Confirmed with Link: Jimmy Howard re-signed for 6 years 5.3m per year

[kuick]

If it means anything, we're 13th in goals against with a blueline that's easily bottom 5 in the league. Not that it's all on Howard, (Z/D plus new 'system'), but it says something.

No one is calling him a savior, we're just defending the contract against those who don't understand how goalies are valued these days. He's paid like a slightly above the middle of the pack starter should be under the new CBA, and that's exactly what he is.

 

[GoAwayDanCleary]

Before the season I said we'd finish 6th to 10th.

We're in 9th.

He's guided us to a 9th place finish so far.

Throw him a Vezina.

Without him I think we're in a 10th or 11th. Doesn't mean he's Vezina caliber, because he's not. Bit without him I don't think we are where we are.

 

[Petes2424]

Need Jimmy for what?

Jimmy isn't a savior. He's not the kind of goalie who can keep your team above water despite poor defense.

He doesn't make us better than any other average starting goalie in the league.

Jimmy Howard is a capable NHL starting goalie. He doesn't mask a poor defense.

Im sorry but what on earth are you looking for? A savior?

How can anyone who's watched the Detroit RedWings both this year and last, say "He's not the type of goalie who can keep your team above water.?"

What on earth has he been doing then? That's exactly what's been going on for most of this season.

 

[Dynheart]

Im sorry but what on earth are you looking for? A savior?

How can anyone who's watched the Detroit RedWings both this year and last, say "He's not the type of goalie who can keep your team above water.?"

What on earth has he been doing then? That's exactly what's been going on for most of this season.

If we had a "true" average goalie in net? We would be hovering around where Calgary and Nashville are. We just don't score enough goals. Who doesn't let in the goals? THe goalie!

There's always people around that have their standards set way too high, and pretty much put down any players contribution; however small or large it may be. Some people cannot except the fact that we are in the playoff hunt with a team that cannot score. And will use every negative view to knock Howard.

You know what's funny? If we were in 4th? With 130+ GF? People would say it's because we have an offense that's clicking, and Howard's contribution isn't needed. If the defense is good? Then you have what every goalie has suffered the last 20 years (except last year and this year) under the Winged Wheel....Wait a minute. I was wrong. The goalie still get's hazed when they play behind a bottom 25 defense! I guess they can't win, eh?

Sad thing is...the Wings have neither, and they aren't even good at them: Offense/Defense. But still in the playoff hunt. Who do you credit? Obviously the goalie. But people are still hell bent on discrediting the goalie here in Detroit.

 

[ricky0034]

what I find amusing is how the people that say that Howard isn't very good tend to also hold the opinion that pretty much everyone on the defense sucks and Babcock sucks etc

it's like....okay some of those things can suck,but all of them? why do the Wings give up so few goals then? 40 games of pure luck?

 

[RedWingsNow*]

I would say it is lack of scoring that has guided us to 9th place not the goalkeeping! you want him to make the saves and set up goals?

when the team is loosing 3 -1 , 2-1 , 2-0 so on and so forth it is not the goalies fault!

Is he the captain? no he is not where is Z in all of this this team looks unmotivated and down right sloppy most nights this year!

Maybe he should be called out as not doing very well as the team captain?

Again, another butthurt response.

Lack of goal scoring is one reason we've struggled. Inconsistent goaltending hasn't helped.

I would say that lack of goal scoring is in part due to a coaching shift (Off the glass and out instead of outlet passes).

As a result, you see less Red Wings forwards getting passes in full flight in the neutral zone and more forwards trying to pick the puck off the boards

 

[RedWingsNow*]

Without him I think we're in a 10th or 11th. Doesn't mean he's Vezina caliber, because he's not. Bit without him I don't think we are where we are.

The difference between 9th adn 10th is 1 point.

Replace Howard with Gustavsson full time... I wonder where we are. I'd say worse, for sure. Though I think Jonas would benefit from consistent action

Replace Howard with Mike Smith or Brian Elliot or Cory Schneider or Corey Crawford...

Are we much worse off?

 

[RedWingsNow*]

what I find amusing is how the people that say that Howard isn't very good tend to also hold the opinion that pretty much everyone on the defense sucks and Babcock sucks etc

it's like....okay some of those things can suck,but all of them? why do the Wings give up so few goals then? 40 games of pure luck?

Because their gameplay has changed to protect a weak defense.

As a result, the Wings offense has declined.

Truthfully, I'm not sure this is the right strategy, given the personnel we have.

Given the players we have on defense, I think a run-and-gun strategy best suits our team.

 

[Dynheart]

The difference between 9th adn 10th is 1 point.

Replace Howard with Gustavsson full time... I wonder where we are. I'd say worse, for sure. Though I think Jonas would benefit from consistent action

Replace Howard with Mike Smith or Brian Elliot or Cory Schneider or Corey Crawford...

Are we much worse off?

To answer your last question...Yes. With the exception of maybe Schneider.

Mike Smith has been inconsistent with a much better defensive team.
Do I need to bring up Elliot. Really? Or are you just happy he's on a hot streak?
Crawford. Really? When the puck hits him the rebounds end up in the slot. Good thing the Hawks got their defense clicking this year. You saw what happened to him last year.

Like I said, anything to discredit Howard. It's your M.O.

 

[RedWingsNow*]

To answer your last question...Yes. With the exception of maybe Schneider.

Mike Smith has been inconsistent with a much better defensive team.
Do I need to bring up Elliot. Really? Or are you just happy he's on a hot streak?
Crawford. Really? When the puck hits him the rebounds end up in the slot. Good thing the Hawks got their defense clicking this year. You saw what happened to him last year.

You want to tell me what makes Howard better than these guys?

How much does Craig Anderson make? How about Bobrovsky?

Like I said, anything to discredit Howard. It's your M.O.

Ad hominem insults.

Posts like yours are disgrace.


For years, it was the rare team that went anywhere without top notch goalies.
But since the cap era began, that's just not the case anymore.

Jonathan Quick was a hero last year. This year, his save percantage is 45th out of 51 goalies with enough shots to count..

Remember when Luongo was considered elite? Ryan Miller? How about when Kiprusoff was the flavor of the month? Steve Mason?

How about Marc Andre Fleury? Is he good? Is he average? Is he great?

The bottom line is that every year, teams pick up veteran goalies of the scrapheap and they perform capably.

I don't think that would happen on Detroit this year, because the Wings have obviously slipped.

Do you think Craig Anderson is far superior to Jimmy Howard? I don't.

But by the same token, I don't believe Jimmy Howard is that superior to Mike Smith.

At the end of the day, I have an objective opinion about the value of goaltenders. It may be wrong. But it's definitely not a fanboy opinion that causes me to sulk like a child

 

[wingfan]

what I find amusing is how the people that say that Howard isn't very good tend to also hold the opinion that pretty much everyone on the defense sucks and Babcock sucks etc

it's like....okay some of those things can suck,but all of them? why do the Wings give up so few goals then? 40 games of pure luck?

I don't think our d is anywhere near as bad as advertised. I do not think Babcock sucks. I do think Howard is extremely over rated by most Wings fans, and the majority of hockey fans in general share this opinion. Howard is a bottom tier starting goalie. He just got paid like a 5-10 goalie.

 

[RedWingsNow*]

Im sorry but what on earth are you looking for? A savior?

How can anyone who's watched the Detroit RedWings both this year and last, say "He's not the type of goalie who can keep your team above water.?"

What on earth has he been doing then? That's exactly what's been going on for most of this season.

I'm not looking to spend $5.3M a year on a goalie who isn't significantly better than someone I can get on the UFA market for $3M

 

[RedWingsNow*]

what I find amusing is how the people that say that Howard isn't very good tend to also hold the opinion that pretty much everyone on the defense sucks and Babcock sucks etc

it's like....okay some of those things can suck,but all of them? why do the Wings give up so few goals then? 40 games of pure luck?

How many people on hfboards believe that
1) Babcock sucks
2) Holland sucks
3) The defense sucks
4) howard sucks.

Maybe mindfly.

So it sounds like you're making things up, Ricky

 

[ProPAIN]

I'm not looking to spend $5.3M a year on a goalie who isn't significantly better than someone I can get on the UFA market for $3M

The only goaltender I would rather take instead of Howard is Mike Smith and I think he'll ask for a similar contract if not more.

Other options are Nabokov and Emery, but Nabby is going to be 38 and Emery is going to base his next contract on this year's stats which wouldn't be a good idea.

 

[Dynheart]

You want to tell me what makes Howard better than these guys?

How much does Craig Anderson make? How about Bobrovsky?





Ad hominem insults.

Posts like yours are disgrace.


For years, it was the rare team that went anywhere without top notch goalies.
But since the cap era began, that's just not the case anymore.

Jonathan Quick was a hero last year. This year, his save percantage is 45th out of 51 goalies with enough shots to count..

Remember when Luongo was considered elite? Ryan Miller? How about when Kiprusoff was the flavor of the month? Steve Mason?

How about Marc Andre Fleury? Is he good? Is he average? Is he great?

The bottom line is that every year, teams pick up veteran goalies of the scrapheap and they perform capably.

I don't think that would happen on Detroit this year, because the Wings have obviously slipped.

Do you think Craig Anderson is far superior to Jimmy Howard? I don't.

But by the same token, I don't believe Jimmy Howard is that superior to Mike Smith.

At the end of the day, I have an objective opinion about the value of goaltenders. It may be wrong. But it's definitely not a fanboy opinion that causes me to sulk like a child

I'm just calling a spade, a spade. You do it here. You do it in every thread. Hell, even if the conversation isn't about Howard! You find a way to blame the 1-0 loss, or 2-1 loss on him.

What else do you want people to say around here? Obviously the vast majority are seeing a different scenario on the ice. You're also not the authority on goaltenders...which is why I don't understand why you're replying to everyone you disagree with..which seems to be just about everyone in this thread.

Fanboys are one thing. Posting damn near 92.0 SV on a ***** team? That's another. And that SV percentage means only one thing: He's making the saves, and a lot of them. A high quality at that.

But do what you do, tear this post apart. Say Howard belongs with the Theodores. The Dubnyks. The Raycrofts. You know...the real definition of average. Average in the NHL get's one thing...back up role...or you may be a little better and hit Biron status. That's why these goalies that try out as starters...their teams never get far...even if their teams are good.

 

[RedWingsNow*]

The only goaltender I would rather take instead of Howard is Mike Smith and I think he'll ask for a similar contract if not more.

Other options are Nabokov and Emery, but Nabby is going to be 38 and Emery is going to base his next contract on this year's stats which wouldn't be a good idea.

Next year's UFA goalies

Emery
Backstrom
Smith
Dan Ellis
Theodore
Khudobin
Montoya

I could do Backstrom or Smith instead of Howard.

I really doubt anyone is going to pay Smith $5M a year.

I don't think Jimmy's contract is out of line.
I just don't think that you pay a goalie like that unless you think he's really, really good.

I don't think Howie is a difference making goalie.

 

[RedWingsNow*]

I'm just calling a spade, a spade. You do it here. You do it in every thread. Hell, even if the conversation isn't about Howard! You find a way to blame the 1-0 loss, or 2-1 loss on him.

Do you lie for living? Are you a member of Congress?

What else do you want people to say around here? Obviously the vast majority are seeing a different scenario on the ice. You're also not the authority on goaltenders...which is why I don't understand why you're replying to everyone you disagree with..which seems to be just about everyone in this thread.

I don't think you have a firm grasp of what I think, let alone what "everyone else" thinks.

Fanboys are one thing. Posting damn near 92.0 SV on a ***** team? That's another. And that SV percentage means only one thing: He's making the saves, and a lot of them. A high quality at that.

Jimmy Howard's save percentage is 17th out of 51 goalies.
His goals against is 19th out of 51 goalies.

Where will his salary be out of 51 goalies?

How much should Ottawa pay Craig Anderson for his .949 save percentage and 1.53 goals against average?


If Anderson was a free agent, how much would you pay him?

How much is Corey Crawford worth for his 1.90 goals against and .926 save percentage (which is probably even higher after this afternoon's shutout.)

 

[ricky0034]

How many people on hfboards believe that
1) Babcock sucks
2) Holland sucks
3) The defense sucks
4) howard sucks.

Maybe mindfly.

So it sounds like you're making things up, Ricky

replace 4 with something more mild(I never said anything about people believing Howard "sucks" just people believing he isn't very good) and you pretty much just described half this forum

 

[RedWingsNow*]

replace 4 with something more mild(I never said anything about people believing Howard "sucks" just people believing he isn't very good) and you pretty much just described half this forum

We're talking about whether or not he's a $5.3M goalie for six years.

Is he that good?

I think there's more than one way to look at it.

Does that fit in terms of the NHL's market for goalies?
Sure.
Is that the best way to spend $5.3M a year?
The answer might be completely different depending on who you ask

 

[GoAwayDanCleary]

I'm not looking to spend $5.3M a year on a goalie who isn't significantly better than someone I can get on the UFA market for $3M

None of those goalies are getting less than $4M on the open market.

 

[Michael Brand Eggs]

We're talking about whether or not he's a $5.3M goalie for six years.

Is he that good?

I think there's more than one way to look at it.

Does that fit in terms of the NHL's market for goalies?
Sure.
Is that the best way to spend $5.3M a year?
The answer might be completely different depending on who you ask

You're viewing it in a vacuum, though. It's not the best way to spend $5.3m a year necessarily, but Jimmy has earned that money and he's the Wings' goalie at this point in time.

Plus, the fact that Jimmy is getting 5.3 sets the very market for guys you brought up like Backstrom and Smith. In actuality, you might get a worse goalie for 4.75 and you'd have to trade to get him. Those other guys are going to want their paydays too, and they'll get them. Or even if we trade Jimmy and sign those guys as UFA, if we think Jimmy's contract is so bad, then surely GMs will too and we won't be able to get a great return. It's hard to see how trading Jimmy in that case would be worthwhile just to sign another guy.

Plus, this is about to be a pretty bad team. Why do we care so much about cap hit? Sure, we can't give him 7 mil, but 5.3 mil instead of 4.5 isn't going to ruin a cup run (a cup run that we won't be seeing in the life of this contract).

 

[RedWingsNow*]

You're viewing it in a vacuum, though. It's not the best way to spend $5.3m a year necessarily, but Jimmy has earned that money and he's the Wings' goalie at this point in time.

Plus, the fact that Jimmy is getting 5.3 sets the very market for guys you brought up like Backstrom and Smith. In actuality, you might get a worse goalie for 4.75 and you'd have to trade to get him. Those other guys are going to want their UFA payouts too, and they'll get them.

Plus, this is about to be a pretty bad team. Why do we care so much about cap hit? Sure, we can't give him 7 mil, but 5.3 mil instead of 4.5 isn't going to ruin a cup run (a cup run that we won't be seeing in the life of this contract).

Well, I can think of lots of reasons.

If this is about to be apretty bad team, I expect Jimmy's numbers to go south.

And then what?

 

[DatsyukToZetterberg]

The only goaltender I would rather take instead of Howard is Mike Smith and I think he'll ask for a similar contract if not more.

Other options are Nabokov and Emery, but Nabby is going to be 38 and Emery is going to base his next contract on this year's stats which wouldn't be a good idea.

I don't understand the love for Smith. He was junk in Tampa & Dallas, he goes to Phoenix where we know they have a very defence heavy system. Bryz was incredible there he goes to Philly and he's having a very rough go with, though I still think he's a top 20 goalie. I want to see Smith succeed outside of Phoenix before I call him a 5M+ goalie.

 

[GT500x]

You're viewing it in a vacuum, though. It's not the best way to spend $5.3m a year necessarily, but Jimmy has earned that money and he's the Wings' goalie at this point in time.

Plus, the fact that Jimmy is getting 5.3 sets the very market for guys you brought up like Backstrom and Smith. In actuality, you might get a worse goalie for 4.75 and you'd have to trade to get him. Those other guys are going to want their UFA payouts too, and they'll get them.

Plus, this is about to be a pretty bad team. Why do we care so much about cap hit? Sure, we can't give him 7 mil, but 5.3 mil instead of 4.5 isn't going to ruin a cup run (a cup run that we won't be seeing in the life of this contract).

I think you're missing his point. I think most people here agree that it's fair market value for him. Of course a few people don't agree that Howard is worth that but it's not the 5.3 alone that is the issue most people have -- it's the six years. Will he be worth that much years later? I don't believe in signing goalies for long terms because I've seen too many of them get hot for a year or two and then become mediocre.

Another point I want to make is that it's not the people who don't like the contract that are making a big deal of it. They are questioned about their opinion and then have to defend it, and then when they defend it people get the impression that they "care so much."

 

[Michael Brand Eggs]

Well, I can think of lots of reasons.

If this is about to be apretty bad team, I expect Jimmy's numbers to go south.

And then what?

This is already a pretty bad team. If it gets worse, will Jimmy's numbers be the thing we're really concerned about? I doubt it. We'd likely be more concerned about the lack of talent and at least partially explain Jimmy's struggling with that fact.