Confirmed with Link: It's Started! (Management firings)

Status
Not open for further replies.

ericstrat1

Registered User
Oct 29, 2010
198
72
Anyone who doesn’t think that his voice, as likely the longest tenured Pens employee at the table and one most closely working with the new GM team, won’t be given the most weight is delusional


Let's see who they hire before getting too Sully despondent. This isn't the old boys club of Mario, we've got slick corporate double-talkers in charge now who may love Sully or are just bs'ing us and he'll be fired by the new GM.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Andy99

MetalheadPenguinsFan

Registered User
Sep 17, 2009
66,864
20,713
Canada
Yep, the dreaded “we’ll learn from this” rears its ugly head…be better than this Sid! Lol



Called it the night we got the boot….

These FSG chucklef***wads are probably still writing their Excuse-O-Dex list right about now.

Or they’ll try and spin some garbage narrative about how “Sully knows that next season can/will be “different” because “he knows that they are a bunch who will “learn” from this humbling wake-up call.”

Or some such Beantown f***ing garbage…… :rolleyes:

Honestly f*** the culture of this team….
 
  • Like
Reactions: Andy99

Freeptop

Registered User
Jun 17, 2009
2,409
1,318
Pittsburgh, PA
It's funny how many conclusions are jumped to around here based on interpreting what is basically marketing-speak and then extrapolating things that were never said.

When Shero was fired, but Bylsma wasn't fired on the same day, these boards had all the same "we're definitely stuck with Bylsma!" posts that we see about Sullivan. We even had the same sort of "he's a good coach and we like him" from ownership at the time.

Then Rutherford was hired, and Bylsma was fired first thing.

It's still possible a new GM could decide to retain Sullivan, but Beeston specifically said it would be the call of the new GM. Which means that ownership is not going to tell them they have to keep him.
To me, that says it's more likely than not that Sullivan won't be kept, because a new GM is going to want to hire their own coach.

There's also this weird idea that Sullivan is going to choose the new GM. It has been stated several times now that he isn't involved in hiring the new GM. His duties in the interim are exactly what any head coach would be doing this time of year: evaluation of players, and attempting to figure out where they want to go next year. Since he hasn't been fired as of yet, having him continue to do the job that he currently holds should not be interpreted as some sort of weird "he has ultimate power!" like seems to be happening around here.

One other thing to consider - normally when a GM is fired, one of the Assistants gets an Interim title to run things. FSG cleared the entire front office. There is no AGM to take over. But the team is still there, and things still need to be taken care of. That leads to an unusual circumstance where they have people who otherwise wouldn't be involved in this stuff taking care of things. That said, none of the duties Sullivan listed sounded like anything that wouldn't normally be a Head Coach's responsibility in the offseason.

I get that the pessimism is built up over time from experience, but remember: almost all of that experience comes from a time under different ownership. We don't know how FSG will do things yet. This summer will give us our first real insight into it.
 

Big Friggin Dummy

Registered User
Feb 22, 2019
25,894
25,080
Even if everything goes well, which is pretty much never does, you're probably realistically looking at an entire season of rearranging things to get this team anywhere close to the level it needs to be at in order to challenge for a Cup again. This isn't a team that needs tinkering, it needs major roster surgery and doesn't really have the cap situation or assets to do it.
 

Honour Over Glory

#firesully
Jan 30, 2012
81,385
45,799
Let's see who they hire before getting too Sully despondent. This isn't the old boys club of Mario, we've got slick corporate double-talkers in charge now who may love Sully or are just bs'ing us and he'll be fired by the new GM.
If a new GM doesn't "Bylsma" Sullivan immediately after being hired, you'll have your answer.
 

DesertedPenguin

Registered User
Mar 11, 2007
7,441
8,370
It's funny how many conclusions are jumped to around here based on interpreting what is basically marketing-speak and then extrapolating things that were never said.

When Shero was fired, but Bylsma wasn't fired on the same day, these boards had all the same "we're definitely stuck with Bylsma!" posts that we see about Sullivan. We even had the same sort of "he's a good coach and we like him" from ownership at the time.

Then Rutherford was hired, and Bylsma was fired first thing.

It's still possible a new GM could decide to retain Sullivan, but Beeston specifically said it would be the call of the new GM. Which means that ownership is not going to tell them they have to keep him.
To me, that says it's more likely than not that Sullivan won't be kept, because a new GM is going to want to hire their own coach.

There's also this weird idea that Sullivan is going to choose the new GM. It has been stated several times now that he isn't involved in hiring the new GM. His duties in the interim are exactly what any head coach would be doing this time of year: evaluation of players, and attempting to figure out where they want to go next year. Since he hasn't been fired as of yet, having him continue to do the job that he currently holds should not be interpreted as some sort of weird "he has ultimate power!" like seems to be happening around here.

One other thing to consider - normally when a GM is fired, one of the Assistants gets an Interim title to run things. FSG cleared the entire front office. There is no AGM to take over. But the team is still there, and things still need to be taken care of. That leads to an unusual circumstance where they have people who otherwise wouldn't be involved in this stuff taking care of things. That said, none of the duties Sullivan listed sounded like anything that wouldn't normally be a Head Coach's responsibility in the offseason.

I get that the pessimism is built up over time from experience, but remember: almost all of that experience comes from a time under different ownership. We don't know how FSG will do things yet. This summer will give us our first real insight into it.
Logic and reason have no place on a message board.

Jim Rutherford had a large front office staff when he was first hired. Multiple assistants, people in specialized roles, etc. As people left for other organizations, he never replaced them. By the time he quit, Allvin was basically the only assistant GM left and he was largely in a scouting role.

Enter Hextall. He started to rebuild the front office, but many of his hires were people he worked with previously like Chris Pryor.

Given that FSG is on record for wanting to reshape the entire structure of the front office and that it is not likely going to give major responsibilities to someone closely tied to the men it just fired, it's not surprising that the following three men were given the responsibilities of managing the day to day operations for the next few weeks:

- Alec Schall, director of hockey ops - he's a former agent and oversaw contracts and the cap. He's going to get all the end of season financial stuff in order for the next administration.

- Erik Heasley, manager of hockey ops and WBS GM - he assists with amateur and college free agent scouting and player development. He's going to be making sure the prospects have a plan for the summer and helping the remaining scouts keep preparing for the draft.

- Andy Saucier, hockey operations analyst - video guru was promoted to work more with analytics and pro scouting. Guarantee his assignment will be to lead the video team in pulling video on free agents so that the new staff can hit the ground running.

The official release said Mike Sullivan would assist the above three. There's one area of off-season work that doesn't fall under the umbrellas of the above three guys, and that's ensuring that the NHL players have their medical evaluations, off-season workout plans, and other details taken care of. Sullivan likely assisted in that process before but now he will be the primary one coordinating all of it.

None of that has anything to do with hiring a new GM. People misread the release. None of these guys, including Sullivan, will have a direct role in hiring a GM.

Sullivan very well could be back next year. In fact, it's quite probable. But a new GM could quite possibly tell FSG, "I know you like Mike, but I'm confident I can hire XYZ and give us a fresh start" and FSG will be on board with it.
 

Pens x

Registered User
Oct 8, 2016
16,387
8,170
Sullivan very well could be back next year. In fact, it's quite probable. But a new GM could quite possibly tell FSG, "I know you like Mike, but I'm confident I can hire XYZ and give us a fresh start" and FSG will be on board with it.
You dont actually believe this, right?

Edit: I have some volcano insurance to sell if you are interested.
 

Pens x

Registered User
Oct 8, 2016
16,387
8,170
Wasn’t it a pretty much done deal that Bylsma would be fired? I bet there weren’t quotes from ownership praising him when Shero was fired.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Gurglesons

Sidney the Kidney

One last time
Jun 29, 2009
56,750
49,143
Anyone who doesn’t think that his voice, as likely the longest tenured Pens employee at the table and one most closely working with the new GM team, won’t be given the most weight is delusional



Oh joy. Sullivan's part of the process of assessing needs and what this team lacks.

So don't bother hoping for any additions to upgrade the talent level, just a bunch of vanilla players who can be used on the PK.
 

AjaxTelamon

Registered User
Jul 8, 2011
6,090
1,857
If in fact they get a Theo Epstein-esque moneyball guy in here that's creative and given the directive to win now at all costs (and what other directive could they get?) then I am actually optimistic and curious about how this all plays out.

And I think there's a lot more flexibility with this roster for a GM who is creative than it seems like. We can buy out Rust and Granlund for actually really cheap over the next couple of years:

Rust cap hit:
2023-24: $670k
2024-25: $670k
2025-26: $1,600k

Granlund cap hit:
2023-24: $833k
2024-25: $1,800k
2025-26: $1,800k

Then you have like 30m in cap space, you already have a great top line, a top D pair, a 2C, and the right side of your D is basically covered if our dipshit coach can figure out how to use Petry. Play O'Connor with Geno. Obviously better to just trade Granlund with a sweetener, which should also be possible.

This is actually a great GM opportunity. If it works out you're a hero, and if not who cares.
 
  • Like
Reactions: CascadiaPenguin

Pens x

Registered User
Oct 8, 2016
16,387
8,170
This is actually a great GM opportunity. If it works out you're a hero, and if not who cares.
You’re handcuffed by the owners saying you are going to need to give Sully another chance, and that they pinky promise you can fire him [in 2026].

But you should still be able to find a good GM. How many of these jobs open up a year? People will overlook some wrinkles with teams if they are offered the position.

But the hemorrhoid that is Sully will make the position a little less enticing unless they find a dinosaur GM or wuss that actually still believes the fool is a good coach.
 

Big Friggin Dummy

Registered User
Feb 22, 2019
25,894
25,080
Oh hell yeah. From the guy who brought "buy out Zucker" all last summer comes the new hit "buy out Rust and Granlund." :laugh:

And next summer, it'll be "buy out Jarry and Dumoulin".
 
  • Like
Reactions: Pens x

cygnus47

Registered User
Sep 14, 2013
7,606
2,707
We can definitely trade Rust without buying him out. One bad season doesn't take you from valuable to buyout, even if we see flaws developing. We just won't get much back for him. It's probably the ideal time to trade him.

Granlund on the other hand...
 

Big Friggin Dummy

Registered User
Feb 22, 2019
25,894
25,080
I want someone to buy ME out. No, actually I want someone to buy our Rust and give me the money instead.
Amen.

Shit, they were paying Hextall $3.5 million a year to have agoraphobia. I'll take $300k and do no worse of a job.

Trade Granlund retained for a second at the draft.
*Trade Granlund and a second for an expiring contract at the draft

Is probably much more realistic. :laugh:
 

Flying Dego

Registered User
Apr 30, 2013
5,253
6,433
Oh hell yeah. From the guy who brought "buy out Zucker" all last summer comes the new hit "buy out Rust and Granlund." :laugh:

And next summer, it'll be "buy out Jarry and Dumoulin".
My two guesses. Call them my pessimism:

-Sully is retained by the new GM maybe ownership allows them to sacrifice the assistants yet again.

-if this happens I'm highly confident they extend old Dumo. Still playing top LD minutes, setting a career high in points. Smells to me like a 4x4 NTC deal. People can poo poo this but I'll believe in change once I see it.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad