muscle memory is off

 

[renberg]

I think this being Tortorella's last rodeo puts a limit on how much credibility he can have, and I don't think there will be a scrap of trickle-up.

I agree that this is probably his last shot as a HC. This job will determine his legacy. He’s going to go full Torts sooner or later. With this bunch, that might not be such a bad idea. There’s a few of them that need to be tuned up. My view was that there was a lack of professionalism exhibited by some. Torts won’t have that. Those guys will be press boxed, traded or cut. Playing Yandle last year set a low bar in many ways. Don’t think that others saw that and figured, what the heck, I can goof off and play as well. Then to have Thompson and Hayes sticking up for Yandle. Not good.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

I agree that this is probably his last shot as a HC. This job will determine his legacy. He’s going to go full Torts sooner or later. With this bunch, that might not be such a bad idea. There’s a few of them that need to be tuned up. My view was that there was a lack of professionalism exhibited by some. Torts won’t have that. Those guys will be press boxed, traded or cut. Playing Yandle last year set a low bar in many ways. Don’t think that others saw that and figured, what the heck, I can goof off and play as well. Then to have Thompson and Hayes sticking up for Yandle. Not good.

Tortorella said himself that it’s his last job.

 

[deadhead]

It doesn't require an admission to know a 64 year old HC on a 4 year contract is on his last job.
It also means Torts is impossible to pressure from above or below - whatcha gonna do, fire him?
He'll take his money and laugh.

However, I don't see Torts mailing it in, he's wired too tight for that.
Burn out maybe, but the year off and just the perspective of being in his 60s will protect him from that.

 

[Fight4yourRight]

Luke Richardson named HC of the Hawks. Why wasn’t he ever being seriously considered for this job? Despite him being an ex Flyer, he actually had a decent resume and track record with working with young players.

 

[blackjackmulligan]

Let's not blame the players for the real reason why the Flyers sucked, and it was AV going fully AV with his systems after they had a single loss.

It was a combination of both. The players are part of the team and part of the reason this team has been bad for a while now.

 

[Beef Invictus]

It was a combination of both. The players are part of the team and part of the reason this team has been bad for a while now.

And the players and coaches aren't at fault for themselves, it all goes back to Fletcher in the end. Teams and staffs don't just congeal at random out of the ether.

 

[blackjackmulligan]

And the players and coaches aren't at fault for themselves, it all goes back to Fletcher in the end. Teams and staffs don't just congeal at random out of the ether.

There are multiple reason why this team/franchise is in the shape it is currently. Management, players, development, drafting, coaching, just pure ineptness.

 

[snoop88]

Like Richardson would’ve been way too forward thinking and creative for this organization.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

What has Luke Richardson ever done? Two first round exits and two missed playoffs as an AHL coach?

Maybe he'll be a good head coach, but I'm not seeing any justification for bashing the Flyers for not being interested. And he's 53. How "forward thinking" is his hire?

 

[Beef Invictus]

There are multiple reason why this team/franchise is in the shape it is currently. Management, players, development, drafting, coaching, just pure ineptness.

But more than anything, it all comes back to Clarke.

 

[Flyerfan4life]

What has Luke Richardson ever done? Two first round exits and two missed playoffs as an AHL coach?

Maybe he'll be a good head coach, but I'm not seeing any justification for bashing the Flyers for not being interested. And he's 53. How "forward thinking" is his hire?

have you ever agreed with anyone other then urself even once in ur life ?

im betting not...

 

[blackjackmulligan]

But more than anything, it all comes back to Clarke.

That is your opinion. Fletcher seeks out Clarke. Clarke doesn't seek him out.

 

[Beef Invictus]

That is your opinion. Fletcher seeks out Clarke. Clarke doesn't seek him out.

Fletcher is here because of Clarke, and damned near the whole staff from top to bottom is here because they're Clarke's friends or family.

 

[dragonoffrost]

That is your opinion. Fletcher seeks out Clarke. Clarke doesn't seek him out.

I'll refer you to evidence of the reverse

Flyers' History: - The OFFICIAL Flyers Cronyism Chart

**UPDATED x4** Lol at putting Nick Schultz in alternating orange and green. Dark horse for ultimate crony Mad love up to Barry Hanrahan, VP and Assistant GM who was neither a former Flyer nor crony from what I can see. Just got hired and worked up. What a miracle. This post brought to you...

hfboards.mandatory.com

 

[blackjackmulligan]

Fletcher is here because of Clarke, and damned near the whole staff from top to bottom is here because they're Clarke's friends or family.

Clarke no doubt put in a good word. Clarke didn't hire him. Clarke isn't responsible for the prior regimes failures or the current failures. You want to blame Clarke no big deal to me.

 

[deadhead]

Holmgren was more actively involved until recently, he was GM, then the VP who fired Hextall and hired Fletcher with a mandate for a "bias for action," and listening to Scott, he's still mouthing Wormtongue's words.

Clarke is probably responsible for Holmgren, both were fired (Holmgren as HC, Clarke as GM) during the only stretch of Flyers history when they actually rebuilt. So both are strongly adverse to any hint of rebuilding. Clarke has been more publicly vocal recently, but behind the scenes? Who knows?

They both wanted Torts and his accountability and "play hard," but I think they haven't done their homework. "Play hard" probably means something different for Torts relative to Holmgren/Clarke, who still think they're in the 1990s before they enforced the rules on slashing, hooking, grabbing, discouraged fights and implement a hard cap.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Holmgren was more actively involved until recently, he was GM, then the VP who fired Hextall and hired Fletcher with a mandate for a "bias for action," and listening to Scott, he's still mouthing Wormtongue's words.

Clarke is probably responsible for Holmgren, both were fired (Holmgren as HC, Clarke as GM) during the only stretch of Flyers history when they actually rebuilt. So both are strongly adverse to any hint of rebuilding. Clarke has been more publicly vocal recently, but behind the scenes? Who knows?

They both wanted Torts and his accountability and "play hard," but I think they haven't done their homework. "Play hard" probably means something different for Torts relative to Holmgren/Clarke, who still think they're in the 1990s before they enforced the rules on slashing, hooking, grabbing, discouraged fights and implement a hard cap.

Clarke and numerous sources with inside info all affirm Clarke is the problem, not Holmgren.