Player Discussion Jack Campbell

McTonyBrar · Feb 25, 2023

f*** this fragile f***. He can get shot into the sun

Spawn · Feb 25, 2023

It's time to do the same that the LA Kings did with Cal Peterson and waive Jack Campbell. You can't play a goalie who gives up 4+ a game more often than he gives up 3 or fewer.

No hyperbole or sarcasm.

Call up Calvin Pickard and see if he can at least put up a ~.900 sv% like the Kings did with Phoenix Copley.

Buy Campbell out in the summer.

nexttothemoon · Feb 25, 2023

Stats from the last 3 seasons combined (Top 64 goalies in time on ice over those 3 seasons)...

Goalie	Team	GP	GAA	xG Against/60	Actual goals against per game compared to expected goals against
Ilya Sorokin	NYI	119	2.36	2.85	-0.49
Igor Shesterkin	NYR	129	2.38	2.79	-0.41
Connor Hellebuyck	WPG	156	2.71	3	-0.29
Juuse Saros	NSH	146	2.57	2.85	-0.28
Linus Ullmark	BOS, BUF	97	2.27	2.5	-0.23
Andrei Vasilevskiy	T.B	148	2.44	2.65	-0.21
Darcy Kuemper	ARI, COL, WSH	123	2.59	2.77	-0.18
Semyon Varlamov	NYI	86	2.52	2.7	-0.18
Frederik Andersen	CAR, TOR	95	2.42	2.58	-0.16
Mike Smith	EDM	60	2.54	2.7	-0.16
Filip Gustavsson	MIN, OTT	54	2.61	2.77	-0.16
Jake Oettinger	DAL	120	2.38	2.53	-0.15
Stuart Skinner	EDM	47	2.87	3.02	-0.15
Anthony Stolarz	ANA	55	2.9	3.04	-0.14
Anton Forsberg	OTT	82	3.01	3.11	-0.1
Jeremy Swayman	BOS	75	2.26	2.36	-0.1
Ville Husso	DET, STL	99	2.79	2.86	-0.07
Robin Lehner	VGK	63	2.66	2.73	-0.07
Antti Raanta	ARI, CAR	61	2.59	2.65	-0.06
Marc-Andre Fleury	CHI, MIN, VGK	127	2.64	2.65	-0.01
Alexandar Georgiev	COL, NYR	92	2.77	2.77	0
Thatcher Demko	VAN	114	2.92	2.91	0.01
Sergei Bobrovsky	FLA	123	2.87	2.86	0.01
Logan Thompson	VGK	56	2.66	2.65	0.01
Tristan Jarry	PIT	126	2.61	2.59	0.02
Vitek Vanecek	N.J, WSH	117	2.58	2.55	0.03
Casey DeSmith	PIT	74	2.91	2.88	0.03
Scott Wedgewood	ARI, DAL, N.J	71	3.07	3.01	0.06
Craig Anderson	BUF, WSH	55	2.91	2.85	0.06
Chris Driedger	FLA, SEA	50	2.54	2.48	0.06
Jacob Markstrom	CGY	144	2.55	2.48	0.07
John Gibson	ANA	131	3.38	3.24	0.14
Jordan Binnington	STL	124	3.02	2.88	0.14
Jonathan Quick	L.A	98	2.9	2.76	0.14
Ilya Samsonov	TOR, WSH	93	2.73	2.59	0.14
Sam Montembeault	MTL	63	3.54	3.4	0.14
Jaroslav Halak	BOS, NYR, VAN	53	2.71	2.56	0.15
James Reimer	CAR, S.J	100	2.97	2.82	0.15
Jake Allen	MTL	97	3.15	2.99	0.16
Adin Hill	ARI, S.J, VGK	67	2.64	2.48	0.16
Karel Vejmelka	ARI	92	3.54	3.35	0.19
Alex Nedeljkovic	CAR, DET	91	3	2.8	0.2
Matt Murray	OTT, TOR	66	3.08	2.88	0.2
Cam Talbot	MIN, OTT	111	2.75	2.54	0.21
Spencer Knight	FLA	57	2.91	2.69	0.22
Jack Campbell	EDM, TOR	102	2.78	2.53	0.25
Philipp Grubauer	COL, SEA	118	2.7	2.43	0.27
Cal Petersen	L.A	82	2.99	2.7	0.29
Dan Vladar	BOS, CGY	51	2.89	2.6	0.29
Carter Hart	PHI	116	3.19	2.88	0.31
Mikko Koskinen	EDM	71	3.13	2.81	0.32
Brian Elliott	PHI, T.B	63	2.83	2.48	0.35
Braden Holtby	DAL, VAN	45	3.21	2.85	0.36
Martin Jones	PHI, S.J, SEA	107	3.21	2.84	0.37
Kevin Lankinen	CHI, NSH	82	3.15	2.78	0.37
David Rittich	CGY, NSH, TOR, WPG	52	2.94	2.57	0.37
Kaapo Kahkonen	MIN, S.J	85	3.09	2.71	0.38
Mackenzie Blackwood	N.J	77	3.15	2.77	0.38
Petr Mrazek	CAR, CHI, TOR	58	3.31	2.93	0.38
Joonas Korpisalo	CBJ	83	3.45	3.01	0.44
Thomas Greiss	DET, STL	81	3.23	2.78	0.45
Elvis Merzlikins	CBJ	111	3.32	2.86	0.46
Dustin Tokarski	BUF, PIT	46	3.36	2.89	0.47
Anton Khudobin	DAL	41	2.76	2.21	0.55

Oilers essentially replaced Mike Smith with Stuart Skinner who is about as good as Mike Smith and replaced Mikko Koskinen with Jack Campbell who is about as good as Mikko Koskinen.

If they had goaltending issues before... they essentially still have goaltending issues... if they choose to play Campbell as much as or more than Skinner.

Whiston532 · Feb 25, 2023

I’ve been away from here for a while. Is Campbell the king of “sure he let in 4+ but other than that he looked solid” here like he is on r/edmontonoilers ?

Harry Curry · Feb 25, 2023

Whiston532 said:
I’ve been away from here for a while. Is Campbell the king of “sure he let in 4+ but other than that he looked solid” here like he is on r/edmontonoilers ?

One of many reasons to avoid the cesspit that is reddit.

Oilhawks · Feb 25, 2023

Harry Curry said:
One of many reasons to avoid the cesspit that is reddit.

Reddit is toxic positive like this place is toxic negative. I’ve been called many names (no filter there either) and downvoted into oblivion for date criticizing the team.

SwedishFire · Feb 25, 2023

Spawn said:
It's time to do the same that the LA Kings did with Cal Peterson and waive Jack Campbell. You can't play a goalie who gives up 4+ a game more often than he gives up 3 or fewer.

No hyperbole or sarcasm.

Call up Calvin Pickard and see if he can at least put up a ~.900 sv% like the Kings did with Phoenix Copley.

Buy Campbell out in the summer.

His style looks so weird. Playing like a socver goalie. He looks soooo unsure of his own style and positioning. Yes, I think calling up Pickard coild be a thing to try. For also giving Campbell a heads up.

McJadeddog · Feb 25, 2023

He just can’t start any more games that aren’t back to back games, he just can’t. Pathetically bad, maybe the worst goalie we’ve had in the past 5-7 years

Trafalgar Sadge Law · Feb 25, 2023

Honestly the Jack Campbell debacle should be the line in the sand when it comes to jobs. People like Brad Holland who were allegedly anti-Campbell should be pushed into more influential positions, people like Ken Holland and Dustin Schwartz who were pro-Campbell should be on watch or even outright fired (seriously why is Schwartz still here? part of Campbell's suckage is probably linked to this dude).

Spawn · Feb 25, 2023

McJadeddog said:
He just can’t start any more games that aren’t back to back games, he just can’t. Pathetically bad, maybe the worst goalie we’ve had in the past 5-7 years

5-7 years? The Oilers haven’t had goaltending this bad since we were running Conklin and Markanen as a tandem.

Trafalgar Sadge Law said:
Honestly the Jack Campbell debacle should be the line in the sand when it comes to jobs. People like Brad Holland who were allegedly anti-Campbell should be pushed into more influential positions, people like Ken Holland and Dustin Schwartz who were pro-Campbell should be on watch or even outright fired (seriously why is Schwartz still here? part of Campbell's suckage is probably linked to this dude).

Brad Holland is a grifter. When his dad is out the door I hope the next person with him is his son. Glorified travel agent.

Oilhawks · Feb 25, 2023

I don’t think even Campbell’s own mother would give him any non b2b starts now, hopefully Skinner is ready for a steady diet of starts.

McShogun99 · Feb 25, 2023

Our goaltending has been crap since Mcdavids 3rd year with the team. Is we had 2016-17 Talbot on this current team we’d be legit contenders.

Trafalgar Sadge Law · Feb 25, 2023

Spawn said:
5-7 years? The Oilers haven’t had goaltending this bad since we were running Conklin and Markanen as a tandem.

Brad Holland is a grifter. When his dad is out the door I hope the next person with him is his son. Glorified travel agent.

I'm not a fan of the Brad Holland hire either, but just him being anti Jack Campbell alone means I'll take his opinions more seriously than Holland Sr.

TKB21 · Feb 25, 2023

Any other goaltender that is putting up Campbells numbers would have a one way ticket to the echl. The guys in the AHL literally couldn’t be any worse…

KeithIsActuallyBad · Feb 25, 2023

Fire Dustin Schwartz.

KarmaPolice · Feb 25, 2023

Oilhawks said:
I don’t think even Campbell’s own mother would give him any non b2b starts now, hopefully Skinner is ready for a steady diet of starts.

Tough for a rookie goalie to take the pressure that comes with this team's playoff hopes and aspirations, but we have to hope he's up for it. I'd say it could potentially ruin him and his development if not. The management better be aware of this and make sure we're doing the right thing with how the entire goalie situation is being handled.

CantHaveTkachev · Feb 25, 2023

4 more years with this guy
Buy-out candidate after next year if he doesn’t improve

nexttothemoon · Feb 25, 2023

Stats from just this year...

Top 64 goalies in the league in time on ice this season:

Rank	Goalie	Team	GP	GAA	xG Against/60	GAA vs expected GA/60
1	Ilya Sorokin	NYI	45	2.41	3.28	-0.87
2	Linus Ullmark	BOS	36	1.88	2.63	-0.75
3	Connor Hellebuyck	WPG	45	2.46	3.08	-0.62
4	Filip Gustavsson	MIN	27	2.11	2.66	-0.55
5	Jake Oettinger	DAL	43	2.24	2.79	-0.55
6	Sam Montembeault	MTL	25	3.24	3.76	-0.52
7	Juuse Saros	NSH	43	2.82	3.31	-0.49
8	Craig Anderson	BUF	20	2.7	3.13	-0.43
9	Andrei Vasilevskiy	T.B	43	2.6	2.95	-0.35
10	Pyotr Kochetkov	CAR	19	2.33	2.67	-0.34
11	Alexandar Georgiev	COL	40	2.67	2.97	-0.3
12	Vitek Vanecek	N.J	38	2.37	2.67	-0.3
13	Ilya Samsonov	TOR	30	2.35	2.65	-0.3
14	Connor Ingram	ARI	20	3.16	3.45	-0.29
15	Stuart Skinner	EDM	33	2.9	3.17	-0.27
16	Jeremy Swayman	BOS	24	2.34	2.6	-0.26
17	Darcy Kuemper	WSH	40	2.69	2.91	-0.22
18	Joonas Korpisalo	CBJ	28	3.13	3.34	-0.21
19	Semyon Varlamov	NYI	19	2.82	3.02	-0.2
20	Mackenzie Blackwood	N.J	17	3.04	3.24	-0.2
21	Pavel Francouz	COL	15	2.53	2.71	-0.18
22	Scott Wedgewood	DAL	18	2.92	3.09	-0.17
23	Igor Shesterkin	NYR	42	2.67	2.83	-0.16
24	Matt Murray	TOR	19	2.73	2.89	-0.16
25	Carter Hart	PHI	44	2.94	3.08	-0.14
26	Pheonix Copley	L.A	25	2.73	2.87	-0.14
27	Karel Vejmelka	ARI	40	3.38	3.5	-0.12
28	Jaroslav Halak	NYR	18	2.72	2.83	-0.11
29	Brian Elliott	T.B	14	2.9	3	-0.1
30	Frederik Andersen	CAR	19	2.43	2.53	-0.1
31	Tristan Jarry	PIT	30	2.79	2.87	-0.08
32	Cam Talbot	OTT	29	2.9	2.98	-0.08
33	Anton Forsberg	OTT	28	3.26	3.34	-0.08
34	David Rittich	WPG	16	2.43	2.51	-0.08
35	Sergei Bobrovsky	FLA	38	3.12	3.18	-0.06
36	Antti Raanta	CAR	21	2.32	2.38	-0.06
37	Anthony Stolarz	ANA	19	3.73	3.79	-0.06
38	Casey DeSmith	PIT	28	3.28	3.31	-0.03
39	Ville Husso	DET	42	2.85	2.86	-0.01
40	Charlie Lindgren	WSH	25	2.71	2.71	0
41	Philipp Grubauer	SEA	23	2.97	2.97	0
42	Logan Thompson	VGK	36	2.66	2.64	0.02
43	Adin Hill	VGK	23	2.55	2.49	0.06
44	Jordan Binnington	STL	46	3.25	3.16	0.09
45	John Gibson	ANA	40	4.01	3.92	0.09
46	Jake Allen	MTL	33	3.42	3.31	0.11
47	Marc-Andre Fleury	MIN	35	2.89	2.76	0.13
48	Martin Jones	SEA	38	2.95	2.77	0.18
49	Jacob Markstrom	CGY	38	2.93	2.71	0.22
50	Dan Vladar	CGY	23	2.9	2.66	0.24
51	Spencer Knight	FLA	21	3.18	2.83	0.35
52	Collin Delia	VAN	15	3.51	3.12	0.39
53	Thomas Greiss	STL	16	3.54	3.14	0.4
54	Arvid Soderblom	CHI	15	3.45	3.05	0.4
55	James Reimer	S.J	30	3.29	2.88	0.41
56	Ukko-Pekka Luukkonen	BUF	24	3.55	3.13	0.42
57	Petr Mrazek	CHI	26	3.86	3.35	0.51
58	Eric Comrie	BUF	15	3.59	3.01	0.58
59	Kaapo Kahkonen	S.J	25	3.6	2.97	0.63
60	Jonathan Quick	L.A	30	3.44	2.73	0.71
61	Jack Campbell	EDM	31	3.48	2.74	0.74
62	Thatcher Demko	VAN	15	3.93	3.02	0.91
63	Spencer Martin	VAN	29	3.99	3.01	0.98
64	Elvis Merzlikins	CBJ	24	4.21	3.01	1.2

Skinner isn't the problem... he's been playing like a middling starter (15th in the NHL).

Campbell on the other hand has been playing like a really crappy back up. 61st... 4th worst numbers in the NHL.

The difference between Skinner and Campbell has been 1.01 goals against compared to expected goals against... so anytime you are putting Campbell in net over Skinner... you are basically gifting the opposing team a 1 goal lead even before the game begins.

CROTT · Feb 25, 2023

nexttothemoon said:
Skinner isn't the problem... he's been playing like a middling starter (15th in the NHL).

Campbell on the other hand has been playing like a really crappy back up. 61st... 4th worst numbers in the NHL.

The difference between Skinner and Campbell has been 1.01 goals against compared to expected goals against... so anytime you are putting Campbell in net over Skinner... you are basically gifting the opposing team a 1 goal lead even before the game begins.

Worse than Markstrom/Vladar.... Yikes.

Spawn · Feb 27, 2023

So I was watching highlights from other games around the league and I saw
goalies making difficult saves when there is a defensive breakdown!? It can’t be. Campbell apologists say that’s impossible!

yukoner88 · Feb 27, 2023

is there a way we can delete this contract?

im in the camp of buying this guy out

Drivesaitl · Feb 27, 2023

nexttothemoon said:
Stats from just this year...

Top 64 goalies in the league in time on ice this season:

Rank
Goalie
Team
GP
GAA
xG Against/60
GAA vs expected GA/60
1
Ilya Sorokin
NYI
45
2.41
3.28
-0.87
2
Linus Ullmark
BOS
36
1.88
2.63
-0.75
3
Connor Hellebuyck
WPG
45
2.46
3.08
-0.62
4
Filip Gustavsson
MIN
27
2.11
2.66
-0.55
5
Jake Oettinger
DAL
43
2.24
2.79
-0.55
6
Sam Montembeault
MTL
25
3.24
3.76
-0.52
7
Juuse Saros
NSH
43
2.82
3.31
-0.49
8
Craig Anderson
BUF
20
2.7
3.13
-0.43
9
Andrei Vasilevskiy
T.B
43
2.6
2.95
-0.35
10
Pyotr Kochetkov
CAR
19
2.33
2.67
-0.34
11
Alexandar Georgiev
COL
40
2.67
2.97
-0.3
12
Vitek Vanecek
N.J
38
2.37
2.67
-0.3
13
Ilya Samsonov
TOR
30
2.35
2.65
-0.3
14
Connor Ingram
ARI
20
3.16
3.45
-0.29
15
Stuart Skinner
EDM
33
2.9
3.17
-0.27
16
Jeremy Swayman
BOS
24
2.34
2.6
-0.26
17
Darcy Kuemper
WSH
40
2.69
2.91
-0.22
18
Joonas Korpisalo
CBJ
28
3.13
3.34
-0.21
19
Semyon Varlamov
NYI
19
2.82
3.02
-0.2
20
Mackenzie Blackwood
N.J
17
3.04
3.24
-0.2
21
Pavel Francouz
COL
15
2.53
2.71
-0.18
22
Scott Wedgewood
DAL
18
2.92
3.09
-0.17
23
Igor Shesterkin
NYR
42
2.67
2.83
-0.16
24
Matt Murray
TOR
19
2.73
2.89
-0.16
25
Carter Hart
PHI
44
2.94
3.08
-0.14
26
Pheonix Copley
L.A
25
2.73
2.87
-0.14
27
Karel Vejmelka
ARI
40
3.38
3.5
-0.12
28
Jaroslav Halak
NYR
18
2.72
2.83
-0.11
29
Brian Elliott
T.B
14
2.9
3
-0.1
30
Frederik Andersen
CAR
19
2.43
2.53
-0.1
31
Tristan Jarry
PIT
30
2.79
2.87
-0.08
32
Cam Talbot
OTT
29
2.9
2.98
-0.08
33
Anton Forsberg
OTT
28
3.26
3.34
-0.08
34
David Rittich
WPG
16
2.43
2.51
-0.08
35
Sergei Bobrovsky
FLA
38
3.12
3.18
-0.06
36
Antti Raanta
CAR
21
2.32
2.38
-0.06
37
Anthony Stolarz
ANA
19
3.73
3.79
-0.06
38
Casey DeSmith
PIT
28
3.28
3.31
-0.03
39
Ville Husso
DET
42
2.85
2.86
-0.01
40
Charlie Lindgren
WSH
25
2.71
2.71
0
41
Philipp Grubauer
SEA
23
2.97
2.97
0
42
Logan Thompson
VGK
36
2.66
2.64
0.02
43
Adin Hill
VGK
23
2.55
2.49
0.06
44
Jordan Binnington
STL
46
3.25
3.16
0.09
45
John Gibson
ANA
40
4.01
3.92
0.09
46
Jake Allen
MTL
33
3.42
3.31
0.11
47
Marc-Andre Fleury
MIN
35
2.89
2.76
0.13
48
Martin Jones
SEA
38
2.95
2.77
0.18
49
Jacob Markstrom
CGY
38
2.93
2.71
0.22
50
Dan Vladar
CGY
23
2.9
2.66
0.24
51
Spencer Knight
FLA
21
3.18
2.83
0.35
52
Collin Delia
VAN
15
3.51
3.12
0.39
53
Thomas Greiss
STL
16
3.54
3.14
0.4
54
Arvid Soderblom
CHI
15
3.45
3.05
0.4
55
James Reimer
S.J
30
3.29
2.88
0.41
56
Ukko-Pekka Luukkonen
BUF
24
3.55
3.13
0.42
57
Petr Mrazek
CHI
26
3.86
3.35
0.51
58
Eric Comrie
BUF
15
3.59
3.01
0.58
59
Kaapo Kahkonen
S.J
25
3.6
2.97
0.63
60
Jonathan Quick
L.A
30
3.44
2.73
0.71
61
Jack Campbell
EDM
31
3.48
2.74
0.74
62
Thatcher Demko
VAN
15
3.93
3.02
0.91
63
Spencer Martin
VAN
29
3.99
3.01
0.98
64
Elvis Merzlikins
CBJ
24
4.21
3.01
1.2

Skinner isn't the problem... he's been playing like a middling starter (15th in the NHL).

Campbell on the other hand has been playing like a really crappy back up. 61st... 4th worst numbers in the NHL.

The difference between Skinner and Campbell has been 1.01 goals against compared to expected goals against... so anytime you are putting Campbell in net over Skinner... you are basically gifting the opposing team a 1 goal lead even before the game begins.

Important to mention though that the list is ranked on Expected GA vs GA. Thats it. Just mentioning this as people tend to look at information superficially. But the above is ranking goalies entirely on a stat lacking validity or substantiation. What we see as a reulst is a lot of noise and goalie we would expect to be better down the list and vice versa. The degree of random seemingly pronounced in the list.

Note as well where the list is putting goalies like Vladar and Markstrom. The scoring seems to imply that the "so good Calgary Flames" are letting in way more goals than should be expected. I think that notion is absolute nonsense. Indeed what gets doubled down on lists like this is that flawed parameters that were predicting some clubs to be great (Calgary) are now saying the actual results have not met with what ought to occur. lol

Theres something to be seen with stats like this but take with grain of salt and flesh out the noise in the stats. No metric is close to ideal for measuring goalie play.

Drivesaitl · Feb 27, 2023

CROTT said:
Worse than Markstrom/Vladar.... Yikes.

Vladar has been pretty good in Calgary. They give up a ton of chances. Calgary are just a bad team. If anything their goalies have kept them in the running for a number of years and Markstrom just last season. The look at Calgary goalies being the fault for the team is ridiculous. Just a year ago they were staking out a record number of shutouts. For a longwhile last season Flames were poised to have the most shutouts in any season, ever, by any team. If anything Calgary are so bad now that even that level of goaltending that got them a dozen shutouts can't even save them. I think this is the more realistic view. It isn't their goalies failing them and we're only one season removed from the goalies being the best flames.

5 Mins 4 Ftg · Feb 27, 2023

Drivesaitl said:
Important to mention though that the list is ranked on Expected GA vs GA. Thats it. Just mentioning this as people tend to look at information superficially. But the above is ranking goalies entirely on a stat lacking validity or substantiation. What we see as a reulst is a lot of noise and goalie we would expect to be better down the list and vice versa. The degree of random seemingly pronounced in the list.

Note as well where the list is putting goalies like Vladar and Markstrom. The scoring seems to implay that the "so good Calgary Flames" are letting in way more goals than should be expected. I think that notion is absolute nonsense. INdeed what gets doubled down on lists like this is that flawed parameters that were predicting some clubs to be great (Calgary) are now saying the actual results have not met with what ought to occur. lol

Theres something to be seen with stats like this but take with grain of salt and flesh out the noise in the stats. No metric is close to ideal for measuring goalie play.

Now that “expected” this and “expected” that are the Twitterlytics Stat du Jour, actual real stats and performance have taken a back seat amongst the “I only know the game through Excel” community.

“Expected” is as you say a very subjective stat and a laughable one at that.

CROTT · Feb 27, 2023

5 Mins 4 Ftg said:
Now that “expected” this and “expected” that are the Twitterlytics Stat du Jour, actual real stats and performance have taken a back seat amongst the “I only know the game through Excel” community.

“Expected” is as you say a very subjective stat and a laughable one at that.

I agree with this to some extent, though it seams like there is a very high almost 100% probability to have an “expected” 4 GA when Campbell is in net.

Player Discussion Jack Campbell

Registered User

Something in the water

and again...

Registered User

Registered User

Over Old Hills

Registered User

Registered User

Registered User

Something in the water

Over Old Hills

Registered User

Registered User

Registered User

You thrust your pelvis, huh!

Snack enthusiast

Accruing Cap Space

and again...

Registered User

Something in the water

Registered User

Finding Hemingway

Finding Hemingway

Life is better with no expectations.

Registered User

Ad

Ad

Ad