ToneDog
56 years and counting. #FireTheShanaClan!
A bit extreme but we could use that cap hit to change the mix of our top line without having to move 16 or 88.
John Tavares Discussion
- Thread starter stickty111
- Start date
-
Xenforo Cloud will be upgrading us to version 2.3.5 on March 3rd at 12 AM GMT. This version has increased stability and fixes several bugs. We expect downtime for the duration of the update. The admin team will continue to work on existing issues, templates and upgrade all necessary available addons to minimize impact of this new version. Click Here for Updates
- Status
A bit extreme but we could use that cap hit to change the mix of our top line without having to move 16 or 88.
I’d rather have just kept Kadri as our 2nd line C at this point.
That said, Tavares is akin to a manager who gets paid way too much at an office that got the job because he’s buddies with the higher ups and presents himself in a certain way. When it comes to the actual work, he is incompetent and incapable of doing any of the heavy lifting or critical thinking and delegates to others making less than he is to do his job for him.
I have never seen this guy put this team on his back ever. Sundin did it all the time. This guy is just a heavily overpaid passenger on a bus he’s supposed to be driving.
Stephen
Moderator
- Feb 28, 2002
- 83,109
- 62,027
A near PPG center who often fails the eye test is a double edged sword though. So many plays he’s struggling to keep up and looks like he’s playing with a grenade out there.
1specter
Registered User
- Sep 27, 2016
- 12,924
- 19,611
Let's see what he does in playoffs, he was robbed of that opportunity last year. If he delivers in playoffs none of this regular season stuff really matters.
notDatsyuk
Registered User
- Jul 20, 2018
- 12,002
- 10,169
He's getting his points on the PP. Three of his four best seasons on the PP have been here (no surprise).
At even strength he's having his third worst season in both goals per 60 and primary assists per 60. His secondary assists are almost double (95% higher) his career average, and 20% higher than his previous best, which was last year. You can see that more and more he is getting points because his wingers are doing all the work.
He's at his best when all he has to do is win faceoffs (he's very good at that), and stand close to the net while the other players, with the man advantage, pass the puck around until they can set him up or he gets a rebound.
Stephen
Moderator
- Feb 28, 2002
- 83,109
- 62,027
What tends to bug me about him - and what also seems to earn him a lot of respect - is his skill/effectiveness/effort ratios are a little “atypical” for a “superstar” player.
It just looks like everything he does out there requires a super human level of effort. Whether that’s just moving around and keeping pace with the play, or puck recovery or trying to find open space or even completing those little touch pass plays or getting a scoring chance off. So much labour and sweat in the most routine situations.
In the end he might be quite productive, but I guess what I don’t like is how it often feels like his line is playing on the back foot. I just come away thinking, man the game is so hard for this guy. But why is it so hard for a superstar to play the game? Just doesn’t compute for me.
It just looks like everything he does out there requires a super human level of effort. Whether that’s just moving around and keeping pace with the play, or puck recovery or trying to find open space or even completing those little touch pass plays or getting a scoring chance off. So much labour and sweat in the most routine situations.
In the end he might be quite productive, but I guess what I don’t like is how it often feels like his line is playing on the back foot. I just come away thinking, man the game is so hard for this guy. But why is it so hard for a superstar to play the game? Just doesn’t compute for me.
3blizzard4
Registered User
Man it seems like everyone including this whole team is in the same boat. Lets wait and see what they do in the playoffs. Auston, Mitch, Tavares...all need to bring it in the playoffs. Not to mention goaltending.
Larcos_Unal
Registered Nurse
JT's character is so nonchalant, it's like he's out to lunch and not engaged. You're gonna tell me TBay completely destroyed the Leafs 8-1 and the captain was a total no show?? Unacceptable
They need to strip the C off him and give it to Matthews, they need to make him lose 15 pounds so he keeps up with the rest of the league...he's turning into Jason Allison before our eyes. $11M per year for a failure at 5 on 5 is gonna hurt deep. Nylander will have to be sacrificed cause of JT's no move clause.
They need to strip the C off him and give it to Matthews, they need to make him lose 15 pounds so he keeps up with the rest of the league...he's turning into Jason Allison before our eyes. $11M per year for a failure at 5 on 5 is gonna hurt deep. Nylander will have to be sacrificed cause of JT's no move clause.
Leafsfan74
Registered User
- Jul 2, 2018
- 5,745
- 6,245
He definitely needs to bring it this playoffs. Whether it's scoring, driving the net, throwing checks and/or standing up for his teammates. This is the season in which he and others either lose their lustre or they shine and pursue a lasting legacy.
Obviously the focus is production and showing some battle when the game tightens. All memorable Leaf captains have shown production in the big games. Let's hope Tavares shows up this postseason and leads by example.
Obviously the focus is production and showing some battle when the game tightens. All memorable Leaf captains have shown production in the big games. Let's hope Tavares shows up this postseason and leads by example.
Stephen
Moderator
- Feb 28, 2002
- 83,109
- 62,027
Bourne and Kyper were talking about the too many men call on the Tavares and Kerfoot change and how he has a weird way of showing the body language of a player ready to change only to change his mind at the last second and stay out. Seems like an easy fix and someone should talk to him about that.
Stephen
Moderator
- Feb 28, 2002
- 83,109
- 62,027
No, they were talking about his body language. Hand off the stick, gliding off, basically signals to the next man up to jump on the ice, but has a major malfunction and button hooks back into the play.
Seath The Scaleless
Paledrake
2 Slick
Registered User
He's not a game breaker like Marner or Matthews. He's slow, makes bad plays, gives the puck away a lot in the offensive zone, has bad hands tight in the net, just looks gassed and old... which I guess he is.
He's the Captain, he should be playing with more drive, more passion, motivate the team around him. Rest of the Leafs looked great in the first and third period, but man, Tavares looked like he's done most of 2022.. just horrendous.
I'm not familiar with all of our history, but he seems like our worst captain in recent memory. Sure he may be better than Phaneuf, but at the time Phaneuf was a more reasonable choice for who was on the team.
At the time I wanted Morgan, still do ... but Matthews also makes sense too if it was something he wanted and on a longer contract.
HamiltonNHL
Resigning Marner == Running it back
- Jan 4, 2012
- 22,710
- 13,885
kevsh
Registered User
- Nov 28, 2018
- 3,899
- 5,531
I don't see any reason to think he's going to be any different than what we see right now.
Just hoping and expecting he has a bounce-back season next year.
For the immediate future, I'd just cut his ice time and bump Kampf's. This is no time to worry about hurt feelings, John has got to find some way to have an impact besides being good in the faceoff circle.
Stephen
Moderator
- Feb 28, 2002
- 83,109
- 62,027
To get the most juice out of Tavares they need to put him on a line where straight line skating is taken out of the equation. One linemate should be the designated puck carrier and the other should be a big body guy who can dig the puck out in corners. The puck carrier can slalom and buy time for Tavares to get into position and the other guy supports the grunt work and presents a crease front option. You basically want to set up a cycle which can be gradually slowed down in pace from the initial zone entry and then work the play into a smaller and tighter area where Tavares can operate at a gliding/standstill pace. Then he's able to get his ball hockey style whip shot off or create garbage goal conditions. These seem to be the plays where Tavares/Marner thrive and also how Tavares worked with guys like Matt Moulson and Okposo and friends in New York. So we need to re-create those conditions.
A few years ago Matthews and Tavares were referred to as 1A and 1B. This year Matthews is 1AAA and Tavares is a very average 2. And Tavares is sheltered because all other teams put their best defensive players out to slow down Matthews. I really doubt JT steps up in the playoffs if and when needed.
notDatsyuk
Registered User
- Jul 20, 2018
- 12,002
- 10,169
notDatsyuk
Registered User
- Jul 20, 2018
- 12,002
- 10,169
He was responding to your comment about how laborious everything Tavares does, not about the penalty.
Aashir
Backcheck, Forecheck, Paycheque
- Apr 19, 2019
- 13,891
- 14,996
At this point for me, it’s his last chance in the playoffs before I lose all faith in him.
Against Boston he might’ve been the most selfish player I’ve ever seen:
Constantly going 1 on 3. Trying to put the puck between the opponents stick and skate instead of passing. Multiple times he’d look Marner off and try to go superman
Columbus he was a disaster:
He generally choked all around. Even in game 5, when he played left goddamn wing to MM and AM he still looked lost. He missed the emptiest of empty nets (I’ll never forget that one). He generated the least of the big 3 as well
Montreal he got hit in the face:
Not his fault. Not even gonna say anything apart from that I’m glad he’s alright
He’s been here for 2/3 series and he’s been the worst of the $11m men each time. He’s gotta take over a series and have over a PPG for it.
Against Boston he might’ve been the most selfish player I’ve ever seen:
Constantly going 1 on 3. Trying to put the puck between the opponents stick and skate instead of passing. Multiple times he’d look Marner off and try to go superman
Columbus he was a disaster:
He generally choked all around. Even in game 5, when he played left goddamn wing to MM and AM he still looked lost. He missed the emptiest of empty nets (I’ll never forget that one). He generated the least of the big 3 as well
Montreal he got hit in the face:
Not his fault. Not even gonna say anything apart from that I’m glad he’s alright
He’s been here for 2/3 series and he’s been the worst of the $11m men each time. He’s gotta take over a series and have over a PPG for it.
riffle
Registered User
Love the post above. Tavares is not a guy who inspires me. Does he inspire anyone in Leafs nation? He's as bland as bland can be. He's death on toast in interviews. A titanic bore of a guy. Not inspirational to the fan base and no way he's relatable or inspirational to the guys in the room. Every behind the scenes look at JT speaking in the locker room is cringeworthy. He's never won anything except a ridiculous deal from Kyle Dubas (Yes, I'm aware other teams allegedly wanted to pay even more).
The injury to Bunting made me ponder his absence and it got me thinking Michael Bunting is EXACTLY the kind of guy you need as a captain. Obviously, he's not going to be captain, but someone who plays the way he does is the kind of guy who should be the captain of this team. He's got that something nobody else on the Leafs really has save for maybe Simmonds and he's well past his prime.
All we can hope is Tavares somehow elevates his game come playoff time. Playoffs should mitigate his speed issues. A great playoff run from him would truly cover a multitude of sins so to speak.
And, I'd love to have Kadri's production and 6.5 million in cap savings over JT.
- Status
