Speculation: Jakob Chychrun being held out of the Coyotes lineup until a trade is completed

[rt]

1.) Teams care. Sample size matters. Just because he was hot when he returned from injury last time doesn't mean every time he returns from injury he's going to play great. If he can play great, prove it by letting him play.

They did. For 36 games. It matters because it wasn’t 42? Give me a break. This is nonsense.

2.) Teams were worried about injury, Chychrun playing would prove that he is healed. Holding an injury ridden player out of the lineup out of fear of injury doesn't instill confidence. This is a player who has never played 70 games in the NHL. The team trading for him is most likely a playoff team who wants to see he's healthy and can contribute.

He did play. And he is healthy. This in no way makes teams MORE worried about injuries they otherwise would be. Which I’ve already said.

3.) Recency bias. If Chychrun put up 10 points in the last 5 games, he's more enticing. The same as how Karlsson and P. Kane chatter picks up when they started playing well. Had teams never seen P. Kane or Karlsson play before? Of course they have. However, if you're a buyer and a player is lighting it up right now, you want the player coming to your team with confidence.

So negligible it’s not even the difference of a 4th vs a 5th round pick. This is absurd. These are professionals not hobbyists. They weren’t going to change their opinion because of a few games. There’s a body of work.

 

[Divine]

They did. For 36 games. It matters because it wasn’t 42? Give me a break. This is nonsense.

He did play. And he is healthy. This in no way makes teams MORE worried about injuries they otherwise would be. Which I’ve already said.

So negligible it’s not even the difference of a 4th vs a 5th round pick. This is absurd. These are professionals not hobbyists. They weren’t going to change their opinion because of a few games. There’s a body of work.

1.) The NHL season is longer than 36 games. It's not the number of games that matters, it's the fact this guy hasn't played hockey in 2 weeks. Sure, if they kept him out 1 or 2 games like everyone else, it's asset management. This guy hasn't played since February 10th! Of course that matters. I think you're misguided because not every team is Arizona, some teams actually care if a player contributes right away, especially buyers at the deadline. There's less incentive to trade for a player who's not even playing hockey. That's why historically players were pulled after a trade was finalized, or in motion. Heck, you would have players pulled from games because they got traded. Putting Chychrun in a bubble wrap is not confidence inspiring to anyone but you.

2.) How do we know he's healthy when he's not playing, because you said so? If anything, the idea of him having a lingering injury and being pulled makes more sense than this unprecedented take a month off while healthy for no reason.

3.) Their opinion changes based on play. If a player is playing well, it's called recency bias. It's talked about a lot. It's been proven time and time again. What do you think the value of Karlsson was last season? Were there trade talks? What about Luke Schenn? Why do players get paid more after having a career year in their UFA year, can't the teams just look at their career stats?

 

[JohnnyJacket13]

Blue Jackets trade involving Vladislav Gavrikov falls through — so now what?

The Blue Jackets have held out Gavrikov, firmly believing a deal was in place. That changed on Thursday night.

theathletic.com

The Blue Jackets wanted to get the Gavrikov trade done well ahead of the trade deadline, two sources told The Athletic, so that they could potentially flip the first-round pick from Boston in a trade with Arizona for defenseman Jakob Chychrun.

 

[rt]

1.) The NHL season is longer than 36 games. It's not the number of games that matters, it's the fact this guy hasn't played hockey in 2 weeks. Sure, if they kept him out 1 or 2 games like everyone else, it's asset management. This guy hasn't played since February 10th! Of course that matters. I think you're misguided because not every team is Arizona, some teams actually care if a player contributes right away, especially buyers at the deadline. There's less incentive to trade for a player who's not even playing hockey. That's why historically players were pulled after a trade was finalized, or in motion. Heck, you would have players pulled from games because they got traded. Putting Chychrun in a bubble wrap is not confidence inspiring to anyone but you.

2.) How do we know he's healthy when he's not playing, because you said so? If anything, the idea of him having a lingering injury and being pulled makes more sense than this unprecedented take a month off while healthy for no reason.

3.) Their opinion changes based on play. If a player is playing well, it's called recency bias. It's talked about a lot. It's been proven time and time again. What do you think the value of Karlsson was last season? Were there trade talks? What about Luke Schenn? Why do players get paid more after having a career year in their UFA year, can't the teams just look at their career stats?

This is all so ridiculous. Completely asinine.

You can’t tell the difference between two weeks and two months and I can’t help you. But I can definitely ignore you.

 

[mouser]

Personally, I think they should make it against the rules to scratch a healthy player like that. We all get it, they are trying to get futures in a rebuild but what about the player? Seems lob sided towards team management in this case. If the player wanted to play and the team said no, I wonder where that would lead to? I guess he is welcoming the time off?

Scratching players like this actually makes the Escrow get higher. Why? Cause the Coyotes have to replace him in the line-up. Even if it's a $1M player, that still chews into the salary cap. Not a huge effect but an effect none the less.

While we’re at it let’s ban LTIR, because that also increases Escrow.

We should also ban Roster Emergency Exceptions for teams with less than 20 healthy player, they increase Escrow as well.

 

[rt]

Blue Jackets trade involving Vladislav Gavrikov falls through — so now what?

The Blue Jackets have held out Gavrikov, firmly believing a deal was in place. That changed on Thursday night.

theathletic.com

So, this is the 2nd time the Yotes and Jackets have had a deal somewhat finalized only to have it go sideways at the last minute? Dang. I wish we knew the return.

 

[FSL KINGS]

Bruins also sent cap back and significant money was retained on who they picked up. Two things that its rumored Arizona isn't willing to do.

I mean for their sake I hope its not true because if it is the number of teams that can both fit him right now and are willing to part with anywhere close to the ask is very small and will most likely just mean that he is still a Coyote ten days from now.

Wait, so a player, Orlov, with a bigger cap hit than Chychrun was just retained down to 1.275M a cap dump was taken back that the caps don't care about & it was less than the Coyotes ask?

Weren't people telling me this wasn't realistic a couple days ago?

Edit: & Hathaway, a good sandpaper pick up for the playoffs, was included.

 

[Cogburn]

Wait, so a player, Orlov, with a bigger cap hit than Chychrun was just retained down to 1.275M a cap dump was taken back that the caps don't care about & it was less than the Coyotes ask?

Weren't people telling me this wasn't realistic a couple days ago?

Edit: & Hathaway, a good sandpaper pick up for the playoffs, was included.

I don't have context for the original comments, but there is a big difference between Washington and Arizona, in terms of how the finances and ownership of each team work especially.

 

[Divine]

This is all so ridiculous. Completely asinine.

You can’t tell the difference between two weeks and two months and I can’t help you. But I can definitely ignore you.

Agree to disagree then.

This is the first time in history this has happened, and you're assuming there's no negative consequences to this.

If there aren't, why isn't every team holding out all players they plan on trading? Tons of players were traded today who didn't miss a game, how is that even possible?

 

[FSL KINGS]

Is AZ cutting down to the salary floor minus Weber & Little's salary (about 13 combined) next year?
61 (if cap goes up) - 13 = 48M spent on the team.

Schmaltz @ 5.85 now in rumors. Probably backup plan if Chychrun can't be moved.

Not being able to take any salary back is going to be a major obstacle trying to acquire players from AZ.

 

[lanceuppercut75]

If Ottawa acquires Chychrun, which LHD plays on the right side? Chabot or Sanderson or Chychrun?

 

[deaderhead28]

Bill Armstrong knows Chychrun has a modified no trade clause, in which he submits a 10 team no trade list, but that doesn't become active until the 2023 - 2024 NHL season. So Armstrong does have a little pressure on him to get the best package before next season and teams know this.

 

[BB88]

At this point I'd be really surprised if the Yotes don't hold off until the offseason

& then untill next trade deadline

 

[NB613]

Sens for Chychrun

‘23 1st top 10 protected
‘24 1st top 5 protected
Thomson
Ostapchuk
Joseph

 

[BradyTkachucky]

Sens for Chychrun

‘23 1st top 10 protected
‘24 1st top 5 protected
Thomson
Ostapchuk
Joseph

WAY too much going the other way.

 

[SixthSens]

Sens for Chychrun

‘23 1st top 10 protected
‘24 1st top 5 protected
Thomson
Ostapchuk
Joseph

f*** no.

 

[CauZuki]

The year is 2034, somehow Jakob Chychrun is still being held out of the lineup.

 

[TkachukNorris79]

Sens for Chychrun

‘23 1st top 10 protected
‘24 1st top 5 protected
Thomson
Ostapchuk
Joseph

I really want Chychrun but that's too much.

That '23 1st is the best pick Arizona can get in a Chychrun deal right now, so if their asking price from the Bruins was 2 1sts, theoretically it should cost Ottawa less than 2 1sts, since their 2023 pick is going to be 15-20 spots ahead of Boston's and worth much more.

Would you rather 2 picks in the 25-32 range and probably won't touch your lineup until 2026-27? Or a Top 15 pick plus a multiple NHL-ready prospects with 2nd round value, all of which will be in your lineup within a couple years?

 

[stevo61]

So, this is the 2nd time the Yotes and Jackets have had a deal somewhat finalized only to have it go sideways at the last minute? Dang. I wish we knew the return.

Which is potentially weird if the Bruins 1st in that scenario is the deciding factor with the Columbus 2nd likely going to be a couple picks away. Seems like it would be easy enough to bridge that gap

 

[KevinRedkey]

If Ottawa acquires Chychrun, which LHD plays on the right side? Chabot or Sanderson or Chychrun?

Chychrun

 

[AZviaNJ]

One week.

7 days.

175 hours.

Then hopefully these threads can go away.

 

[hbk]

While we’re at it let’s ban LTIR, because that also increases Escrow.

We should also ban Roster Emergency Exceptions for teams with less than 20 healthy player, they increase Escrow as well.

Ban movement of players on IR or who haven’t played in a calendar year. Make the teams that signed those deals live with them. This means if Vancouver wants to LTIR OEL’s contract 2 years from now they can’t get him off the books ever and will be hamstrung by the cap.

Bill Armstrong knows Chychrun has a modified no trade clause, in which he submits a 10 team no trade list, but that doesn't become active until the 2023 - 2024 NHL season. So Armstrong does have a little pressure on him to get the best package before next season and teams know this.

Also makes it more imperative for a team likely on his list like Edmonton or Winnipeg to act while they can.

 

[herzausstein]

I cant wait till after the trade deadline and chychrun takes to the ice again sporting a brand new coyotes jersey

 

[Wondercarrot]

Sens for Chychrun

‘23 1st top 10 protected
‘24 1st top 5 protected
Thomson
Ostapchuk
Joseph

Not a chance.

 

[Golden_Jet]

They did. For 36 games. It matters because it wasn’t 42? Give me a break. This is nonsense.

He did play. And he is healthy. This in no way makes teams MORE worried about injuries they otherwise would be. Which I’ve already said.

So negligible it’s not even the difference of a 4th vs a 5th round pick. This is absurd. These are professionals not hobbyists. They weren’t going to change their opinion because of a few games. There’s a body of work.

It appears Zona is pampering him now.