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Post-Game Talk: ITS OVER- Did we make a huge mistake on Pierre-Luc Dubois Thread?

“Would you rather that the Habs trade for Dubois or instead wait and try to sign him when he becomes

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Destopcorner

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Apr 29, 2018
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nhlfan9191 said:
I agree. My comment was more in response to your top 10 comment. Like I said he was a feel good story. He played extremely well given what he had to work with and where he was previous. But he’s nothing more than a stop gap. He lacks talent and it gets exposed the moment he’s not on his A game.
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This year he was constant enough to warrant more than a stop gap chair. Next season will determine his faith with us for sure.

What I meant by top 10 is there is less than 10 goalies who would have done significantly better in his 40 shots +/20 outman rush per game normality. Frankly, he did so good. Sammy is a former 1st with talent and size so maybe, maybe... he just needed more time?
 
Corky

Corky

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Destopcorner said:
You think a top 5 with Bedard, Caufield, Suzuki, Dubois and Dach isn't close to make the playoffs? I think it's one of the best of the league but agree to disagree
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Agreed that's a pretty strong top 5 that you can also round out with Slaf. Caufield, Suzuki, Dach and Dubois are all young players but pretty used to the league by now (Caufield cup run helped).

Slaf and Bedard would be pretty green, but in the case of Bedard, does that really matter, he's a generational talent probably making an impact year 1.

Our defense is missing a Pietrangelo type but as a group, they are nothing to be ashamed of. Matheson, Guhle, Xekaj, Savard, Harris, Kova is a decent group (but not a great group). The fact that we have been running 4 rookies on defense this year will reap dividends as these guys gained valuable experience.

The bottom 6 is fine, not elite. RHP, Anderson, Dvorak is a fine 3rd line. Evans, Gallagher and Heineman is a fine 4th line.

Goaltending I would agree is a question mark.

To me, great top 6, adequate bottom 6, top 4, goaltending. Enough to compete for the playoffs, not enough to win a Stanley Cup. Some good pieces coming up in Hutson, Roy, Beck, Heineman, Mailloux, Engstrom to move us from playoff contender to Stanley cup contender but that's not for 2024.

Goalie of the future remains a question mark to be addressed. I would like to see Monty play in a more pressured situation,

Obviously, this all hinges on us winning the lottery. Without Bedard, we are missing an elite talent (jury still out on Caufield).
 
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Nico Cauzuki

Nico Cauzuki

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Jul 19, 2009
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Seb said:
If we pick 1 or 2, do we still trade for PLD?
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personally i woudlnt i would use the Florida pick for a RD or G ( gotta focus on the cap also )

in 2/3 years

Roy - Bedard - Dach
Slafkovsky - Suzuki - Caufield

should be a great top 6

Guhle - X ( trade )
Matheson - Mailloux
Hutson - Barron
Xhekaj

obviously trades and ufas will happen but something around this
 
LaP

LaP

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Jun 27, 2012
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Destopcorner said:
All those teams didnt have a Suzuki/Caufield/PLD/Dach foresome ready to rock with the rookie star. Plus I wonder what Monty could have done to have some respect around here. He played like a top10 goalie this year behind one of the shittiest team ever. Starting by saying "not with those goalies" is not fair since no other would have done better in his situation.
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Pens had a pretty decent team.

They had Crosby.
Thye had Recchi who did that year 57 points in 63 games.
They had Palffy who had 42 points in 42 games.
They had LeClair with 51 points. Good vets group to surround Crosby.
They had Gonchar who was one of the best dman in the league and who was in integral part of their cup winning team two years later.
They had MAF in net.
Scuderi and Orpik were there they were both part of the cup wining top 6. In fact half their defense was the same as the cup winning team and the goalie was the same.

Yet they missed the playoffs. While Crosby did 102 points in his first season he was not anywhere near the players he was 3 years later. He weas raw defensively and was unable to win a faceoffs in his first year. Bedard will be the same for his first two years. He'll do points but he'll be raw and the rest of the team is not good enough. They wont finish bottom 10 with Bedard but they'll still miss for at least one year.
 
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CrAzYNiNe

CrAzYNiNe

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Jun 5, 2003
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Corky said:
Agreed that's a pretty strong top 5 that you can also round out with Slaf. Caufield, Suzuki, Dach and Dubois are all young players but pretty used to the league by now (Caufield cup run helped).

Slaf and Bedard would be pretty green, but in the case of Bedard, does that really matter, he's a generational talent probably making an impact year 1.

Our defense is missing a Pietrangelo type but as a group, they are nothing to be ashamed of. Matheson, Guhle, Xekaj, Savard, Harris, Kova is a decent group (but not a great group). The fact that we have been running 4 rookies on defense this year will reap dividends as these guys gained valuable experience.

The bottom 6 is fine, not elite. RHP, Anderson, Dvorak is a fine 3rd line. Evans, Gallagher and Heineman is a fine 4th line.

Goaltending I would agree is a question mark.

To me, great top 6, adequate bottom 6, top 4, goaltending. Enough to compete for the playoffs, not enough to win a Stanley Cup. Some good pieces coming up in Hutson, Roy, Beck, Heineman, Mailloux, Engstrom to move us from playoff contender to Stanley cup contender but that's not for 2024.

Goalie of the future remains a question mark to be addressed. I would like to see Monty play in a more pressured situation,

Obviously, this all hinges on us winning the lottery. Without Bedard, we are missing an elite talent (jury still out on Caufield).
Click to expand...

I'm only going to focus on the D part of your post. The D lacks top end talent and stability. Hopefully the top end talent can be found within (Guhle plus another player). Matheson appears to be better than I thought. The rest of the guys need to step up and prove they aren't just NHL players by default. I'm hopeful the D finds its way with the prospects, but I also feel one or maybe 2 moves will be needed when this team decides it's time to compete and not just meander in perpetuity.
 
Benstheman

Benstheman

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Nov 20, 2014
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Seb said:
If we pick 1 or 2, do we still trade for PLD?
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Even more so.

CrAzYNiNe said:
I'm only going to focus on the D part of your post. The D lacks top end talent and stability. Hopefully the top end talent can be found within (Guhle plus another player). Matheson appears to be better than I thought. The rest of the guys need to step up and prove they aren't just NHL players by default. I'm hopeful the D finds its way with the prospects, but I also feel one or maybe 2 moves will be needed when this team decides it's time to compete and not just meander in perpetuity.
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Yeah Matheson should be no.3-4 D. Guhle needs a solid partner on the right side so we get a real 1st pair to play against other teams top line.
 
CrAzYNiNe

CrAzYNiNe

who could have predicted?
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LaP said:
Pens had a pretty decent team.

They had Crosby.
Thye had Recchi who did that year 57 points in 63 games.
They had Palffy who had 42 points in 42 games.
They had LeClair with 51 points. Good vets group to surround Crosby.
They had Gonchar who was one of the best dman in the league and who was in integral part of their cup winning team two years later.
They had MAF in net.
Scuderi and Orpik were there they were both part of the cup wining top 6. In fact half their defense was the same as the cup winning team and the goalie was the same.

Yet they missed the playoffs. While Crosby did 102 points in his first season he was not anywhere near the players he was 3 years later. He weas raw defensively and was unable to win a faceoffs in his first year. Bedard will be the same for his first two years. He'll do points but he'll be raw and the rest of the team is not good enough. They wont finish bottom 10 with Bedard but they'll still miss for at least one year.
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The Pens had players at the end of their careers and that season they were plagued with injuries (just did a double check and you can see on hockeydb they used a ton of players).

The talk of Bedard is rather silly, but I can't help myself either! If we do land him, it will be a rather interesting situation that we cannot look back to 2005 for comparable. The NHL is a VERY different game than it was in 2005. Banking on top quality ELC players seems to be how teams win championships. Let's see if that trend continues!
 
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nhlfan9191

nhlfan9191

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Aug 4, 2010
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Stompin Paul Peller said:
If we get a deal on Dubois, and/or win draft lottery, I think Habs should be all in next season to make playoffs.
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How are we fixing the defence and goaltending? RHD are as hard to get as good centers. We were spoiled for a decade with Subban/Weber and Petry. We also lack depth. Our bottom 6 doesn’t add balanced offence/defence. We have a long way to go and that’s IF we win the lottery which the odds are strongly against us. Our fans need to settle down and respect the process.
 
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Kudo Shinichi

Kudo Shinichi

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Seb said:
If we pick 1 or 2, do we still trade for PLD?
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Yes. Take advantage of having Bedard/Fantili on elc. Gallagher will have 1 year left when their elc end. When his contract is gone, that will free up a lot of cap space.
 
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Captain Mountain

Captain Mountain

Formerly Captain Wolverine
Jun 6, 2010
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Seb said:
If we pick 1 or 2, do we still trade for PLD?
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Maybe? There's more incentive to go for him now, but there's also more incentive to look at other deals.

If Montreal ends up with center depth of Bedard/Fantilli, Suzuki and Dach, then it makes more sense to see what a hypothetical Dubois trade package gets you elsewhere, because you'd probably be moving Dach to the wing on a permanent basis and may even move one of Dubois/Suzuki to the wing. Maybe Lafreniere becomes of available if the Rangers have cap trouble? Or a young RD? Perhaps Meier can't come to terms with NJ?

Dubois makes sense for Montreal if its a cheaper deal than would otherwise be there. That doesn't change if Montreal wins the lottery, it just means Montreal shops elsewhere instead of hanging on to their assets.
 
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Favster

Favster

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Jul 21, 2013
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The ball is 100% in the Jets court. At this point they know he will not resign, other teams know he won't resign with them even if they trade for him this offseason so his trade value is basically a rental at this point, even for the Habs.

The question is, what are you willing to pay for 1 year of Dubois?

That is how I would look at the trade if I was part of the Habs management team.
 
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BLONG7

BLONG7

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Oct 30, 2002
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Easy boys....................easy. This thread has turned into a dream scenario where we have Bedard, and PLD???
Title change on the thread, to I like Dreaming?

Hate to bust the party up.............................we are more than likely to draft 5-7 and trading for PLD is not a given, but there is a chance ( cue the Jim Carey pic )
I do really think the Jets trade him our way, but, there is always a but........
 
Estimated_Prophet

Estimated_Prophet

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Mar 28, 2003
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Captain Mountain said:
Maybe? There's more incentive to go for him now, but there's also more incentive to look at other deals.

If Montreal ends up with center depth of Bedard/Fantilli, Suzuki and Dach, then it makes more sense to see what a hypothetical Dubois trade package gets you elsewhere, because you'd probably be moving Dach to the wing on a permanent basis and may even move one of Dubois/Suzuki to the wing. Maybe Lafreniere becomes of available if the Rangers have cap trouble? Or a young RD? Perhaps Meier can't come to terms with NJ?

Dubois makes sense for Montreal if its a cheaper deal than would otherwise be there. That doesn't change if Montreal wins the lottery, it just means Montreal shops elsewhere instead of hanging on to their assets.
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Suzuki and Dach are both RHC's whereas PLD and Fantilli/Carlsson are LHC's. If we draft 2nd you simply put a LHC and RHC on the same line and they alternate taking draws depending on who is on their strong side.
 
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