Interesting Info: Part XXII (Jackets-related "tidbits" here)

[Iron Balls McGinty]

Was creeping here to see if there was any news on Werenski for my fantasy pool but I can chime in on this. My Canucks have seen a night and day difference since we let go of Horvat who sounds very Jenner-esque. Obviously there was a coaching change which had a major impact but some teams just don’t do well with the strong silent leadership type.

This could very well be the case. I'm certainly not saying there is only 1 way to do things but we see things like Connor Bedard being taken under Nick Foligno's wing to get acclimated off the ice. Sidney Crosby lived with Mario Lemieux.

Who did Adam Fantill live with when he first came to Columbus?

Patrick Laine.

I'm not saying Laine is like Mike Commodore mentoring Derrick Brassard and Jake Voracek and partying al over Columbus but it makes me question some of the team leadership structure when it comes to acclimating the young future.

 

[stevo61]

Was creeping here to see if there was any news on Werenski for my fantasy pool but I can chime in on this. My Canucks have seen a night and day difference since we let go of Horvat who sounds very Jenner-esque. Obviously there was a coaching change which had a major impact but some teams just don’t do well with the strong silent leadership type.

Well the coaching change, Hronek, healthy Demko and a good backup in DeSmith, Boeser back on track, added some veteran depth defensemen. Just some small details

This could very well be the case. I'm certainly not saying there is only 1 way to do things but we see things like Connor Bedard being taken under Nick Foligno's wing to get acclimated off the ice. Sidney Crosby lived with Mario Lemieux.

Who did Adam Fantill live with when he first came to Columbus?

Patrick Laine.

I'm not saying Laine is like Mike Commodore mentoring Derrick Brassard and Jake Voracek and partying al over Columbus but it makes me question some of the team leadership structure when it comes to acclimating the young future.

Laine knew the pressure that came with being a highly touted top pick and wanted to give him some support he apparently didnt feel when he came up. He tried to step up in a different way. Does being a captain mean rookies have to live with you? I dont even know what weird leap you are trying to make here

 

[Iron Balls McGinty]

Laine knew the pressure that came with being a highly touted top pick and wanted to give him some support he apparently didnt feel when he came up. He tried to step up in a different way. Does being a captain mean rookies have to live with you? I don't even know what weird leap you are trying to make here

I said:

I'm certainly not saying there is only 1 way to do things

What I am saying is people say Boone is great leader but I honestly can't name 1 example as to how. If anyone else can cite an example feel free.

Being a generally good guy who has been here for a number of years and being able to win a face off isn't something I see as leadership. I'm sure there are things going on we don't see but he's so soft spoken. if he's such a great captain what am I missing and why am I not seeing those traits translate over to other players?

The best example of anything I can find is people say he works hard and leads by example. Great. How does he get others to do that? How does he hold others accountable?

I won't get too into the weeds but I teach an activity of high school level kids. I can have a kid who is great and works really hard but I would really love a kid who works really hard and drags others into the "fight" with them for the good of the group. If someone has trouble with a skill set they can pull them aside and work with them on a peer level versus forcing me as their leader to make the kid work on it.

I see Boone called a "coach's dream" because he works so hard. Great. Coaches love him but I'm not sure I can pinpoint a specific example of how he makes the others around him better.

I'll openly admit if I'm wrong but I just can't simply connect being a hard worker to being a great leader.

 

[Cowumbus]

Laine knew the pressure that came with being a highly touted top pick and wanted to give him some support he apparently didnt feel when he came up. He tried to step up in a different way. Does being a captain mean rookies have to live with you? I dont even know what weird leap you are trying to make here

Might just be trying to say that Laine is not the normal situation you think of regarding veterans mentoring young players. Normally it is an older player with tangible leadership skills. Johnston with Pavelski, MacKinnon with Talbot. Those type of guys. I imagine Derek MacKenzie would be a great choice back in the day.
I don’t know that Laine has ever been considered that type of leader/pro. I respect him trying to reach out and help Fantilli; but I don’t know how badly I would want a player like Laine (with some of his past question marks / baggage) influencing my future star vs other guys we have here.

It is odd that it was not Jenner, or anyone considered to be part of the core leadership group, hosting him.

 

[majormajor]

As usual we make endless speculation based on scant actual information about players interacting.

Laine might have just been the first person to see Fantilli and offer him a place to stay. In any case he stayed there briefly, so it feels a bit odd that it has figured into so many of our conversations here.

Likewise we wouldn't know about specific examples of Jenner's mentorship, we just have to take the word of people who would know. And no it isn't their job to provide us with examples of such things. This is a hockey team not a reality tv show.

 

[koteka]

I am open to trading anyone besides Fantilli if the offer is right. And if someone wants to overpay for Fantilli, I’d consider it.

I just would want to fire Jarmo first.

 

[Napoli]

I think the real question is, is this a franchise that hates losing or do they tolerate mediocrity?

How many guys on the roster HATE losing?

Where's Vinny Prospal when you need him.

 

[stevo61]

I think the real question is, is this a franchise that hates losing or do they tolerate mediocrity?

How many guys on the roster HATE losing?

Where's Vinny Prospal when you need him.

I think a few of the kids hate it a lot which bodes well for the future but they can only do so much right now. Fantilli/Jiricek are 2 guys that are very passionate and dont seem to like losing at all. Jarmo has really failed bridging the gap to those guys

 

[Cowumbus]

I think the real question is, is this a franchise that hates losing or do they tolerate mediocrity?

How many guys on the roster HATE losing?

Where's Vinny Prospal when you need him.

Fantilli
Jiricek
Merzlikins
Voronkov

Strike me as guys who hate to lose

 

[Iron Balls McGinty]

I think a few of the kids hate it a lot which bodes well for the future but they can only do so much right now. Fantilli/Jiricek are 2 guys that are very passionate and dont seem to like losing at all. Jarmo has really failed bridging the gap to those guys

And how long does it become until they become complacent being surrounded by older vets who have become numb to it? I'd love it if we had older vets who hated losing as much. I'm not trying to pick on Boone here or make it his fault but the team has finished in the top half of the Metro 2 times his entire career.

Perhaps upper management has poisoned the entire leadership structure from the top down with their incompetence.

 

[stevo61]

And how long does it become until they become complacent being surrounded by older vets who have become numb to it? I'd love it if we had older vets who hated losing as much. I'm not trying to pick on Boone here or make it his fault but the team has finished in the top half of the Metro 2 times his entire career.

Perhaps upper management has poisoned the entire leadership structure from the top down with their incompetence.

Do you think Boone is numb to it? You get highs and lows from guys numb to losing, Boone gives you what hes got every night. You could swap Boone with prime Bergeron and only so much would change. You need a leadership group. Bergeron had Chara and Marchand plus others along the way. we have Boone and...? Being a good captain isnt like a video game, it doesnt add +5 to everyones stats, management still needs to go out and build a good team. Hell even super talented teams that do a lot of regular season winning has its leadership and mental toughness questioned all the time in Toronto. They'd kill for Jenner but we will pretend like hes not valuable to us?

 

[Iron Balls McGinty]

Do you think Boone is numb to it? You get highs and lows from guys numb to losing, Boone gives you what hes got every night. You could swap Boone with prime Bergeron and only so much would change. You need a leadership group. Bergeron had Chara and Marchand plus others along the way. we have Boone and...? Being a good captain isnt like a video game, it doesnt add +5 to everyones stats, management still needs to go out and build a good team. Hell even super talented teams that do a lot of regular season winning has its leadership and mental toughness questioned all the time in Toronto. They'd kill for Jenner but we will pretend like hes not valuable to us?

I never said he wasn't valueable.

But I will say he is tradeable. if they'd kill for him, let's let them pay a price and we can get the tools for the long run with more quality youth.

I think the only people who are untouchable in my eyes are Fantilli, Jiricek, and Mateychuk with the Russians not far behind.

I don't believe this team is that much worse without Boone if you can replace him with someone who can win a damned faceoff. If Boone is such a great captain, what is he doing to help develop the rest of the leadership within the locker room? That is my point. What does Werenski do? There is a reason Pascal gave Gudbranson an A this year.

If the phrase "Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime" means anything what is our leadership doing to teach others how to lead other than bringing in a "motivational speaker" mid season as a PR move?

Being a hard worker and a "coach's dream" doesn't mean you are a good leader or can teach others how to lead. As far as I'm concerned, working hard and not being difficult for your coach/manager isn't a leadership quality, it is what you are being paid to do.

I think he's a great player and a key piece on a "good team". The CBJ isn't a good team and still a couple of years from maybe being it when he is on the back 9 of his career. His value is never higher than it is now.

 

[5th Line Fanatic]

I said:

I'm certainly not saying there is only 1 way to do things

What I am saying is people say Boone is great leader but I honestly can't name 1 example as to how. If anyone else can cite an example feel free.

Being a generally good guy who has been here for a number of years and being able to win a face off isn't something I see as leadership. I'm sure there are things going on we don't see but he's so soft spoken. if he's such a great captain what am I missing and why am I not seeing those traits translate over to other players?

The best example of anything I can find is people say he works hard and leads by example. Great. How does he get others to do that? How does he hold others accountable?

I won't get too into the weeds but I teach an activity of high school level kids. I can have a kid who is great and works really hard but I would really love a kid who works really hard and drags others into the "fight" with them for the good of the group. If someone has trouble with a skill set they can pull them aside and work with them on a peer level versus forcing me as their leader to make the kid work on it.

I see Boone called a "coach's dream" because he works so hard. Great. Coaches love him but I'm not sure I can pinpoint a specific example of how he makes the others around him better.

I'll openly admit if I'm wrong but I just can't simply connect being a hard worker to being a great leader.

Great leaders are great communicators. Are there examples of the strong silent types being great leaders, maybe. But, normally the great leaders throughout history aren't just "lead by example" types. They communicate the plan constantly and effectively.

I have no idea what Boone is like behind the scenes, but like IBM said above, I've never seen any examples of his leadership or communication skills.

The thing that bothered me the most last summer was reading about all the interaction between Foligno and Bedard. Apparently they were in constant communication. Then the news about Babcock looking through young players phones hits and Boone says, "I had no idea." That was a red flag for me.

 

[Napoli]

I think you keep Boone for as long as you can. This team really needs more vets who play like him.

They're in a spot with limited veteran leadership. The vets they do have aren't exactly great at hockey, (Kuraly, Gudbranson), this isn't Chara and Marchand helping out Bergeron.

I think you keep the one vet who is still useful around. Now if they are afraid Boone's back isn't going to hold up, maybe you start looking in a different direction.

The young kids need to either develop and take control of the franchise or they're going to be stuck in a never ending cycle of mediocrity.

There will be playoff years and people will say "hey look this franchise is improving" but until the culture is a serious one about winning Cups, I won't be surprised to see another 20 years like the first 20.

 

[cbjthrowaway]

as a cbj fan i have a fondness for boone jenner as a person and a player, but i can set that aside and recognize that:

1. the team is entering a new chapter with new core players
2. given age curves + boone's injury history, his on-ice contributions are likely to decline
3. trading him would bring back significant assets, free up roster space, open up cap, and force a hard culture reset in the room – four important boxes a new FO regime would look to check off
4. his leadership has been spoken about glowingly, but they have been one of the worst teams in the league under his captaincy and rumors of them having a 'country club atmosphere' going into this season

it's possible to think highly of a player, be immensely thankful for what they've done for your team, and still recognize that a trade is the right lever to pull.

the jackets have made similar hard decisions before. the atkinson trade felt like a gut-punch for the same reasons, but it was the right move for that roster.

it feels like this team needs to definitively close the previous chapter of cbj hockey and fully embrace fantilli as the face of the franchise. if you squint, you can also see a clear future leadership core with him, sillinger and mateychuk.

in the short-term, they have some journeyman vets (gudbranson, danforth) and stars (gaudreau, werenski, laine) who could step up as leaders in the interim. but it's clear where this team is headed, and as much as we all love boone, it's hard (for me anyway) to see him being a part of that in the long term.

 

[MoeBartoli]

Just boarded a flight to Florida and saw JD seated as I passed by. I was kind and said nothing derogatory, rather just a pleasant greeting. I guess he wanted to get away from the team, too.

 

[EspenK]

Just boarded a flight to Florida and saw JD seated as I passed by. I was kind and said nothing derogatory, rather just a pleasant greeting. I guess he wanted to get away from the team, too.

Looks like your timing is good. Warmth predicted to return to the Sunshine State.

 

[VT]

as a cbj fan i have a fondness for boone jenner as a person and a player, but i can set that aside and recognize that:

1. the team is entering a new chapter with new core players
2. given age curves + boone's injury history, his on-ice contributions are likely to decline
3. trading him would bring back significant assets, free up roster space, open up cap, and force a hard culture reset in the room – four important boxes a new FO regime would look to check off
4. his leadership has been spoken about glowingly, but they have been one of the worst teams in the league under his captaincy and rumors of them having a 'country club atmosphere' going into this season

it's possible to think highly of a player, be immensely thankful for what they've done for your team, and still recognize that a trade is the right lever to pull.

the jackets have made similar hard decisions before. the atkinson trade felt like a gut-punch for the same reasons, but it was the right move for that roster.

it feels like this team needs to definitively close the previous chapter of cbj hockey and fully embrace fantilli as the face of the franchise. if you squint, you can also see a clear future leadership core with him, sillinger and mateychuk.

in the short-term, they have some journeyman vets (gudbranson, danforth) and stars (gaudreau, werenski, laine) who could step up as leaders in the interim. but it's clear where this team is headed, and as much as we all love boone, it's hard (for me anyway) to see him being a part of that in the long term.

Voráček was a real leader, much more than Cam. He was raised by Jágr, who is a real personality, a great professional (btw, Jakub had a very good relationship with Laine). Besides we needed a playmaker.

As for Boone, we don't know what kind of captain he is. But if he was even a combination of MacKinnon and Bergeron, one wouldn't have to prevent injuries, bad goalies play and unforced mistakes in defence. Because if the hockey stick is personal enemy for some player, there's nothing you can do about it. Plus we must compare Foligno's teams and Jenner's teams.

But replacing him is impossible because even Jarmo won't do it. And that's saying something. Also he has M-NTC.

 

[Doggy]

From Aaron Portzline and The Athletic: Sunday Gathering trivia question: Name the only Blue Jackets player to finish a season among the NHL’s top-10 leaders in points.

 

[tunnelvision]

Just boarded a flight to Florida and saw JD seated as I passed by. I was kind and said nothing derogatory, rather just a pleasant greeting. I guess he wanted to get away from the team, too.

Huh, I thought JD was always going North...

 

[Iron Balls McGinty]

Voráček was a real leader, much more than Cam. He was raised by Jágr, who is a real personality, a great professional (btw, Jakub had a very good relationship with Laine). Besides we needed a playmaker.

As for Boone, we don't know what kind of captain he is. But if he was even a combination of MacKinnon and Bergeron, one wouldn't have to prevent injuries, bad goalies play and unforced mistakes in defence. Because if the hockey stick is personal enemy for some player, there's nothing you can do about it. Plus we must compare Foligno's teams and Jenner's teams.

But replacing him is impossible because even Jarmo won't do it. And that's saying something. Also he has M-NTC.

This is the argument I see all the time. "replacing him is impossible"

Really?

What exactly is impossible about it?

 

[VT]

This is the argument I see all the time. "replacing him is impossible"

Really?

What exactly is impossible about it?

I wrote it bad. Not "impossible" but "trade".

 

[Monk]

From Aaron Portzline and The Athletic: Sunday Gathering trivia question: Name the only Blue Jackets player to finish a season among the NHL’s top-10 leaders in points.

Finished the season top-10 in points while they played for CBJ or any time in their career? Really struggling to think of 1 that was top 10 while playing for the Jackets.

 

[cbjthrowaway]

From Aaron Portzline and The Athletic: Sunday Gathering trivia question: Name the only Blue Jackets player to finish a season among the NHL’s top-10 leaders in points.

i distinctly remember posting the same question/answer on this board over a year ago lol

 

[stevo61]

I never said he wasn't valueable.

But I will say he is tradeable. if they'd kill for him, let's let them pay a price and we can get the tools for the long run with more quality youth.

I think the only people who are untouchable in my eyes are Fantilli, Jiricek, and Mateychuk with the Russians not far behind.

I don't believe this team is that much worse without Boone if you can replace him with someone who can win a damned faceoff. If Boone is such a great captain, what is he doing to help develop the rest of the leadership within the locker room? That is my point. What does Werenski do? There is a reason Pascal gave Gudbranson an A this year.

If the phrase "Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime" means anything what is our leadership doing to teach others how to lead other than bringing in a "motivational speaker" mid season as a PR move?

Being a hard worker and a "coach's dream" doesn't mean you are a good leader or can teach others how to lead. As far as I'm concerned, working hard and not being difficult for your coach/manager isn't a leadership quality, it is what you are being paid to do.

I think he's a great player and a key piece on a "good team". The CBJ isn't a good team and still a couple of years from maybe being it when he is on the back 9 of his career. His value is never higher than it is now.

We have all the picks in the world, we have no shortage of young skilled players. We have a severe lack of veterans. Even if you want to pretend Jenner isnt a good captain just treat him as a placeholder for Fantilli. I dont always care about maximizing a players trade value,we could just as easily make a Foligno like trade where the pick turns into Ceulemans and we are the dummies who gave away our captain with term on a good deal.
The motivational speaker thing is a joke anyway, just Jarmo and JD throwing shit at the wall to see what sticks