Proposal: Islanders-Lightning

[sayheykid]

stamkos isn't better than kucherov?

That's correct.

 

[VoynovsParoleOfficer]

My offer stands...
Hamonic + MDC + 2017 1ST for Kuch

so a #5 overall pick 2 years ago, your 2nd best d-man (arguably 1) and a first rounder next year and you think that makes the islanders better?

 

[oilerbear]

Kucherov is getting the OEL treatment suddenly, used to be underrated and now is just so overly rated its crazy, yes hes a fringe top 5 winger but don't say Tavares is in same category

14-15 to 15-16:
Tavares: 26yr in 16-17
160 gm upper 2nd comp 67.1 ZS
105 EVP 16:52 EVTOI/gm
1 SHP 0:02 SHTOI/gm
50 PPP 3:26 PPTOI/gm

Kucherov: 23yr in 16-17
159gm 2nd comp 60.5% ZS
91EVP 13:47 EVTOI/gm
0 SHP 0:01 SHTOI/gm
40 PPP 2:43 PPTOI/gm

Kucherov 13.3% less EV points in 18.3% less TOI
Short handed is a wash!
kucherov 20.0% less PP points in 20.9% less PPTOI

so
Kucherov Faced 2nd com and the 40th easiest ZS of any player
Tavares faced upper 2nd comp with the 6th easiest ZS of any Player.
Kucherov Generated More EVp and PPp per time on ice than Tavares.
Shame cooper did not give him the same TOI as Tavares.

Crazy hey!

Facts say you are giving an opinion.

Opinion; Def: Point of view NOT BASED on FACTS or knowledge.

 

[VoynovsParoleOfficer]

That's correct.

I guess he deserves more than 8 years/68 mil in the near future then, that should be interesting

 

[JT Kreider]

stamkos isn't better than kucherov? ok then this alone proves my point that he is being intensely over rated...kuchy had 66 points last year stamkos has a 60 goal season in his past and I think Drouin WILL be better, I would rather Drouin than kuchy In 3 years.

Hockey has drastically changed since Stamkos 60 goal season. Even though it's only been what 4-5 seasons.

Goaltending has generally improved league wide. There are very few teams in the league that don't have a very good goalie currently in net. Carolina, Winnipeg and Dallas off the top of my head. Though CAR and WPG have top goaltending prospects in the pipeline.

There has also been a big emphasis on defense (especially from the forwards).

Kucherov was better than Stamkos in the 2015 playoffs.

Kucherov was without a doubt the Lightning's best forward the entire 2016 season. And their run to the ECF as well.

Yeah I get Stamkos is more proven and has a bigger sample size, but I'd take Kucherov over Stamkos moving forward.

 

[VoynovsParoleOfficer]

14-15 to 15-16:
Tavares: 26yr in 16-17
160 gm upper 2nd comp 67.1 ZS
105 EVP 16:52 EVTOI/gm
1 SHP 0:02 SHTOI/gm
50 PPP 3:26 PPTOI/gm

Kucherov: 23yr in 16-17
159gm 2nd comp 60.5% ZS
91EVP 13:47 EVTOI/gm
0 SHP 0:01 SHTOI/gm
40 PPP 2:43 PPTOI/gm

Kucherov 13.3% less EV points in 18.3% less TOI
Short handed is a wash!
kucherov 20.0% less PP points in 20.9% less PPTOI

so
Kucherov Faced 2nd com and the 40th easiest ZS of any player
Tavares faced upper 2nd comp with the 6th easiest ZS of any Player.
Kucherov Generated More EVp and PPp per time on ice than Tavares.

Crazy hey!

Facts say you are giving an opinion.

Opinion; Def: Point of view NOT BASED on FACTS or knowledge.

....... put Tavares on a PP with Stamkos, Hedman and TJ and see how these stats read at the end of the year. Kucherov has a line of productive play makers almost at all times....JT played with Josh Bailey & a struggling strome most of the year lol idk how you can justify logically who is a better player solely by crunching statistics together.

 

[JT Kreider]

....... put Tavares on a PP with Stamkos, Hedman and TJ and see how these stats read at the end of the year. Kucherov has a line of productive play makers almost at all times....JT played with Josh Bailey & a struggling strome most of the year lol idk how you can justify logically who is a better player solely by crunching statistics together.

Toews played with a terribly aged Marian Hossa and stone hands Andrew Shaw this season and he's become the HF whipping boy.

But Tavares' linemates are being used as an excuse now?

 

[VoynovsParoleOfficer]

Hockey has drastically changed since Stamkos 60 goal season. Even though it's only been what 4-5 seasons.

Goaltending has generally improved league wide. There are very few teams in the league that don't have a very good goalie currently in net. Carolina, Winnipeg and Dallas off the top of my head. Though CAR and WPG have top goaltending prospects in the pipeline.

There has also been a big emphasis on defense (especially from the forwards).

Kucherov was better than Stamkos in the 2015 playoffs.

Kucherov was without a doubt the Lightning's best forward the entire 2016 season. And their run to the ECF as well.

Yeah I get Stamkos is more proven and has a bigger sample size, but I'd take Kucherov over Stamkos moving forward.

Definitely completely fair to say that he was their best player last year and then some but stamkos is coming off easily his weakest season in his career since he was a rookie. Stammer had three consecutive 90 point seasons and then 2 more cut short by injury and lockout that would have paced him in the 90's. He then followed it up with a 72 point season and last year finished 2 points behind kuch just don't think many teams would take kucherov over stamkos but you guys are entitled to your favorite players

 

[dechire]

stamkos isn't better than kucherov? ok then this alone proves my point that he is being intensely over rated...kuchy had 66 points last year stamkos has a 60 goal season in his past and I think Drouin WILL be better, I would rather Drouin than kuchy In 3 years.

So you're saying that Drouin is definitely better than Kucherov because of what you predict for the future but that Stamkos was once better than Kucherov so Kucherov can't possibly be better than him now ? That's certainly an interesting interpretation.

 

[VoynovsParoleOfficer]

Toews played with a terribly aged Marian Hossa and stone hands Andrew Shaw this season and he's become the HF whipping boy.

But Tavares' linemates are being used as an excuse now?

not even an excuse, but if someone is going to crunch ice time statistics with ppg statistics I think its fair that you take into account the difference between playing with play makers and then playing with josh bailey

 

[dechire]

....... put Tavares on a PP with Stamkos, Hedman and TJ and see how these stats read at the end of the year. Kucherov has a line of productive play makers almost at all times....JT played with Josh Bailey & a struggling strome most of the year lol idk how you can justify logically who is a better player solely by crunching statistics together.

You say that like the TBL PP isn't complete crap. And don't just take my word for it. It was the 28th ranked PP in the league last season. But once again you obviously don't know anything about the Lightning and are just desperately trying to defend your incorrect comments at this point.

 

[VoynovsParoleOfficer]

So you're saying that Drouin is definitely better than Kucherov because of what you predict for the future but that Stamkos was once better than Kucherov so Kucherov can't possibly be better than him now ? That's certainly an interesting interpretation.

You can see the scoring ability in Drouins game, it doesn't take stat crunching to see that he is going to be producing HUGE seasons (80-90 points) you can tell simply by his vision and scoring touch that he is special and hes 20 years old. Kucherov at age 20 wasn't doing what drouin is and that's fine and Kuchy at age 23 wasn't doing what stamkos did at 23. Its not like Stamkos is not still in his prime and wont score 90 points next year. Stamkos had 5 consecutive point per game campaigns and kucherov still has zero so until he does im not placing kucherov over stamkos because he outplayed stammer for one season and 1 playoff run just doesn't make sense

 

[VoynovsParoleOfficer]

You say that like the TBL PP isn't complete crap. And don't just take my word for it. It was the 28th ranked PP in the league last season. But once again you obviously don't know anything about the Lightning and are just desperately trying to defend your incorrect comments at this point.

but were comparing kucherovs season to Tavares.... lightning still ,with their crap PP , had more PP goals than the islanders did last season

 

[dechire]

You can see the scoring ability in Drouins game, it doesn't take stat crunching to see that he is going to be producing HUGE seasons (80-90 points) you can tell simply by his vision and scoring touch that he is special and hes 20 years old. Kucherov at age 20 wasn't doing what drouin is and that's fine and Kuchy at age 23 wasn't doing what stamkos did at 23. Its not like Stamkos is not still in his prime and wont score 90 points next year. Stamkos had 5 consecutive point per game campaigns and kucherov still has zero so until he does im not placing kucherov over stamkos because he outplayed stammer for one season and 1 playoff run just doesn't make sense

Your ranking for current best TBL forwards:

1 Stamkos (because of his past performance from 3+ years ago)
2 Drouin (because of his future potential which may or may not happen)
3 Kucherov (the one who is actually the best right now)

I mean I usually base my ranking of the best players on who is actually playing well in the present but maybe I'm doing it wrong

 

[VoynovsParoleOfficer]

Your ranking for current best TBL forwards:

1 Stamkos (because of his past performance from 3+ years ago)
2 Drouin (because of his future potential which may or may not happen)
3 Kucherov (the one who is actually the best right now)

I mean I usually base my ranking of the best players on who is actually playing well in the present but maybe I'm doing it wrong

okay its fair to say 1.)Kucherov 2.)Stamkos 3.) Drouin for the start of the 2016 season whose playing the best. But if im Yzerman the list you wrote above is how I categorize my priorities moving forward

 

[Pure Slaughter Value]

I mean I usually base my ranking of the best players on who is actually playing well in the present but maybe I'm doing it wrong

You are. This is HFboards, potential always outweighs the present as far as importance.

 

[dechire]

but were comparing kucherovs season to Tavares.... lightning still ,with their crap PP , had more PP goals than the islanders did last season

Yeah 2 more goals in 50 more opportunities. Kucherov was clearly blessed in his role on the 3rd worst PP in the league.

 

[Group Chat Legend*]

Kucherov is getting the OEL treatment suddenly, used to be underrated and now is just so overly rated its crazy, yes hes a fringe top 5 winger but don't say Tavares is in same category

Except the poster never said they are the same. Only you interpreted it that way, along with whoever you think does the same with OEL.

Tampa does not move Kucherov unless Tavares is coming back. That is the posters point, not 'Kucherov is equal to Tavares'.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Sorry but any deal around Strome, Isn't going to get you Kucherov. Kucherov isn't getting dealt he will be eventually resigned and be one of Tampa's top forwards.

 

[GrandmaSlices51631]

Tampa doesn't need Strome. They have Drouin as their 2C and Namestnikov who is a great 3rd Line C.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Tampa doesn't need Strome. They have Drouin as their 2C and Namestnikov who is a great 3rd Line C.

Actually Johnson for the time being will be Tampa's 2C and Drouin most likely his Winger.

 

[JT Kreider]

Tampa doesn't need Strome. They have Drouin as their 2C and Namestnikov who is a great 3rd Line C.

Stamkos
TJ
Filppula
Boyle

That's really good center depth.

 

[Vatican Roulette]

Pulock
Barzel
Strome

For

Kucherov

?

 

[Sheva7]

Pulock
Barzel
Strome

For

Kucherov

?

Woah lol common dude, really? Yea I know all 3 are less proven, but jeez lol

 

[Vatican Roulette]

Woah lol common dude, really? Yea I know all 3 are less proven, but jeez lol

In return the Islanders get a top line superstar wing.

It's potential for proven. And it's not ok proven, its a top young offensive winger.