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John Tortorella Named (Part Time) Head Coach Discussion

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What's the rush.
Hollywood Cannon said:
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He's totally accurate, the "golden child" has been the poster child for inconsistent play.
When you're outscored by MacEwen, time for some soul searchin' :naughty:

The problem isn't the "complexity" of the schemes, it's implementation and execution. Which still leaves something to be desired.

And what's the rush? Is this the best environment for player development?
Would Foerster develop faster in the AHL with Asinimov as his center or the NHL with Cates, Frost or Sedlak?
Is York better off as 1LHD in LHV or 3LHD in Philly? (he's made it clear he's not comfortable on the right side)?
Is Attard better off practicing defensive fundamentals 3 days a week in LHV or hardly practicing in Philly and trying to figure it out in games?

It's a lost season, throwing a bunch of rookies out there isn't going to help matters or speed their development.
They'll get worked in as the season progresses, gee, right now they have 8 players 25 or under:
Laczynski (25), Frost (23), Tippett (23), Bellows (23), Cates (23), Farabee (22), Zamula (22), Hart (24)
MacEwen, Provorov, Sanheim, Sandstrom are 26.
Allison and TK, both 25 should return in a couple weeks.
Lycksell (23) is a good bet to be promoted soon.

Let's sort through this group before we promote the next wave.
 
deadhead said:
He's totally accurate, the "golden child" has been the poster child for inconsistent play.
When you're outscored by MacEwen, time for some soul searchin' :naughty:
Click to expand...

You must be talking about Noah Cates again, since he's been gifted Golden child usage by Torts this season despite anemic ES point production (6 compared to MacEwen's 7) and very poor possession results (the only regulars with worse Corsi Rel are Farabee and Risto).

Player Season Totals - Natural Stat Trick

www.naturalstattrick.com

Zamula has the best Corsi Rel on the team, but can't get a minute from Torts during a 10 game losing streak. :laugh:
 
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Hollywood Cannon said:




Beef, you didn't hear? The complex schemes is the new justification of why the sucked the first ten games and why we can't use that sample size to try and show anything. Only the last 12, or whatever it is now, can be used.
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The f*** is that toilet seat comment? Couldn't just say "he's been up and down"? What a twat.
 
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There are moves I didn't like
- though Deslauriers was an overpay
- didn't like the Risto trade, the TDL non-trade or the extension, now it's just about salvaging some value
- think Lycksell should be up over Willman (though we don't know if there are conditioning issues after two week layoff)
- agree that Sanheim should get a shot at PP QB over Provorov

But after seeing too many prospects flame out b/c they were rushed, I'm in favor of marinating most prospects who aren't uber-talents, and it's pretty obvious when they are, TK and Farabee at 19 showed more than Frost has at 23.

Look at Vorobyev, took 3 seasons in the KHL, after three in the AHL, to finally hit his stride - now he's looking like a legitimate prospect at 25. He's an example of rushing a marginal player who was over his head in the NHL.
 
FartVacuumFletcher said:
Normally, I’m all for piling on Torts because it’s funny, but I cannot f***ing stand how the beat writers value their importance.

The only time Meltzer isn’t bending over backwards to kiss ass and spread Flyers propaganda, is when he feels obligated to protect the beat writer fraternity.
Click to expand...
In that situation Tortorella left the Flyers staff out to dry. They were waiting for him to speak and they weren't aware that he was gone so they put Brad Shaw up there.

It wasn't just the media. He put the organization in a tough spot.
 
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deadhead said:
What's the rush.

He's totally accurate, the "golden child" has been the poster child for inconsistent play.
When you're outscored by MacEwen, time for some soul searchin' :naughty:

The problem isn't the "complexity" of the schemes, it's implementation and execution. Which still leaves something to be desired.

And what's the rush? Is this the best environment for player development?
Would Foerster develop faster in the AHL with Asinimov as his center or the NHL with Cates, Frost or Sedlak?
Is York better off as 1LHD in LHV or 3LHD in Philly? (he's made it clear he's not comfortable on the right side)?
Is Attard better off practicing defensive fundamentals 3 days a week in LHV or hardly practicing in Philly and trying to figure it out in games?

It's a lost season, throwing a bunch of rookies out there isn't going to help matters or speed their development.
They'll get worked in as the season progresses, gee, right now they have 8 players 25 or under:
Laczynski (25), Frost (23), Tippett (23), Bellows (23), Cates (23), Farabee (22), Zamula (22), Hart (24)
MacEwen, Provorov, Sanheim, Sandstrom are 26.
Allison and TK, both 25 should return in a couple weeks.
Lycksell (23) is a good bet to be promoted soon.

Let's sort through this group before we promote the next wave.
Click to expand...

A young player is inconsistent? Wow. Sounds like every young player who isn't elite out of the box.

Trashing him publicly will surely help. What a development genius.
 
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Curufinwe said:
You must be talking about Noah Cates again, since he's been gifted Golden child usage by Torts this season despite anemic ES point production (6 compared to MacEwen's 7) and very poor possession results (the only regulars with worse Corsi Rel are Farabee and Risto).

Player Season Totals - Natural Stat Trick

www.naturalstattrick.com

Zamula has the best Corsi Rel on the team, but can't get a minute from Torts during a 10 game losing streak. :laugh:
Click to expand...
But you want him to replace the best xGF and xGFrel D-man?

3rd pair D-man tend to be sheltered, which makes their metrics suspect, remember Folin, who had nice metrics until he was asked to play up in the lineup, then he cratered.
 
Torts continues to prove that, in addition to being an incompetent dinosaur who can’t coach an NHL team, he’s just a garbage human being.

Pretty shameful that there’s so many Flyers fans who worship a person like that. Reveals their own poor character too.
 
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Hollywood Cannon said:
In that situation Tortorella left the Flyers staff out to dry. They were waiting for him to speak and they weren't aware that he was gone so they put Brad Shaw up there.

It wasn't just the media. He put the organization in a tough spot.
Click to expand...
I honestly agree, but it’s so fake.

The Flyers media would sit on their hands for 10 years before they said anything negative about the organization or any of its employees; Unless one of their compatriots needed defending.
 
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Curufinwe said:
You must be talking about Noah Cates again, since he's been gifted Golden child usage by Torts this season despite anemic ES point production (6 compared to MacEwen's 7) and very poor possession results (the only regulars with worse Corsi Rel are Farabee and Risto).

Player Season Totals - Natural Stat Trick

www.naturalstattrick.com

Zamula has the best Corsi Rel on the team, but can't get a minute from Torts during a 10 game losing streak. :laugh:
Click to expand...

I have a hard time believing Tortorella would call a golden child a toilet seat.

Deady is also strawmanning again. The only people who argued that Frost should be performing at a first line level were the people looking to scapegoat another failed season from management on him before the year even began. They pretend he's a golden child to trash him, because that's what management would want.
 
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deadhead said:
But you want him to replace the best xGF and xGFrel D-man?

3rd pair D-man tend to be sheltered, which makes their metrics suspect, remember Folin, who had nice metrics until he was asked to play up in the lineup, then he cratered.
Click to expand...
I don't mind which one of Braun, Risto and Seeler take a seat. There should be rotation among the bottom 3.
 
When Torts took the job he had Fletcher’s roster to work with. There probably was an agreement that Torts would work these vets to see which ones were worth keeping. By now it’s become obvious which ones are not. One by one they should be replaced by Phantoms.
No doubt that Fletcher wants to keep the vets. They’re his guys and his future is staked to them. From what Torts has being saying lately, they need to go and maybe Fletcher as well. Notice Torts recent talking up of Briere. Even Marcus Hayes in today’s Inky pointed out that the Flyers are where they are today because of Fletcher’s ineptitude. Start the death watch.
 
Hollywood Cannon said:
God Emperor.
Click to expand...

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Shrike said:
At what age do you believe a player can no longer be called a prospect?
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Depends on the player's history, injuries, the two COVID seasons probably slowed the development of a lot of players.
Bellows is 11 months older than Frost, and a year younger than Allison and Laczynski.
I just laugh at those who want to be patient with Frost but cut Bellows and Tippett.
Frost had a great CHL career, but at this point that's ancient history. He's not even an average 3C at this point.

And you never know, Sedlak clearly benefited from playing on the 1st line in the KHL for three years, didn't make him a top 6 NHL player, but improved his offense to the point he's a legitimate NHL player. We may be seeing the same thing with Vorobyev.

The problem isn't guys like Willman, who you know can't play after a half season to show his stuff at 26.
It's the guys who are 23-25, getting their first or second shot at extended PT, how long do you wait to see more than "flashes?"
The luxury of a season like this is you can play all these kids serious minutes and see who sinks and swims.
 
deadhead said:
Depends on the player's history, injuries, the two COVID seasons probably slowed the development of a lot of players.
Bellows is 11 months older than Frost, and a year younger than Allison and Laczynski.
I just laugh at those who want to be patient with Frost but cut Bellows and Tippett.
Frost had a great CHL career, but at this point that's ancient history. He's not even an average 3C at this point.

And you never know, Sedlak clearly benefited from playing on the 1st line in the KHL for three years, didn't make him a top 6 NHL player, but improved his offense to the point he's a legitimate NHL player. We may be seeing the same thing with Vorobyev.

The problem isn't guys like Willman, who you know can't play after a half season to show his stuff at 26.
It's the guys who are 23-25, getting their first or second shot at extended PT, how long do you wait to see more than "flashes?"
The luxury of a season like this is you can play all these kids serious minutes and see who sinks and swims.
Click to expand...

It's almost like nuance exists and not all players have identical upside and potential. Imagine that.
 
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deadhead said:
Depends on the player's history, injuries, the two COVID seasons probably slowed the development of a lot of players.
Bellows is 11 months older than Frost, and a year younger than Allison and Laczynski.
I just laugh at those who want to be patient with Frost but cut Bellows and Tippett.
Frost had a great CHL career, but at this point that's ancient history. He's not even an average 3C at this point.

And you never know, Sedlak clearly benefited from playing on the 1st line in the KHL for three years, didn't make him a top 6 NHL player, but improved his offense to the point he's a legitimate NHL player. We may be seeing the same thing with Vorobyev.

The problem isn't guys like Willman, who you know can't play after a half season to show his stuff at 26.
It's the guys who are 23-25, getting their first or second shot at extended PT, how long do you wait to see more than "flashes?"
The luxury of a season like this is you can play all these kids serious minutes and see who sinks and swims.
Click to expand...
 
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