Rumor: Ilya Kovalchuk will be signing a 2-3 year deal with NYR

[Thirty One]

Can someone explain to me the downside I seem to be missing?

 

[eco's bones]

It probably does mean the end for Zucc but I think it's worth saying that Zucc would be a hell of a linemate to work with Kovalchuk. He is our most creative playmaker.

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

Came in here to see if there are any updates and RegDunlop is just spewing absolute diarrhea in here

My word

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

So with a straight face, you really think that the NYR, after getting Pat Kane in 2007, would have been similar to these teams and not the Chicago Blackhawks? Or Stamkos in 2008?

Your point is well taken and I agree with it.

I think the hysteria in this thread over Kovalchuk signaling the end of a rebuild is ridiculous. I know you yourself have stated that Kovy short term doesn't signal the end of anything, but people need to realize that this is nothing like 2005.

We're in a much better place right now as a franchise and Kovalchuk is not 2005 Jagr.

Hank isn't 2005 Hank either.

 

[GAGLine]

Leafs rebuild took too long because of moves like trading Seguin and Hamilton for Kessel, signing Jason Blake to a 5 year contract, signing Phaneuf to a mega deal, David Clarkson, Burkie being deluded into thinking college FAs = 1st rounders etc. Their first iteration of top 10 picks in Kadri and Schenn weren't good enough. They really only turned things around after they drafted in the top 5 - Marner and Matthews who are their 2 best players already.

It took too long because Burke was an idiot and tried to accelerate the rebuild by trading for Kessel. Look at what Lou and Shanny did from the time they got there. The ate some bad contracts in exchange for assets, they drafted well, and yes, they got lucky getting Matthews, but it didn't take them that long once they set about doing it the right way. With smart decisions and a little luck, the Rangers can follow the same path.

 

[Mikos87]

Can someone explain to me the downside I seem to be missing?

He's not a teenager.

 

[Gardner McKay]

That's all true. However, what of the teams that took the "long term approach" and still suck? I mean neither approach is a guarantee to get you back to where you want to be.

No and I think that is a point that is often forgotten. There are more cases of tanking not working than there are of it working. When it does work it is because of extreme luck or tanking long enough that eventually the odds had to fall in that teams favor... like Pittsburgh by falling ass backwards into two generational talents. When you have two of the top 25 players of all time on your team (an argument can be made for Malkin), of course you're going to have success. What about Buffalo? Edmonton? Carolina? Florida? Arizona?

You do what you can to remain competitive and use the advantages you have to your favor. While we do have to pay more to our players due to absurdly high taxes in NY, we also have the luxury of having our team be based in a city that is very appealing (culture, diversity, wealth, etc.) to a large portion of NHL players. The latter seems to appeal to Ilya. Good for us.

 

[ReggieDunlop68]

It probably does mean the end for Zucc but I think it's worth saying that Zucc would be a hell of a linemate to work with Kovalchuk. He is our most creative playmaker.

Whatever...

Zucc played great in an Olympics several years ago ---> snore....

Kovy played great in an recent Olympics --> Neurotransmitter Surge!

Stop living in the past...

 

[ReggieDunlop68]

He's not a teenager.

He's a little more than halfway out of his 30's too.

 

[nyr2k2]

And there are other instances where it has worked. Pointing out teams that have failed in a rebuild doesn't prove that the Ranger will fail. Why must everyone who wants to rebuild guarantee that it will work? Can you guarantee that not rebuilding will work?

No one can guarantee anything. And that's the whole point, you can dislike the strategy of trying for a quicker retool/rebuild but you can't shit on it for it being "the wrong way" to do things. You can go all out in a multi-year rebuild and fail, or succeed. You can try to do a quicker retool and fail, or succeed. There's no right or wrong way when you can point to evidence of all four outcomes.

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

Your point is well taken and I agree with it.

I think the hysteria in this thread over Kovalchuk signaling the end of a rebuild is ridiculous. I know you yourself have stated that Kovy short term doesn't signal the end of anything, but people need to realize that this is nothing like 2005.

We're in a much better place right now as a franchise and Kovalchuk is not 2005 Jagr.

Hank isn't 2005 Hank either.

I agree with all of this, Kovy on a 2-yr deal is fine and likely won't swing the needle either way.

 

[RGY]

I'm thinking long term. And this is total RangersTown™ bull****.

Yea i bet Arizona, Buffalo, Florida, Edmonton, etc were “thinking long term” too when they decided to rebuild with non-competitive rosters year in and year out....

 

[NYR Viper]

I think like most rumors, a lot of whether many of us would be happy/upset with this move is answered by 'it depends'.

If Kovalchuk signed for 3 years @ $5m per season, knowing a 2 year deal would cost $6.5m per season, would many be upset? What about if the first two years had a NMC while the 3rd had nothing?

What about a 2 year deal @ $7m per season with a full NMC?

It depends on the term, the cap hit and the clauses involved.

I think most people realize Kovalchuk would be a nice addition (whether at 2 or 3 years) as he would provide some leadership, some offensive output, cost no assets besides cash, etc.

Hopefully Gorton is able to get him at his terms and he is able to then utilize some of the other assets to continue the rebuild.

 

[Mikos87]

It took too long because Burke was an idiot and tried to accelerate the rebuild by trading for Kessel. Look at what Lou and Shanny did from the time they got there. The ate some bad contracts in exchange for assets, they drafted well, and yes, they got lucky getting Matthews, but it didn't take them that long once they set about doing it the right way. With smart decisions and a little luck, the Rangers can follow the same path.

Coach helped too.

 

[ReggieDunlop68]

Yea i bet Arizona, Buffalo, Florida, Edmonton, etc were “thinking long term” too when they decided to rebuild with non-competitive rosters year in and year out....

Or they didn't have a a cup winning plan.

Some teams are parasites in modern leagues with TV deals. That's why they have the cap floor.

 

[Mikos87]

He's a little more than halfway out of his 30's too.

30's you say? Dear God tell me thats a typo and you meant 20's.

 

[ReggieDunlop68]

Coach helped too.

They had the same coach since 1967.

 

[ReggieDunlop68]

30's you say? Dear God tell me thats a typo and you meant 20's.

Na he's mid 30s, so it's not just because "he's not 18".

 

[Cassano]

Can someone explain to me the downside I seem to be missing?

No downside asset wise of course. It's a no-brainer to sign him if he's willing. But it depends on how management will approach the rebuild.

nyr2k2's post:

Signing Kovalchuk, to me, signifies that the team is pretty content with the "rebuilding" that they've done thus far. Yeah, they might flip Zuccarello or Spooner or someone, but there is no way next season is going to be one where we're a cellar dweller selling off every last valuable part. Gorton is going to continue this plan of getting younger and acquiring youthful assets while fielding a competitive team. We probably would have remained competitive this year had the injuries not piled up and had we not quick on our limp-dick coach. I truly believe the goal next year will be to compete for a WC spot, and in two years to compete for a division title. That's how I perceive what Gorton is doing.

I don't think the team has 'bottomed-out' enough if that makes sense. They absolutely need to draft an elite player in the next draft or two if there are long term aspirations for this team to be a potential cup winning team. It's harder to do that when you're drafting in the ~20th range.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

I think like most rumors, a lot of whether many of us would be happy/upset with this move is answered by 'it depends'.

If Kovalchuk signed for 3 years @ $5m per season, knowing a 2 year deal would cost $6.5m per season, would many be upset? What about if the first two years had a NMC while the 3rd had nothing?

What about a 2 year deal @ $7m per season with a full NMC?

It depends on the term, the cap hit and the clauses involved.

I think most people realize Kovalchuk would be a nice addition (whether at 2 or 3 years) as he would provide some leadership, some offensive output, cost no assets besides cash, etc.

Hopefully Gorton is able to get him at his terms and he is able to then utilize some of the other assets to continue the rebuild.

I'd still take the shorter deal at higher money.

 

[Glen Sathers Cigar]

So with a straight face, you really think that the NYR, after getting Pat Kane in 2007, would have been similar to these teams and not the Chicago Blackhawks? Or Stamkos in 2008?

I don't believe this is what I was implying at all.

However, the Islanders have John Tavares, Oilers had 5 1st overall picks including McDavid, Sabers have Eichel.

Obviously it comes down to how the franchise is run and what players you get, but to act like a rebuild is guaranteed success is naive.

 

[Rangers in 7]

Can someone explain to me the downside I seem to be missing?

there is no downside hahah

everyone needs to calm down, signing kovy means nothing....we arent trading assets to acquire him and he isnt going to be blocking anyone on the depth chart, if people thought we were going to ice a roster with everyone being under 24 you were sorely mistaken

WE ARE STILL REBUILDING! but it will be fun to watch kovy light up the scoresheet at times

 

[Cassano]

Of course Vegas winning the cup with no real superstars will probably encourage more teams to compete right away and tank less. Could be good for the league Lol.

 

[ReggieDunlop68]

I don't believe this is what I was implying at all.

However, the Islanders have John Tavares, Oilers had 5 1st overall picks including McDavid, Sabers have Eichel.

Obviously it comes down to how the franchise is run and what players you get, but to act like a rebuild is guaranteed success is naive.

The history of RangersTown™ is a greater warning against NOT rebuilding than the few recent parasite shitters who f***ed up.

 

[Glen Sathers Cigar]

And there are other instances where it has worked. Pointing out teams that have failed in a rebuild doesn't prove that the Ranger will fail. Why must everyone who wants to rebuild guarantee that it will work? Can you guarantee that not rebuilding will work?

I'm not saying it's proof the Rangers will fail. I'm not arguing rebuilding won't work.

I was responding to the claim that the Oilers and Sabres are the only teams it hasn't worked for.

Truth is it can go either way and that's why it's important to have a good GM leading the way.