Is Bedard more McDavid or Drai/Matthews/Mackinnon level talent?

[centipede2233]

you must be very young.


there's more to size than just height. Bedard is huge for his height and just led the combine in pull ups. He's a beast.

if 47 is young then I’m a young buck, but I feel old

 

[Howboutthempanthers]

Prospect hype, and actually talent are two different things. I don't watch him enough to get a good gauge on his talent. I'd say the prospect hype is a bit below McDavid, and obviously way above MacKinnon and Matthews. Draisaitl wasn't hyped as prospect.

 

[Connor McConnor]

Except when they don't. Kane, Kucherov, Gaudreau etc..

Bedard was a bit bigger than Kane (arguably closer to Crosby than Kane) at his draft and dominated more than Kane did at a slightly younger age. No reason to expect his dominance in the CHL will not translate as Kane's did but at a higher level.

We are talking about McDavid not midget wingers and Kucherov. The context seemed pretty obvious when I reread my post, I’m saying this guy is projecting better than MacK, AM and Drai and youre acting like I said he’s not going to do well

 

[Sun God Nika]

I would say he is going to be less than McDavid but better than the rest. Which means Edmonton will have the first and third best player now instead of the best two players in the league.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Not even close to McDavid. He’s being overhyped because it doesn’t generate buzz to be rational. It generates buzz to overhype. Every year they do this to a player or two that is going to carry the narrative for a draft. He’s in the same tier as Matthews and a few others. He’s very good, but he’s not even a true 5’10, his skating is good not amazing for that height and his defense needs some improvement.

 

[daver]

We are talking about McDavid not midget wingers and Kucherov. The context seemed pretty obvious when I reread my post, I’m saying this guy is projecting better than MacK, AM and Drai and youre acting like I said he’s not going to do well

Size doesn't keep these guys from dominating the league. You think McDavid has cornered the market on skill? That you fail to acknowledge Bedard's shot (arguably the greatest ever seen by a prospect) shows you are treating McDavid has a faster version of the most skilled players in the league.

 

[daver]

Not even close to McDavid. He’s being overhyped because it doesn’t generate buzz to be rational. It generates buzz to overhype. Every year they do this to a player or two that is going to carry the narrative for a draft. He’s in the same tier as Matthews and a few others. He’s very good, but he’s not even a true 5’10, his skating is good not amazing for that height and his defense needs some improvement.

How can he be overhyped if he was even more dominant than McDavid in the CHL and his peers as a prospect in the last 50 years all met expectations.

There is zero reason to think he will not meet the expectations set by his all-time great production pre-draft.

To say he is in the same tier as Matthews and a few others cannot be reasonably argued.

 

[Felidae]

Bedard doesn’t skate well enough to equal McDavid.

Never really understood this line of reasoning.

Rarely anyone in hockey history is on McDavid's level of skating but there are a few players near or above his level due to besting him in other skills...

Bedard's strengths may very well be enough to make him as good as McDavid.

 

[Belial]

Size doesn't keep these guys from dominating the league. You think McDavid has cornered the market on skill? That you fail to acknowledge Bedard's shot (arguably the greatest ever seen by a prospect) shows you are treating McDavid has a faster version of the most skilled players in the league.

Goalies, Defenders, and Coaches will figure out his weird release at one point... They will adjust.

 

[daver]

Goalies, Defenders, and Coaches will figure out his weird release at one point... They will adjust.

So will he. I see him winning Art Rosses on the strength of his playmaking potential as much as his shot/goalscoring. He has an uncanny ability to get himself on the scoresheet without standing out like Wayne and Crosby did rather than being visually dominant like Mario, Jagr, OV and McDavid.

People are looking for an excuse/being contrarian to rate him below the generational level prospect that his pre-draft career justifies.

 

[Belial]

So will he. I see him winning Art Rosses on the strength of his playmaking potential as much as his shot/goalscoring. He has an uncanny ability to get himself on the scoresheet without standing out like Wayne and Crosby did rather than being visually dominant like Mario, Jagr, OV and McDavid.

People are looking for an excuse/being contrarian to rate him below the generational level prospect that his pre-draft career justifies.

We'll see, I don't think he will reach McJesus standards.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

How can he be overhyped if he was even more dominant than McDavid in the CHL and his peers as a prospect in the last 50 years all met expectations.

There is zero reason to think he will not meet the expectations set by his all-time great production pre-draft.

To say he is in the same tier as Matthews and a few others cannot be reasonably argued.

of course there's reasons, people have already mentioned size and skating could hamper him from being "generational"

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

How can he be overhyped if he was even more dominant than McDavid in the CHL and his peers as a prospect in the last 50 years all met expectations.

There is zero reason to think he will not meet the expectations set by his all-time great production pre-draft.

To say he is in the same tier as Matthews and a few others cannot be reasonably argued.

How? Because it’s not an objective measure of junior hockey performance. It’s a subjective measure of what translates best to the NHL. Small guys translate worse, fast guys translate better. We’ve seen this a million times how people overestimate junior hockey stats.

 

[LetsGoBLUES91]

Probably somewhere in between. I think he'll be a guy who yearly gets around 50 goals, 60-70 assists.

 

[daver]

How? Because it’s not an objective measure of junior hockey performance. It’s a subjective measure of what translates best to the NHL. Small guys translate worse, fast guys translate better. We’ve seen this a million times how people overestimate junior hockey stats.

Except when we are talking about generational production in the CHL by an identified phenom. We haven't seen that NOT translate into the NHL.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Except when we are talking about generational production in the CHL by an identified phenom. We haven't seen that NOT translate into the NHL.

Jack Hughes had generational production too. Not generational. Alexis Lafreniere had generational production too. Certainly not generational. I can keep going, but I think you get the point.

 

[hamzarocks]

Jack Hughes had generational production too. Not generational. Alexis Lafreniere had generational production too. Certainly not generational. I can keep going, but I think you get the point.

Laf didnt have generational production he produced around Marner level or a bit better

Hughes im not sure on as I dont follow the USJHL.

He does look to be a franchise player and was by his 3rd yesr (95 pt pace)

We will see how Bedard stacks when he makes the league. Hype is high for sure

 

[Hippasus]

How can he be overhyped if he was even more dominant than McDavid in the CHL and his peers as a prospect in the last 50 years all met expectations.

There is zero reason to think he will not meet the expectations set by his all-time great production pre-draft.

To say he is in the same tier as Matthews and a few others cannot be reasonably argued.

Alexander Daigle had tons of hype too after Lindros was a prospect and the latter seemed to be delivering.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Laf didnt have generational production he produced around Marner level or a bit better

Two time CHL player of the year before being drafted. Only done before by Crosby. Also captained Canada to WJC gold in pretty dominant fashion before being drafted too.

 

[KCC]

Never really understood this line of reasoning.

Rarely anyone in hockey history is on McDavid's level of skating but there are a few players near or above his level due to besting him in other skills...

Bedard's strengths may very well be enough to make him as good as McDavid.

I maintain that he will struggle a lot at even strength because he won’t be able to do most of what he could do in junior plus Chicago‘s roster is terrible.but I do think he will do well on the PP because of his great shot.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Except when we are talking about generational production in the CHL by an identified phenom. We haven't seen that NOT translate into the NHL.

Patrick Kane draft year in the OHL:
58gp 62g 145p

Connor Bedard draft year in the WHL:
57gp 71g 143p

 

[TLEH]

I think his physical tools don't jump off the charts like McDavids did with the size and skating. I think people are generally underselling his game. He is a McDavid level prospect. McDavid exceeded expectations, at least for me, but that doesn't mean Bedard is less of a prospect. He dominated his peers at the same exact level.

 

[TLEH]

Patrick Kane draft year in the OHL:
58gp 62g 145p

Connor Bedard draft year in the WHL:
57gp 71g 143p

Relative to the rest of the league, Bedard dominated more than Kane did.

Also if he is a Kane level scorer that plays center, then that is cool with me.

Not even close to McDavid. He’s being overhyped because it doesn’t generate buzz to be rational. It generates buzz to overhype. Every year they do this to a player or two that is going to carry the narrative for a draft. He’s in the same tier as Matthews and a few others. He’s very good, but he’s not even a true 5’10, his skating is good not amazing for that height and his defense needs some improvement.

Yeah but Michkov is going to "terrorize" the Rangers for years to come with his amazing defense and size.

 

[93LEAFS]

He's closer to Patrick Kane than really any of them in skill set and I wouldn't be shocked if he ends up on the wing long-term.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Yeah but Michkov is going to "terrorize" the Rangers for years to come with his amazing defense and size.

He probably will. Bedard could too, if he played in that division. I think Michkov has a higher ceiling and Bedard a higher floor, but Bedard would probably be one of the best players in the Metro.