If it's not Jack Campbell who should be the Leafs new #1 goalie?

[TheRumble]

I dunno if anyone watched Rangers vs Lightning...

But one of the luxuries that the Rangers have in Shesterkin is that he's good enough to cover up for what is a pretty poor defensive team. Rather than trying to shut the Lightning down defensively, the Rangers went all out on offense and ask Shesterkin to cover for them which he did for Games 1, 2 and 3. When he came back down to Earth, they lost. There are only 3-4 goalies like that in the league. The fans here are too hung up on that.

The Leafs ARE NOT the Rangers. They are a very good defensive team, Shesterkin would obviously put this team over the top but he can't be traded for so you just need a guy who is good enough. When he had that hot November, we went 14-2. But the team also had a winning record in every month where they were getting sub .900 goaltending (which was every month outside of November).

If you're just looking for Good Enough, Gibson is in that category but he's got a cap hit of $6.4 million. That's a lot of money to be spending on Good Enough. If you're gonna spend $6.4 million, you'd like someone like Hellybyuck.

A Honda Civic is a fine car but you don't pay $80,000 for one.

 

[rocketman588]

I would rather spend that much or a bit more on another goaltender to be honest.

I'm ok with Kallgren as a backup. We need to clear out cap space and acquire a starter with pedigree at the going rate.

I completely agree. It's a definite risk but at this point it's one you need to take imo

 

[Bluelines]

Based on what? Gibson was a better goalie...three years ago. By several accounts from the Ducks' fanbase he's nowhere near where he once was and hasn't shown indications of returning. The only caveat is that perhaps a change of scenery might revive his play. That's hardly reassuring.

And to the bold, if he's just as good as Campbell, then Campbell is just as good as Gibson at far less the cost. That's a no-brainer in favor of Campbell.

There's only one scenario where you look at Gibson and spend assets and justify taking his cap on: If Gibson was coming off of a stellar return to form type season that points to more to follow.

But there's nothing there and we should look elsewhere.

If Anahiem wants to take Mrzek and retain 40% of Gibsons salary, I'd do the trade but Gibson is not the all world goalie he was 3 years ago, because the Leafs give up a lot of high Danger opportunities, I think they need a goalie that does not need structure in front of him.

Jack was 46th in HDSV%....

Husso was one of the best last year with his HDSV% but .... St Lou plays a very structured system, if we signed Husso we are not getting a guy that will have a HDSV% @ .867 in the Leafs system.

 

[Carltons Cup]

I dunno if anyone watched Rangers vs Lightning...

But one of the luxuries that the Rangers have in Shesterkin is that he's good enough to cover up for what is a pretty poor defensive team. Rather than trying to shut the Lightning down defensively, the Rangers went all out on offense and ask Shesterkin to cover for them which he did for Games 1, 2 and 3. When he came back down to Earth, they lost. There are only 3-4 goalies like that in the league. The fans here are too hung up on that.

The Leafs ARE NOT the Rangers. They are a very good defensive team, Shesterkin would obviously put this team over the top but he can't be traded for so you just need a guy who is good enough. When he had that hot November, we went 14-2. But the team also had a winning record in every month where they were getting sub .900 goaltending (which was every month outside of November).

If you're just looking for Good Enough, Gibson is in that category but he's got a cap hit of $6.4 million. That's a lot of money to be spending on Good Enough. If you're gonna spend $6.4 million, you'd like someone like Hellybyuck.

A Honda Civic is a fine car but you don't pay $80,000 for one.

so which is it??? Are the Rangers a good defensive team or not?

 

[SeaOfBlue]

so which is it??? Are the Rangers a good defensive team or not?

Clearly says the Rangers are not a good defensive team while the Leafs are a good defensive team.

 

[mydnyte]

If Anahiem wants to take Mrzek and retain 40% of Gibsons salary, I'd do the trade but Gibson is not the all world goalie he was 3 years ago, because the Leafs give up a lot of high Danger opportunities, I think they need a goalie that does not need structure in front of him.

View attachment 559286

Jack was 46th in HDSV%....

View attachment 559288

Husso was one of the best last year with his HDSV% but .... St Lou plays a very structured system, if we signed Husso we are not getting a guy that will have a HDSV% @ .867 in the Leafs system.

i would try to poach one of Washington's goalies, they have a far worse defensive structure than we do, and they still cant pick one G over the other, and both have potential, and minimal risk.

 

[ITM]

If Anahiem wants to take Mrzek and retain 40% of Gibsons salary, I'd do the trade but Gibson is not the all world goalie he was 3 years ago, because the Leafs give up a lot of high Danger opportunities, I think they need a goalie that does not need structure in front of him.

View attachment 559286

Jack was 46th in HDSV%....

View attachment 559288

Husso was one of the best last year with his HDSV% but .... St Lou plays a very structured system, if we signed Husso we are not getting a guy that will have a HDSV% @ .867 in the Leafs system.

To the bold; I stand corrected. I would that deal, but that's about it concerning Gibson.

Interesting note on the stats comparison.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

One year of groin injuries = a groin less durable than melted cheese? And uh, considering half our goaltending apparently had groin injuries this year, you sure the goalie coach has nothing to do with it?

Yes a goalie coach and a doctor are not the same

 

[Lightsol]

Yes a goalie coach and a doctor are not the same

You seem to be under the impression that a doctor causes injuries, rather than attempts to heal them...

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

You seem to be under the impression that a doctor causes injuries, rather than attempts to heal them...

No I'm saying a doctor is the one that is going to fix the issue IF it can be fixed.

Not the goalie coach.

changing goalie coaches is not to turn Mrazek's groin from melted cheese which it basically is, a groin made a steal.

Mrazek's groin is f***ed and changing goalie coaches won't fix that

 

[Lightsol]

No I'm saying a doctor is the one that is going to fix the issue IF it can be fixed.

Not the goalie coach.

changing goalie coaches is not to turn Mrazek's groin from melted cheese which it basically is, a groin made a steal.

Mrazek's groin is f***ed and changing goalie coaches won't fix that

I don't know why you seem to be under the impression that Mrazek is Rick Dipietro... Actually check his injury history; this is his first groin injury. If one groin injury meant your groin was melted cheese, there'd be a bunch of goalies out there not doing what they're doing right now.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

I don't know why you seem to be under the impression that Mrazek is Rick Dipietro... Actually check his injury history; this is his first groin injury. If one groin injury meant your groin was melted cheese, there'd be a bunch of goalies out there not doing what they're doing right now.

he's played 32 games combined the last 2 years 32 out of 164 possible games.

It's not just the groin injury but that does seem to be the more serious one since it happened 3 times last year.

Mrazek is going down the path of Rick Dipirtro

That's why he needs to go one way or the other

 

[NJG]

Based on what? Gibson was a better goalie...three years ago. By several accounts from the Ducks' fanbase he's nowhere near where he once was and hasn't shown indications of returning. The only caveat is that perhaps a change of scenery might revive his play. That's hardly reassuring.

And to the bold, if he's just as good as Campbell, then Campbell is just as good as Gibson at far less the cost. That's a no-brainer in favor of Campbell.

There's only one scenario where you look at Gibson and spend assets and justify taking his cap on: If Gibson was coming off of a stellar return to form type season that points to more to follow.

But there's nothing there and we should look elsewhere.

Gibson being a better goalie three years ago was not just a better goalie then Campbell he was one of the best goalies in the league. Making his potential miles ahead of Campbells. A change of scenery can always do a player good he was on a bad team and faced the harder teams and probably had no motivation etc. I think coming here would be a good thing for him and if he actually wants to win coming here could light a fire under his ass. Let's also not forget Campbell hasn't really proved anything either... He has what? two years of being a decent goalie and before that was a backup all of his life hardly playing... the change of scenery did him good.

I didn't say Campbell was just as good as Gibson. I said even Gibson at his worse is still as good as Campbell so he just needs to play better than his worst and he will be better than Campbell. Campbell had better stats obviously... He played for a team that finished fourth in the league.

Spend assets? We're in winning a Stanley Cup mode not a rebuilding phase. If you can get a goalie of Gibson's caliber and the risk pays off and he regains form you have one of the best goalies in the league. We need a goalie that can be that and Binnington, Husso, Campbell, or anyone else available isn't going to give you that except maybe Varlamov and I don't see Islanders trading him.

Any other top goalie in the league isn't available and no team is going to trade a top 10 goalie in the league if they have it. So regardless if it's Campbell or anyone else you're pretty much getting the same goaltending across the board.

 

[usernamezrhardtodo]

I think the Leafs need to be realistic and put a bit of money in the goalie position whomever they decide to go with. It can’t be two trash goalies making a combined salary of Alex Kerfoot and Justin Holl or something like that. You think you can cheat the 82 game season but that becomes a real weak spot in a head to head playoff. Stop reinventing the wheel and build a strong net position, please. If you go into the third straight year paying your starting goalie less money than Justin Holl, you’re just playing with fire.

It's obvious you have not heard of the book that was made into a movie starring Brad Pitt. It was called MoneyBall and it is quite a fascinating flick showing how the wheel can and will be re-invented by MLSE.

 

[usernamezrhardtodo]

If Anahiem wants to take Mrzek and retain 40% of Gibsons salary, I'd do the trade but Gibson is not the all world goalie he was 3 years ago, because the Leafs give up a lot of high Danger opportunities, I think they need a goalie that does not need structure in front of him.

View attachment 559286

Jack was 46th in HDSV%....

View attachment 559288

Husso was one of the best last year with his HDSV% but .... St Lou plays a very structured system, if we signed Husso we are not getting a guy that will have a HDSV% @ .867 in the Leafs system.

That's what I worry about...will previous seasons on other teams translate to our system. Are our high danger chances against much more dangerous? I don't know...but when we make a mistake it seems like its always in the back of our net. I want a more disciplined defensive team approach like St. Louis has...they can still score but they wear you down. We can't do that with our players...so something has to change.

 

[colchar]

Gibson is not the all world goalie he was 3 years ago

Was he ever? If you check his GAA, SV%, and wins he has only been in the top ten a couple of times (not counting his first season during which he only played three games).

 

[Gabriel426]

Would you rather trade for Gibson or spend a bit more assests on Helly?

 

[Tarmore]

I find it interesting that the crowd complaining that we haven't developed a goalie in 20 years isn't all in for playing one of the Marlies goalies.

You can't develop one if you don't play em!

 

[Racer88]

I find it interesting that the crowd complaining that we haven't developed a goalie in 20 years isn't all in for playing one of the Marlies goalies.

You can't develop one if you don't play em!

That may be true but they have to be good to play them……..are they?

 

[ACC1224]

I find it interesting that the crowd complaining that we haven't developed a goalie in 20 years isn't all in for playing one of the Marlies goalies.

You can't develop one if you don't play em!

They develop on the Marlies until they are good enough to play for the Leafs. People are complaining that they haven’t develop one good enough for that.

 

[Tarmore]

They develop on the Marlies until they are good enough to play for the Leafs. People are complaining that they haven’t develop one good enough for that.

Development continues at the NHL level. If not you have serious issues, especially with young players.

That may be true but they have to be good to play them……..are they?

Stats are a little shallow but promising. The again if you don't play them you'll never know at the NHL level I guess.

 

[ACC1224]

Development continues at the NHL level. If not you have serious issues, especially with young players.



Stats are a little shallow but promising. The again if you don't play them you'll never know at the NHL level I guess.

I think that's obvious but they have to be ready for it.
Do you have a player in mind that they've neglected?

 

[Tarmore]

I think that's obvious but they have to be ready for it.
Do you have a player in mind that they've neglected?

I think they should invest more games in Woll and Källgren to see what they have.

Both did pretty well IMO. Their W/L records were good in small sample sizes.

Someone can enlighten me as to their waiver status, as that could be critical.

 

[ACC1224]

I think they should invest more games in Woll and Källgren to see what they have.

Both did pretty well IMO. Their W/L records were good in small sample sizes.

Someone can enlighten me as to their waiver status, as that could be critical.

I agree with that. The first step though is to get a bonafide #1.
Hard to spot start rookies when you have the 1A/B set up.

 

[Bluelines]

I don't know why you seem to be under the impression that Mrazek is Rick Dipietro... Actually check his injury history; this is his first groin injury. If one groin injury meant your groin was melted cheese, there'd be a bunch of goalies out there not doing what they're doing right now.

[TABLE=collapse]
[TR]
[TD]2022-05-04[/TD]
[TD]Missed the last 16 regular season and first playoff games (groin).[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2022-04-01[/TD]
[TD]Groin, injured reserve.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2022-03-30[/TD]
[TD]Groin, sidelined indefinitely.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2021-12-30[/TD]
[TD]Activated from the COVID-19 list by the Toronto Maple Leafs.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2021-12-21[/TD]
[TD]COVID-19, day-to-day.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2021-12-11[/TD]
[TD]Missed 17 games (groin).[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2021-11-07[/TD]
[TD]Groin, injured reserve.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2021-11-06[/TD]
[TD]Groin, day-to-day.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2021-10-30[/TD]
[TD]Missed 6 games (groin).[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2021-10-16[/TD]
[TD]Groin, sidelined indefinitely.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD][/TD]

[TD][TABLE=collapse]
[TR]
[TD][/TD]

[TD]2020-21[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2021-05-03[/TD]
[TD]Missed 6 games (lower body injury).[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2021-04-22[/TD]
[TD]Lower body injury, day-to-day.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2021-04-04[/TD]
[TD]Missed 31 games (right thumb surgery).[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2021-02-03[/TD]
[TD]Right thumb surgery, sidelined indefinitely.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2021-02-01[/TD]
[TD]Upper body injury, sidelined indefinitely.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2021-01-31[/TD]
[TD]Upper body injury, day-to-day.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD][/TD]

[TD][TABLE=collapse]
[TR]
[TD][/TD]

[TD]2019-20[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2020-03-10[/TD]
[TD]Missed 6 games (concussion).[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2020-02-25[/TD]
[TD]Concussion, sidelined indefinitely.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD][/TD]

[TD]

2018-19

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2019-05-07[/TD]
[TD]Missed the last 2 playoff games (lower body injury).[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2019-04-29[/TD]
[TD]Lower body injury, day-to-day.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2018-11-24[/TD]
[TD]Missed 9 games (lower body injury).[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2018-11-03[/TD]
[TD]Lower body injury, day-to-day.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD][/TD]

[TD][TABLE=collapse]
[TR]
[TD][/TD]

[TD]2015-16[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2016-06-28[/TD]
[TD]Detroit Red Wings tendered a qualifying offer.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2016-03-22[/TD]
[TD]Missed 2 games (illness).[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2016-03-17[/TD]
[TD]Illness, day-to-day.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2016-03-02[/TD]
[TD]Missed 1 game (groin).[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2016-02-29[/TD]
[TD]Groin, day-to-day.[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]