Post-Game Talk: Jets are a mess, lose 6-3

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WpgSteve

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Great first by PLD. First time I've seen him as a legit 1C.

Why can't we criticize Hellebuck? Let in a bunch of unscreened shots while we were still in it. An "elite" goaltender needs to make those saves, especially given where the team is.

Lots of blame to go around in the second and third. Playing Beaulieu better be for trade purposes. Let's treat the rest of the year as a training camp.
 

tbcwpg

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I can understand how you feel about European hockey, but the Jets need a culture change, and there's some great players coming out of European hockey leagues, and especially Finland. Think Barkov, Rattenan, Laine, and many others from a small country with only 5 million people. They do play a more defensive style, but that wins you games, just like Carolina does.

Just a suggestion on my part, but the Jets are going to have to make some big changes, and I just proposed several that I could think of, for posters to think about.

Carolina is 4th in the NHL for goals per game. It's not just defence.
 

gojetsgo

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If the team thought it would be a smoother transition by firing him, I'd have to assume they would have fired him.
Maurice stated the team needed to hear a new voice - that takes the pressure off the players IMO. What other questions would be raised?
By firing him, the players could consider themselves as part of the problem that forced the firing.
This happens a lot -
the team was going to fire him sooner then later had they kept playing like they were
"By firing him, the players could consider themselves as part of the problem that forced the firing." and having him quit doesn't? it's a huge leap saying it's better for the players to have their coach quit on them to have him fired...
 
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GNP

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Carolina is 4th in the NHL for goals per game. It's not just defence.

I think you can still score a lot of goals playing a more defensive style of hockey. It's obvious the Jets totally offensive style of hockey, is getting them walloped by better teams. They have to change their systems IMO.
 
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gojetsgo

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I think you can still score a lot of goals playing a more defensive style of hockey. It's obvious the Jets totally offensive style of hockey, is getting them walloped by better teams. They have to change their systems IMO.
were 15th in goals against and 20th in goals for, I wouldn't call what were currently doing an offensive style of hockey..
 
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LowLefty

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the team was going to fire him sooner then later had they kept playing like they were
"By firing him, the players could consider themselves as part of the problem that forced the firing." and having him quit doesn't? it's a huge leap saying it's better for the players to have their coach quit on them to have him fired...


Depends on how you want to view it -
Some might think a coach who takes the blame and steps aside is not quitting on them.
Why don't we just leave it at that - we don't view the issue the same way -
 

LowLefty

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were 15th in goals against and 20th in goals for, I wouldn't call what were currently doing an offensive style of hockey..


You can play an offensive style of hockey and still not score a lot of goals - I guess you'd probably call it a bad offensive style of hockey.
We certainly don't play a defensive style -
What would you call it?
 

WpgSteve

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Listening to the interviews, Doobie and A Lowry call out the fact they are missing an "Identity" - a style to fall back on that will get them through 3 periods.
Coach comes out and states they have an identity - play hard and fast like they did in the first -
That says it all -
This team has lacked identity all year. By lacking identity, I mean that no one seems to know exactly what their role is or what to do. Cliches like 'being hard to play against' mean nothing.

Normally I'd blame coaching, but it has existed under 2 coaches now. Maybe roster composition is the problem. We have a team of skilled players that aren't used to playing a team game.
 

gojetsgo

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This team has lacked identity all year. By lacking identity, I mean that no one seems to know exactly what their role is or what to do. Cliches like 'bring hard to play against' mean nothing.

Normally I'd blame coaching, but it has existed under 2 coaches now. Maybe roster composition is the problem. We have a team of skilled players that aren't used to playing a team game.
2 coaches that are using the same system, lowry hasn't changed anything other then the pk.
 

WpgSteve

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2 coaches that are using the same system, lowry hasn't changed anything other then the pk.
For sure. I think new coaching has a chance to succeed. Showing the team a way to win that they buy into could go a long way.

That said, it could be a poor mix of players. I don't know.
 

gojetsgo

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For sure. I think new coaching has a chance to succeed. Showing the team a way to win that they buy into could go a long way.

That said, it could be a poor mix of players. I don't know.
new coach and over haul the bottom six and that could go along way
 
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LowLefty

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2 coaches that are using the same system, lowry hasn't changed anything other then the pk.


Lowry likely started with baby steps - maybe getting them to show up every night and put in a little effort
He can't even get that out of this bunch -
I think system changes will be on the agenda at some point - but I wouldn't call out Lowry for not bringing anything new to this line up under the circumstances.
Give a listen to Doobies post game tonight - there are hints on the issues in his comments
 

WpgSteve

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Lowry likely started with baby steps - maybe getting them to show up every night and put in a little effort
He can't even get that out of this bunch -
I think system changes will be on the agenda at some point - but I wouldn't call out Lowry for not bringing anything new to this line up under the circumstances.
Give a listen to Doobies post game tonight - there are hints on the issues in his comments
Hard to put in effort when you don't have a clear understanding understanding of what you are supposed to be doing. This team needs a Moses to lead then to the promised land.
 

gojetsgo

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Lowry likely started with baby steps - maybe getting them to show up every night and put in a little effort
He can't even get that out of this bunch -
I think system changes will be on the agenda at some point - but I wouldn't call out Lowry for not bringing anything new to this line up under the circumstances.
Give a listen to Doobies post game tonight - there are hints on the issues in his comments
why, he pretty much had a training camp to implement something new with all the postponements, and what did he do? he left the same systems mauirce used intact...
"if we have an identity to fall back on you know what kind of team is going to show up from us, that's when you have consistency. you'll lose some games but you'll win some when you don't even play well and were still trying to find our identity is here and I think that's what is hurting us"
to me that screams coaching, good coaches put in structure that you can rely on when you are playing bad, we have no structure so when we play bad we look awful..
 
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LowLefty

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Hard to put in effort when you don't have a clear understanding understanding of what you are supposed to be doing. This team needs a Moses to lead then to the promised land.

This isn't their first rodeo - they know how to play the game.
I get where you're going but there are a few fairly simple things that any coach could bring to the line up.
The team at this point, is built around speed and skill (to varying degrees) - I'm sure this has been mentioned by the coaching staff -
If fact is was brought up tonight in the post game presser.
Why not start with the easy stuff and then layer in the complex systems and game plan.

From where I sit, I don't see them using their speed / skill with any consistency - it almost appears as thought they lose interest.
And that, IMO, is the issue - and it's not complex

It's not hard to put on effort. Forecheck, back check, hard on the puck, take away space. I know this much - you'd think they could probably grasp the idea.
 
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LowLefty

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why, he pretty much had a training camp to implement something new with all the postponements, and what did he do? he left the same systems mauirce used intact...
"if we have an identity to fall back on you know what kind of team is going to show up from us, that's when you have consistency. you'll lose some games but you'll win some when you don't even play well and were still trying to find our identity is here and I think that's what is hurting us"
to me that screams coaching, good coaches put in structure that you can rely on when you are playing bad, we have no structure so when we play bad we look awful..

OK - I've already stated why -
Why would you start with systems when you can't even get the guys to play basic fast, tenacious hockey with any consistency.
You have to start with the basics when you have a team as lost as this one -

The major issue Maurice had with the team is that he lost the room - they were not paying any attention to his demands for a faster, harder game from the team -
You need to deal with that issue before you move onto systems -

You and I are calling out the same argument on every post -
If I understand the point you are driving, you want to see improved systems, style and game planning
I agree with you - we need to improve in these areas.

My point is that we need to start with the basics first - the team is not skating, hitting, back checking, puck pursuit or any of that basic stuff that forms the foundation of most good teams.
Lowry is asking for these things now - he brings this stuff up after every loss - but he can't get the guys to do it consistently.
So why would he move onto systems when he can't get them doing the stuff they should have been doing since midget hockey?

This is why I keep harping on the point that maybe there is more to this than just coaching - maybe we have roster issues as well.
That's my take on it up to this point - but I will join you on the system issues when they get to the point where they can actually start implementing them.
 
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gojetsgo

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OK - I've already stated why -
Why would you start with systems when you can't even get the guys to play basic fast, tenacious hockey with any consistency.
You have to start with the basics when you have a team as lost as this one -

The major issue Maurice had with the team is that he lost the room - they were not paying any attention to his demands for a faster, harder game from the team -
You need to deal with that issue before you move onto systems -

You and I are calling out the same argument on every post -
If I understand the point you are driving, you want to see improved systems, style and game planning
I agree with you - we need to improve in these areas.

My point is that we need to start with the basics first - the team is not skating, hitting, back checking, puck pursuit or any of that basic stuff that forms the foundation of most good teams.
Lowry is asking for these things now - he brings this stuff up after every loss - but he can't get the guys to do it consistently.
So why would he move onto systems when he can't get them doing the stuff they should have been doing since midget hockey?

This is why I keep harping on the point that maybe there is more to this than just coaching - maybe we have roster issues as well.
That's my take on it up to this point - but I will join you on the system issues when they get to the point where they can actually start implementing them.
why would you start with systems? because you give them structure.. look at what pld said, the good teams even when not playing well have something to fall back on... and don't give me this bullshit that maurice/lowry are just being tuned out and were/are preaching for players to play harder... if that was actually true sheif/wheeler would be benched and pld/connor would have taken over the #1 line, like the only player that was weirdly held accountable for his play has been svechnikov


we need structure/accountability both things maurice/lowry lack


and of course we have roster issues.. who's saying we don't, our bottom six is a bunch of ahlers that couldn't score if they were in a porno
 

Jets 31

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Seriously this winter can't end soon enough for me , you are up 3-0 after the 1st period on the road and lose 6-3 ? Wheeler looked like a 60 year old out there tonight and he's our highest paid player, he should be embarrassed taking a paycheck. Scheifele was awful tonight as well and Helly needs to sit for a while . Booboo and the rest of the clowns we have playing on our 3rd and 4th lines all need to go back to the Moose for better coaching.
 

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Chevy not going and getting a real coach is also pissing me off because it looks like he just didn't want to do his job and just kept all the same coaches. Now the season is done and who knows what would have happened had he just gone and hired someone brand new , he had lots of dead time in the schedule that he could have hired someone.
 
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